# Flee/Tick Preventative (Nexgard)



## Windjammer (May 29, 2014)

All,
I would love your feedback on this issue. We currently use a topical flee/tick killer that works great. However, my lab can not get wet for 5ish days once applied. We were thinking about switching to Nexgard, a new product that the dog takes orally. My concern is that whatever is killing the flees and ticks, is going to be running through my dog's system. Can't that be bad? 

Do you have any reccomendations on a product that works well for this? Lyme disease is a serious issue here (Charlottesville, VA). 

Thanks,
Mike


----------



## T3P0 (Jun 21, 2014)

About to finish the first month on Nexgard. Seems to be working fine.


----------



## JoeSimmons (Aug 10, 2009)

I am curious to read replies. I have a NexGuard sample on my counter, but hesitate to try it for the same reason. My vet is giving it to her Vizslas no problem so far. I read the insert, and cannot find information if this is safe for bitches who will have a litter or boys used for breeding?


----------



## Windjammer (May 29, 2014)

T3P0- Any side effects noticed so far?
Joe- I think I remember reading that it has NOT been tested on bitches who are "lactating, pregnant or actively breeding".


----------



## zeekster (Jun 15, 2009)

Tried the Comfortis pills only for fleas worked well but couldn't continue to use with the heart worm medication I was using.
Could that be a concern with this also.


----------



## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

I switched to nexgard 2 months ago from K9 Advantx and no question about it this stuff works. K9 Advantx would only work for about 2 weeks then ticks would start to show up. I haven't found a single tick on my dog in two months and where we live that says a lot. If your dog swims, then the topicals aren't going to work.


----------



## T3P0 (Jun 21, 2014)

Effectiveness has been excellent. At this point (only a month on this treatment), I have witnessed no negative reactions/side effects to Nexgard. Both my dogs are males.


----------



## DFB (May 5, 2014)

Almost done with our second month of Nexgard and we love it. It works great and we have noticed no side effects. All the dogs seem as happy and healthy as ever. We have one bitch dog that would always seem a little puny for a day or so after Frontline application and she doesn't show any sign of illness after taking her Nexgard. It has not been tested on lactating, nursing, or breed bitches. I even have my 10 week old BLF on it and she is a picture of health.


----------



## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

How can topicals be less effective if the dogs swim? My understanding is that the stuff is absorbed into the blood stream through the skin. Its not like a "repellent" that just sits on the outside. Also, how is the Nexgard more "into the system" because it is taken orally, than these others? Anybody got a clear answer?


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

Yep.. putting chemicals into your dog VS on your dog is not good long term for the liver or kidneys... I do believe K9 Advantix says just two to three days before getting wet... 

Two new Tick collars work for six to eight months months and can get wet... your Vet will have it or Chewy.com... 

http://www.chewy.com/dog/seresto-flea-tick-collar-large-dogs/dp/46497

http://www.petparents.com/products.aspx/index/seresto?WHGRedir=1

http://www.scalibor-usa.com/


----------



## RJW (Jan 8, 2012)

.44 magnum said:


> Yep.. putting chemicals into your dog VS on your dog is not good long term for the liver or kidneys... I do believe K9 Advantix says just two to three days before getting wet...
> 
> Two new Tick collars work for six to eight months months and can get wet... your Vet will have it or Chewy.com...
> 
> ...



I am not arguing or doubting you, what is the difference both are eventually in the dogs system? Just curious on your take on this is all.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

RJW said:


> I am not arguing or doubting you, what is the difference both are eventually in the dogs system? Just curious on your take on this is all.


No.. the skin holds the chemical in the sebaceous glands , and does not flow into the blood system.. it does not get processed by the liver.. it 's on the outside of your dog.. 

Ask yourself if you would swallow a bottle of pesticide, or rather spray your skin with Cutters or Off... All these pesticides are needed, but you want to also minimize the damage done at a cellular lever. None of these companies that make ingestable pesticides ever tell you that they slowly harm the liver and kidneys... They say they are safe, but then your dog dies at six years old of cancer because the cells started breaking down and the cancers grow... These chemical kill the ticks and fleas, but not without a cost.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

JoeSimmons said:


> I am curious to read replies. I have a NexGuard sample on my counter, but hesitate to try it for the same reason. My vet is giving it to her Vizslas no problem so far. I read the insert, and cannot find information if this is safe for bitches who will have a litter or boys used for breeding?


 No.. not safe as no studies have been done
*IMPORTANT SAFETY INFORMATION:* 
*NexGard is for use in dogs only. The most frequently reported adverse reactions include vomiting, dry/flaky skin, diarrhea, lethargy, and lack of appetite. The safe use of NexGard in pregnant, breeding or lactating dogs has not been evaluated. Use with caution in dogs with a history of seizures.*
1. Data on file. Merial, Limited.
2. Vet-dispensed; MDI Data.
3. Drag M, Saik J, Harriman J, Larsen D. Safety evaluation of orally administered afoxolaner in eight-week-old dogs. Vet Parasitol. In press.
4. Freedom of Information Summary, NADA 141-406, NexGard.
5. NexGard Chewables Label.


----------



## Windjammer (May 29, 2014)

Thanks guys. I appreciate the feedback. 44Magnum, your thoughts are on track with mine.


----------



## kelrobin (Aug 12, 2013)

I won't use anything that is new on the market. I prefer to wait 3-5 years before I try anything and no I won't give my dogs poison for any reason. It seems like we're seeing an increase in hemagio as well as other cancers and giving something orally makes me twitch. I hate even giving Ivomec, but know I have no choice and give the lowest dose possible.


----------



## Mark Littlejohn (Jun 16, 2006)

.44 magnum said:


> "Yep.. putting chemicals into your dog VS on your dog is not good long term for the liver or kidneys"
> "...ingestable pesticides.. slowly harm the liver and kidneys... then your dog dies at six years old of cancer"





CodyC said:


> "..If your dog swims, then the topicals aren't going to work."


This is all very insightful. Would you guys mind sharing your professional credentials? 
What non-oral medication do you give your dogs to prevent heartworms?


----------



## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

Mark Littlejohn said:


> This is all very insightful. Would you guys mind sharing your professional credentials?
> What non-oral medication do you give your dogs to prevent heartworms?


I don't know many people that will have any credentials on topical flea and tick medicine and I definitely do not however, I have seen and witnessed it first hand that the topicals will lose their effectiveness if your dog does a lot of water work. I am not a spokesperson for nexgard but I do live in an area that I would put up against any other area in the US for ticks and I HAVE to have something that works. Dogs around here drop like flies every summer due to lyme. 

I don't think I have ever read anything about cancer being linked directly to and caused by a flea and tick medicine. Sure you can say "I am not putting anything in my dogs system that could harm him" but your going to sit there and take these dogs out in the harshest conditions on dangerous hunts in freezing temps without thinking twice about it. 

OP- be careful what you listen to on here. Lots of good information but some is a little biased.


----------



## Buck Mann (Apr 16, 2003)

.44 magnum said:


> None of these companies that make ingestable pesticides ever tell you that they slowly harm the liver and kidneys... They say they are safe, but then your dog dies at six years old of cancer because the cells started breaking down and the cancers grow... These chemical kill the ticks and fleas, but not without a cost.


Can you reference the data that supports this statement? If it is your opinion can you tell us your scientific background that allows this opinion?

Just so you know I also have elected not to use NexGard until it's safety profile is better known. I'm a physician and also try and keep up with the veterinary science that impacts my dogs. But, I'm not aware of any science that supports your statement.

Buck


----------



## Windjammer (May 29, 2014)

OP- be careful what you listen to on here. Lots of good information but some is a little biased.[/QUOTE]


Thanks...This is my first post to the forum, and will take everything with a slight grain of salt.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

Buck Mann said:


> Can you reference the data that supports this statement? If it is your opinion can you tell us your scientific background that allows this opinion?
> 
> Just so you know I also have elected not to use NexGard until it's safety profile is better known. I'm a physician and also try and keep up with the veterinary science that impacts my dogs. But, I'm not aware of any science that supports your statement.
> 
> Buck


Guess you wouldn't be my Dr. ... It's called common sense. But please continue to push products that have no place inside your pets...

This is a product made from Sea Sponges and a toxin they produce... the stupid company has zero proof it would prevent Lymes disease... and you dare to say this is healthy to put into your pet... 

Tell you what... you take if for a few years and get back to me. See if it does something to your central nervous system or you got a huge tumor growing on your liver...

and I suggest you are not using it is because you know I am right.


----------



## RJW (Jan 8, 2012)

.44 magnum said:


> No.. the skin holds the chemical in the sebaceous glands , and does not flow into the blood system.. it does not get processed by the liver.. it 's on the outside of your dog..
> 
> Ask yourself if you would swallow a bottle of pesticide, or rather spray your skin with Cutters or Off... All these pesticides are needed, but you want to also minimize the damage done at a cellular lever. None of these companies that make ingestable pesticides ever tell you that they slowly harm the liver and kidneys... They say they are safe, but then your dog dies at six years old of cancer because the cells started breaking down and the cancers grow... These chemical kill the ticks and fleas, but not without a cost.



Thanks, I was just curious on what your take on it was all.


----------



## Buck Mann (Apr 16, 2003)

.44 magnum said:


> I suggest you are not using it is because you know I am right.


Not at all. If it's safety profile turns out to be good I will definitely use it. But to make comments like you did without any science to back it up and an obvious lack of understanding regarding cancer genesis and growth is unfair to the people reading that might take it as truth. And you are right, I definitely would not be the right doctor for you.


----------



## Renee P. (Dec 5, 2010)

As far as the immune system goes, the skin is the first defense against anything. It is naive to think that you are doing no harm by applying chemicals that alter the way the skin communicates with the environment.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

mitty said:


> As far as the immune system goes, the skin is the first defense against anything. It is naive to think that you are doing no harm by applying chemicals that alter the way the skin communicates with the environment.


So as owners we have two choices... use products that repel and kill ticks, or do nothing and have them come down with TBD... 

Skin is not the first barrier of the immune system... that is the gut and the lining of the bowels... The ticks bite your dog on it's skin.. That is where medications/ preventives have to be... why have it systemic, even able to cause seizures, vomiting and diarrhea? When if you apply a product to the outside of the dog it does not get absorbed into its system.. Dogs who have issues with a topical will have a reaction at the site you place. Easy to solve by not using that brand... 

Nexgard does not repel ticks, and a tick can be alive on a dog using it for 48 hours before it kills the tick... giving it ample time to infect your dog with Lyme or other co-infections. 

Some people swear by Bug Off Garlic.... at least that only causes anemia if fed too much... but being air dried the amount of allicin is reduced... 

Every dog owner has to make choices... always be well informed, and no one else can make any owner's decisions for them... Cancers are on the rise in young dogs, especially Labradors ... wouldn't be great if we did not have to vaccinate, use Heartworm prevention, and Flea and tick prevention... but we do... we just get to choose the poison.


----------



## Jared McComis (Aug 12, 2013)

I have been using the Seresto collars and it has worked very well for me.


----------



## cocdawg (Mar 9, 2013)

Jared McComis said:


> I have been using the Seresto collars and it has worked very well for me.


I think I'm going this route when mine gets home from the trainers. Does it work with fleas and ticks or just ticks?


----------



## Mark Littlejohn (Jun 16, 2006)

.44 magnum said:


> When if you apply a product to the outside of the dog it does not get absorbed into its system..





.44 magnum said:


> Skin is not the first barrier of the immune system... that is the gut and the lining of the bowels


Incredible.

My recommendation to the OP: Consult a licensed veterinarian and do not risk your dog's health to internet advice.


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

.44 magnum said:


> So as owners we have two choices... use products that repel and kill ticks, or do nothing and have them come down with TBD...
> 
> Skin is not the first barrier of the immune system... that is the gut and the lining of the bowels... The ticks bite your dog on it's skin.. That is where medications/ preventives have to be... why have it systemic, even able to cause seizures, vomiting and diarrhea? When if you apply a product to the outside of the dog it does not get absorbed into its system.. Dogs who have issues with a topical will have a reaction at the site you place. Easy to solve by not using that brand...
> 
> ...



Magnum I know you are trying to provide help but please STOP. You clearly have no idea about what you are talking about. The skin IS THE FIRST BARRIER of the mammalian body. Systemic vs. topical/collar administration is a choice but there is a good reason for systemic over collar. It is a choice that one should refer to their vet according to their geographic location and a multitude of other factors. FYI my credentials on the subject is a doctorate degree in pharmacology. 

Both the medications and the collars have their limitations. Neither one is perfect. Medications don't repel but kill and collars can only repel within a given radius and serve no ability to kill. Again, it is a trade off. In order for the medications to kill ticks once they bite, thus drink blood that is systemically circulating, the medication must be present in the blood system. Collars cannot kill the ticks they only repel.

If you would like a resource for a general overview of pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic principles I'll be more then happy to share it. Us pharmacologists are not all out to poison everyone through cancer, seizures, and other horrors. We tend to do our research and usually have a logical rationale for the given profile of the drug, its use, dose, and contraindications. Of course there are examples of lapses in judgement.


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

.44 magnum said:


> No.. the skin holds the chemical in the sebaceous glands , and does not flow into the blood system.. it does not get processed by the liver.. it 's on the outside of your dog..
> 
> Ask yourself if you would swallow a bottle of pesticide, or rather spray your skin with Cutters or Off... All these pesticides are needed, but you want to also minimize the damage done at a cellular lever. None of these companies that make ingestable pesticides ever tell you that they slowly harm the liver and kidneys... They say they are safe, but then your dog dies at six years old of cancer because the cells started breaking down and the cancers grow... These chemical kill the ticks and fleas, but not without a cost.


This is COMPLETELY FALSE!! The sebaceous glands have nothing to do with transdermal absorption rates of a topical chemical/drug.


----------



## Sabireley (Feb 2, 2005)

Jared McComis said:


> I have been using the Seresto collars and it has worked very well for me.


I just started using these as well. So far, so good.


----------



## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

What if the dog is running through the woods with a "tick collar" around his neck and he gets hung on a stick and strangles himself??? 

That is clearly a humorous remark but you are making some mighty concrete accusations on a product that you know nothing about and the chance of that product killing the dogs liver or causing tumors is about the same as getting strangled in the woods with the tick collar.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

In most cases as pet parents we have to use common sense. It is different for everyone. I hope nexgard works for those who use it and it keeps your dog healthy.


----------



## Jared McComis (Aug 12, 2013)

cocdawg said:


> I think I'm going this route when mine gets home from the trainers. Does it work with fleas and ticks or just ticks?


Works on both!


----------



## Kyle B (May 5, 2005)

.44 magnum said:


> Guess you wouldn't be my Dr. ...


I don't know Buck, you should branch out from your gyno practice and be Tom Selleck's Doctor.


----------



## suepuff (Aug 25, 2008)

jrrichar said:


> Magnum I know you are trying to provide help but please STOP. You clearly have no idea about what you are talking about. The skin IS THE FIRST BARRIER of the mammalian body. Systemic vs. topical/collar administration is a choice but there is a good reason for systemic over collar. It is a choice that one should refer to their vet according to their geographic location and a multitude of other factors. FYI my credentials on the subject is a doctorate degree in pharmacology.
> 
> Both the medications and the collars have their limitations. Neither one is perfect. Medications don't repel but kill and collars can only repel within a given radius and serve no ability to kill. Again, it is a trade off. In order for the medications to kill ticks once they bite, thus drink blood that is systemically circulating, the medication must be present in the blood system. Collars cannot kill the ticks they only repel.
> 
> If you would like a resource for a general overview of pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic principles I'll be more then happy to share it. Us pharmacologists are not all out to poison everyone through cancer, seizures, and other horrors. We tend to do our research and usually have a logical rationale for the given profile of the drug, its use, dose, and contraindications. Of course there are examples of lapses in judgement.


THANK YOU! Janelle


----------



## rugerpuppy0447 (May 30, 2014)

.44 magnum said:


> When if you apply a product to the outside of the dog it does not get absorbed into its system...


Im not, by all means a doctor or a vet (i did go to paramedic school though). But if you apply a product to the outsude of anything it gets absorbed into its system. If what you said was the case, then what good are nicotene patches, or contraceptive patches if they dont end up in the system to do what they were intended for? Just food for thought...


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

rugerpuppy0447 said:


> Im not, by all means a doctor or a vet (i did go to paramedic school though). But if you apply a product to the outsude of anything it gets absorbed into its system. If what you said was the case, then what good are nicotene patches, or contraceptive patches if they dont end up in the system to do what they were intended for? Just food for thought...


Not all products applied to the skin will be absorbed by the skin and more importantly, into systemic circulation at a high enough dose to be considered therapeutic. Your examples of nicotine and sex hormones (which is what a contraceptive patch is) both have chemical structures (hydrophilic and hydrophobic properties must be present) that allow for transdermal absorption. This is the factor for a chemical/drug to pass through the skin and into systemic circulation, its chemical structure. Very few drugs can actually be delivered effectively through this method because of polar opposite requirements (must love water and oil) required for transdermal passage. 

Chemical structure and the route/rate of metabolism are key facts to what route of administration a drug is given. There are some good resources available, one recently published by oxford journal on the history of transdermal drugs. 

The repellent on a collar does not go through the dog's skin (like bug repellent on you) to any significant degree. That is why they only repel. Frontline, advantage, revolution, etc. are absorbed through the skin (their chemical structure permits it) and make their way into the circulatory system. Thus, they kill ticks.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

rugerpuppy0447 said:


> Im not, by all means a doctor or a vet (i did go to paramedic school though). But if you apply a product to the outsude of anything it gets absorbed into its system. If what you said was the case, then what good are nicotene patches, or contraceptive patches if they dont end up in the system to do what they were intended for? Just food for thought...


As one post said, the skin is a barrier so foreign substances don't get into the bloodstream.. the introduction of Transdermal patches to slow release medicine has to have been manufactured with molecules small enough to penetrate the skin barrier. Humans not being fur covered, exposes the skin to the elements way different then your dog.. 

Spot ons applied to the back of your dog spread over the skin surface over time and enter the sebaceous glands of the skin and remain there... does a dog ingest some pesticide by some minimal grooming, yes... but these manufactures of the spot ons and the new flea and tick collars give good explanations on their web sites as to how they work... 

Dog owners have a lot of choices when it comes to keeping Tick disease away from your dog... learn about each one, and make your choice. I for one have found K9 Advantix to be powerful in repelling ticks from even climbing on your dog... I live in the worlds largest vector for deer ticks, and since using this, I've not found one embeded tick... but you have to be faithful in its application so the product can work all over the dog over a couple months time... 

This Nexgard product maybe shown over time to cause no harmful side effects... I would doubt that however... In my mind you are just slowly poisoning your dog.. 

I just called Nexgard and asked how long was the studies done to get FDA approval of the drug... only 90 days folks. 90 days of testing and guess what... your dog now becomes the long term test subjects..... I've seen these products come and go, and most go because long term usage starts to cause cell damage to organs. 

The makers of Nexgard , who make Front line Plus, also just assured me Zero Frontline enters the bloodstream as it only mixes with the oils on the skin in the top layer of the skin.. all these companies have Customer service, call for yourself and ask before using any products.
*
Merial Customer Service
1.888.637.4251 (opt. 3)
Monday–Friday, 8 AM–6 PM (ET)*


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

.44 magnum said:


> As one post said, the skin is a barrier so foreign substances don't get into the bloodstream.. the introduction of Transdermal patches to slow release medicine has to have been manufactured with molecules small enough to penetrate the skin barrier. Humans not being fur covered, exposes the skin to the elements way different then your dog..
> 
> Spot ons applied to the back of your dog spread over the skin surface over time and enter the sebaceous glands of the skin and remain there... does a dog ingest some pesticide by some minimal grooming, yes... but these manufactures of the spot ons and the new flea and tick collars give good explanations on their web sites as to how they work...
> 
> ...



Magnum your opinion is yours. I will repeat this several times, you have no experience or knowledge to make many of the claims that you do. 90 day FDA approval, what is your comparison to? Are you familiar with the requirements of FDA approval, the data, trials, etc. Have you ever even seen an application? Even in human medicine the FDA can often fast-track a drug. However, to reach this state there is already a decent baseline of literature supporting it. 

Really long term usage causes cell damage and organ failure? Please the amount of garbage coming from you stinks this forum up. I think EdA said it best "FOS."

Bottom line: Don't listen to the guy with no name, no credentials, and no stake in the game of medical/veterinary research.

FYI: Nexgard is an isoxazoline compound which blocks insect-specific GABA-A channels at Ki values in nM concentration. The efficacy and toxicity data provides no basis for "cell damage to organs." Vet Parasitology 2014 PMID 24631502. 

But what do I know, I only have a PhD from Georgetown University and 5 years of recording in animals both peripheral organ systems and neuronal circuits with GABA signaling a large focal point of the research. But hey you got it all figured out.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

jrrichar said:


> Magnum your opinion is yours. I will repeat this several times, you have no experience or knowledge to make many of the claims that you do. 90 day FDA approval, what is your comparison to? Are you familiar with the requirements of FDA approval, the data, trials, etc. Have you ever even seen an application? Even in human medicine the FDA can often fast-track a drug. However, to reach this state there is already a decent baseline of literature supporting it.
> 
> Really long term usage causes cell damage and organ failure? Please the amount of garbage coming from you stinks this forum up. I think EdA said it best "FOS."
> 
> ...


Good for you... congrats... now please tell me more about all the side effects of nexgard... just a wonderful product tested form 90 days and gets FDA approval... this is entirely why the big pharmaceuticals have ruined our nations health system.


----------



## gerrimitchell (Aug 10, 2005)

My golden retriever male started having seizures about every 4-6 weeks. This went on for 10 months...the vet said he would not recommend meds until the seizures got closer together. I started thinking, what else do I do every 4-6 weeks? I put on Frontline topical. I stopped putting on frontline and the seizures stopped. I told CDC about it and found there were many many other pet owners who had the seizure problem from frontline.


----------



## Maxs Mom (Sep 17, 2009)

Just had a conversation at my vets office about Nexgard yesterday. They were saying "expensive" and I need to consider that. We discussed how dogs had reactions to Trifexis and this is a similar product. Like previously stated here, I'd rather wait a few years and see how it is in the long run. 

Another vet told me (and no I never would consider this) but Frontline is safe enough to eat without ill effects as a human. To me that is enough for now. With Frontline we need to wait 24 hours from application before swimming. I've been happy with my product of choice. Haven't seen a tick yet.


----------



## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

I keep hearing how Frontline does not work anymore. My dogs have not had a stuck on tick since we got to NC, so it appears to be working for them. As to safety, last month when I was putting it on Indy he wiggled when he shouldn't have and I managed to squirt some in my eye. I immediately rinsed the eye good in the hose. No problems. But I guess I washed it out too soon, I got a tick on me later that week!


----------



## DoubleHaul (Jul 22, 2008)

Mark Littlejohn said:


> This is all very insightful. Would you guys mind sharing your professional credentials?
> What non-oral medication do you give your dogs to prevent heartworms?


Mark,

We are currently giving one of our critters Advantage Multi--a topical for heartworms. This one is getting ready for allergy testing and the vet wanted him off pretty much anything he could eat that could be part of the problem.

I am in the wait and see camp on this--sure would be nice for the golden with the thick undercoat, though.


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

.44 magnum said:


> Good for you... congrats... now please tell me more about all the side effects of nexgard... just a wonderful product tested form 90 days and gets FDA approval... this is entirely *why the big pharmaceuticals have ruined our nations health system*.


Really...you decided to come back with this statement. I won't go there because it is so ridiculous. 

Nexgard's side effect profile is stated in the article that I put the PMID number for. No one can know ALL the side effects of a given drug. Period. Regardless of whether it is nexgard, frontline, or a tick collar. Does Nexgard have side effects, yes. Does this mean (in your words) this drug is just waiting to cause cell damage and organ failure? No. Do we know 10 years down the line? No, because we lack the data. Nexgard is just another option in treatment of pests. To come out and say it is going to kill your pet is a complete lie. 

FYI- I give my dog Nexgard and she is yet to drop dead. I put her on it based on the literature, my vet, and her activities. 

I work to improve current drugs, as well as, to define other systems. What the heck have you done other then complain? 

It is a lot easier to get on a forum bitch about something that you do nothing to improve, know little about, and have wikipedia lead your retort.


----------



## MSDOGS1976 (Mar 7, 2009)

jrrichar said:


> Magnum your opinion is yours. I will repeat this several times, you have no experience or knowledge to make many of the claims that you do. 90 day FDA approval, what is your comparison to? Are you familiar with the requirements of FDA approval, the data, trials, etc. Have you ever even seen an application? Even in human medicine the FDA can often fast-track a drug. However, to reach this state there is already a decent baseline of literature supporting it.
> 
> Really long term usage causes cell damage and organ failure? Please the amount of garbage coming from you stinks this forum up. I think EdA said it best "FOS."
> 
> ...


Thanks for your post. Good to get info from someone who is educated in the field.


----------



## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

It makes no sense to me for someone to say in the same sentence, "we know nothing about nexgard because it's so new so I will not use it" and "It is killing your dogs cells and is going to cause tumors on the liver and kidneys". 

That right there tells you the guy has no idea what he is talking about. You have to throw the BS flag when someone contradicts their own statement in the same conversation.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

CodyC said:


> It makes no sense to me for someone to say in the same sentence, "we know nothing about nexgard because it's so new so I will not use it" and "It is killing your dogs cells and is going to cause tumors on the liver and kidneys".
> 
> That right there tells you the guy has no idea what he is talking about. You have to throw the BS flag when someone contradicts their own statement in the same conversation.


I've just got common sense... some of you guys who trust these new innovative creations understand nothing about the evolution of how disease happens. You can have fast reactions to a new ingested drug or topical, or a delayed response from prolonged use... more young dogs then ever are dying premature deaths from Cancers with tumors attached to internal organs. 

So you want to say Nexgard may be safe... I don't like the "May" .. and the reason is your dogs system does not need to have Nexgard in every bloodcell and organ... which is how this product works... it is not just delivered to the outer skin as safer products do. Make no mistake Nexgard is a toxin... While one or two doses may not start to change the cell structures of organs they do have the potential to do so if given for years. The drug company in this case tested it for* 90 days and got FDA approval... 90 days...* well you may think every new product that comes out is wonderful, ask the hundreds of dog owners who started to use Trifexis who have had their dogs die... it's up and over 700 at this point... I told people on anther forum to beware and got similar comments about my stupidity. 

When drug companies come up with these novel approaches like using bacteria found in soil to make Trifexis, and now the toxin from sea sponges to make Nexgard, they fail to accept the consequences of what long term exposure to internal organs will occur.. mutations can and do happen when the host body is exposed to a foreign substance....

Now you may not like any product like the topicals because some dogs do have a reaction , but rather then think putting a chemical into the blood steam, the companies that have made these new Tick collars like Bayer, have improved them greatly. They don't leave your dogs back greasy, but slowly release the product over 8 months time. The big plus is they can get wet and not lose effectiveness. 

You also have many people who swear by Bug off Garlic, which is air dried, which removes the harmful Allicin, allowing the Garlic to be taken at high amounts..


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

Trifexis... issue... 

The maker says to every new case called into their company your dog is the first to have an issue... meanwhile the drug maker has reporter to the FDA over 700 dead dogs... 

Wonderful investigative story done by this reporter getting documents using the Freedom of Information act... 

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/owners-blame-700-dog-deaths-trifexis/nb5B4/

These drug companies are in it for profit, not for your dogs safety... Corporations have no soul ... they tell you these products are safe, but you have to use your common sense. 

Every 36 hours, Trifexis kills a dog....

The same side effects reported to the FDA for Trifexis apply to the product Nexgard... beware that the makers of Nexgard will not tell you the truth about how many complaints they have received. They always have a Vet on staff that will say it's not the Nexgard or Trifexis, as it could be from other things. How they sleep at night I do not know.


----------



## SjSmith (Oct 25, 2011)

.44 magnum said:


> ...Every dog owner has to make choices... always be well informed, and no one else can make any owner's decisions for them...


You say this so why are you so hellbent on talking everyone out of Nexgard?


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

SjSmith said:


> You say this so why are you so hellbent on talking everyone out of Nexgard?


I love dogs... and know the pain caused by their untimely deaths... and I don't like being called stupid by intellectuals in the employ of these drug companies. If one dog owner reads this thread and decides not to use Nexgard I have not wasted my time.

I say again... 90 days was amount of time this drug company used in evaluating it's safety... 90 days.... no one can dispute that because that was the time spent... 

God Bless the USA and the FDA procedures for ensuring our pets health.


----------



## Scott R. (Mar 13, 2012)

My vet thinks highly of the product so far. Plan to move off of the topical we have been using once my current supply is gone and try Nexguard. We had been using Parastar Plus with great success but I would prefer an oral med if it is effective.

If only we didn't have access to the drugs those evil pharma companies produce.


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

.44 magnum said:


> I love dogs... and know the pain caused by their untimely deaths... and I don't like being called stupid by *intellectuals in the employ of these drug companies*. If one dog owner reads this thread and decides not to use Nexgard I have not wasted my time.
> 
> I say again... 90 days was amount of time this drug company used in evaluating it's safety... 90 days.... no one can dispute that because that was the time spent...
> 
> God Bless the USA and the FDA procedures for ensuring our pets health.



Facts: I am not employed by any drug companies. I take a significant pay cut by working in academia. I have no stock nor any interests in current big pharma. I make little money and work long hours. I have published in scientific peer-reviewed articles and am funded through the national institute of health and the american diabetes association. My knowledge gained over years in the classroom, lab, scientific conferences, and collaborations with some of the top scientists in their field (big pharma included) has given me my knowledge base. Where does yours come from again?? 

God bless the FDA but screw them if they try and fast-track a drug based on data! Have you actually read/understand the PKA study done on Nexgard...assumption NO.


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

.44 magnum said:


> I love dogs... and know the pain caused by their untimely deaths... and *I don't like being called stupid by intellectuals* in the employ of these drug companies. If one dog owner reads this thread and decides not to use Nexgard I have not wasted my time.
> 
> I say again... 90 days was amount of time this drug company used in evaluating it's safety... 90 days.... no one can dispute that because that was the time spent...
> 
> God Bless the USA and the FDA procedures for ensuring our pets health.


Simple solution don't say stupid things based on NO FACTS.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

jrrichar said:


> Simple solution don't say stupid things based on NO FACTS.


Great ... I'll remember that when more dogs die each day from products like Nexgard and Trifixis.... Stupid to use such products when safer ones exist.

When a dog dies from using these products.. I got a question for you to answer... How many cells died in the dog? How much bleeding was found on these dogs internal organs... so far a lot... so do not tell me these products are safe..


----------



## MSDOGS1976 (Mar 7, 2009)

.44 magnum said:


> I love dogs... and know the pain caused by their untimely deaths... .


Is that you Uplander?  If not you........you have a twin on a lab forum. Or I should say used to. He was banned.


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

MSDOGS1976 said:


> Is that you Uplander?  If not you........you have a twin on a lab forum. Or I should say used to. He was banned.


What is an Uplander... someone who hunts with his dog? What does that statement have to do about dead dogs using systemic drugs to kill ticks and fleas? Ticks and fleas attack the skin where topical prevention belongs. You don't need a thirty day supply of poison being inside your dog attacking its organs.


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

.44 magnum said:


> Great ... I'll remember that when more dogs die each day from products like Nexgard and Trifixis.... Stupid to use such products when safer ones exist.
> 
> When a dog dies from using these products.. I got a question for you to answer... How many cells died in the dog? How much bleeding was found on these dogs internal organs... so far a lot... so do not tell me these products are safe..


Still waiting for the facts....


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

.44 magnum said:


> Great ... I'll remember that when more dogs die each day from products like Nexgard and Trifixis.... Stupid to use such products when safer ones exist.
> 
> When a dog dies from using these products.. I got a question for you to answer... *How many cells died in the dog? * How much bleeding was found on these dogs internal organs... so far a lot... so do not tell me these products are safe..



I don't know. Why don't you go grab a rat, do a necropsy, and when you die of old age loooong before you would ever finish counting the number of cells in a rat let alone a dog. If you don't want to be viewed as stupid why write this!


----------



## .44 magnum (Feb 20, 2014)

jrrichar said:


> I don't know. Why don't you go grab a rat, do a necropsy, and when you die of old age loooong before you would ever finish counting the number of cells in a rat let alone a dog. If you don't want to be viewed as stupid why write this!


Dead is dead... the life is gone... the bacteria that are left all part of nature. all we want as dog owners is a lot more then 90 days of research with a limited number of dogs... stop using our dogs as the Guinea Pigs.


----------



## MSDOGS1976 (Mar 7, 2009)

.44 magnum said:


> What is an Uplander... someone who hunts with his dog? What does that statement have to do about dead dogs using systemic drugs to kill ticks and fleas? Ticks and fleas attack the skin where topical prevention belongs. You don't need a thirty day supply of poison being inside your dog attacking its organs.


An Uplander is a member id on a labrador forum who's writing style and philosophy is very similar. If not you.....my mistake.


----------



## tobyche (Aug 5, 2014)

*Nexgard*



.44 magnum said:


> Great ... I'll remember that when more dogs die each day from products like Nexgard and Trifixis.... Stupid to use such products when safer ones exist.
> 
> When a dog dies from using these products.. I got a question for you to answer... How many cells died in the dog? How much bleeding was found on these dogs internal organs... so far a lot... so do not tell me these products are safe..


Hi - Hoping nobody will bite my head off but I need to say this - My two dogs have been on Nexgard for 3 months - one dog did fine the other one (which I guess I am slow because I didn't put it all together for 3 months) after giving him the dose - within hours he started doing a licking thing with his tongue and gulping! It went on for a while. Then it was done he seemed OK - the next month the same thing, the last month again the same thing.

I have been researching for reasons and it is considered a seizure - he never had seizures until he started on Nexgard. He is no longer on it, in fact I have a six month supply in my purse which is going back to the Vet today. I know I can't prove it is the Nexgard but I also know poisons are not a good thing to be injested so I am going to go the Holistic way with collars that have no poison in them - I will also be checking my dogs everyday for ticks and fleas! 

I am only giving you my opinion so you can disagree with me but I know what I am going to do to make sure my guys live a long time! Please be kind to a Newbie!

Thanks
Lynn


----------



## banknote (Jul 26, 2014)

I’m considering switching from Frontline Plus to Nexgard, at vet’s recommendation, and trying to be as informed as I can. Have had to remove several ticks recently while on Frontline, but finding mix of positive reviews and horror stories blamed on Nexgard. Now that it’s been in use for a few years or so, does anyone here know of more data available regarding side effects? 

Thanks.


----------



## jrrichar (Dec 17, 2013)

Most new studies on Nexgard focus on the combo Nexgard Spectra. The 2014 efficacy, pharmacokinetic, and safety profiles still hold true. One of my dogs will have been on Nexgard for 4 years next month and hasn’t had a single issue. I have 3 others that are on it- no issues. Lots of options for flea prevention, most who believe they are poisons looking to kill your dog simply don’t understand how they work. If your interested put Nexgard and efficacy into pubmed. 

Plenty of vets use Nexgard and recommend and still others like something else. Like dog food, do what makes sense for you and your dog.


----------



## Charles C. (Nov 5, 2004)

Have given Nexgard with no issues. Much more effective for me than topical meds.


----------



## banknote (Jul 26, 2014)

Thank you Janell and Charles. I appreciate the feedback and will discuss further with my vet.


----------



## JaneJane (Dec 29, 2018)

I've been using both Nexguard and Frontline on two different dogs and everything was fine.


----------



## Anas Rubripes (Jan 28, 2016)

To contribute to the original discussion ...
We just made the decision to switch to Nexgard for our 2.5 yo YLM. No problems with the first one. Second one resulted in diarrhea on day one, more on day two, and just when we thought we were over the hump, he threw up on day three. He's back to normal now. 

The second came while we were traveling for Christmas last week. Our boy isn't really motivated by food at all and after extensive travel with minimal exercise (oh, the holidays) he usually gives up on food for a day or two. That seemed to be the case toward the end of our trip. We thought back to the first dose and (1) he was definitely eating full meals because we had already returned home from a shorter Thanksgiving trip and (2) since it was his first dose, we gave him half after dinner one night to monitor his response to it and the other half the next night with another full meal. He only ate half his dinner with the second dose, which again I attribute to the travel, and only ate half his dinner the next night. His lack of appetite isn't atypical at all but in this case I'm certain it didn't help. We're going to take Nexgard through spring when the brown dog ticks in the field behind our house are everywhere to see if it's right for us, and we'll make sure we plan a bit better to make sure he's getting full meals with them.


----------

