# Lines-studs with good tractablity to influence a girl that might be lacking in it.



## Hunt'EmUp (Sep 30, 2010)

On the search, I assure everyone all tests are in order and the girl works-titles, so none of that please . Just a girl that takes after her Old school Hotter pedigree (Lean Mac Heavy), which I'm attempting to find a balance ideas are welcome.


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## Kaiser878 (Apr 17, 2015)

What exactly are you looking for? Any line in particular?


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## bamajeff (May 18, 2015)

I've always heard good things about Ranger(Nick of Time Lone Ranger) pups. No Lean Mac in his pedigree either.


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## labsforme (Oct 31, 2003)

Ask Chris Hatch about Saber. Very nice dog.


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## Ted Shih (Jan 20, 2003)

The Ali pups that I have seen are very tractable. That is one of the reasons that I bred Kitty to Ali.


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## Lpgar (Mar 31, 2005)

Live the biddablity of my Holland pup


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## Billie (Sep 19, 2004)

I know this is probably going to sound typical, but as a trainer, I've seen many (owned,trained and friends' dogs) Grady pups or Grady grandpups. One of the things I have enjoyed about training these dogs, is their extreme willingness to please. And dont need a lot of pressure ,either. As a trainer, two very nice qualities in a dog. 
There are lots of Grady sons out there (here on the west coast as well) being used, if you didnt want to go to the frozen source.


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## Kaiser878 (Apr 17, 2015)

Billie said:


> I know this is probably going to sound typical, but as a trainer, I've seen many (owned,trained and friends' dogs) Grady pups or Grady grandpups. One of the things I have enjoyed about training these dogs, is their extreme willingness to please. And dont need a lot of pressure ,either. As a trainer, two very nice qualities in a dog.
> There are lots of Grady sons out there (here on the west coast as well) being used, if you didnt want to go to the frozen source.


I can attest to that.... while I dint have a Grady son, I have a traveler grandson... I am an Ameature in the training world and think I was blessed with a very level headed dog that is a breath of fresh air to train.... much easier than my last.... so I can attest to the Grady blood being very trainable...


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## Hunt'EmUp (Sep 30, 2010)

Kaiser878 said:


> What exactly are you looking for? Any line in particular?


I would just like some ideas on lines that tend to throw a lot of itself that tends to balance, Fire. Dog marks like a dream, plenty of go, tenacious only little thing self-employed and she was hard as heck to train to handle, also hard to maintain. Had to be really tough to get it done, have to be really tough to keep her controlled. I'd call her an old school throw back. Not lacking, just high maintenance; and we're breeding much more user friendly dogs these days that don't require such maintenance.

So just curious what people have added to old school lines to bring in tractability, a bit more softness.

Considering Nitro-line, but fearing that it might not be enough to balance. She's got a bit of Barracuda Blue on mom's side, but the tractability seems to have been washed out; by semi-line breeding of Heavy hitters on both sides.


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## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

labsforme said:


> Ask Chris Hatch about Saber. Very nice dog.


isnt that a Lean Mac grandson?


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## bamajeff (May 18, 2015)

2tall said:


> isnt that a Lean Mac grandson?


I think so. That's the reason I didn't mention Grady. His progeny are very tractable, but pedigree of dam is already heavy Lean Mac. O/P stated he was wanting a different line.


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## Peter Balzer (Mar 15, 2014)

Does EIC status matter?


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## John Gianladis (Jun 23, 2012)

Look at Raft Creek Road Grader 'Willie' owned by Jim Byrd. He is out of Grady bred to my female 'Gypsy'. Willie made the derby list in 3 or 4 starts, had two Qual wins as a 2 year old, and has several all-age placements and several jams as a 3 year old. He is EIC/CNM clear. Willie is and has always been the epitome of Tractable! He has been trained by Mark Miles. Both parents were yellow factored.

Johnny G


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## Hunt'EmUp (Sep 30, 2010)

Peter Balzer said:


> Does EIC status matter?


Nope, Girl is Clear-clear; Actually wouldn't mind EIC carrier, don't think they get bred enough. Color doesn't matter either. The girl is black carries chocolate, but it's hard to beat a litter of nothing but black .


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## Trent Goree (Aug 10, 2005)

Hunt'EmUp said:


> Nope, Girl is Clear-clear; Actually wouldn't mind EIC carrier, don't think they get bred enough. Color doesn't matter either. The girl is black carries chocolate, but it's hard to beat a litter of nothing but black .


What about NFC AFC Bullet?


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## rrwilly (Jul 22, 2009)

FC Blackwater's Last Resort (Finn) I have a female by him out of his second litter I co-owned a female and bred her to him. My female that I kept is all him because she is very little like her dam and after conversations with his owner Bob Swenson they have the same personality type. Steady at the line, great training attitude, excellent marking and memory, team player, thinker (sometimes an over thinker). I would describe her personality as being sensitive not soft because she gets over a correction without holding a grudge but doesn't need a lot of pressure. I believe from what I've read similar to his sire FC AFC Blackwater Rudy. So if not Finn maybe a half brother


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## sapitrucha (Dec 17, 2011)

Mickey, Coal, Pow,


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## Mike W. (Apr 22, 2008)

rrwilly said:


> FC Blackwater's Last Resort (Finn) I have a female by him out of his second litter I co-owned a female and bred her to him. My female that I kept is all him because she is very little like her dam and after conversations with his owner Bob Swenson they have the same personality type. Steady at the line, great training attitude, excellent marking and memory, team player, thinker (sometimes an over thinker). I would describe her personality as being sensitive not soft because she gets over a correction without holding a grudge but doesn't need a lot of pressure. I believe from what I've read similar to his sire FC AFC Blackwater Rudy. So if not Finn maybe a half brother


I know this dog had a couple of Open wins early, but never was consistent after that, nor has he produced any FC or AFC dogs, despite being bred a lot. I hate it when people answer these kinds of posts with their current dog's sire.

To the OP, I would cross your Lean Mac x something that is proven with skins on the wall. I would try to hit it with a sire with significant Code Blue, or Harley. For Code Blue , Ranger, Grady, Luke. Harley I would say Ali, Ford (Easy Riider), Cosmo, Emmitt.


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## rrwilly (Jul 22, 2009)

I know this dog had a couple of Open wins early, but never was consistent after that, nor has he produced any FC or AFC dogs, despite being bred a lot. I hate it when people answer these kinds of posts with their current dog's sire.


I don't see what there is to hate I'm not trying to sell you anything. I was responding to the OP's #9 post with what I thought was a pretty good balance to his female.


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## fishnfetch (Jul 30, 2011)

Hunt'EmUp said:


> I would just like some ideas on lines that tend to throw a lot of itself that tends to balance, Fire. Dog marks like a dream, plenty of go, tenacious only little thing self-employed and she was hard as heck to train to handle, also hard to maintain. Had to be really tough to get it done, have to be really tough to keep her controlled. I'd call her an old school throw back. Not lacking, just high maintenance; and we're breeding much more user friendly dogs these days that don't require such maintenance.
> 
> So just curious what people have added to old school lines to bring in tractability, a bit more softness.
> 
> Considering Nitro-line, but fearing that it might not be enough to balance. She's got a bit of Barracuda Blue on mom's side, but the tractability seems to have been washed out; by semi-line breeding of Heavy hitters on both sides.


I was in pretty much the same boat as you a few years ago. Hard charging, hard headed, just take the ducks out of my mouth, black bitch. As you know, I chose Nitro, and other than the EIC thing I got EXACTLY what I was trying to get. Truly the most well rounded, easy to train dog I will probably ever own.


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## DuckDynasty (Aug 12, 2014)

Maybe look at Jazztime's Frequent Flyer (Tripp). Understand to be very biddable line, no Lean Mac but proven to cross well with LM.


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## Bubba (Jan 3, 2003)

Pirate has been known to throw some real pleasant personalities but he is kinda unavailable.

Might be some Pirate sons around though regards

Bubba


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## Peter Balzer (Mar 15, 2014)

This question piqued my interest on finding a Maxx free FC/AFC stud currently running and I know there are some out there, but I ran across FC Rock River Benjamin. Nice bottom side of pedigree including Code Blue/Red, qualified for multiple nationals, any reports on his pups? Is he getting bred much?


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## LGH (Oct 20, 2013)

How about Slider? LEAN Mac is pretty far back
Or Sailor. Buddy of mine has a dog out of Sailor thats a really nice dog


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## bamajeff (May 18, 2015)

LGH said:


> How about Slider? LEAN Mac is pretty far back
> Or Sailor. Buddy of mine has a dog out of Sailor thats a really nice dog


I've heard Slider can be know to be a handful at the line at times


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## Purpledawg (Jul 16, 2006)

Are you for sure lean Mac is the source of self employment gene?


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## Hunt'EmUp (Sep 30, 2010)

Purpledawg said:


> Are you for sure lean Mac is the source of self employment gene?


Dog is 50% (High Tech CEO x (Rebel daughter) & 50% (barracuda blue x PDQ daughter). A little Honest Abe in there, and interspersing of other diluted Lean Mac; females. Just past experience, from dogs I know. All generalizations (so no-one get insulted) Rebel tends to give style and go, haven't ever seen tractability issues with his get or any of theirs. Barracuda Blue offspring tend to be very tractable. Most PDQ dogs also tractable, probably one of the best handling dogs I've worked was a PDQ son. So if I had to think what I might want to play down in the next generation it is less Lean Mac. I like a bit of lean-mac, but past experience has shown that a little Lean Mac tends to go a long way. Could just be the mix in this dog, but her siblings are much the same. 

Thank You all who sent pms. The list is broadening, will have to do some traveling to see some of these boys in action.


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## Purpledawg (Jul 16, 2006)

May I suggest "Biggie one more time" who is in Northern Calif. amateur trained with AA points. Grady son. His dam is a NFC Flipper


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## Billie (Sep 19, 2004)

Purpledawg said:


> May I suggest "Biggie one more time" who is in Northern Calif. amateur trained with AA points. Grady son. His dam is a NFC Flipper


I trained a pup by him recently. She was very tractable, and sweet. Caught on quickly and always wanted to do the right thing. - again, I think this comes from Grady.


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## lidd4838 (Apr 7, 2011)

Do you know of any litters out of Biggie he currently has or upcoming?


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## Brokengunz (Sep 3, 2011)

Guide pups are doing well, he is a EIC carrier.


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

Purpledawg said:


> Are you for sure lean Mac is the source of self employment gene?


I don't find doubling up on LeanMac to make much difference. I had a Barracuda Blue son that was the most self employed dog I ever owned and I would never double up on him.


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## Ken Barton (Jun 7, 2010)

Like Ted said -Ali-I have a 21/2 y/o most tractable dog I’ve ever had and pinpoint marker


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