# Who was asking for photos of dwarf labs earlier?



## Montview (Dec 20, 2007)

I remember seeing puppy photos on another forum of someone's chocolate puppy a year or two ago, and asked them at the time whether or not she could be a dwarf...well, as she grew up, they found that she was, indeed. They had surgery done on her front legs to allow them to grow more normally (not as curved as they would have otherwise been). Thankfully, she doesn't have any signs of the retinal dysplasia that goes along with dwarfism, but she _does _have 2 littermates who are also dwarfs. 

I asked the owner if I could post her photos here, and she agreed. 

As a puppy (this is the photo I saw that initially made me ask the question):









And more recently:


















Anyhow, she's doing great and I just thought I would share.


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## Rainmaker (Feb 27, 2005)

Wow, that's pretty incredible to look at, thanks. If a dog like that came into our shelter, they'd swear it was a Lab/doxie cross or something.


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## MikeBoley (Dec 26, 2003)

Dang I thought this was about Lainee


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## Montview (Dec 20, 2007)

Rainmaker said:


> If a dog like that came into our shelter, they'd swear it was a Lab/doxie cross or something.


These owners mentioned that everyone always argues with them about how the dog must be crossed with a basset hound, in spite of the AKC papers they have for the dog. It is definitely an appearance that is common to all of them, and something you don't forget once you've seen one.


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## BrettG (Apr 4, 2005)

Looks like a jacked up weinee dog. I have a midget but she doesn't have dwarfism she's just small.


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## Bud (Dec 11, 2007)

Montview said:


> These owners mentioned that everyone always argues with them about how the dog must be crossed with a basset hound, in spite of the AKC papers they have for the dog. It is definitely an appearance that is common to all of them, and something you don't forget once you've seen one.


A silver lab owner once said something like that too me. Just saying....

Sorry couldn't pass it up.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

MikeBoley said:


> Dang I thought this was about Lainee


I great sized dog for a gnome!


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## Vicky Trainor (May 19, 2003)

I would like to see a picture of that dog standing next to an average sized Lab.


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## Furball (Feb 23, 2006)

Wow -- thanks for posting! Very interesting.
Definitely you can see how the dwarfism genes effect corgis, bassets, etc. 
--Anney


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## Jay Dufour (Jan 19, 2003)

I trained one in 1993.I told the owner that he may not last long,but he wanted to proceed anyway.Bubba went on to hunt for the guy for five years,but went bind,and had arthritis in the legs.He had a big heart and would goose hunt with the best of them.Of note....he was from a rather prolific stud dog that bred for years,and Im sure he put out a bunch of carriers.The breeder told him that some of the litter were dwarf labs,that were great in a pirogue....actually making it seem an asset !


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## Peggy Snyder (Jan 12, 2008)

I have seen this from a litter a breeder friend had--believe or not these pups were not crossed with anything but labs for at least 4 generations---out of the litter of 8 there were 3 pups that looked like the one above.. There is a difference between dwarf and just a small lab. The interesting thing is that I have only seen Chocolate labs that are dwarf--anyone seen or heard of any other color?


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

Peggy Snyder said:


> I have seen this from a litter a breeder friend had--believe or not these pups were not crossed with anything but labs for at least 4 generations---out of the litter of 8 there were 3 pups that looked like the one above.. There is a difference between dwarf and just a small lab. The interesting thing is that I have only seen Chocolate labs that are dwarf--anyone seen or heard of any other color?


Dwarfs have nothing to do with color. Probably the ones are chocolate because they are bred for color with no cerfs by byb.


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## msdaisey (May 13, 2004)

How could a breeder (of any breed) be breeding dogs (legitimately) that had not had any outcrosses for four generations?!?


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## Montview (Dec 20, 2007)

msdaisey said:


> How could a breeder (of any breed) be breeding dogs (legitimately) that had not had any outcrosses for four generations?!?


There wasn't anything mentioned about outcrosses vs. line-breeding...the comment was that there hadn't been anything beside a labrador (ie- purebred) for at least 4 generations.


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## Peggy Snyder (Jan 12, 2008)

I did not say that dwarfism were only in chocolate labs--I just commented that I have only seen chocolate dwarf labs--I'm sure dwarf labs come in other colors as well. And Montview was right in the respect that is particular breeder has had 4 generations of the pair he bred that had the dwarfs--these were labrador retrievers--I have seen the pedigrees and they are unrelated by at least 4 generations and they were only exposed to labrador retrievers when bred when they had the dwarfs. I am sure there was some line breeding in their generations beyond this--this was and still is a very common pratice. The pair was bred once more after the dwarfs were born and this litter was completely normal. Their vet said is was very rare to have even 1 in a litter let alone 3. This breeder has since retired the female but still uses the stud. I do not have enought knowledge to comment on why or how the gene is carried for dwarfs--my comments are based only on observation of that litter and those particular puppies.


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## Jay Dufour (Jan 19, 2003)

I have seen a yellow,and had purchased a black one a couple of years ago,where four or five out of the litter were diagnosed as dwarfs.There is worlds of info on it via a google search under canine dwarfism.It seems that its the same breakdown as CNM EIC ect.It can skip generations.


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

> Their vet said is was very rare to have even 1 in a litter let alone 3.


Not necessarily. Read the reference in this thread. Doing CERF on the eyes has pretty much eliminated the problem. The byb often don't do health certs. 
http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/showthread.php?t=28731&highlight=dwarfism


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## firehouselabs (Jan 23, 2008)

Thanks for the picture! Yes, that is exactly the body type of the dogs that my childhood friends had. All three were yellow, all lived to be 10+yrs without going blind, although ironically, all three ended up with three legs from chasing (and catching) cars. They were all from different litters too. It's funny, I can still remember their names, scooter, king, and buck.


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## BetsyBernock (Jul 29, 2004)

Peggy Snyder said:


> The interesting thing is that I have only seen Chocolate labs that are dwarf--anyone seen or heard of any other color?


About 8 years ago I saw a black dwarf Lab in the shelter where my mom worked.


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## Guest (Aug 18, 2008)

Bud said:


> A silver lab owner once said something like that too me. Just saying....
> 
> Sorry couldn't pass it up.


I've heard that there are achondroplasia genes in chocolates, but this is the first time I've ever seen a picture. Don't let my wife see this, she'll go to the ends of the earth to find one.

Does anyone know anything about silver labs?? 

The only one I've ever seen was phenotypically a dead ringer for a Weim cross, but the silver breeders say it's a recessive natural gene. Is that BS?

Who am I gonna believe? The silver breeder or my lying eyes?


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## LabLove (Jul 18, 2013)

Hi all, I just came across the dwarf chocolate lab through a Google search and am looking for the author/owner... I teach genetics to first year university students and would love to be able to get permission for showing the pictures in class as part of an exercise (nothing better than a super cute dog to alleviate the "genetics is hard" anxiety!). Thanks!


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## Renee P. (Dec 5, 2010)

LabLove said:


> Hi all, I just came across the dwarf chocolate lab through a Google search and am looking for the author/owner... I teach genetics to first year university students and would love to be able to get permission for showing the pictures in class as part of an exercise (nothing better than a super cute dog to alleviate the "genetics is hard" anxiety!). Thanks!


Bully whippets (myostatin mutation) are a fun one, too.


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## Raymond Little (Aug 2, 2006)

Jay Dufour said:


> I trained one in 1993.I told the owner that he may not last long,but he wanted to proceed anyway.Bubba went on to hunt for the guy for five years,but went bind,and had arthritis in the legs.He had a big heart and would goose hunt with the best of them.Of note....he was from a rather prolific stud dog that bred for years,and Im sure he put out a bunch of carriers.The breeder told him that some of the litter were dwarf labs,that were great in a pirogue....actually making it seem an asset !


I think I have one now, do you recall ped?


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## Terri (May 28, 2008)

Thanks for sharing the picture. I thought I saw one at a hunt test, but the dog I saw was not as short as the one posted here.

Terri


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## Jay Dufour (Jan 19, 2003)

Raymond Little said:


> I think I have one now, do you recall ped?


No.The last time I told someone that I had purchased two puppies that were found to be dwarfs, the owner of the stud dog tried to sue me.


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## Cedarswamp (Apr 29, 2008)

DNA the dwarf and post reaults on OFA...(it's free to post affected, but test isn't cheap). Then it could be found by search. IMO hurting the future puppies and owners by not disclosing that type of info. (Not blaming you, but the stud owner.)


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## Daniel J Simoens (Jul 7, 2011)

I'd just like to point out that this thread was started in 2008.


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## Montview (Dec 20, 2007)

LabLove said:


> Hi all, I just came across the dwarf chocolate lab through a Google search and am looking for the author/owner... I teach genetics to first year university students and would love to be able to get permission for showing the pictures in class as part of an exercise (nothing better than a super cute dog to alleviate the "genetics is hard" anxiety!). Thanks!


I am not the owner but the owner (actually in Europe) gave me permission to share photos. I can't imagine that she would have a problem with you using them in a university setting but I can see if I can get ahold of her to make sure? Like mentioned, this topic is from a few years back...


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## Joel907 (Aug 17, 2012)

Perfect size for the layout blind. 
Thanks for sharing


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## weathered (Mar 17, 2011)

Just curious if anyone knows if the sire or dam of any of these dwarfs passed a CERF exam. Optigen says its possible that RD/OSD Carriers can have no retinal folds, thereby being able to pass a CERF exam. But, the only carriers I know of failed their CERF.


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## Jiggy (Apr 14, 2003)

I know of carriers that passed CERF...over and over again...before they were tested.


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