# Average Cost??



## Gerald Kelley (Apr 26, 2010)

Just curious what the average cost is to send one to be profesionally trained and campaigned until it recieved its HRCH and MH titles. Dog comes home to hunt during hunting seasons then returns to compete. Not counting puppy price, vet bills and things like that. I know all dogs are different, but I bet there is an average cost to have one fully trained and titled?


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## Breck (Jul 1, 2003)

Budget $1,000/month for duration. If you want to "compete" look into field trials.


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## Jerry and Freya (Sep 13, 2008)

Gerald Kelley said:


> Just curious what the average cost is to send one to be profesionally trained and campaigned until it recieved its HRCH and MH titles. Dog comes home to hunt during hunting seasons then returns to compete. Not counting puppy price, vet bills and things like that. I know all dogs are different, but I bet there is an average cost to have one fully trained and titled?


Think of it as putting a kid thru college.

What with cost to Pro and entry fees, I would figure over a $1,000.00 a month


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## Gerald Kelley (Apr 26, 2010)

How many months from start to finish do you think? are we talking 12k from start to finish or more then that. saying they compete 6 months are year?


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## DoubleHaul (Jul 22, 2008)

Figure the dog goes off at about 7 months. Stays with the pro until the titles, varies but probably until it is about 2-3 years old. That would not be taking the dog home. If you did that, deduct how long you would have it home for hunting season (but I would keep it with the pro for the first year), but you would probably have to add more on the back end as losing that training time would probably mean the dog was older when it titled.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

With a talented dog and a good trainer, figure 30-36 months of training and testing to get both titles. So about $30,000 to $40,000. 3-4 YOA for an MH is about the norm.-Paul


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## Gerald Kelley (Apr 26, 2010)

Ouch!!! LOL 
I was way off! I was hoping more like $10K Haha DREAM CRUSHED......


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## DoubleHaul (Jul 22, 2008)

Gerald Kelley said:


> Ouch!!! LOL
> I was way off! I was hoping more like $10K Haha DREAM CRUSHED......


Well, you don't have to pay it all up front  Also, there is no reason you couldn't get a MH on your dog without a pro. It would take longer, most likely, but it is certainly possible. If you really want bang for your buck, put the dog with a pro until it is through transition then take up the training yourself. The dog will have basic skills and you can work on the more advanced stuff on your own.


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## Gerald Kelley (Apr 26, 2010)

I agree was just thinking it would be nice to have one 3 or so that was finished to enjoy hunting since that what I get to do most of. I don't have the know how to even pass a MH test with a MH dog LOL.


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## WBF (Feb 11, 2012)

If you are just looking for an HRCH and MH title, I think you can get it done cheaper if you find the right breeding that gives you the best chance to make what you are looking for. A balanced breeding and a good trainer can put HRCH tiles on pretty close to a year or a little after. It really just comes down to finding a nice balance breeding and a pro that is geared to get you what you want. Be sure to find someone that can devote good time each day with your dog. Be careful and do your research, if you put your dog with someone that has 30+ dogs on the truck you might be doubling the time in training. If they do have several dogs just make sure they have a good system so your animal gets the drill work it needs as well as marks and setups. Gerald PM me


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## Good Dogs (Nov 1, 2005)

Gerald Kelley said:


> I agree was just thinking it would be nice to have one 3 or so that was finished to enjoy hunting since that what I get to do most of. I don't have the know how to even pass a MH test with a MH dog LOL.


You don't need a title to have a good hunting dog. But the skills you and pup learn through the training process will make for a better team and more fun on the hunt. Ask around for a good "gun dog" trainer and get to know him/her. The good ones will be happy to engage you in the the training process and will start off by helping you find the right dog for you. Offer to help out with training and kennel work in exchange for training/boarding offsets. For $10K you can easily, with luck, get a nice pup and feed, vet and train it to a level that will work well with you in any hunting situation.


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## Steve Shaver (Jan 9, 2003)

paul young said:


> With a talented dog and a good trainer, figure 30-36 months of training and testing to get both titles. So about $30,000 to $40,000. 3-4 YOA for an MH is about the norm.-Paul



Guess Im going to have to raise my rates. I do it for half that.


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## WBF (Feb 11, 2012)

For $40k I hope I'm close to having an FC. You can find a AA washout for $10,000 to $15,000 that will run all the MH test you want. Hunt test pros buy them for their clients everyday. Some stack their trucks with them to run the SRS. A nice trained dog will make any handler look good.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

WBF said:


> For $40k I hope I'm close to having an FC. You can find a AA washout for $10,000 to $15,000 that will run all the MH test you want.


AA WASHOUT FOR $10,000= BAGGAGE. Just my opinion.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

I feel like I need to explain my estimate.

In 21 years of training and testing my own dogs, and 18+ years of judging HT's for all 3 programs, I would say the AVERAGE age of a SOLID MH/HRCH performer is 3 yoa. By solid, I mean passing 75% of the tests they are entered in.

Yes, I've seen a few prodigies that could pass just about anything thrown at them as 2 year-olds, but the key here is FEW. I have even seen some achieve the titles earlier, but they had some real holes in their training and failed more tests than they passed. They were thrown into water way over their head, and to their credit, persevered through sheer talent in spite of insufficient training. 

The OP expressed a desire to have a dog trained to those titles. I based the price on food, Vet bills, training cost, live bird costs, entry fees, and handlers fees. I really don't think I'm that far off.

As someone else pointed out, this is beyond what makes a good hunting dog. I would say that an HR/SH/WR would fill a hunter's needs very nicely. That could be done by a good pro with a good pupil in probably half that amount of time, and that level of training is within most amateurs ability if they are willing to put in the sweat/hours/time.-Paul


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## WBF (Feb 11, 2012)

paul young said:


> AA WASHOUT FOR $10,000= BAGGAGE. Just my opinion.


If a 3 year old HRCH MH titled dog is worth 40k and people pay that, I'm in. What do you think they would be worth at 2 years? Man HT pros must be living high on the hog.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

WBF said:


> If a 3 year old HRCH MH titled dog is worth 40k and people pay that, I'm in. What do you think they would be worth at 2 years? Man HT pros must be living high on the hog.


Not worth it to me, I train my own.

People think Pros are getting rich charging what they do. They would be AMAZED at the overhead costs involved in that business. If you're thinking of 'getting in' , you better have $100,000 dollars start-up money. Full trucks are earned. The first few years will be pretty lean ones.-Paul


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## cvrsix (Mar 13, 2011)

I have a 3 year old HRCH. Working towards MH now. In first year he was with trainer 4 months. Second year 5 months. Third year 3 months. During the time at trainers I tried to go and train with them weekly, and brought him home on weekends. When he wasn't in full time training with pro I work him a little each day if possible. We run lots of tests. Went SHR, HR, then HRCH. In process of getting AKC titles now. 

Approx year or so with pro full time spread over 3 years. 

Not sure how some are calculating time or money. 

I only count training fees, and hunt test expenses. Even if not hunt test or hunting dog I would still have food and vet expenses, so why include.

I couldn't have left mine for 12-15 months straight and expected same result. He needed to mature. Hunting was good to settle and focus him, plus it increased his drive and excitement to train. Plus I needed time to learn as well to be better handler. My trainer has always joked with me that he knew my dog could do it, but he wasn't sure about me. So, he was training both of us!

My trainer's fees include training and food. No hunt test or travel included. You pay that as you test. He will run your dog, but encourages owners to handle themselves. I paid approx $500 a month.

Brett Bunk at Cuivre River Retrievers is my pro. Small operation. Trains only 10-12 at time. Books almost year in advance.


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## Gerald Kelley (Apr 26, 2010)

CVRSIX my thoughts exactly on the other expenses. So your saying a couple thousand a year for your dog so far the way I look at it.
I agree I don't need the title for a hunting dog. I have a dog that isn't trained anywhere close to that level and she has picked up every bird I have ever asked of her. Some I didn't ask of her when she was younger lol. To have my pup titled and trained to that level is a dream of mine. He might be a washout hard to tell at 4 months old.

Thanks for all the replies
Gerald


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## waycool (Jan 23, 2014)

My .02.. What does the title give you ? Just food for thought... Dogs don't live very long.. and its unlikely you'll recoup the costs with stud fees... Been there done that (myself fwiw not with a pro) and not with retrievers just to be clear.. 

Point being you can have a great dog that has every skill that a dog with a title has .. without the title. 

If you just want one (i.e. bucket list) then figure out how to work it out, as many have suggested above and do the deal !  

I worked my butt off to finish several field champions myself (cause I couldn't afford to pay a pro) and it was satisfying but the reality is... they are still dogs, they don't live nearly long enough and a title doesn't make your day out hunting any better than if the dog doesn't have a title.. 

fwiw everyone please don't start the whole "why we NEED HT, FT" I understand the need to test/compete  I'm just helping Gerald with some things to think about .. I've been there (obviously not with retrievers but nonetheless) and now am past it.. so I'm giving him my reflection of my experiences..

Best wishes and best of luck no matter your decision...


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## David McCracken (May 24, 2009)

Most trainers around here charge $400-$600 per month. They would need your dog for about 6-8 months to put an HRCH on him, so that's around $3000-$4000 for training. You also have the costs of tests and handling fees. Assuming the dog passes every test, you'll run 2 Started, 3 Seasoned, and 4 Finished tests at an average cost of $60 each for $540 and about the same for handling fees ($540). So, if your dog passes everything, it will cost around $5500 for an HRCH.
Then, if you want to go for 1000 points, like I did, (with a dog that didn't pass every test), well, I don't even want to think about what I've spent. But, we've had a BALL!!!!


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## WBF (Feb 11, 2012)

David McCracken said:


> Most trainers around here charge $400-$600 per month. They would need your dog for about 6-8 months to put an HRCH on him, so that's around $3000-$4000 for training. You also have the costs of tests and handling fees. Assuming the dog passes every test, you'll run 2 Started, 3 Seasoned, and 4 Finished tests at an average cost of $60 each for $540 and about the same for handling fees ($540). So, if your dog passes everything, it will cost around $5500 for an HRCH.
> Then, if you want to go for 1000 points, like I did, (with a dog that didn't pass every test), well, I don't even want to think about what I've spent. But, we've had a BALL!!!!


I agree with David. That is the average price that you will spend for an HRCH dog. Give or take depending on the amount of tests that are ran. You will probable save a little buying one already finished.


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## ADB391 (Jan 9, 2014)

Another question to add to this…how many of you have bought a dog and left it with a trainer for this long to achieve these titles? If you figure you send the dog off at 6 months or so, and it takes another 6-8 months to get to HRCH (at minimum) and you factor in that most people pay around $1,000 for the dog (at least), then another average of $5,500 in training fees you're looking at best case scenario: $6,500 investment and not having your dog for at least one hunting season if his birthday falls in a good time of the year.

I'm just curious how many people have put the time and money into doing this? If you have no plans on breeding him, is there still an advantage to it?

We had a dog get to SH at about 14 months or so. The trainer asked my bro in law to keep him and continue running him because he had potential. With hunting season quickly approaching, he declined to leave him with the trainer because he wanted to hunt him. His reasoning was two fold: #1) he bought the dog to hunt #2) he thought the more time he spent in the blind at a young age picking up birds, the better hunting dog he would be later. Thoughts?


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## Lonnie Spann (May 14, 2012)

WBF said:


> For $40k I hope I'm close to having an FC. You can find a AA washout for $10,000 to $15,000 that will run all the MH test you want. Hunt test pros buy them for their clients everyday. Some stack their trucks with them to run the SRS. A nice trained dog will make any handler look good.


Amen.

Lonnie Spann


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## Steve Shaver (Jan 9, 2003)

cvrsix said:


> I have a 3 year old HRCH. Working towards MH now. In first year he was with trainer 4 months. Second year 5 months. Third year 3 months. During the time at trainers I tried to go and train with them weekly, and brought him home on weekends. When he wasn't in full time training with pro I work him a little each day if possible. We run lots of tests. Went SHR, HR, then HRCH. In process of getting AKC titles now.
> 
> Approx year or so with pro full time spread over 3 years.
> 
> ...






This is exactly the way it goes with most of my client dogs. It's not that big a deal or actually require a real special dog to earn a MH or MH level at 3 yr old whether you want the title or not.
If I could make 30 or 40 grand on a master level dog I would not take any client dogs on I would just go buy a whole litter of decently bred pups train them to master level and sell them. Hell I would only need to sell a couple a year! Now if your looking to end up with a FC quality dog the 30 or 40 grand is not unrealistic.


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## i_willie12 (Apr 11, 2008)

You start wanting to add advanced work to dogs it takes time!! Several months if not years Just think about the average age of a dog that passes a HRCH MH... its about 3.5-5 years old


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## Gerald Kelley (Apr 26, 2010)

I understand just wondered how much a guy would end up spending to get there.


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## ebenezer (Aug 19, 2009)

have a friend with a NFTC which she bred, had 10 pups which sold for $5000.00 a piece. Commented that that was a nice chunk of change. Her reply was that it was a drop in the ocean compared to what she had invested in the dog.


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## i_willie12 (Apr 11, 2008)

I dont even want to add up what my HRCH cost!!!!


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## GaryJ (Jan 1, 2013)

ADB391 said:


> Another question to add to this…how many of you have bought a dog and left it with a trainer for this long to achieve these titles? If you figure you send the dog off at 6 months or so, and it takes another 6-8 months to get to HRCH (at minimum) and you factor in that most people pay around $1,000 for the dog (at least), then another average of $5,500 in training fees you're looking at best case scenario: $6,500 investment and not having your dog for at least one hunting season if his birthday falls in a good time of the year.
> 
> I'm just curious how many people have put the time and money into doing this? If you have no plans on breeding him, is there still an advantage to it?
> 
> We had a dog get to SH at about 14 months or so. The trainer asked my bro in law to keep him and continue running him because he had potential. With hunting season quickly approaching, he declined to leave him with the trainer because he wanted to hunt him. His reasoning was two fold: #1) he bought the dog to hunt #2) he thought the more time he spent in the blind at a young age picking up birds, the better hunting dog he would be later. Thoughts?


I bought my dog for hunting too. The dog in my avatar is a neutered male. We had a couple labs several years ago my wife and I trained. She put a Junior Hunter title on one and I hunted both of them. I thought I could train this guy to hunt but found I really didn't have time. So I looked around and found a pro I really like and then sent him off to get forced, collar conditioned, and started on handling. I got him back after 4 months and I was happy and had a dog I could hunt. Then the HT game bit me so we did the Junior Hunt tests and a couple Started ones. I decided I liked the game so I sent him back for another round to get him and me, mostly me, ready for Senior hunt tests. I think that was another 4 months. He has his Senior title. Now I am trying to train him to be ready for Master tests this fall with a lot guidance from my pro and others. He has 2 years of hunting experience and yes I don't really need to put any more titles on him but like I said earlier I like the game. Getting ready for round 2 as we just bought a puppy a couple weeks back and will follow the same path with professional training along with some breaks in between for hunting etc.

The advantage to me in using a pro is the time reduction to get your dog where you want it to be as well as minimizing the time to unlearn a bad practice. As a novice trainer even following a program little things can be overlooked. As for Hunt Tests or Field Trials that is a personal choice. I have met some real nice folks along the way at Hunt Tests.


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## Breck (Jul 1, 2003)

Another thing to keep in mind is your dogs health. Sport injuries can hit your pocketbook pretty hard.
Get health insurance for your dogs right away, when they're puppies.
.
And back to the original topic.
BUDGET $1,000/month for a dog in training/running events.


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## SWBB (Aug 25, 2013)

I have a 20 month old BLM. I bought him from a highly, highly reputable trainer in Jonesboro Arkansas. I also had this pro trainer train my dog as well. I ran him in 4/4 seasoned tests to get his HR title at 16 months and 5/5 in SH at 18 months old. We have taken duck season off from training and focused on hunting. He picked up 250 ducks this year plus countless pheasants from a few tower shoots. I expanded off of the fundamentals the pro put in my dog for 10 months. I couldnt be happier... All in all, I had kennel fees of $750/month x 10 months. That comes out to $7500.

I ran him in all the hunt tests myself. I have probably $600 in entry fees. I chose to run him in the tests myself because 1 i thought I would save some money.... I totally forgot travel expense and time involved. I am glad I ran my dog, but dont cross out letting a pro run him for you. Its not a bad deal in the big picture.

I have $8500 +/- in kennel fees and hunt test entry fees. I hunted my dog his first season and he did phenomenal. We are training for finished right now, and have been doing finished work for quite some time. I should have his HRCH this spring and have his MH this fall. He will be 2.5 years old in December for referance. Hope this helps.

The route I chose to go wasnt the cheapest, but I have a solid trained dog with tons of potential. I know many who have spent alot more, but I wouldnt trade it for the world the route I chose. The bond created between us passing our first hunt test together to picking up his first mallard and Sprig Pintail in an Arkansas Ricefield, priceless...

Good luck!


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## Russ (Jan 3, 2003)

At 55 cents per mile, it costs us going on $1000 per month in auto expense. Add the cost of food & supplements, entry fees, ground fees, etc., it is cheaper send to a pro than train ourselves...but not near as rewarding. Of course the cost goes down in places that do not entail driving at least 100 miles one way to get halfway decent technical water.


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## swampcollielover (Nov 30, 2012)

Wow...this is why I really like this forum....this is a great post, with many really good comments....

I have been a duck hunter for most of my life, but until 25+ years ago I never had a dog. I then got my first Golden Retriever (I know, I know...why not a Lab, that's another story). I started reading books on how to train dogs to hunt. My oldest son and I spent most of a summer training her to retrieve, sit, heal, etc.,...that season out we went to hunt with her. Fortunately, she had a lot of natural talent, but if she did not see the fall, my son became the retriever. I knew there was more to learn...

A friend ask me to a hunt test, had no idea what it was...but the people their looked at my dog, and took lots of time to start teaching me about hunt tests, retrievers, and even talked about Field Trials. I left that test inspired to learn more. Since then I have had 5 more Goldens (3 still with me). I have used pro trainers on all of them, including my current girl who is in Texas now getting her second round of training. The first two dogs I only had trained for 4 months, to a level to pass JH. With each dog and I have learned more and I was able to take them to where they could line and handle fairly well when hunting with us. 

My initial goal was to have a good hunting dog, that goal was accomplished with all my dogs...but during this time...I also got hooked on hunt tests..I earned some titles but never a MH....this time, with my new girl, we plan to go all the way. She has all the talent....I'm just not sure my trainer will ever get me good enough to handle her at that level....I hesitate to have someone else handle her because, it is not the title itself, it is me handling her to a title that I want.

For having these dogs is something special as both my wife and I love the dogs, I love to hunt with them, and one of my favorite pass times is running them on hunt tests. That is why I spend the money and the time.....not to make money on breeding, or selling them after training...

I think it is important if you spend this time and money to know exactly what you want out of it....for me it is pure pleasure (sometime frustrating)...but then what isn't if it is a challenge....


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## ADB391 (Jan 9, 2014)

swampcollielover said:


> She has all the talent....I'm just not sure my trainer will ever get me good enough to handle her at that level....I hesitate to have someone else handle her because, it is not the title itself, it is me handling her to a title that I want.


I feel the same way too! I feel like any of his short comings will be my fault, not his. I would like to do some hunt tests if we ever get good enough. It just seems fun


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

If you have a hobby it is probably not cheap. Golf, fishing, photography etc. If you calculate the cost versus the level of enjoyment you get and it does not measure up to expectations find a new hobby. Field trials have been my hobby for my entire adult life and I have never considered the cost except for how it fits into my budget which has changed considerably in almost 45 years. 

I disagree with Paul that a so called field trial washout equals baggage as I could give many examples of those dogs who went on to have successful field trial careers, careers as family hunting dogs, careers as professional hunting guide dogs, and successful careers as detection dogs. Generally buying a trained dog is cheaper than starting with a puppy without the time and risk involved.


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## roseberry (Jun 22, 2010)

i an not advertising but.......i can tell y'all where there is a well bred, solid, qual/master/finished dog for waaaaaaay less than $40k!


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

roseberry said:


> i an not advertising but.......i can tell y'all where there is a well bred, solid, qual/master/finished dog for waaaaaaay less than $40k!


But does the dog have "baggage"?


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## RookieTrainer (Mar 11, 2011)

GaryJ said:


> The advantage to me in using a pro is the time reduction to get your dog where you want it to be as well as minimizing the time to unlearn a bad practice. As a novice trainer even following a program little things can be overlooked.


As a new trainer, one of the best things you can do is have a pro FF and CC your dog for you. That way you can be sure of your foundation, and you can get some training in how to do some of that stuff as well. It has been invaluable to me and my dog.

Once you do that, you may also get opportunities to go back and train with that pro sometimes, or maybe even bounce ideas off them. Around here, being able to send them up north is good too.

Just my $0.02.


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## roseberry (Jun 22, 2010)

EdA said:


> But does the dog have "baggage"?


for $20k he can definitely have baggage! i can pack his things in a bag by loius vuitton, coach, tumi.......you name it!


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## big gunner (Mar 1, 2010)

I totaled up what it cost me for 1 year to campaign my dog end of derby to QAA on my own with help from pros. 23m for the year. It would have been cheaper to have sent him to a pro. But I have the satisfaction to have done it so far by my self with help from friends. There is just something about doing it your self when everyone said that you couldn't.


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## jpws (Mar 26, 2012)

I sent my very well bred 6 month old pup to a reputable pro. She stayed for 11 months ($6600). She was in a group ("class) with other young dogs that ran pretty much the same things daily all at the same level. When i got her back, they were on pattern blinds and had done swim by. I dont think they'd run any double yet or cold blinds. With the outstanding base she'd gained, I took her myself with very limited ability and put a seasoned title on her 2 months after picking her up (at around 21 months). We then hunted/guided a 7 day pheasant hunt in SD, and hunted ducks all this year (much diff than HT i learned!), but plan on running finished this Spring. My intent is to give it a try on my own for the first couple to see where we are, and if we have a long way to go i intend to send her back to training for 3-4 months of brush up pro training and give it a go again in the fall. For me, its about having a good dog, better pet, and the competitiveness/desire to reach HRCH - at which time I'd imagine I will try for more. to answer the original $$ question, I have roughly $7000 in training and Hunt Test entries and have my UKC HR (21 months) and would imagine we will have out HRCH by this fall (2.5YO) which may or may not require another $2500 or so in Pro training. Assuming it does, i will have right at $10K in Training and Test fees to get the HRCH.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

EdA said:


> If you have a hobby it is probably not cheap. Golf, fishing, photography etc. If you calculate the cost versus the level of enjoyment you get and it does not measure up to expectations find a new hobby. Field trials have been my hobby for my entire adult life and I have never considered the cost except for how it fits into my budget which has changed considerably in almost 45 years.
> 
> I disagree with Paul that a so called field trial washout equals baggage as I could give many examples of those dogs who went on to have successful field trial careers, careers as family hunting dogs, careers as professional hunting guide dogs, and successful careers as detection dogs. Generally buying a trained dog is cheaper than starting with a puppy without the time and risk involved.


Fair enough, Ed. I'm sure that quite a few FT washouts go on to be great HT and hunting dogs.

Today, good FT breedings are in the 3k-5k range for an 8 week old ball of fur. I question how many All-Age washouts go for as little as $10k. The owners would easily have double that amount invested in the dog. -Paul


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## Keith Stroyan (Sep 22, 2005)

EdA said:


> But does the dog have "baggage"?


Of course, they all do eventually.

It's a question of "good" an "bad" for the trip you want to take.


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## Breck (Jul 1, 2003)

paul young said:


> Fair enough, Ed. I'm sure that quite a few FT washouts go on to be great HT and hunting dogs.
> 
> Today, good FT breedings are in the 3k-5k range for an 8 week old ball of fur. I question how many All-Age washouts go for as little as $10k. The owners would easily have double that amount invested in the dog. -Paul


.
The amount invested in a dog has no bearing on the selling price of a washout. Hell I "gave" one away I had ~$25k invested in as 2 year old.


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## BJGatley (Dec 31, 2011)

If you have a really good dog to start off and can show the potential, then there are sponsors out there that will help...JMO... 

Edit to post: You got to know the game and rub elbows with those who have the deep pockets. That's just how the game plays...


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## limiman12 (Oct 13, 2007)

My current dog went to a pro for FF. came home mostly through FTP..... I had her home for 2-3 months, sent her back for force to water and swim by. I got her ready to run Senior tests, she went back for two months. In that time she got SH and one leg of master. She came home for hunting and the next spring, went back mostly ready to run Master about three weeks before a string of master tests and she passed three for three. In that time I ran her for APLA and NAHRA titles when she w home..... All total she was at my friend/pros house for seven or so months. I got a lot of bang for the buck because I had her Ready to be there for the part I was not as comfortable doing. I think she is a little better then average dog perhaps and is easy to train. We don't have MH and Hrch but are one pass short of MH, should have it but I screwed her up lst fall at a couple tests, don't run HRCH but have an MHR and 3xgmpr on her. I have WAY less the 10k in her, but it would take more then that to buy her....


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## JoeOverby (Jan 2, 2010)

David McCracken said:


> Most trainers around here charge $400-$600 per month. They would ineed your dog for about 6-8 months to put an HRCH on him, so that's around $3000-$4000 for training. You also have the costs of tests and handling fees. Assuming the dog passes every test, you'll run 2 Started, 3 Seasoned, and 4 Finished tests at an average cost of $60 each for $540 and about the same for handling fees ($540). So, if your dog passes everything, it will cost around $5500 for an HRCH.
> Then, if you want to go for 1000 points, like I did, (with a dog that didn't pass every test), well, I don't even want to think about what I've spent. But, we've had a BALL!!!!


David, I think your timeline is waaaayy off. 6 months for an HRCH?? Really?? That means the average age of a pro trains HRCH is 12 months?? No sir. Try 24 months. More like 12-18 months of training. That's 7-10k at $600 a month.


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## Dave Kress (Dec 20, 2004)

Just an intresting post and i cant resist. 

I remember asking these same questions when we started. Yep the dollars were different but the questions were the same. 
Today it is different, no boat, no country club, no golf and almost no conversation that doesnt involve dog ! 
Consider holding up a fist full of currency in one hand and a match in the other, set it on fire, buy a lottery ticket, head to a casino if it is about money. Your chances will be better. 

Our dogs are a way of life, teamwork, training skills, an extended family. To us it is not about winning because we dont however it is about "the set of marks" , "the teamwork on the blind" and borrowing a phrase to be all we can be. 
We train our own dogs and we use a pro trainer. We help others and they help us. It takes time, patience and commitment plus coins. LYes we understand some need others to train their dogs, some of our friends live in subdivisions, most have jobs. Kids and their sports, lifes and needs come first. It also helps if the spouse likes to be out with the dogs. Yet their dogs are important. 

To the guy getting started- please have your budget and understand it is not about the money. Enjoy the ride and experiance all the bumps 
Dk


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

paul young said:


> Fair enough, Ed. I'm sure that quite a few FT washouts go on to be great HT and hunting dogs.
> 
> Today, good FT breedings are in the 3k-5k range for an 8 week old ball of fur. I question how many All-Age washouts go for as little as $10k. The owners would easily have double that amount invested in the dog. -Paul


I know this from personal experience having sold one, a 5k puppy at 24 months for 6.5K, he retrieved over 200 ducks this season and has a satisfied owner, I know of several more, the sellers, like me, more concerned about a good home than the sale's price.


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## jpws (Mar 26, 2012)

EdA said:


> I know this from personal experience having sold one, a 5k puppy at 24 months for 6.5K, he retrieved over 200 ducks this season and has a satisfied owner, I know of several more, the sellers, like me, more concerned about a good home than the sale's price.



I'd certainly like the opportunity to provide a good warm bed inside, and lots of good pheasant, duck, and dove hunts as well as HRCH hunt tests to keep a FT WASHOUT active should you know of any more dogs that fit this bill.


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## Steve Shaver (Jan 9, 2003)

paul young said:


> Fair enough, Ed. I'm sure that quite a few FT washouts go on to be great HT and hunting dogs.
> 
> Today, good FT breedings are in the 3k-5k range for an 8 week old ball of fur. I question how many All-Age washouts go for as little as $10k. The owners would easily have double that amount invested in the dog. -Paul





I sold a pup (Fc x qaa) for $1500 . Bought him back for $2750 at 2 years old. He had approx 15 months of professional training. Plan on running quals and master tests with him this year


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

EdA said:


> I know this from personal experience having sold one, a 5k puppy at 24 months for 6.5K, he retrieved over 200 ducks this season and has a satisfied owner, I know of several more, the sellers, like me, more concerned about a good home than the sale's price.


Lucky people.


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## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

Gerald Kelley said:


> Ouch!!! LOL
> I was way off! I was hoping more like $10K Haha DREAM CRUSHED......


Depending on the dog's inherent talent, your ability to train on your own with help from good amateurs and a pro here and there, and some luck, the cost can be much less than that. The stars kind of lined up for me and my first dog. He had sufficient talent, very birdy, enough drive without being over the top and he really wanted to please me. I was able to hook up with an amateur working guy who possessed good dog sense and was just happy to have another working guy willing to throw birds evenings and weekends. The last pice of the puzzle was a great HT pro who was flexible and willing to take the dog for a month here and there to help work out issues.

Not counting entry fees and travel cost, I think I spent around $2,500.00 (1993 era) in training cost to run him through JH, SH, MH, NAHRA started and intermediate titles. The training with my buddy, growing in the sport with my dog and meet lots of fun people all over the west was priceless. If I were you I would find a good pro to take your dog through basics, figure $700-$800.00 a month for four to six months. Work with the pro as much as you can, then take your dog through Junior and Senior yourself. Find some amateurs to work with or go back to the pro for another season for that big step up to Master.

BTW, a senior hunter titled dog is a very good hunting companion. Don't be discouraged by the crazy $30-$40,000.00 figure. You could spend that as an absentee dog owner, and I shudder to think what I've spent on dogs the past twenty years, but you certainly can title your dog in hunt test for much less. That's the beauty of hunt test, they were designed for the working guy hunter to have fun with his or her dog.

John


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## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

paul young said:


> Lucky people.


Cheryl and I gave away a $2,000.00 washout with four months of training, (add on another $3,000.00). Like Dr. Ed we were more concerned with our pup going to a good home rather than get our money back.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

John Robinson said:


> Cheryl and I gave away a $2,000.00 washout with four months of training, (add on another $3,000.00). Like Dr. Ed we were more concerned with our pup going to a good home rather than get our money back.


Lucky dog and people.


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## BlaineT (Jul 17, 2010)

aint a pro. hang out with a pro a lot though. see a lot of dogs come in and out of his program. to answer the original question. I'd say its gonna cost what it costs for that dog. Can't really put a price on it. way yonder too many variables.


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## Steve Shaver (Jan 9, 2003)

paul young said:


> With a talented dog and a good trainer, figure 30-36 months of training and testing to get both titles. So about $30,000 to $40,000. 3-4 YOA for an MH is about the norm.-Paul




Just one more point to make. If it cost 30 to 40 K to get a MH I seriously doubt there would be over 800 dogs qualified for the Master National. As I said with a decent pup I can do it for a 1/3 or maybe 1/2 at the most of that.


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## roseberry (Jun 22, 2010)

jpws said:


> I'd certainly like the opportunity to provide a good warm bed inside, and lots of good pheasant, duck, and dove hunts as well as HRCH hunt tests to keep them active should you know of any more dogs that fit this bill.


i am certainly no dr. ed. but i mentioned that i "know of" one for waaaaaaay less than $40k. i mentioned $20k, which includes a $13.5k set of designer luggage!;-).......and no pm from you yet?


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## Gerald Kelley (Apr 26, 2010)

Roseberry Im sure not in the market to buy one but it sounds like it would have been a cheaper route!


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## roseberry (Jun 22, 2010)

gerald,
this was a very interesting thread you started. the dog "i know of" is currently on hold pending demo! the family passed on the baggage, said just put his things in a DG bag.
jmc


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## Moose Mtn (May 23, 2013)

So much depends on the dog and the trainer! Im using a well known guy, who understands the style and breeding of the dog I have... He clicks with her. I think the results he is getting show that. 

I have one right now..born 4/2012 sent her to the trainer at 7.5 months old, and had her Jr title at 11months old (3.5 months of training) without a scratch or fail. Senior has been a bit tougher... First test was a fail.. she crossed into an area she shouldnt have taking a not so great route to the flyer, and failed it.. Then an injury scratch (out of a test in MY backyard!) 3 good Sr passes and recently had another scratch due to weather. So she is still needing 1 pass for her Senior title, but is also running Master this weekend....and is in a few masters in coming weeks. So she should be in training about 18 mo, and about 2yrs old as a Master dog.. if all goes well.


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## Migillicutty (Jan 11, 2014)

roseberry said:


> gerald,
> this was a very interesting thread you started. the dog "i know of" is currently on hold pending demo! the family passed on the baggage, said just put his things in a DG bag.
> jmc


Good for you John. Wish my timing was different. I would have really enjoyed putting some wear and tear on that luggage set.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

NEW MASTER HUNTERS 
Here are the 3 dogs that have earned their MH title since the last report (Name/title/owner/breed/sex/age)> Name in red is youngest dog.


Smallest stake - 42 (CSHRC)
Largest stake - 59 *MidFlGRC)


Brandywines Sweet Madeline MH David Ladd BF 5.8 yo 

Candlewood Chunky Girl MH Jeanne Fowler YLF 3.7 yo 

Elmingo's Violence On Request MH Rod Neterer BLF 5.2 yo


Note: The Retriever Results database is adding history every day. As a result, title announcements may be either premature or late. If we've missed a title you have earned, let us know. 
NEW SENIOR HUNTERS 
Here are the 7 dogs that have earned their SH since the last report (name/title/owner/breed/sex/age). Name in red is youngest dog.

Smallest stake - 12 (CSHRC)
Largest stake - 28 (MidFlGRC)

Lady Sandy Belle SH Charles Schumacher, Jr YLF 3.9 yo
Magicgold's Rock A Doodle Doo SH Cheryl Baca GF 1.9 yo
Rida's Mad Max SH Sandra Kenny BLM 2.1 yo
Sorrento's Wingnut SH Cole Fertic CLM 9.1 yo

Turbo Break My Rusty Cage And Run SH James Bryan GM 1.8 yo 
Turbo Smoke'n Khaotic Explosion SH Ron Rubrecht GF 2.8 yo 
Turbo Supersonic Shock Wave SH Bob Smith GM 1.8 yo

Note: The Retriever Results database is adding history every day. As a result, title announcements may be either premature or late. If we've missed a title you have earned, let us know. 
NEW JUNIOR HUNTERS 
Here are the 14 dogs that have earned their JH since the last report (name/title/owner/breed/sex/age). Name in red is youngest dog.

Smallest stake - 31 (CSHRC)
Largest stake - 40 (MidFlGRC)


Beechglenns St. Teresa JH Julie Oven YLF 1.2 yo
Dr. Emmett Brown JH Charlie Bassett BLM 1.6 yo
CH Hawks Nest Saranac Roll Of The Dice JH Joy Annunziato NF 3.1 yo
GCH-CH Kd's Tropical Provo JH Margaret Aldridge NM 4.6 yo
Knightdrmz Frank Lloyd Wright JH Janet Moore GM 4.2 yo
Knudsen's Goose Of Glenn JH Knud Knudsen BLM 1 yo
Maroco Dream Girl JH Colleen Markins YLF 2.7 yo
Moore's Cole Ii JH Mark Moore BLM 1 yo
Morninglo Breeze's Ripple Effect JH Glenda Manucy GF 1.7 yo
Qvale's Mabel JH Bruce Qvale BLF 1.1 yo
Qvale's Murphy JH Bruce Qvale BLM 1.1 yo
CH Scion's 4play JH Kathy Cudak GM 3.1 yo

Topbrass City Limits JH Bob & Macy Swift GM 0.9 yo 
Xl Javelina Lady Penelope JH Randall Hudson YLF 1 yo

Note: The Retriever Results database is adding history every day. As a result, title announcements may be either premature 


This is from Retriever Results HT edition. Note the ages of the MH and SH dogs that just titled. 12-18 months of training to achieve the MH title is just a little bit optomistic.

As someone already posted, it takes as long as it takes.-Paul


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## John Lash (Sep 19, 2006)

To send a dog to be trained full time is very expensive.

If you have access to a training group and decent grounds, you can send a dog away for the winter and spring and train him yourself the rest of the year. Then it's only "pretty" expensive.

If you are trying to do something at FT higher levels it's necessary for most people to do it that way IMO.


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## Barry Ireland (Feb 18, 2005)

We have been in and out of the "game" for a number of years. We have used pro's and we have done it ourselves with the help of some great people and great advice. We have literally spent tens of thousands on dogs and training. Most recently we had a very nice 16 month old male that had 11 months pro training and as the pro said, he was the star of the class. For some unknown reason we found him deceased in his kennel 6 weeks ago. We had autopsy done and tissues sent to the University and found no cause of death. What a great disappointment and heartache !! Not to mention the loss of a wonderful young dog with loads of talent there is also the financial loss of about $15k. Does a person jump back in and go again or walk away and say to heck with it? We have decided to go again as we love the dogs and what they give to us. If a person has to ask the cost then probably best to stay away from the "game".


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## Scott Krueger (Jan 25, 2008)

mine is going to be 525/month,,,everything included....a very reputable trainer...


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