# Gunners up Winger



## badbullgator

Anybody ever use these? They have a nice $, but I don't know anyone who has tried them.


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## Cray Stephenson

I use and sell them. They are a great asset and value.


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## yellrdog

I use them all the time and love them especially for the money. Sometimes I will use the dokken wood ducks and you will get a little better mark.


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## yellrdog

I use them all the time and love them especially for the money. Sometimes I will use the dokken wood ducks and you will get a little better mark.


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## topshelf

My brother has them and has had a lot of problems from bad releases to falty wiring. When I was looking for wingers he told me not to get them! I bought the zinger winger 2s. they cost about $100 more but out of the box they work. No problems at all. Most of all no wasted time in the field. The throw is about 40 yards with a dokken duck.


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## Gunners Up

*NO BS Scoop on Gunners Up Wingers*

Bad Bull Gator,

When you get a chance, scroll down and read the post titled "No Bs Scoop on GU Wingers". 

We have a 30 day money back guarantee and you want have to settle for a #2 or Mini or any of that other stuff.

Take Care and Good Training.

Rich Davis
Gunners Up


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## Howard N

Hey Rich Davis,

I've been looking at your website product page http://www.gunnersup.com/products.htm
for a few months now. You still have the old trigger pictured with the gunners up on that page. When will you have a picture of the new trigger? 

If I bought one today, would it have the new trigger and would the pulleys work? Does it still have a shot?

A guy I train with has one and he hasn't changed out the trigger as he says he won't get a shot with the new trigger and he likes the shot. His pulleys are horrible.


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## captdan

I have one and it works well. There originally was a release problem, but it was fixed with a free upgrade. I highly recommend them and am planning to buy one or two more soon.

Dan Rice


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## Gunners Up

*To Howard*

Howard,

Every unit we ship today has the new servo release and upgraded pulleys.
When loaded correctly, it will fire the primer everytime. I think hands down, we have the finest launcher availible to trainers today regardless of price and I know we have the best customer service bar none. 

As a company we have evolved and our products have as well. When we introduced our new release I didn't think it was fair to penalize the folks who were our early supporters. Solution, offer the upgrade free of charge and believe you me that wasn't a cheap proposition but I slept well at night knowing we had done the right thing.

We now recieve inquires everday from folks wanting to know if our release is compatible with our competitions product and I think that speaks vollumes and that's all I have to say about that.

Take care and good training!

Rich
RIch


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## Don Smith

*Re: To Howard*



Gunners Up said:


> I think hands down, we have the finest launcher availible to trainers today regardless of price and I know we have the best customer service bar none.


I'll ditto that. The customer service always has been great. Now, with the new releases, they operate flawlessly. In my opinion, the best winger on the market. I have 4. Plan to get more.


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## badbullgator

Thanks for the info guys. I was leaning towards the zingers, but I am not sure now, I like them but I could get three of these for the price of two zingers.


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## Howard N

> I could get three of these for the price of two zingers.


That's what I'm thinking but I haven't pulled the trigger yet.


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## 2labs

*Rich, Gunners Up*

What did you replace your original pulley's with? Did you go with an American made National type. Thanks Dave.


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## FOM

Howard N said:


> Hey Rich Davis,
> 
> I've been looking at your website product page http://www.gunnersup.com/products.htm
> for a few months now. You still have the old trigger pictured with the gunners up on that page. When will you have a picture of the new trigger?
> 
> If I bought one today, would it have the new trigger and would the pulleys work? Does it still have a shot?
> 
> A guy I train with has one and he hasn't changed out the trigger as he says he won't get a shot with the new trigger and he likes the shot. His pulleys are horrible.


I got three a couple months back - working great, except don't use bumpers with long ropes on them  the ropes can get tangled on the way ou and "flop" rather than fly! They toss a duck/pheasant nicely! You do get a shot with the "new" releases!

Lainee, Flash and Bullet


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## Mario Monico

*Gunner up winger*

Seems to me every one is telling about problems they have incountered do you want to be next?. Go with the zinger winger. I bought and old style a few months ago and it still works great. (the unit has to be 5 years old).tried tested and true.


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## Don Smith

*Re: Gunner up winger*



Mario Monico said:


> Seems to me every one is telling about problems they have incountered ... .


 *In the past. Read more carefully.*


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## FOM

*Re: Gunner up winger*



Mario Monico said:


> Seems to me every one is telling about problems they have incountered do you want to be next?. Go with the zinger winger. I bought and old style a few months ago and it still works great. (the unit has to be 5 years old).tried tested and true.


In the club i belong to we have both ZW and GUs and all I can say is you don't see a lick of difference, but I do know I saved some serious cash and that allowed me to get three rather than two wingers!

Also have to say Rich at GU is on top of it - friendly even if its the customer making the bone head mistake!  Can't be beat. 

I used my GUs the other day to toss a piegon and I was able to put the bird where I wanted with the type of throw I wanted each and everytime. I've used ducks, pheasants, now pigeons, bumpers, and dokkens in the GUs and they give me a "perfect" throw each time. Easy to setup. Easy to operate. I like them so much that I'm looking at getting three more.

How's that for positive feedback?! :wink: 

FOM


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## Brett Riedlinger

I've purchased two when they first came out, and all I can say is that the GU's were by far the worst purchase I've made in dog training. From the time they were delivered one had a release that was broke, then a hook, release firing problem, pulleys, nuts UN-threading and more that I can't think of right now. Will say this though..Rich will take care of the problems,but why not fix them before putting on the market! When having the release problem he said they test every one 10x before shipping.....well I use mine more then that in one training session, so not sure what that's going to show ya.
Have heard people mentioned the good and bad about this product, but the only thing bad about Zingers are the price. If I had to do it all over again...Zinger!!!! Lost too much training time with the GU's.


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## yellrdog

I will be honest when I first got my GU I had problems with them not firing all the time,I would get to the field setup, get dog out go to the line push button and nothing next one nothing. It was very frustrating BUT since I have recieved my new releases not even one missfire. Train with lots of people who use them and have not heard one complaint or experienced one missfire. I plan to purchase more as soon as possible.
Just my two cents.

Cody.


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## Keith Allison

We have about 17 Gunner's Up Wingers in use right now between three trainers. They get abused everyday and we have yet to have one not fire.

Richard has worked out the kinks he initially had. Nothing but good with these wingers now.

Can't beat them for the price.

I highly recommend them.

By the way, we also have three Zingers and the Gunner's Up throw just as far and high as the Zinger's for less.

Keith


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## badbullgator

Thanks Keith
Thats a pretty strong recomendation.


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## Keith Allison

There have been times they get left in the field due to time constraints, etc. at the end of a day and they have sat through several cold weather/thunderstorms/sunlight, etc. and still work great.

The only thing we've replaced are one set of bands on the first few units we bought, but you can only imagine how many marks get thrown per week through these things. They've got to hold up and be consistent.

We also use the Dogtra Remotes with these and you absolutely can't beat those paired with the GU's.

Give them a try.


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## Mike Peters-labguy23

Keith,
How do your primer's come out? My first releases that I got they were super easy to get the primers out, most of the time they fell out on their own. My new releases I have a heck of a time getting the primers out. It may be because the only way I can get the bang to work is by putting a blade of grass around the primer then putting it in.


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## Gerard Rozas

The Gunsup we have in our training group just quit firing last week.

No matter what we do - can't get it to fire a primer. Was working the day before. And it has a tendency to fall over when placed on a slope.


The MiniZ - we have never had a problem with. 

FWIW - Three of us train together so we normally have 2 real birdboys and 1 thrower out. We alternate between my Mini, John's Gunsup, and Wendall's Max5000. We have just about quit using the Max because we use birds. Funtionally - the Gunsup is the same as the mini, expect for the quality of the materials used and the workmanship. You can really see where then extra money went in the Zinger Winger.


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## Gunners Up

Gerard,

Just last week Gunners Up was named the official launcher for the HRC 2005 Spring Grand. The proof will be in the pudding when 500+ Marks are cycled through our launchers during a one-week period. We welcome this challenge! I'm sure if we fail (AND We Won't!) you will hear about it here first but remember Gunners Up is out front and putting its money where it's mouth is.

I see from the red ribbon that you are holding in your avatar you run some trials and are from Texas. Next time you see Jeff Henard from High Praise Retrievers collecting the BLUE ask him what he thinks about us. 

Or, if you see Derrick Randall and Stella from War Eagle winning the Super Retriever Series ask them what they think about us? Keith from War Eagle says they have 17 (Seventeen) and they haven?t had a lick of trouble. Keith is just makes his living training dogs but what does he know?

One last thing, BIG MO is with us and a lot of good things are happening for Gunners Up. If it wasn't, then Zinger wouldn't have been forced to slash their prices like they have (You can thank us for that one) and to be honest I still don't understand why a Mini is $200 more than a Zinger II? (Could it be because Gunners Up doesn?t offer a Mini yet?) I've found getting gauged like that kind of makes it sore when you sit down!

Good Luck to you, I'm off to Wisconsin to help with the Grand and put my money where my mouth is!

Rich Davis


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## cpayne

I have to agree with Keith. We have 5 that are abused and used on a daily basis as well and since the new release has come out no problems what so ever. Richard has done nothing but bend over backwards to help people. He even came to our place one morning to take a look at ours when we had the old release. 

As far as nuts coming loose..........well that happens all the time here on RTF  Nothing a wrench won't fix.

So...........thanks Rich for a great product and even better service!

Chris Payne
RockErin Kennel
Stillwater, OK


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## Mike Peters-labguy23

Deleted for further review.


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## Gerard Rozas

Keith wrote :


> honest I still don't understand why a Mini is $200 more than a Zinger II?


Actually it is only 100 more.

My neighbor owns and operates a speciality metal working shop for the oil industry. They machine all kinds of one-of-a-kind valves, casings, and what nots for the oil industry, many out of some very high tech metals.
He was very impressed with the machine work and the finish of the Zinger. And he said that kind of finish was not cheap to have done.

From the start the Zinger had heavier aluminum tubing - thicker than Gunsup.

High quailty finish work, welding and grinding - Gunsup uses plactic end caps.

Zinger used best pulleys they could find - Gunsup finally went to them after a bunch of complaints.

Final statement - you get what you pay for.

And a question - what can we do to get the darn thing to fire a primer again?


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## Mike Peters-labguy23

Gerard,
I started putting a piece of grass in with the primer. That seems to help but it's not FOOL proof. Makes it a real pain in the butt getting the primers out though.


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## Brett Riedlinger

Good luck at the Grand with your product Rich. I too will be there to watch my dog run. Why aren't I running my own dog????? I've decided to cut my loses with the (2) G.U. this spring and make my own wingers(almost done). Can't believe I was able to get her MH title last year with the amount of marks she seen. Only one g.u. was working when it felt like it, maybe 75%(old release). Thank goodness for a supporting girlfriend and friends!!
Good luck again sounds like you have a better product now.
A big thumbs up for supporting UKC Grand and Ohio River HRC.
Brett Riedlinger


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## Keith Allison

One thing I love about these, is that when you fire a primer and go to reload it, the primer is gone! No needlenose pliers to carry around in the field pulling spent primers.

That new release just makes them disappear.

Keep up the good work Rich!

See you at the Grand.

Keith


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## Keith Allison

> Keith,
> How do your primer's come out? My first releases that I got they were super easy to get the primers out, most of the time they fell out on their own. My new releases I have a heck of a time getting the primers out. It may be because the only way I can get the bang to work is by putting a blade of grass around the primer then putting it in.


I'd check with Rich on this... our's literally disappear (they're gone) when you walk up to the winger. We have the new releases on all our units.

Hope this helps,

Keith


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## Mike Peters-labguy23

I talked with Rich and he is sending me 2 new units to se what I think. The primer issues were my main probem so if these work better I will be satisfied,


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## Brett Riedlinger

Rich,
Please bring an extra release to the Grand.. my friend's GU isn't firing off the primer.
Thanks,
Brett
see ya there


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## Mike Peters-labguy23

I got the 2 new units and they are improved. The primer is easy to remove and fires everytime. I have only ran about 25 throws from each but they have been flawless. These new units function way better than the oder ones had.


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## Terry A

I have heard(NOT SEEN) that the biggest issue is the fact that the joints are all bolted together and not welded. Can someone confirm or deny this


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## Brad B

Mine is welded except where it needs to pivot to open and close.


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## FOM

Mine are welded, too.....


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## Terry A

Seems that I have a correction to what I was told, Thier gunners up are welded. The complain was in the part where screws aew use, the screws do not stay tight. Locktite fixed that


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## Mike Peters-labguy23

The first Gunners-Up came out maybe too early without enough testing. The new ones are much improved. I like the ones I have a lot more than the ones I bought a year ago.


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## yellrdog

Mike I bought some about a yearago and was thinking about ordering some more, what changes are you talking about just the release or are there more.

Thanks, Cody


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## Mike Peters-labguy23

The primers fire more consistantly. The bolts are on tight and not falling off. The winger just works now. My old ones that had an updated trigger on it were not releasing 50% of the time due to poor connections in wiring. The new ones come prewired and fully installed.


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## badbullgator

Anyone know how that worked at the Grand?


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## Gunners Up

*Gunners Up @ the HRC Spring Grand*

BadBullGator,

Thank you for asking. Our experience at the HRC Spring Grand was very productive. In four days of use at the Grand, 1600+ Birds total were thrown through 14 Gunners Up Launchers. Of that 1600 half were manually launched through our wingers and the other half were launched using the Tri-Tronic electronics that were supplied by Tri-Tronics. In the process of 1600 launches we had 1 Loose Nut, 1 Rubber with a nick in it, *and 0 Mechanical failures*.

I?m not going to tell you that we didn?t have any ?No Birds? because there were some. The Grand Committee hired a local youth Hockey league to man the guns. Every morning we had a fresh batch of kids and would need to coach them up and get them down the learning curve. This in turn did create opportunities for operator error but all in all the kids were a godsend and did a wonderful job. 

We worked our arsses off, met a lot of wonderful people and saw some fantastic dog work. Those that qualified truly have something to be proud of and those that came up short had nothing to hang their head about. It was a tough course. The Grand Committee and Host Clubs did a wonderful job of putting on a great Hunt and kept it running like a well-oiled machine.

All in all we received a lot of great comments, some good constructive criticism and a ton of praise. I think we opened a lot of eyes and answered a lot of questions about Gunners Up. That?s why I wanted to go to the Grand, it was time to put up or shut up and the proof is now in the pudding.

Good Luck & Good Training,

Rich Davis


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## Don Smith

Great news, Rich. I'll tell you -- you're top on my list!!


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## tbyars

I bought a Gunners Up over three months ago and absolutely love it!! It is lightweight and very moblie and throws outstanding, consistent marks. My dog's marking ability has improved dramatically using the Gunners Up. Friends within our club have fallen in love with it so much that they are in the process of buying them. We have used the Gunners Up at our training days and have yet to have a single malfunction of any type. I have seen many wingers to date and none compare in my opinion to Gunners Up. Yes, I bought it originally for the price which is nice, but I am buying some more for their performance. Gunners Up is #1 in my mind!


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## Brett Riedlinger

Well.. for everyone thats happy with your GUs can thank a list of people like me that took it on the chin with the original product. It cost me close to $650.00 because of this product. Wish I would have exchanged my two for the new and improved model. O-Well!!!


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## B. A.

Brett Riedlinger said:


> Well.. for everyone thats happy with your GUs can thank a list of people like me that took it on the chin with the original product. It cost me close to $650.00 because of this product. Wish I would have exchanged my two for the new and improved model. O-Well!!!


Please elaborate. What was the problem, why did it cost you close to $650 ?

And what has GU done to address your concerns (or not)?


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## Cray Stephenson

Brett Riedlinger said:


> Well.. for everyone thats happy with your GUs can thank a list of people like me that took it on the chin with the original product. It cost me close to $650.00 because of this product. Wish I would have exchanged my two for the new and improved model. O-Well!!!



Brett,

did you get the new releases? They were offered at a great price to those that had the GU wingers with the original release...free.


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## Brett Riedlinger

The $650 was the cost to have my female trained for 1 month and run in the Spring Grand by a trainer in the Ohio area. Didn't want to do that, but no way to regain her marking ability without reliable equipment. Wish I had a penny every time asked why I'm not running her myself. 
I didn't add gas & time to go to and from training sites to work on marking drills only to have mechanical problems with the wingers. Did receive the new releases, then I added new rubber tubing, lock washers & nuts w/loctite and sold the product to a person that already had one or two GUs, they weren't a year old. He said he's having good luck with them, but had to return a release...not sure if it was the old or new style.
The loss also be higher if I added the products sold to be replaced by the GUs. Previously had box style launchers (Ramponis) that worked great, but thought the wingers would produce a better mark using ducks.
The two things that bother me the most is not having the chance to run my first trained dog and myself in our first Grand, and not getting an apology for all the problems that I had along with others. I can tell that Rich is very proud of his product now and people are having better success with them. Hope I'm the only person that had the multiple problems as I did. 
Also not here to promote another product because they too copied an exciting product..hint.....their box launcher.
Hey..if I could go home to see new and improved GU wingers on my porch and see the improvements.. that work, then I'd promote them too. 
Sorry I sound so bitter, but well... 
Brett


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## Gunners Up

> retrievertraining.net Forums Forum Index
> Saved :: Message
> From: Gunners Up
> To: Brett Riedlinger
> Posted: Sun May 22, 2005 7:33 pm
> Subject: HRC Grand
> Brett,
> 
> I would like to wish you and your dog the best of luck at the Grand.
> 
> If you have time please look me up. We won't be hard to find, I'll be driving a Siver GMC Crew Cab 2500 with a three hole Ainly Box. I'll be pulling a big Gunners Up trailer.
> 
> I'd like to visit with you, get your thoughts on how we can get better and make things right if we can.
> 
> Once again good luck and I hope to see you there.
> 
> Sincerly,
> 
> Richard Davis


Brett, I sent the above PRIVATE MESSAGE to you before the Grand. I did not hear from or see you there or hear from you afterwards, so I assumed it wasn't that important to you. I hated to see that your dog went out in the 3rd series. 

Best of luck.

Rich Davis


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## Brett Riedlinger

Rich.. you have a PM


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## achiro

Brett Riedlinger said:


> The $650 was the cost to have my female trained for 1 month and run in the Spring Grand by a trainer in the Ohio area. Didn't want to do that, but no way to regain her marking ability without reliable equipment. Wish I had a penny every time asked why I'm not running her myself.
> I didn't add gas & time to go to and from training sites to work on marking drills only to have mechanical problems with the wingers. Did receive the new releases, then I added new rubber tubing, lock washers & nuts w/loctite and sold the product to a person that already had one or two GUs, they weren't a year old. He said he's having good luck with them, but had to return a release...not sure if it was the old or new style.
> The loss also be higher if I added the products sold to be replaced by the GUs. Previously had box style launchers (Ramponis) that worked great, but thought the wingers would produce a better mark using ducks.
> The two things that bother me the most is not having the chance to run my first trained dog and myself in our first Grand, and not getting an apology for all the problems that I had along with others. I can tell that Rich is very proud of his product now and people are having better success with them. Hope I'm the only person that had the multiple problems as I did.
> Also not here to promote another product because they too copied an exciting product..hint.....their box launcher.
> Hey..if I could go home to see new and improved GU wingers on my porch and see the improvements.. that work, then I'd promote them too.
> Sorry I sound so bitter, but well...
> Brett


I haven't read this whole thread and I do not own any gunners up products but I have several friends that do. Some people have had trouble, no different than many products out there. The thing that I have seen though over and over from GU is that they really want to help out. It looks as if you didn't really do much to communicate your troubles(the release is one example, they were replaced for free but you haven't said anything about trying that) Anyway, I just don't think its right for you to complain about a product publicly without letting GU try to make things right.


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## yellrdog

I need some new latex replacements for my GU and was wondering where you guys suggest buying them from? I didnt see anything on th GU website.


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## Cray Stephenson

yellrdog said:


> I need some new latex replacements for my GU and was wondering where you guys suggest buying them from? I didnt see anything on th GU website.


You can get them from GU or a GU dealer


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## Brett Riedlinger

achiro... the product failed me, do you think I purchased this product to complain?? Should a person expect to replace parts soon after the purchase? He did send three old style releases to replace the ones that failed before along with other components that failed. Out of 4 releases only one worked for two wingers, they were the old style. When should a person draw a line and jump ship? I gave it 9 months and maybe 4 training sessions did they both work. Am I the only person that purchased the original and complained about it?....No!! 
It's sad that a company can't even copy a product and to have their's work, does now but why not then?? Would GU have the same product now without earlier concerns?

As the way it looks I'm out of money and training time, so I feel I have a right to complain. 

yellrdog check out a post on where to buy rubber tubing. My friend replaced his with the 7/16".. great winging ducks.


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## B. A.

Brett Riedlinger said:


> achiro... the product failed me, do you think I purchased this product to complain?? Should a person expect to replace parts soon after the purchase? He did send three old style releases to replace the ones that failed before along with other components that failed. Out of 4 releases only one worked for two wingers, they were the old style. When should a person draw a line and jump ship? I gave it 9 months and maybe 4 training sessions did they both work. Am I the only person that purchased the original and complained about it?....No!!
> It's sad that a company can't even copy a product and to have their's work, does now but why not then?? Would GU have the same product now without earlier concerns?
> 
> As the way it looks I'm out of money and training time, so I feel I have a right to complain.


Seems to me that the company that sold the defective units should give you a full and complete refund and also compensate you for the money you had to pay a pro due to their defective product.

If they truly want to "make things right" they need to be willing to step up and dig deeply into their pockets to do so.


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## Cray Stephenson

chessieguy said:


> Seems to me that the company that sold the defective units should give you a full and complete refund and also compensate you for the money you had to pay a pro due to their defective product.
> 
> If they truly want to "make things right" they need to be willing to step up and dig deeply into their pockets to do so.



You really believe that the liability of a company should be to compensate you for everything that happens after you receive a defective part?

Brett could've bought more wingers and asked for a refund on the GU wingers, instead he *chose* to send his dog to a pro. How is GU responsibile for the bill he got from the pro? He did get a service from the pro and the service was not just the use of his wingers. And, at what point would the liability end? 1 month at the pro? 2 months? 3 months? Life? When the dog gets back from the pro, Brett still doesn't have any wingers and the need is still there. So he's right back where he was prior to employing the Pro. How was the *choice* of using the Pro someone elses responsibility?

That's like me going to Autozone, getting an alternator for my truck, installing it, it working for a day, it stopping at a "bad" time, leaving me stranded on the road forcing me to get it towed and to stay in a hotel, then I sell the truck to a friend and then tell Autozonethat it's their responsibility to buy me a new truck and pay the tow bill and the hotel bill.

A Company's liability should be for refund or replacement of the defective part/product....that's it. And to my knowledge, Brett never asked for that.


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## B. A.

Cray Stephenson said:


> chessieguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Seems to me that the company that sold the defective units should give you a full and complete refund and also compensate you for the money you had to pay a pro due to their defective product.
> 
> If they truly want to "make things right" they need to be willing to step up and dig deeply into their pockets to do so.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You really believe that the liability of a company should be to compensate you for everything that happens after you receive a defective part?
> 
> Brett could've bought more wingers and asked for a refund on the GU wingers, instead he *chose* to send his dog to a pro. How is GU responsibile for the bill he got from the pro? He did get a service from the pro and the service was not just the use of his wingers. And, at what point would the liability end? 1 month at the pro? 2 months? 3 months? Life? When the dog gets back from the pro, Brett still doesn't have any wingers and the need is still there. So he's right back where he was prior to employing the Pro. How was the *choice* of using the Pro someone elses responsibility?
> 
> That's like me going to Autozone, getting an alternator for my truck, installing it, it working for a day, it stopping at a "bad" time, leaving me stranded on the road forcing me to get it towed and to stay in a hotel, then I sell the truck to a friend and then tell Autozonethat it's their responsibility to buy me a new truck and pay the tow bill and the hotel bill.
> 
> A Company's liability should be for refund or replacement of the defective part/product....that's it. And to my knowledge, Brett never asked for that.
Click to expand...

I guess it depends on how important it is to the company to "make things right" in the opinion of the damaged customer.


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## badbullgator

Seems to me that with this one exception, the company has made any problems right. If replacements are found to be needed and offered FREE OF CHARGE to anyone that makes the effort to ASK for them, I think the company has done its job. I started the post to find out what people thought. Seems like most think highly of the product.After reviewing the post here and seeing some gunners up in action I will be ordering three next week. 
You can never make everybody happy. To think that you send your dog to a pro and that is the fault of a defective winger is insane. Did you by chance sit on the MJ jury? Cause your crazy as a loon in you logic.
I have had problems with a number of products. In most cases it only takes a little effort on YOUR part to make things right.
I'll post in a few months and see who I agree with after I have had a chance to use them for a while.


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## Gunners Up

*Chessie Guy*



Gunners Up said:


> retrievertraining.net Forums Forum Index
> Saved :: Message
> From: Gunners Up
> To: Brett Riedlinger
> Posted: Sun May 22, 2005 7:33 pm
> Subject: HRC Grand
> Brett,
> 
> I would like to wish you and your dog the best of luck at the Grand.
> 
> If you have time please look me up. We won't be hard to find, I'll be driving a Siver GMC Crew Cab 2500 with a three hole Ainly Box. I'll be pulling a big Gunners Up trailer.
> 
> I'd like to visit with you, get your thoughts on how we can get better and make things right if we can.
> 
> Once again good luck and I hope to see you there.
> 
> Sincerly,
> 
> Richard Davis
> 
> 
> 
> Brett, I sent the above PRIVATE MESSAGE to you before the Grand. I did not hear from or see you there or hear from you afterwards, so I assumed it wasn't that important to you. I hated to see that your dog went out in the 3rd series.
> 
> Best of luck.
> 
> Rich Davis
Click to expand...

Chessie Guy,

Before you weigh in on a thread and start accusing a company of poor customer service, get the facts straight! I wrote the above Private Message to Brett when I first found out he was unhappy. I waited around at the Grand for 4 days and never saw hide or hair of him. Brett choose to ignore my offer. I made a serious effort to reach out to him and that is all I can do. 

Prior to this, we made our Upgrade Release available to existing Gunners Up customers free of charge! All you had to do was call us and we would send you one. The program was announced on RTF and then a post card was sent out to each customer personally. Again, I seriously reached out to Brett, what else can I do? 

To blame Gunners Up for Brett's training shortcomings is ridiculous. The new releases were available (These are the same releases that fired off 1600 birds at the Grand without a hitch) in Sept. of 2004. *There was ample time for Brett to take advantage of this free program and train for the Grand. In fact almost 10 month?s worth of training time!!!!!! *

Brett's dog went out in the third series of the Grand. Who is Brett going to blame for this, Gunners Up or the Pro that had the dog? Should the Pro refund the training fees because the dog didn't pass the Grand? Maybe me and the Pro should pitch in and Brett could double his money! 

In short ChessieGuy, sometimes you have to get off your arse to help yourself. If people reach out to you and try and do the right thing sometimes you have to communicate back. Pick up the phone, write an e-mail, or just walk down the dirt road @ the Bong Recreational Center and say "Hey Rich, I'm Brett Riedlinger and I'm having a problem". But don't trash someone on the internet when they are trying to help you, it makes them not want to help you anymore!

I guess todays lesson would be _"You can't please everybody, and some people just don't want to be pleased"_

That's all I got to say about that.

Rich Davis


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## Vicky Trainor

It seems at this point that Gunners Up has made efforts to satisfy their customer Brett. Perhaps this would be a good time for this problem to be taken private.

Vicky
Moderator


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## tbyars

Totally agree with taking this private as it seems Gunners Up has tried to do with this person. As I stated before, I have used mine everyday with no problem whatsoever. Brett, if you did not have a winger to train your dog to run at the Grand then do what the rest of us did long before wingers were ever around. Join a training group, buy some ducks, and start throwing mark after mark after mark. To complain about $650 spent is ridiculous. I hate to think about the amount of money that I have spent on my dog training him. But, I don't think about it as I do it because I love it. Heck, I am a public school teacher so I don't make a lot of money. I do try and teach my students that they are the ones ultimately responsible and not to blame their problems on somebody else. If they want to accomplish something then don't wait on somebody else to do it for you, do it yourself if it is that important. I have had a great time using my GU wingers and I hope all works out well for you. Seems to me all you have to do is give them a call.


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## Cray Stephenson

chessieguy said:


> I guess it depends on how important it is to the company to "make things right" in the opinion of the damaged customer.


But making things right doesn't mean making things better than they were before.


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## Brett Riedlinger

Rich....I never blamed GU for my dog failing at the Grand. Never suggested GU 
refunding money for the cost of the Pro and the Grand entry fee. You make a 
strong point of my dog going out in the third series, almost like its 
funny. Personally, I feel Molly and Jim did a great job at the Grand. Jim 
only had a month and a half to get her marking back on track.
If anything positive comes out of this it would be me knowing Jim and his 
friend better and how dare you put yourself in the same sentence as him!

The statement you wrote about "good luck in the Grand", followed with sarcasm of her not passing says allot.
As I'm glad you support the Grand and other web sites that I visit, but with a statement like that makes a person wonder. 

You waiting around for me is funny....saw you driving around allot. Did see a 
guy at the booth ..maybe your father or friend? If you were waiting for me 
why not get off your arse and find me? Time better spent. 

I never received a post card nor did a friend of mine. If I would have then 
an exchange would have been made to replace the old style winger for the new 
and we both would be happy. Not sure how many times a person has to contact 
another about any issues but I'd have to say I've contacted you at least 6-8 
times last year with phone calls or emails and never was a refund or exchange 
offered only replacement parts. 
I didn't only have a problem with the release, but knowing you had a problem 
with them why send me more of the same?
****IF YOU HAVE A LIST OF ALL THE PARTS THAT WAS SENT & DATES SENT PLEASE 
POST**** 
Perhaps people will get a better understanding why I'm upset with your product. 

If a refund is possible lets do it!!!!


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## Vicky Trainor

Brett,

Please check your PMs.

Vicky
Moderator


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## Brad B

Geez Brett take your petty whining attitude somewhere else. Or call the guy personally and not use a public forum to air your feelings.


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## Cray Stephenson

Brett Riedlinger said:


> If a refund is possible lets do it!!!!


Brett, didn't you sell them to a friend? Or did I misread that?


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## Gunners Up

*Gunners Up*

Brett,

Please send back your orginal units with the original release by the end of next week (July 1st) and I will refund you your money.

Rich Davis


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## achiro

*Re: Gunners Up*



Brett Riedlinger said:


> If you were waiting for me
> why not get off your arse and find me?


I bought a crock pot from wal-mart once that didn't work. I took it back to wal-mart myself and got it taken care of. I never expected anyone from wal-mart to knock on my door. :roll: 
Oh, and I never expected wal-mart to pay for the meal I had to buy at Golden Corral because I couldn't cook it myself.



Gunners Up said:


> Brett,
> 
> Please send back your orginal units with the original release by the end of next week (July 1st) and I will refund you your money.
> 
> Rich Davis


Thats a hell of a lot more than I would EVER do! :lol:


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## Brad B

That's funny Aichiro !! My thoughts exactly !


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## badbullgator

Rich 
If you want to make me a deal on those slightly used returns with new releases on them, give me a pm.


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## DKR

*Re: Gunners Up*



achiro said:


> Brett Riedlinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you were waiting for me
> why not get off your arse and find me?
> 
> 
> 
> I bought a crock pot from wal-mart once that didn't work. I took it back to wal-mart myself and got it taken care of. I never expected anyone from wal-mart to knock on my door. :roll:
> Oh, and I never expected wal-mart to pay for the meal I had to buy at Golden Corral because I couldn't cook it myself.
> 
> 
> 
> Gunners Up said:
> 
> 
> 
> Brett,
> 
> Please send back your orginal units with the original release by the end of next week (July 1st) and I will refund you your money.
> 
> Rich Davis
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thats a hell of a lot more than I would EVER do! :lol:
Click to expand...


My thoughts exactly :x


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## cpayne

Richard brought me 3 of the newest releases this weekend for my units and I finally got them mounted today..........the work flawlessly! No more primor flying out. No more gently placing the bird in the pouch. Absolutely great! Think I might order a couple more!

Oh yea Richard, thanks for the hat!

Chris


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## Guest

*wingers*

Take a look out our wingers @www.fclaunchers.com. There are alot of different wingers on the market some better than others. I have learned no one winger pleases everybody but people pick according to personal prefference and advice from others. I think my wingers compare well with the other wingers being disscused. We are a new company and are looking foward to getting the product out to the public to raise awareness. We are adding dealers in many states now. I hope to hear reports on how my product compares.

Thanks

Jeremy Chance

FirstChance Launchers


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## FOM

Hey Brett, I'll buy your wingers from you if you don't like them, I'm looking to add to my collection.....

Let me know, this is a serious offer....

Lainee, Flash and Bullet


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## FOM

cpayne said:


> Oh yea Richard, thanks for the hat!


Hey Rich didn't bring me a hat, what about everyone else? Damn Rich what are we going to do about this? :wink: :wink: 

All I know is I had problems and even though it was operator spacing issues Rich was all over it and I was in business the very next evening. But maybe if I complain enough he'll even come out and setup with wingers at training for me? :wink: 

Rich keep up the good work, you are supporting our sport unlike some companies that are just feeding off it.....

Lainee, Flash and Bullet

BTW I have a NAHRA test and a Derby coming up, can I get a refund from you if my dogs fail?? :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## cpayne

Lainee,

Rumor has it that he also has a t-shirt for me! When I get the shirt I'll take a picture and email it to you  

I'll be a Gunners Up billboard. 

Chris


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## badbullgator

Just got my three Gunners Up today. They look great, but no hat  
I'll let you know how they work out.


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## badbullgator

We used the Gunners Up for the first time today. All three worked flawlessly. They throw very nice, high arcing birds even in the 20 mph winds we are having thanks to hurricane Dennis. Frozen ducks have new life in 35 mph gust. 
I?ll post again after using them a few months.
Corey


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## BIG DOG

I have 3 GU and think they are the best thing since sliced bread!!!
I am running up to 14 dogs/3 set ups a day using these things and I have NOT had a miss fire or a malfunction of any kind.

I have thrown everything from a EZ Bumper to a frozen bird flaw less everytime!! 

Rich thanks for the product and what you did at the Grand!!


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## 3 black dogs

Zinger winger GOOOOOD Gunners up BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD as far as wingers go I would compare gunners up right up there with Innotec collars and how many of you would buy a innotec product.


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## badbullgator

3bl

Zinger winger GOOOOOD Gunners up BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD as far as wingers go 

Wow! With an endorsement like that I bet people will be running to buy ZW?s and throw their Gunners UP away. Just a quick check of the 6 pages of post show that the post are 5 to 1 in favor of GU?s


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## Howard N

I have two Gunner's Up launchers, gooooood (so far). Years ago I had a two dog Innotek collar system, baad, verry baaaaad.

Charlie Journey said those collars were god though. :twisted:


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## Kelly

post moved...


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## Steve Hester

*Gunners UP are great!!!*

There are always those who will go out of their way to gripe, no matter what is done to try and satisfy them. And there are those who will knock a product, anybody's product, just to stir the pot. It's obvious that Rich has done everything possible to satisfy the "unsatisfied" customer. I have just purchased two GU's, and they are great, with no problems whatsoever! Some people just like to start trouble. :roll:


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