# My training day



## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Doing some lond blinds today at my local park. 2 bumpers set out about 200 yards away , someone had put 2 barrels near each other and I ran her in between them . I'm running without an ecollar but shes doing good. Picture to follow but is there anything else I can do to make her better? The bumpers are placed in the middle of the far shade .


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Do a three peat drill with barrels. Run one down middle, one on left side of barrels and one on right side. You can move the starting point so that you the left and right one cross the line of the middle one. Hard to describe in words.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

IMO your doing the right thing not using collar correction when teaching blinds but, I would put the collar on her anyway. Putting the collar on should mean we are going to train and have fun, and it will if that's what happens. If you only put it on when you intend to correct she will figure that out quickly.

Look for lots of places to repeat the same concepts and, gradually, introduce more factors. Any water you can find is especially valuable, doesn't have to be much if there is a nice training area around it.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Do you mean move my line for each difrent pile Wayne?


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

You can or leave in same place. Because of trees you may have to move the line for each pile.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Do you mean to move my line around and add the sides?


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Something like this


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Like this then .


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Yep that’s what I was trying to describe


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Got it , but need to shorten the distance to go thru the barrel first then go back to long.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Drunkenpoacher this park has a large pond that i do 4 separate lines on and then work on decheat where she has to go into the water coming and going.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Probably best to have ecollar on dog. Then you have a reasonable defense it someone reports you in violation of leash laws. It has happened to me several times in parks.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Wayne we dont have a leash law in this town.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Where is that?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Grand Prairie or at least they didn't when I moved to Florida, and no cops have said anything to me since Ive been back . All my dogs go wherever I go, at Pet Smart they are amazed Boo carries her own leash and Discount Tire loves her.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Drunkenpoacher this park has a large pond that i do 4 separate lines on and then work on decheat where she has to go into the water coming and going.


Sounds nice and convenient. You will need lots of places to run blinds as your dog advances. It takes very few repetitions for a dog to remember a blind. You want her concentrating on and trusting your casts rather than thinking ahead to where the bird is.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Drunkenpoacher I have alot of places to go train i. This town. For example Lone Star Park (a horse track and the COE properties at JOE POOL LAKE plus another place thats part of a city park that gets mowed monthly as are the first 2 . Ive even had the cops stop by at the last place to make sure everything was alright. If i wanted to 4-5 hundred yard marks or blinds could be attempted. Love this town!


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Oops I forgot if this virus ever gets over with i could just call Wayne Nutt and resume our training sessions.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Wayne Nutt , 
Today was the first day trying the 3peat thur the barrels went good. Boo broke to the center pile when sent on the right diagonal so I used a verble no and called her back for the left diagonal I made a mistake and inadvertantly gave her a no, never made a mistake after that. A lot of mental pressure on her part and she was panting hard at the end not very long run just thing hard. Tomorrow s another day .


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Very good.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today was cold blinds in the first picture you will see a tree on the left the bird is past the tree and if you expand it and look to for a stop sign the bird is inline with it. About 250 or so yards long.
Second picture on the right you see a point bird is at 200 yards left hand blind is about 60 yards away from the tree line distance unknown. I still have 200 yards behind me but with drop I wouldnt have see my dog. Drills tomorrow.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Cold blinds today in excess of 350 yards .she hacked it but i had decide to just let her go shes got the distance just not the line that should improve in time.


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## [email protected] (Jul 16, 2018)

If u are training with an e collar I would NEVER EVER run her without the collar on. Nothing good can come from running her without it.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

I never used to have a collar so I'm well versed on tennis shoe training. My dog knows that i can and will correct her if needed . Tennis shoe training keeps me in shape.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> I never used to have a collar so I'm well versed on tennis shoe training. My dog knows that i can and will correct her if needed . Tennis shoe training keeps me in shape.


I used to do the same. I have no doubt that you run much faster and that you are still too slow to correct a dog at the proper time.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Drunkenpoacher true a timely correction is better , but if you remember a correction manually could really cure some problems.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Drunkenpoacher true a timely correction is better , but if you remember a correction manually could really cure some problems.


No argument there. I use a heeling stick for most corrections at the line, yard training, etc. 
What I learned about "tennis shoe training" is by the time I got there the dog had forgot what he had done wrong.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today was a repeat of yesterday so they are considered pattern blinds , way better than yesterday run. Also note that I called 911 for a break in at the ATT tower that is out there and they had me wait for them, they showed up in 5 minutes.2 cars 4 cops great guys and gal. They were impressed with BOO just sitting there taking it all in.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Sometimes you need to let dogs just run on blinds to build momentum. I have done it and given corrective casts later.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Issues today on the repeat of the long blinds , no go on the first blind why no idea but i addressed it . After a 20 min break no go on the second blind i addressed it and got her there. The question remains on why this happened, was it just an off day ,tired or just plain bored of this repeat I'm going to give her a day off tomorrow and see if she improves. Just another day and we will continue to improve.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Issues today on the repeat of the long blinds , no go on the first blind why no idea but i addressed it . After a 20 min break no go on the second blind i addressed it and got her there. The question remains on why this happened, was it just an off day ,tired or just plain bored of this repeat I'm going to give her a day off tomorrow and see if she improves. Just another day and we will continue to improve.


Think through it, did she appear confused of did you somehow give her mixed signals, improper Q's? 
It can happen very easily sometimes.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

I really think she was tired of doing this repeat so a day off and a new field should work.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Took a day off yesterday and reviewed walking basball this morning going to do this 2 more days then back to cold blinds both long and short. She had great attitude and drive today , funny how a day off perks you up.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Are you getting some marks for her?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Yes sir Wayne we do marks 3 times a week .


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today was revisiting a drill we havent done in a few weeks. I call this go where sent , I know it has a name but cant remember it. She has to go over this concrete seat coming and going.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

It's called a NoNo drill.


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## A team (Jun 30, 2011)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Today was revisiting a drill we havent done in a few weeks. I call this go where sent , I know it has a name but cant remember it. She has to go over this concrete seat coming and going.


Great drill , I use haybales . I'd caution running the pup on concrete to the factor(bench) , if you have to stop the pup often in order to go over the bench you may see some pad damage.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

A Team I've never had to stop her on the concrete, my dogs only problem is me since this is my only dog I tend to overtrain. Im working on that problem.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> A Team I've never had to stop her on the concrete, my dogs only problem is me since this is my only dog I tend to overtrain. Im working on that problem.


I hear you.
Every so often it's good to just go for a walk, still training but light and fun. Work on quartering a field for upland hunting. If you are lucky and can find birds, teach sitting to flush (and shot if you bring your starter pistol). Good practice for hunting and fliers at events. Work on water and cover cheating by placing and recalling the dog across slivers and points of each.


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## [email protected] (Jul 16, 2018)

Again I’d utilize the technology we have today to help the dog learn things easier. However try this I do this weekly with my transition dogs it helps balance a good attitude.

Monday morning - yard work Wagon/ 8 handed casting/ no no drills etc

Tuesday morning - blind work usually two cold land blinds

Tuesday afternoon - two cold water blinds, 3 singles off of multiple guns

Wednesday morning two cold land blinds different field

Wednesday afternoon two cold water blinds, 3 singles off multiple guns, 

Thursday take morning off
Thursday afternoon two water blinds, cold double 

Friday morning two walk around longer water blinds to improve attitude and develop momentum.

Off Friday afternoon

Saturday morning two big 3 Gun marking setups throw birds and fliers if possible.

Off Saturday afternoon

Off all day Sunday


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Taking a week off due to this heat.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Finally got some free time to train this morning . 3 water marks, no no drill and 3 peat thru two separate set of barrels she wanted the work and did fairly well today.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Did 2 150 yard blinds , the no no drill with 3 separate benches and 8 bumper wagon wheel with half in water half on land. She lined up perfectly each time making progress I hope.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Very good.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today was a bad day, ran 2 cold blinds very long 1st was perfect second stunk ! Crossing wind left to right she went past it on the wrong side. I called her back in and resent. The temp 83 degrees and high humidity aren't helping, she quit listen to the whistle. So I walked out and kept walking out til I got her on the bird. She got very hot sot she got a drink and I dumped all the water I had with me on her, she ran maybe a mile just on the last bird. i just couldnt quit til she had success . Shes now resting in her crate here in the house.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Ive about reached the end of what I can train and teach on my own here in Texas , she will go to a trainer after their winter trip. Hopefully I don't screw her up before then.


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## orangeversion (Jul 6, 2020)

You are really working hard. Thats good to see. Dont worry you will not screw up anything.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

For the bext couple of weeks we are giing ti work on wagon wheel handling dirls to get her tightened up.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Wagon wheel hadeling drill today gotta sharpen up her sit on the whistle ,the casting was good. We then worked on marks (I train alone) told her sit and i walked out and threw 3 marks then walked back and sent her. Looking for improvement every day.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

No training today, work needs me from 8 a.m. to 930 p.m. .


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

After a month and 1/2 of working 14 to 12 hour days finally im back at it. Todays session was repeat blinds at 180 yards , it didn't stat well or end well. when she lined up and heard Back she jumped up at me and barked. She was forced back the other 2 blinds my side was made a hot spot and worked from a distance. I think its time to go to the back pile again . Your thoughts please on how to get truh this, i dont want to give the trainer some garbage next month.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

We visited the back pile this morning 32 bumper and from the 1st she had no hesitation but vocal. This is new to me so time to figure it out.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> We visited the back pile this morning 32 bumper and from the 1st she had no hesitation but vocal. This is new to me so time to figure it out.


That’s quite a bit of running on a hot day, don’t overdo it.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

I try not to Dr Ed but she has to realize back means Back. I dont have an answer why she would do this other than the inactivity of the last month.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> I try not to Dr Ed but she has to realize back means Back. I dont have an answer why she would do this other than the inactivity of the last month.


You cannot fix everything in one day and after a point fatigue becomes an impediment to learning.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Just got done 30 mins ago , backpile with no issues or being vocal maybe a refresher is what she needed.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Every dog is different. Rudy occasionally gets in trouble by not taking a cast or poor initial line. And will do as you described. My solution is to just throw a bumper from the line about 20 yards. Then send him on back. Then all is well for future blinds. This is a simple remedy. I can't explain why it works. But for him it does.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Went back at it this morning , 4 bumper blind it wasn't a good line but she went with a purpose . On the rest of the resents she was vocal and refused to go she was forced on each one . Gave her a swim in the pond then went to the no no drill no issues. What went sour on the blinds anybody have an answer.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

I would need to see the dog either in person or on a video before suggesting. If you can, come out and train with me. We can social distance easily.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

I will give you a call in the morning Wayne.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> I will give you a call in the morning Wayne.


An unedited video of that training and process would be great for everyone .


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Dine traing for the day , 3 walkout blinds with no issues followed by 3 more walkout blinds way better than yesterday. The longest was about 150 yards and none can be seen from the line . I think what she was trying to tell me yesterday was that she did not want to do repeats for blinds, we shall see going to go train with Wayne tomorrow morning.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Great spending the day with you Wayne Nutt. For those of you wondering Wayne will post up a video soon.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

https://youtu.be/QUNvmdkEyko
Boo and Jesse running three walkout blinds.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

_"Doing some lond blinds today at my local park. 2 bumpers set out about *200 *yards away , someone had put 2 barrels near each other and I ran her in between them . but is there anything else I can do to make her better? "_

"Dine traing for the day , 3 walkout blinds with no issues followed by 3 more walkout blinds way better than yesterday. The longest was about *150* yards and none can be seen from the line "

"Boo and Jesse running three walkout blinds."
What did the dog learn ?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

For me its to read my dog better , she doesn't like repeats as for Boo to trust me there is something out there.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> *she doesn't like repeats* as for Boo to *trust me there is something out there*.


That would be repeats then ?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today it was more blinds , 6 walkout blinds in separate areas the longest was 180 yards away. We also did 1 mark at 125 yards across the pond and onto land this was self thrown she knows sit very well. Also did 2 along the shore and had great sucess. Shes entered in a derby next month so marks are going to be used heavily for the rest of this month .


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

3 blinds this morning 150 yards for 2 of them 1 at 200+ yards. Also 150 yard mark across water and 180 yard mark on land. She wanted more but I thought it best to leave her wanting more. Loving this 58 degree weather here in Texas today!


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Shes entered in a derby next month so marks are going to be used heavily for the rest of this month .


Throw marks with multiple compounding factors, many of them 250-300 yards or more.
Shoot some fliers and throw a memory bird, some tight and some wide.

Hope she gets some color.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Doing some lond blinds today at my local park. 2 bumpers set out about 200 yards away , someone had put 2 barrels near each other and I ran her in between them . I'm running without an ecollar but shes doing good. Picture to follow but is there anything else I can do to make her better? The bumpers are placed in the middle of the far shade .


#1 is a long way off from where you are right now.perhaps?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Polimase its in a diffrent area.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Drunkenpoacher since I train alone but the plan tomorrow is doubles with ducks at 250+ yards. She will sit where I tell her to til I get back to the line.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Drunkenpoacher since I train alone but the plan tomorrow is doubles with ducks at 250+ yards. She will sit where I tell her to til I get back to the line.


Good plan, hope you can get a flier or 2 or 3 before the derby.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Polimase its in a diffrent area.


Jeezus, Sometimes you have to know where you are, before you know where to go.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Friday 2 land marks at 250 yards and 1 blind at 150 yards we did this twice. Then we went to play in the tiver.
Saturday was doubles in water still working to get better. Long work day for me today.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today was nothing but singles 6 at 75 to 100 yards and 3 at an unknown distance, she was worn out. Since I throw my own marks she gets to rest between marks and also gets break and water before the long marks , todays session took about2 hours and 30 minutes then we went on a cooldown walk.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

Just because....
Forgive me , I am a 'Heathen' from upland cover and often wet and cold. 
Just so I GET it right so far! ..you had an issue with multiple blinds and barrels, had a training day with a respected member on blinds way shorter in distance than you had an issue with , and now that a 'Derby' event is looming, Marks are now prime importance and you run singles in heat , stand alone marks are easier on the handler and dog btw, especially at dawn and daybreak..that aside... how did the "sending on blinds" with the helpful member help with 'Marks at 250 yards+' like others suggested ?..really interested, because it comes across as 'all over the place'. would love to make sense of it all thanks. Hope you get ribbons!


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Polimaise we have done marks for the last year , i do them constantly always retired. All I'm doing is stateing what I did today . And Wayne Nutt gave me some good tips on blind work and shes doing good , sorry for the confusion.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Polimaise we have done marks for the last year , i do them constantly always retired. All I'm doing is stateing what I did today . And Wayne Nutt gave me some good tips on blind work and shes doing good , sorry for the confusion.


No problem. Stand alone marks are good! No need for blinds or barrels or even ...a blind as a helper. Just marks.?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Yesterday was blinds and doubles mark 1 was about 150 yards in tall grass mark 2 was in ankle high grass at about 250 yards , blinds were set out long and short yardage.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today we went to feed at the spot I hunt on COE property. Then headed to the dam to do a couple of blinds 1 at 283 yard and 1 at 305 yards. Then went to the river to do doubles in water , the opened the gates up during a retrieve so lost a bird.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Jesse, Ranch hand is bush hogging/mowing at the Broken Road ranch now. Soon, I'll be going over there and we can stretch out quite a bit.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Im gonna try to call you in a week Wayne Nutt.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today was spent on blinds at 285 yards then 2 sets if quads early this morning , then at lunch 2 more blinds at 250 yards and 1 mark at 150. Lovinf this cooler weather it allows us to do more here in Texas.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Just my luck all the traing we've done to get ready for a derby and we couldn't get out of the 3rd series. She retrived the first bird but on the 2nd she just froze and would not leave my side. I picked her up the judges ask me to handle her to pick up the bird but I wasnt going to reward her for not leaving my side when sent. Back to the drawing board.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Todays training was marks and blinds. We did single marks , doubles and blinds thru the arch of the marks it was all mixed up long and short and had no balks on anything. Ended up using 3 parks and 2 areas on C.O.E. property . Started at 7 and ended at 10 with lots of breaks.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Just my luck all the traing we've done to get ready for a derby and we couldn't get out of the 3rd series. She retrived the first bird but on the 2nd she just froze and would not leave my side. I picked her up the judges ask me to handle her to pick up the bird but I wasnt going to reward her for not leaving my side when sent. Back to the drawing board.


Did she see both marks thrown?


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Todays training was marks and blinds. We did single marks , doubles and blinds thru the arch of the marks it was all mixed up long and short and had no balks on anything. Ended up using 3 parks and 2 areas on C.O.E. property . Started at 7 and ended at 10 with lots of breaks.



Less is more.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Druckenpoacher yes sir she saw both marks . I lined her up on the l/h one when we got to the line, had her pull her head to the mark on the right by stepping back when the mark was thrown and shot. I know that this sport isnt easy but darn she should have done what I commanded. Oh well it was a learning experience and hope to do better next time.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Tobias , right now I'm trying to get my point across to her , I may have not pushed her enough (im a softy) when I should have but the heat here in texas keeps me from doing that. Im going to follow this path then ease off before the next derby in Oklahoma.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today was 3 blinds and 4 marks only issue was on the 1st blind she refused to go. Every thing else was ok. I couldn't push her more than I did yesterday that was too much. I may have failed at a derby but I shouldn't push her so hard that I loose her spirit and love. We go on.


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Today was 3 blinds and 4 marks only issue was on the 1st blind she refused to go. Every thing else was ok. I couldn't push her more than I did yesterday that was too much. I may have failed at a derby but I shouldn't push her so hard that I loose her spirit and love. We go on.



My rules for training my own dogs that I have learned through trial and error 

#1 - There has to be something in it for the dog (always)
#2 - If my attitude is poor going into the training session, it will probably be even worse after. Make sure my attitude is good at the beginning of each session, no matter what.
#3 - Train the dog in front of me - not the dog I wish he/she ''would be' 
#4 - Live on the donut. (Thank you Denis Voigt) 
#5 - You can't fit a square peg in a round hole .
#6 - Keep training sessions short, two 10 minute successful sessions are better than one 20 minute 'session from hell'.

Somehow, I think all those rules are connected. LOL


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Thank you Tobias I realized that finally!


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Today was 3 blinds and 4 marks only issue was on the 1st blind she refused to go. Every thing else was ok. I couldn't push her more than I did yesterday that was too much. *I may have failed at a derby *but I shouldn't push her so hard that I loose her spirit and love. We go on.


You did not "fail" at the derby. You and your dog made it through 2 series. And I think this was your first derby? You should be proud. You should take away the positives from ANY trial. What did she do great in the first and second series? Remember those moments and be proud of her for those moments. As for not going on the memory bird in the the 3rd series, you may never know why she chose not to go? But that's ok. Don't over think it and just keep training. 

In FT's, you are going to lose WAY more trials then you will finish. It's the nature of the beast. Find the positives and then just keep training. Get'em next time.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Thank you Tobias I realized that finally!


curious /?
Was that after the donut' or while doing it ?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today's session was blinds there water, it didn't start well but ended on a. Good note. We went for a long walk afterwards.
For those wondering I did not mean that the dog failed the test but that I must have missed something in training and I failed the dog.
I am learning and trying to get better. But I won't take it out on her.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Well we ended up with a great 2 weeks of training doing marks and blinds. But failed in the 1st series at the SRC derby. The marks went long but the dogs disappeared in the tall grass. Something new to work on now.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

I havent stopped training , since I last posted . My dog is as ready as I can get her when she goes to the trainer next weekend. Today we revisited the double t then went for a swim and a walk. I'm not as experienced as most of you guys and gals but I think I've done a good job . Onward now to equals and hope for the best. Updates will come as she advances now.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Haven't posted in awhile so here we go. BOO is now wth the trainer, but she went into heat on day 3 sure surprised my wife and I. Reports coming in are good and the foundation I did is solid . Hoping to run her in QUALs in the springtime.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

My dog Boo is still with the trainer and won't run an event til she's ready. That being said this will be a continuing post just the dogs will change.
Today's training is just as it always is with a 7 week old puppy. Crate training, crying, barking, intro to duck,bumper and paint roller. She's kinda tuckered out right now so she's recharging her batteries for later today . Call name CINCO !


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Started the morning with crate training getting her used to going in and out , right now we are at the park and giving her a duck.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

What I've noticed about this puppy is that while she is a go-getter she doesn't just run out and try to retrieve she suits there and then goes to the thrown object. So do I have a timid dog or a thinking dog only time will tell.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Last night was the first quiet night since we brought Cinco home . My wife and I were up at 4:30 and Cinco went straight to the yard to air out. We fed her and I took her for a few laps around the yard, we did puppy retrieves with me restraing her and she's getting the idea to wait before she goes. Her sit training is going well. My wife works from home and I'm at work right now.


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

She's a baby yet...I don't worry about steadying puppies - I hold them by their chest and when the toy is in the air, release them on their name... use the motion/prey drive to your advantage. Sounds like she is adjusting well to her new life.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Tobias said:


> She's a baby yet...I don't worry about steadying puppies - I hold them by their chest and when the toy is in the air, release them on their name... use the motion/prey drive to your advantage. Sounds like she is adjusting well to her new life.


Tobias , I feel that it needs to be done this way everything this pup is showing me that she will be a handful .


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Tobias , I feel that it needs to be done this way everything this pup is showing me that she will be a handful .


I would have suggested the same as Tobias. Maybe we misinterpreted your prior comment that you were wondering if she was timid or a thinker?


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

In the end only you can be the judge of 'how much dog' you have. One thing to keep in mind is 'you can take it out of them, but you can't put it back in' --- If she is 'hesitant' to go once you release her, it seems like you are making her wonder if she should go or not go? At 8 weeks, I don't want any 'thinking' about going... That said, you are the one with the puppy in your hands  you know what she is doing, we only know what you tell us she is doing.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Tobias said:


> In the end only you can be the judge of 'how much dog' you have. One thing to keep in mind is 'you can take it out of them, but you can't put it back in' --- If she is 'hesitant' to go once you release her, it seems like you are making her wonder if she should go or not go? At 8 weeks, I don't want any 'thinking' about going... That said, you are the one with the puppy in your hands  you know what she is doing, we only know what you tell us she is doing.


Oh yeah all the signs are there, after all she is out of FC/AFC MICKEY who is a thinker and a Pow granddaughter. I've seen Mickey run at an event but Pow I have never seen before and he from what I've read brings alot to the table. No work today she gets a day off.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

I'm pretty much following Hillman with Yates. At Yates stage all retrieves are freebees. No restraining. He just does it differently.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

I get her excited in what ever we are going to use bird ,Kong, bumper or paint roller. If it thrown on the deck she is a deom but on the grass she stalks it like a cat then blows up on it . It's not being timid in my opinion it's her brain working . Hopefully by next weekend we have get her more fired up and thinking a little less.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Today is nothing but a long walk at a C.O.E. property we left after 2 unsavory people walked up to us. Let's just say I could handle any problem at that time. Overall it was a great day.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Success finally! Cinco finally quit thinking and just exploded on short duck retrieves. I did throw 2 ducks at least 20 yards that she dragged back most of the way , she wanted more but I put her up and try again tomorrow.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Great!


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

This morning was a continuation of yesterday except we also used a bumper and a Kong. I had someone on Facebook tell me not to use ducks only bumpers , to that I say BS . I use everything ball,knotted rope,bumper , birds, paint roller , sticks ,softdrink cans and plastic bottles. Just remember we're dealing with puppies and you present everything with a sense of excitement and fun ! I'm waiting for the water to warm up a little more before we both get in there for her swimming, this will be at lake TextMate. I'm cheap and don't have the money for a pool like Wayne has


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Lake Texoma.


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## DL (Jan 13, 2003)

If you didn’t want to work on lining, you could a mark and blind combinations or more advanced no no drills. I think you are asking the dog to do something advanced if you set up a three peat like that cold. I get the sense that you are setting it up then trying to teach it. I personally wouldn’t do that.

I’d set that up cold with a dog that I expected could do it. I wouldn’t set it up to teach with a transition dog. If you do, you might as well be setting up pattern blinds.

I think a mark and a blind would be good in a yard like place because it can go the opposite of the dog learning locations. The same can be said of no no blinds.

if you want to work on handling and not lining, I think pole drills do that.

That is what I think. I could wrong. Everybody thinks about something before they set something up. It isn’t limited to experts.


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## DL (Jan 13, 2003)

I didn’t realize the post was old and six pages long. Disregard.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

I unstood that , I figured you didn't catch it when I started with new puppy. No harm no foul DL .


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Not much going on over here just keeping the birds and bumper going on , we did go to JOE POOL LAKE and finally got her in some water so she can swim .


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Interesting day today , Cinco loves and wants her birds . My wife and I went out and threw for her and she marked and retrievd to 50 yards . She started out barking while at the mat then settled down and was quite for the last 2 marks .


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Two things:
I would lay off the birds. Barking at the line is one of the most difficult issues to fix. 
Don't become reliant on the mat. I use mat periodically especially around water where it may get muddy. I try to steady w/o mat but use mat sometimes where line placement is critical for running from same spot. 
These are just my suggestions.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

I agree Wayne , I know she's birds now and for the last few days am using bumpers. The results are she is wild , today was day 1 of trying to get her to settle down she can not retrieve til she quiets down. The plan is to still let her be a puppy just be quiet. Obedience starts next month and it will be very strict and done right that is pri 1. She will still get short happy bumpers but no more long throws. As I said she is a wild 1 and I hope I still have some hair on my head when its over. She's not thinking anymore!


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)




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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

She loves to swim .


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Great


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

It wasn't a long swim ,about 25 30 yards and this pong gets wider and longer. Just more work for later.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

This morning my wife and I took Cinco to the Dallas Farmers Market . She was very excited to have kids come from everywhere to come pet her , I must have gotten 100 plus sits in this short excursion!


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## Marvin S (Nov 29, 2006)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> View attachment 86665


Stop using white bumpers.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Marvin S said:


> Stop using white bumpers.


Marvin I have been told not to use birds , and you believe that I use only white bumpers , well let me tell you what I throw .
White ,black and orange bumpers I also throw ducks , pheasant and quail now if I were to follow all the advice that has been given to me what am I to throw in water rocks? The white bumper was the first thing we grabbed before heading to my trainers. We stopped off at my brothers property just to give her some more swimming time . She also gets staked out to watch h the big dogs run and hears alot of shooting this has helped on her barking . So what would you suggest that I do Marvin ( my experience goes back to the mid 80's) no disrespect intended I'm just surprised by what people suggest.


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## Marvin S (Nov 29, 2006)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Marvin I have been told not to use birds , and you believe that I use only white bumpers , well let me tell you what I throw .
> White ,black and orange bumpers I also throw ducks , pheasant and quail now if I were to follow all the advice that has been given to me what am I to throw in water rocks? The white bumper was the first thing we grabbed before heading to my trainers. We stopped off at my brothers property just to give her some more swimming time . She also gets staked out to watch h the big dogs run and hears alot of shooting this has helped on her barking . So what would you suggest that I do Marvin ( my experience goes back to the mid 80's) no disrespect intended I'm just surprised by what people suggest.


I watched a very well broke out FC-AFC pick a white cup out of nowhere to head for to retrieve. 
Dog had trial won up to that point. You can make whatever you want from that.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Marvin, Do you realize that this puppy is about three months old? Jeez.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Wayne Nutt said:


> Marvin, Do you realize that this puppy is about three months old? Jeez.


Thanks Wayne , I was going to let him know that but I let it be.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Well the waiting begins again for me. My older dog BOO is in Colorado to run at Ft Collins event I'm hoping for the best and she is on her game . She's running in the Qual and she is in good hands let's see how it goes.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Good luck Boo.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Thank you Wayne.


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## Mark Littlejohn (Jun 16, 2006)

Jesus Ochoa said:


> Well the waiting begins again for me. My older dog BOO is in Colorado to run at Ft Collins event I'm hoping for the best and she is on her game . She's running in the Qual and she is in good hands let's see how it goes.


Note that Ft.Collins is on the 6th. Is Mark up there yet?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Yes Mark has been there for a week week and a half sir. BOO is in good hands with him.


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Best of luck to Boo at the trial in CO. Mark recently sent me a photo of Skyy investigating some stacked bird crates (presumably full of ducks) and indicated that was where they were!


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Marvin S said:


> I watched a very well broke out FC-AFC pick a white cup out of nowhere to head for to retrieve.
> Dog had trial won up to that point. You can make whatever you want from that.


Would not surprise me at all... Even a duck's wing sticking up is white. I watched some experienced derby dogs key in on a small pale colored rock that happened to be catching the morning light 'just right'.


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## polmaise (Jan 6, 2009)

Tobias said:


> I watched some *experienced derby dogs* key in on a small pale colored rock that happened to be catching the morning light 'just right'.


Confused slightly Juli ? ..I thought 'experienced derby dogs' were excellent Markers?  Why would they be de-tracted on anything else ?.


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Tobias said:


> Best of luck to Boo at the trial in CO. Mark recently sent me a photo of Skyy investigating some stacked bird crates (presumably full of ducks) and indicated that was where they were!


Tobias the last time that I saw her I noticed that she is very birdy


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

polmaise said:


> Confused slightly Juli ? ..I thought 'experienced derby dogs' were excellent Markers?  Why would they be de-tracted on anything else ?.


An experienced derby dog is not the same as an all age dog (by any stretch of the imagination). An experienced derby dog may or may not be an excellent marking dog, but I bet it has been thrown a lot of marks, maybe with white streamers on the legs of the birds, or white bumpers if the person training the dog doesn't have the funds to throw birds every day.

A light colored rock (light gray, of the right shape and size) could certainly influence many dogs. And the fact that the use of white flagging on birds (in trials) is not uncommon, so a dog would/could be easily 'tricked' by a white plastic cup or even a light colored rock close to the AOF....... Do UK dogs never stop to check out a 'similarly shaped object' to the bird or hare it was sent after?


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## Jesus Ochoa (Apr 10, 2018)

Just a short update on BOO. On her summer trip she ran 3 quals and went out all 3 times, right now she appears to be ready for a few events . She's gotten to come home a couple of times but the goal is to get her through quals and move on to the open . Maturity , she's now 3 seems to be helping her so we will evaluate her progress in June and make a decision at that time. Enjoy your holiday time everyone.


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