# Legal options; dogs stolen out of back of truck



## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

I'm going to be calling my lawyer as soon as the time is decent. I'm curious as to what the legal options are for this situation:

My girlfriend in Northern Illinois finished training and went out to lunch with friends. Dogs were locked(pad locked at bottom of crates) in the back of her truck. Truck topper was open, fans were on, dogs have water and are fine. By passer calls police, police arrive and determine dogs to be fine. By-passer insists dogs are not fine and prys open crates, puts dogs in her car and leaves. Officer did take down by-passers name and leaves card under wiperblade. Girlfriend finishes lunch, returns to empty truck, call officers card in panic, officer returns says that yes dogs were fine, crazy lady took them. Go to police station, crazy lady's returns dogs. Girlfriend manages to not punch crazy lady in face and the woman lectures her on the condition of her dogs. Dogs in question: OTCH, MACH, MH***. Male is proven stud. So my girlfriend is now past the I'm just thankful to have my dogs back stage and shock-is now wanting to press charges against the crazy woman and the officer. States attorney told her they won't touch it since she wants to pursue charges against the officer. What are her legal options?


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## Breck (Jul 1, 2003)

This could be helpful. *Animal Enterprise Protection Act*


*WARNING *
*(Animal Enterprise Protection Act)*
*Tampering with, bothering, injuring, abusing, or causing damage to these animals is an offense under the *
*Animal Enterprise Protection Act of 1992.*
*Penalties include fines, damages and restitution and prison sentences from one year to life*
*ORDINANCE NO.18 USC, SECTION 43, PUBLIC LAW 102-346*​ 
*Animal Enterprise Protection Act of 1992. *
*Public Law 102-346--Aug. 26, 1992 *​ 
*102nd Congress *
*An Act To protect animal enterprises. *​ 
*Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, *​ 
*SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE. *​ 
*This Act may be cited as the "Animal Enterprise Protection Act of 1992". *​ 
*SEC. 2. ANIMAL ENTERPRISE TERRORISM. *​ 
*(a) IN GENERAL.--Title 18, United States Code, is amended by inserting after section 42 the following: *​ 
*"§ 43. Animal enterprise terrorism *​ 
*"(a) OFFENSE.--Whoever-- *
*"(1) travels in interstate or foreign commerce, or uses or causes to be used the mail or any facility in interstate or foreign commerce, for the purpose of causing physical disruption to the functioning of an animal enterprise; and *​ 
*"(2) intentionally causes physical disruption to the functioning of an animal enterprise by intentionally stealing, damaging, or causing the loss of, any property (including animals or records) used by the animal enterprise, and thereby causes economic damage exceeding $10,000 to that enterprise, or conspires to do so; shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both. *​ 
*"(b) AGGRAVATED OFFENSE.-- *​ 
*"(1) SERIOUS BODILY INJURY.-- Whoever in the course of a violation of subsection (a) causes serious bodily injury to another individual shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 10 years, or both. *​ 
*"(2) DEATH.--Whoever in the course of a violation of subsection (a) causes the death of an individual shall be fined under this title and imprisoned for life or for any term of years. *​ 
*"(c) RESTITUTION.-- An order of restitution under section 3663 of this title with respect to a violation of this section may also include restitution-- *​ 
*"(1) for the reasonable cost of repeating any experimentation that was interrupted or invalidated as a result of the offense; and *​ 
*"(2)) the loss of food production or farm income reasonably attributable to the offense. *​ 
*"d) DEFINITIONS.-- As used in this section-- *
*"(1) the term 'animal enterprise' means-- *​ 
*"(A) a commercial or academic enterprise that uses animals for food or fiber production, agriculture, research, or testing; *
*"(B) a zoo, aquarium, circus, rodeo, or lawful competitive animal event; or *
*"(C) any fair or similar event intended to advance agricultural arts and sciences; *​ 
*"(2) the term 'physical disruption' does not include any lawful disruption that results from lawful public, governmental, or animal enterprise employee reaction to the disclosure of information about an animal enterprise; *​ 
*"(3) the term 'economic damage' means the replacement costs of lost or damaged property or records, the costs of repeating an interrupted or invalidated experiment, or the loss of profits; and *​ 
*"(4) the term 'serious bodily injury' has the meaning given that term in section 1365 of this title. *​ 
*"9e) NON-PREEMPTION.--Nothing in this section preempts any State law.". *​ 
*(b) CLERICAL AMENDMENT.--The item relating to section 43 in table of sections at the beginning of chapter 3 of title, United States Code, is amended to read as follows: *​ 
*"43. Animal enterprise terrorism.". *​ 
*SEC. 3. STUDY OF EFFECT OF TERRORISM ON CERTAIN ANIMAL ENTERPRISES. *​ 
*(a) STUDY.-- The Attorney General and the Secretary of Agriculture shall jointly conduct a study on the extent and effects of domestic and international terrorism on enterprises using animals for food or fiber production, agriculture, research, or testing. *​ 
*(b) SUBMISSION OF STUDY.-- Not later than 1 year after the date of enactment of this Act, the Attorney General and the Secretary of Agriculture shall submit a report that describes the results of the study conducted under subsection (a) together with any appropriate recommendations and legislation to the Congress. *​ 
*Approved August 26, 1992.*​


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## pat addis (Feb 3, 2008)

Pals said:


> I'm going to be calling my lawyer as soon as the time is decent. I'm curious as to what the legal options are for this situation:
> 
> My girlfriend in Northern Illinois finished training and went out to lunch with friends. Dogs were locked(pad locked at bottom of crates) in the back of her truck. Truck topper was open, fans were on, dogs have water and are fine. By passer calls police, police arrive and determine dogs to be fine. By-passer insists dogs are not fine and prys open crates, puts dogs in her car and leaves. Officer did take down by-passers name and leaves card under wiperblade. Girlfriend finishes lunch, returns to empty truck, call officers card in panic, officer returns says that yes dogs were fine, crazy lady took them. They then go to crazy lady's house and retrieve owners dogs. Girlfriend manages to not punch crazy lady in face and the woman lectures her on the condition of her dogs. Dogs in question: OTCH, MACH, MH***. Male is proven stud. So my girlfriend is now past the I'm just thankful to have my dogs back stage and shock-is now wanting to press charges against the crazy woman and the officer. States attorney told her they won't touch it since she wants to pursue charges against the officer. What are her legal options?


sue the crap out of the crazy lady and pursue criminal charges,theft,destruction of property and anything else,this stuff has to stop.the other day it was 82 degrees out the dogs were in the dog box under a tree in the yard the box is ventelated on all 4 sides i was in the yard with 1 dog and the dog cop pulls up and tells me some one complained the dogs were mistreated after looking around he decides it's ok and leaves.it left me in a bad state of mind


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

I would like to see her take my dogs......they are not fans of someone else getting near their crates ;-)


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

BGB-usually Hootie barks at people who get too close to his crate. I don't know why he went with the nutcase. This whole thing makes me see red and quite frankly scares the crap out of me. Still waiting before I can call my sister in law and call in a few favors.


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

> States attorney told her they won't touch it since she wants to pursue charges against the officer.


What about the county DA? They are connected on a local level. Pursue a complaint about the officer to the PD and let them handle it and prosecute the lady under every possible crime you can find and get a good attorney. Get one from the county you live in-the best you can find with the best reputation in the courts. Don't ask me how I know.


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## MarkyMark (Jun 5, 2010)

Find a barrister that has tons of court room time, he's going to have a war on his hands when PETA and HSUS jumps in. I would call here first to find one that is used to working with tree huggers. www.ussportsmen.org


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## mohaled (Oct 7, 2007)

Introduce that lady to your lawyer, Mr. Benelli.


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## 43x (Mar 29, 2009)

All squirrels don't live in trees


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## Good Dogs (Nov 1, 2005)

UFB. Press charges against the idiot. Grand theft, vehicular burgalry, anything esle you can think. Include the cop for "aiding and abetting." File an injunction against the idiot to make sure she stays away from you and your truck. 

We bought some crates years - decades - ago that had a 4" x 3" plastic placard that read:

STOP
TAMPERING WITH THIS ANIMAL MAY BE A FEDERAL OFFENSE UNDER THE ANIMAL ENTERPRISE PROTECTION ACT OF 1992. PENALTIES MAY INCLUDE FINES, DAMAGE RESTITUTION, AND PRISON SENTENCES FROM ONE YEAR TO LIFE.
ORDINANCE No. 18 USC SECTION 43 PUBLIC LAW 102 346

I'd forgotten about the signs but after reading this dug the crates out of the barn and retrieved the one readable (barely) sign. I've tried to find the signs for sale but no luck. May have to have some made at a local sign shop but will have one mounted on the dog crate.
'Course that assumes that some idiot perp can read but at least it might keep a stupid cop from just standing by watching someone try to break into my truck. 

Good luck and let us know how this turns out.


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## Sue Kiefer (Mar 4, 2006)

Also put something in the local newspaper, local T.V. station,anything that would call attention to this crap.
Good Grief!!!!!!!
I would be more than a little pissed at that nutjob and the cop what the hell???????
Sue


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## CMRR&GC (Apr 3, 2010)

How does the state attorney have say in whether or not they will touch it or not.....you get to decide if you want to press charges. You don't have a snowballs chance making anything stick against a cop but I digress. 

I would have made the officer go get my dogs....if he refused I would have reported them stolen....he would be an accomplice.

I'd also raise holy hell until the folks and or made good on any damage they did to the crate....I'd have the dogs vetted and make them pay....if they don't I'd raise a stink with the city.

What was the temp in N. Illinois anyway all of 80-85 degrees at lunch time?

Even if I didn't get a thing I would make 10 times as much trouble for those involved as their behavior made for me....


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## Terry Thomas (Jun 27, 2005)

Maybe the cop did the best thing to defuse an incident. He did leave a card and assist in retrieving the animals. He may have personnal knowledge of this wacko and realize the animals were safe. He will probably be your most reliable and respectable witness in a civil suit against the women. Consider reapproaching the States Attorney about fileing charges against the women and not the officer.


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## CMRR&GC (Apr 3, 2010)

Terry Thomas said:


> Maybe the cop did the best thing to defuse an incident. He did leave a card and assist in retrieving the animals. He may have personnal knowledge of this wacko and realize the animals were safe. He will probably be your most reliable and respectable witness in a civil suit against the women. Consider reapproaching the States Attorney about fileing charges against the women and not the officer.


If you knew of a house where say 10-15 dogs were living inside do you think a cop would stand by while you kicked the door in....?

I'm sure the cop is a stand up guy as 90%+ are but he botched this one.


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## seandcso75 (May 12, 2009)

If I assisted someone break in to a vehicle to "rescue" some dogs I would lose my job immediately!!


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## bandcollector (Oct 9, 2003)

Was the officer there when the dogs were taken?


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## Robert (Feb 28, 2006)

This kind of story makes me want to start putting pad locks back on the dog kennels.

I pulled up in the driveway a few months ago to see an animal control officer walking out of our house with my wife. I quickly learned someone had reported my dogs due to "inadequate shelter".... The officer didn't even let me get a word out first and said with a smile on his face those dogs are wonderfully taken care of. That set up must of cost you some money. 

Brand new concrete kennel runs, insulated dog houses, large water buckets fill fresh each day, no crap anywhere, and the sides and tops of the kennels tied off with sun screens.

Boy was I pi$$ed. The neighbors all got to look at a few signs strategically placed around the property that simply said, "MIND YOUR OWN F’ING BUSINESS for a few weeks. 

The best of luck to you in this scenario!


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## rabersin (Dec 2, 2009)

It Illinois, they are having a hard time convicting Blago when he is on tape, do you think they want to prosecute a "do-gooder" just trying to save dogs from the cruel life they're forced to live. Forget prosecuting them, sue her in civil court and sue the policeofficier and police department. Messing with hunting dogs anywhere in this country will get the attention of any jury. Get a good attorney and sue. Make her and the police pay money.


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## TN_LAB (Jul 26, 2008)

Press charges and call Fox News. 

Talk to the cop. I ain't big on upsetting the men in blue (especially local ones). After talking with him, you might need to file a complaint against him. I'd also take that lady to small claims court. If for nothing else, than because she damaged your property. 

I'd make a hobby of doing something.


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## Brad B (Apr 29, 2004)

I'm sorry I have a hard time believing that the cop just stood by while the wack job broke into someone's vehicle. But if all that is said is true, I would press criminal charges on the lady and got to the cop's internal affairs division and file a complaint.

Who saw all this going on anyway? Was it related to her from the officer?


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## Christa McCoy (Jan 29, 2010)

mohaled said:


> Introduce that lady to your lawyer, Mr. Benelli.


Love it! I would be beyond mad if that happened to me. I just might loose my good Christian disposition.


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## Richard Meisemann (Dec 29, 2009)

Crazy...

That's also why I live in the south...and definately don't live in Illinois, it's like the 3rd whackiest state out, behind Cali and NY


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## deanlange (Apr 26, 2010)

It probably doesn't help that a local tv station did a story on unattended animals and the law here in Iowa according to the reporter is you cannot leave a dog unattended in a vehicle if the outside temperature exceeds 75 degrees.


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## Bubba (Jan 3, 2003)

Hey Nancy- I'll ship Lilly back there for a while. Leave her in a kennel in a likely spot and wait for the show.

Wouldn't want to be the dumb SOB that opens her kennel door.

Short Arm of the law regards

Bubba


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## frontier (Nov 3, 2003)

http://www.animallaw.info/articles/qvuspetsincars.htm

This is a crazy situation. I've been asked some in the hot weather about my dog box on my pickup, and the first thing I tell anyone is don't worry, there are no dogs being transported there in this heat. It's normally while I am parked in a mall or in a eating establishment's parking lot. I am glad the dogs were recovered.


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## limiman12 (Oct 13, 2007)

Personally, I would hesitate to directly press charges against the officer. Press charges against the lady, list the officer as a witness. If he handled the situation how the chief wanted it, pressing charges against him would not do any good, if not he will get reprimanded once he gives his version of the story.

He was in a no win. LEt happen what happened, you are mad. But lets say he said no the dogs are fine and doesn't let the whack job "rescue them", and then one of the dogs turns out not fine, he would/could be named in a lawsuit coming from PETA or HSUS........

Nothing good comes from picking a fight with a cop, no matter how right you are. Doing it this way sheds light on what he did, without you having to hold the spotlight.


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## limiman12 (Oct 13, 2007)

deanlange said:


> It probably doesn't help that a local tv station did a story on unattended animals and the law here in Iowa according to the reporter is you cannot leave a dog unattended in a vehicle if the outside temperature exceeds 75 degrees.


According to the article linked above, the tv station had it wrong.....

OMG, imagine that, A tv news station didn't get the facts right


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 23, 2004)

While the AETA may seem to apply, which would make it a Federal offense, I doubt that it would fly.

In both a criminal and civil trial your friend seems to have legitimate standing. However, bringing the officer into the criminal case may be self-defeating. He's the single best witness to the lady's inappropriate behavior and also he'll be seen as an "expert" insofar as condition and care of the animals. 

On the police officer, go to his superiors and talk to them about the case in a non-threatening manner. Find out what his justification was for letting her break into the car. You may be able to raise police awareness on this problem without putting a bulls-eye on your back.

Eric


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## Lenore (Apr 2, 2010)

Just want to keep an eye on this. I am glad that you got the dogs back and they are fine.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

Yes the officer stood by why this lady took these "too beautiful to sit in crates" dogs. The lady took down the shade blanket, turned the fans off and pryed open her crates. Then my friend had to go to the police station, where the officer called the 'good citizen' who then returned the dogs. After the officer tells my friend that she did nothing wrong and the dogs were fine in the truck. If the police don't do a police report we are screwed, no grounds to prosecute because "the dogs were returned unharmed". I kid you not. I've offered to help pay for a lawyer I'm so pissed off about this.


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## scott furbeck (May 28, 2008)

Eric Johnson said:


> While the AETA may seem to apply, which would make it a Federal offense, I doubt that it would fly.
> 
> In both a criminal and civil trial your friend seems to have legitimate standing. However, bringing the officer into the criminal case may be self-defeating. He's the single best witness to the lady's inappropriate behavior and also he'll be seen as an "expert" insofar as condition and care of the animals.
> 
> ...


Exactly..... Your friend has standing, but it makes no difference. If you can educate your local cops, they may be on your side next time. You are rightfully mad now, but cool heads have to prevail.


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## wheelhorse (Nov 13, 2005)

Pals said:


> If the police don't do a police report we are screwed, no grounds to prosecute because "the dogs were returned unharmed". I kid you not. I've offered to help pay for a lawyer I'm so pissed off about this.


So that means if I break into someone's moving van, steal their tv while LE is watching, that I don't get arrested for burglary if I return it with out a dent or scratch on it, after the owner calls and asks me to return the tv?

The last time I looked, dogs are considered property and that wacko stole property. What are those dogs worth? $10,000? What would she be charged with if she stole $10,000 of inanimate property?

Kathleen


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## Brad B (Apr 29, 2004)

Pals said:


> Yes the officer stood by why this lady took these "too beautiful to sit in crates" dogs. The lady took down the shade blanket, turned the fans off and pryed open her crates. Then my friend had to go to the police station, where the officer called the 'good citizen' who then returned the dogs. After the officer tells my friend that she did nothing wrong and the dogs were fine in the truck. If the police don't do a police report we are screwed, no grounds to prosecute because "the dogs were returned unharmed". I kid you not. I've offered to help pay for a lawyer I'm so pissed off about this.


All state's laws are different but no matter if they were unharmed or not, in TX anyway that's a theft or burglary of a motor vehicle.

Sounds like some stupid yankee laws at work.


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## hotel4dogs (Aug 2, 2010)

Here in IL dogs are still considered chattel (sp?) with a maximum value of $500 or the actual purchase price, whichever is higher.
However, breaking and entering is a different issue.
I'm not an attorney, and I don't agree with what the whacko did AT ALL.
But here's how the opposing attorney might argue it...
Suppose you were walking down the street and saw a house on fire. You saw a dog in the doorway barking like crazy. You broke the door down, grabbed the dog, and took it home with you until the owner could come get it.
What are you guilty of?
The person was WRONG but the attorney can argue that she believed she was in the right, believed she was saving the dogs' lives, and so on.
IMHAOWO, not worth the effort to try to fight it.





wheelhorse said:


> So that means if I break into someone's moving van, steal their tv while LE is watching, that I don't get arrested for burglary if I return it with out a dent or scratch on it, after the owner calls and asks me to return the tv?
> 
> The last time I looked, dogs are considered property and that wacko stole property. What are those dogs worth? $10,000? What would she be charged with if she stole $10,000 of inanimate property?
> 
> Kathleen


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## Joseph Kendrick (Mar 19, 2010)

How many dogs did she take?

How much damaged was done to the crates?

Was there any damage done to the vehicle (even a scratch)?

Find out if there is a video of what happened (most police cars have video)

Do not go after the officer untill you have everything you need on the lady

Find out if she is on the "board" or a member of any animal related groups or organizations (they may be liable for her actions if she is on a board)

This is a theft, you do not have to go through your police department to file charges (ie County Sheriff)

In the case mentioned above with the house on fire the person is still guilty of breaking and entering (you can tell the fire department not to go into a burning house and all they can do is keep the fire under control from the outside)

If something is not done about these animal wackos now we are going to have more and more problems with them. This is something that must be pursued until a point not just justice is made. 

Keep us informed.


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## Julie R. (Jan 13, 2003)

Relentless said:


> That's also why I live in the south...and definately don't live in Illinois, it's like the 3rd whackiest state out, behind Cali and NY


Don't think just because you live in the South it couldn't happen to you. In April I left my truck running with the A/C on while I dashed into a store in Front Royal VA to get some stuff for our club's AKC hunt test the next day. It wasn't even hot, but breezy and sunny and about 75 degrees (one of those perfect spring days you think you can slip a blind or quick training session in somewhere) but I didn't want to leave the windows down because I had guns and other expensive stuff in the vehicle.

As I was checking out 15 minutes later I heard the clerk and another customer talking about some moron that had left dogs locked in a car all day. Sure enough when I looked outside there was a crowd assembling in front of MY truck! Shoved my cart & card at the clerk and raced out just as the law (2 cruisers, animal control truck) drove up. Before I could even open my mouth some old battle ax in a house coat smoking cigarettes on the bench by the Big Lots ranted on about how those poor dogs had been locked in that truck all day and were dying.

Much as I wanted to grab her by the housecoat and slap her silly a passing thought of animal cruelty charge--how would that look for a HT/club secretary? slid across my consciousness and I kept my cool and tried to politely explain to the officers that the dogs had only been there 15 min. and the truck was running with the AC on.

These days even a whiff of animal cruelty is as politically correct to antagonize/throw the book at as any garden variety hate crime and the officers would NOT listen to me. One gave me a genial, "But it's hot and even on a day like this, cars can heat up" lecture as if I was a slobbering moron and produced a gizmo that looked like a radar gun to read the inside temp. of my vehicle while the battle ax screeched on. I was slack jawed at the 118 degree reading, and indignantly opened the door and invited him in to take an inside reading (75 degrees) and see for himself the dogs slumbering comfortably in their boxes, water buckets in each. Oh and it was a major effort of self control not to whisper "sic-sic-sic-sic-sic" to the waking Chesapeakes. I don't think I even got a chance to explain the AC was on or that the truck had only been there 15 minutes as the old biddy lit another cigarette and shrieked for my arrest to the assembled crowd of onlookers.

And the cops and animal control fellow acted like they were doing me a favor not to cite me for animal endangerment even though my dogs were never in any distress! I never lost my temper, never raised my voice, I was the very soul of polite cooperation, but I cringe to think of what might've happened if I had spoken what I wanted. It seems today's Oh-So PC environment extends to anything perceived mean or cruel to animals is a hot button LEOs take very seriously for fear of bad press.

One lesson learned is that if a cop has one of those interior temp. guns pointed at your dogs, challenge it. No way it was 118 degrees anywhere near my truck! Made me wonder how many others have had to deal with bogus charges from one.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

Here is the latest: Geneva police will not file a report, according to their sargent the officer did nothing wrong, she got her dogs back-end of story. When pressed about stealing someones property he did not respond, when asked if one of the dogs had bitten the crazy lady, who would be responsible-silence. When told that owner wished to press charges against the lady-silence. When told that officer did not follow protocol-silence and too bad lady. There were two witnesses to the entire incident, besides my friend. So she does have back up for a civil suit. The sargent is closing ranks because he knows his officer made a very poor decision. Two dogs were taken, minor damage to crates-doors bent. After spending part of the day on the phone to many lawyers here is what I've discovered: Illinois law in regards to this type of incident sucks, the crazy lady will get away with this, put two padlocks on your crates in the truck, put a sign on your crate with multiple phone numbers. State on the sign that the dogs are being monitored and you have a system set up to warn you if the temp. becomes dangerous, also reference the 1992 law and that you will prosecute anyone touching your dogs. Always park your truck where you can see it. I've never had any problems with my dogs in the truck in Central or southern Illinois. However I will from this day forward act like it could happen to me. 

After watching my girlfriend get nowhere("hey no harm you got your dogs back"-don't get me wrong I'm so grateful she did get her dogs back unharmed-truly God was watching out for them. Just think of all the possiblities of what could have happened.) This is what I will do if this ever happens to me. Retrieve my dogs, ask the "good citizen" and officers to please wait while I put my dogs up-I wish to discuss this incident further. I will get the dogs in the truck, give my keys and wedding rings to someone I trust and make sure they are on the road going to a safe place. I will then walk back into the police station, ask for them to file a police report for theft of my "property". If my request is not granted I will then turn around and punch the "good citizen" for all I'm worth. My one phone call will be to my husband to bail me out.


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## John Kelder (Mar 10, 2006)

There has to be a protocol in the state to prosecute those who carry a badge and those who refuse to take corrective action when they become aware of it . Typically , you have to have your attorney initiate the proceedings , because ,until then , they will not take you seriously .
Google Illinois Police complaints. I found cook cty. complaint forms,SP procedure, etc. Good Luck Nancy


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## Ken Newcomb (Apr 18, 2003)

Julie R. said:


> One gave me a genial, "But it's hot and even on a day like this, cars can heat up" lecture as if I was a slobbering moron and produced a gizmo that looked like a radar gun to read the inside temp. of my vehicle while the battle ax screeched on. I was slack jawed at the 118 degree reading, and indignantly opened the door and invited him in to take an inside reading (75 degrees) and see for himself the dogs slumbering comfortably in their boxes, water buckets in each.




For future reference these are surface area thermometers. All he was doing was measuring the temperature of the window.


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## CMRR&GC (Apr 3, 2010)

It all comes down to can you get a free lawyer or do you have more rage than money.....if so I'd ruin several people's day on principle. If not then the whole thing sucks but you did get your dogs back. If my crate doors were bent I'd at a minimum get brand new ones of any kind I chose. If they won't cooperate I'd file suit against the lady, officer, and city.


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## Steve Amrein (Jun 11, 2004)

Pals said:


> Here is the latest: Geneva police will not file a report, according to their sargent the officer did nothing wrong, she got her dogs back-end of story. When pressed about stealing someones property he did not respond, when asked if one of the dogs had bitten the crazy lady, who would be responsible-silence. When told that owner wished to press charges against the lady-silence. When told that officer did not follow protocol-silence and too bad lady. There were two witnesses to the entire incident, besides my friend. So she does have back up for a civil suit. The sargent is closing ranks because he knows his officer made a very poor decision. Two dogs were taken, minor damage to crates-doors bent. After spending part of the day on the phone to many lawyers here is what I've discovered: Illinois law in regards to this type of incident sucks, the crazy lady will get away with this, put two padlocks on your crates in the truck, put a sign on your crate with multiple phone numbers. State on the sign that the dogs are being monitored and you have a system set up to warn you if the temp. becomes dangerous, also reference the 1992 law and that you will prosecute anyone touching your dogs. Always park your truck where you can see it. I've never had any problems with my dogs in the truck in Central or southern Illinois. However I will from this day forward act like it could happen to me.
> 
> After watching my girlfriend get nowhere("hey no harm you got your dogs back"-don't get me wrong I'm so grateful she did get her dogs back unharmed-truly God was watching out for them. Just think of all the possiblities of what could have happened.) This is what I will do if this ever happens to me. Retrieve my dogs, ask the "good citizen" and officers to please wait while I put my dogs up-I wish to discuss this incident further. I will get the dogs in the truck, give my keys and wedding rings to someone I trust and make sure they are on the road going to a safe place. I will then walk back into the police station, ask for them to file a police report for theft of my "property". If my request is not granted I will then turn around and punch the "good citizen" for all I'm worth. My one phone call will be to my husband to bail me out.


I could not let this go.

I would at minimum go to th e sheriff or state HP or even the states atty. and I would take it to small claims court and have the officer and his boss show up to testify. If not I would haunt the do gooder and call every fricken agency if she had 1 blade of grass to high or the lid was off her garbage can. 2 can play that game. I would even follow them to work and screw with them there.


As for the police ask them since its ok for someone to break into your car the what would they do if someone smashed the window of a K9 car and took the dog out.


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## Kelly Greenwood (Dec 18, 2008)

You can contact both the ACLU and you can contact the FBI. The FBI is in charge of investigating cover ups of police that commit crimes while on duty. and while it is a minor case of theft, it is a big case because of the cover-up and accomplice by the officer. The civil rights of the person are being denied by the police station to due process.


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## Bklk (Aug 3, 2008)

Joseph Kendrick said:


> In the case mentioned above with the house on fire the person is still guilty of breaking and entering (you can tell the fire department not to go into a burning house and all they can do is keep the fire under control from the outside)


Most states the property laws are similar. Only the District or State's Attorney can pursue criminal charges. The most you can pursue is the damage to the crates which is done in Civil Court. As to the quote about the Fire Dept. it's absolutely not true. If you call 911 or state you have a fire in or on your property. The F.D. has a "Duty To Act". Which means the owner can not stop them from going in to investigate or put a fire out. As a recently Retired Battalion Chief from a SE Florida Metropolitan Fire Dept. I speak from experience.


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## Julie R. (Jan 13, 2003)

Ken Newcomb said:


> For future reference these are surface area thermometers. All he was doing was measuring the temperature of the window.


I'd never seen one, and the officer told me it took a reading of the temperature as he showed me the digital display. It looked sort of like a radar speed detector, kind of gun-shaped. You could well be right, but why would he say it could take the inside temperature? And even if it was just a surface area thermometer, there's no way even the outside temperature could've been 118 degrees--my truck has tinted windows and they weren't even hot to the touch outside. I know because I was trying to get him to look in the windows at the dogs lounging comfortably in their boxes not in any distress because the woman kept shrieking to the crowd that they were dying.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 23, 2004)

First of all, state laws differ so I'm going to argue in a sort of generic sense.

The lady took the dogs. That's theft. Apparently in Illinois there's a limit on dog value for garden variety dogs. This limit seems to be higher if the owner can show value. The titles that were cited would tend to show this plus, as I recall, there were two dogs so the minimum value would be $1000.

The police have decided to not file charges because she got the dogs back....sort of a no harm, no foul concept. However, no matter whether the dogs were returned, there's still the matter of theft. If a person takes a painting from a gallery (theft), they don't get to return it under this concept of no harm, no foul and not be charged with theft. 

The police are the normal entry into the criminal justice system...but not the only one. The states attorney can initiate criminal charges without police action. The prosecutor may be reluctant to file charges because of the bad light the police officer would be in but, s/he should do this anyway.

I doubt that there is anything available in a civil suit because there are no real damages.

Eric


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## Hunchaser (Jun 15, 2009)

True story. My dog truck (stainless steel, 6 holes) was parked at a restaurant and I was having a bite to eat. I was lucky becuase I could see my truck. I saw a man and and I assume his wife came up to the truck. The man bent down to look in through the doors and the woman had her hand on the door handle. My dogs didn't make a sound until the guy was about an inch away from the door when all of a sudded they started to bark. The lady jumped oput of her skin and the man moved backwards so fast that he fell over backwards. I walked out side and as I was getting into the truck said,"see what happens when you touch things that don't belong you and drove off with a smile on my face.


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## mostlygold (Aug 5, 2006)

This is one reason why I will only park my vehicle where I can see it. 

I am in awe of your friend's self control. Just due to the sheer terror of having my dog's missing, I am certain I would have beaten that woman into the ground. 

I have warned people away from my vehicle in the past. They don't understand the difference between leaving a dog in a vehicle with windows cracked and leaving a dog in a dog box or well shaded, well ventilated crate. People who train dogs know how to keep their dogs comfortable. My dogs are always a lot more comfortable than I am at training sessions and trials. 

My own nature is to not get the law involved in things that I can take care of myself quite nicely. 

Regards
Dawn


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## JusticeDog (Jul 3, 2003)

Eric Johnson said:


> First of all, state laws differ so I'm going to argue in a sort of generic sense.
> 
> 
> I doubt that there is anything available in a civil suit because there are no real damages.


True.... 

1. Since they are declining criminal charges, there is no criminal theft charges that can be brought. I doubt if they would pursue it since they have bigger fish to fry, and the dogs were recovered and were fine.
2. You cannot sue a police officer individually since most governmental entities in Illinois have immunity, and can only be sued if the test of willful and wanton misconduct comes into play. This test is rarely ever met.
3. The only damages are to the locks/crates which is minimal - can be brought in small claims court if one wanted to. Be prepared with estimates of repair/replacement and keep the broken items to be introduced into evidence at trial. 
4. A jury might see the woman as a hero - rescuing the animals on a hot day. (I'm not saying they were in distress, just what the jury could believe.
5. Dogs are viewed as property in Illinois, and have the same value as a car, etc. If they have a special job, they are worth more. This is due to a recent change in the case law in the past < 5 years. Your friend may use them in her business, and there may be a loss of income claim because of that.

The damages are so minimal in this instance, sometimes, it's best to move forward and forget about it. There is a filing fee to file a small claims action. You should check with your local courthouse.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 23, 2004)

Susan-

Could not the wronged party sign a warrant for the person's arrest for theft. The case may never see the light of day but the record would still reflect the warrant....would it not?

Eric


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## Jason Glavich (Apr 10, 2008)

Call one of the court tv shows, they will pay to fly you to there set and there decision is final, if you can get the do gooder to show up, free trip to LA might get them to come. I have seen it before when local courts wont touch it.


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## JusticeDog (Jul 3, 2003)

Eric Johnson said:


> Susan-
> 
> Could not the wronged party sign a warrant for the person's arrest for theft. The case may never see the light of day but the record would still reflect the warrant....would it not?
> 
> Eric


Perhaps, but the police are obviously not viewing this as a theft. That's why the report wasn't made in the first place....... my hunch is that since the officer allowed this to occur, he felt it was a "rescue" of sorts as well. And, what would a record get you if there is a prosecutor unwilling to prosecute? A report such as this would have minimal bearing in a civil matter for the loss of the padlocks that were cut, etc. Doesn't seem as if the lady is denying it, in her mind she rescued the goldens. In the owners mind, she stole them.


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## Leddyman (Nov 27, 2007)

You know in the old days this could have been resolved by a good old fashioned Butt whoopin. You just wade in and its knuckle and skull. Not any more though, you just can't administer what some people need theese days.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

*****Update*****

He he he he he..........

After being told by numerous attorney's that there is nothing she can do without costing big bucks with little result-my girlfriend just got a guardian angel sent to her-in the form of a well known attorney from Chicago who has goldens and plays the game. Just on principle he is going to go after this pro-bono. The Geneva police are fixing to get a spanking for the poor decision's they made and he will find out who the good smaritain is and will pursue this civily as well. 

....this makes me smile and not in a good way either. You just don't mess with our dogs, let alone steal them out of the back of the truck.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Where's the like button when you need it?


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## AmiableLabs (Jan 14, 2003)

FOM said:


> Where's the like button when you need it?


DITTO!!

The real "good Samaritan" in this case is the attorney who has decided to pick up the case on the behalf of. . . . ALL OF US!!!


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## Lady Duck Hunter (Jan 9, 2003)

Outstanding....keep us posted with the case. It will be interesting to watch.


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## HuntinDawg (Jul 2, 2006)

That is fantastic. I don't think I posted originally on this, but I was also appalled that the police stood by and allowed this to happen in spite of the fact that he did not feel the dogs were in danger. To stand there and allow that dingbat to damage the crates when it was not an emergency situation is ridiculous and even worse, to allow her to leave with someone's property was unconscionable. At worst he should have called animal control so at least a responsible party would have had the dogs. He had no way to ensure the safety of the dogs once he allowed those dogs to be taken by that overzealous idiot. It would have been a better "chain of custody" if he had turned them over to animal control. The whole thing was wrong in so many ways it is absurd. I hope it causes enough problems for the police that they set a policy for how to handle such a thing in the future and I hope it causes a real problem for the idiot who took the dogs. I would want my pound of flesh out of her sorry arse. She thinks she can do whatever she wants as long as she can rationalize it as animal welfare in her overly dramatic mind.


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

Cool. I heard the story again as we stopped for lunch yesterday after training. They should only know her accomplishments. Hope he kicks some azzes.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

No kidding Nancy-- let's see the crazy lady or as I refer to her, DFB, stole a dog that is: QAA, MH, MACH and a OTCH. A national obedience invitational finalist and one of the top golden boys in the nation. But hey--he isn't even worth the price of your car stero according to Illinois stupid laws! I know these dogs really well and it still gives me chills to think about what could have happened when the DFB took them.


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## Golddogs (Feb 3, 2004)

I have 2 custom wire crate in my Blazer. A 12 volt fan and the side windows covered with shade screen. If I need to run in somewhere, I open the rear window, lock the tailgate and bungy the window so it isn't wide open. Even on a warm/hot day the dogs are fine.

My older Golden will not let anyone near his crate if I am not around. Had a woman try to open the tail gate and he about gave her a heart attact. If he could have reached her, he would have drawn blood. I tell her it isn't a good idea to reach into a dogs crate and she goes off on me. I let her rant anf just then a local K9 officer shows up. She proceeds to let this fine officer know what a monster I am and insists I be fined and he take my dogs. He listens to her for a few minutes then turns to me and asks " Do you hunt them?' with a big grin on his face. I say why yes I do and open the window for him, introduce the boys and Riley starts moaning and wagging his tail and the officer gives him a scratch all the while this lady is staring daggers at us both. After a couple of minute of hunting stories, he asks me if I want to press charges. Suddenly the woman turns a bit pale and very quiet. I decline but ask if he could please inform her about messing with a mans truck and dogs.

I see him just about once a week and we still chuckle. Glad I had a good one.


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## Keith Stroyan (Sep 22, 2005)

Golddogs said:


> ... After a couple of minute of hunting stories, he asks me if I want to press charges. Suddenly the woman turns a bit pale and very quiet. ...


Glad to read this kind of thing works out right some of the time.

I'm real conflicted about the other one. I'd like the "good" lawyer to get some revenge, but most times you get lawyers involved only the lawyers win... I assume there are DFB lawyers out there, too, who could turn the whole thing up-side down...

(I was thinking more in terms of the Haloween prank of a paper bag full of nice gooy dog poo, in front of the door. Light it with a match and ring the doorbell... NAAH.)


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## Illinois Bob (Feb 3, 2007)

Nancy,I was going to ask where this happened and when I saw it was Geneva I wasn't surprised.I was driving by the golf driving range on Kirk rd. one day and got the big side window on my old Land Cruiser broken by a golf ball.I pulled into the driving range to find who did it.Of course nobody would admit it.I called Geneva PD to come out there and they wouldn't.They said I could go downtown and file a complaint if I wanted to.I went down there and then they said they were too busy and took my number and said an officer would call me.A few days later they finally called.It was a waste of time,I ended up paying for my own window.My opinion,based on that and a few other incidents(too much to type),most of the cops here in the Fox Valley are a pretty lazy bunch.They have great pensions though.


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## Bill Davis (Sep 15, 2003)

Bklk said:


> Most states the property laws are similar. Only the District or State's Attorney can pursue criminal charges. The most you can pursue is the damage to the crates which is done in Civil Court. As to the quote about the Fire Dept. it's absolutely not true. If you call 911 or state you have a fire in or on your property. The F.D. has a "Duty To Act". Which means the owner can not stop them from going in to investigate or put a fire out. As a recently Retired Battalion Chief from a SE Florida Metropolitan Fire Dept. I speak from experience.


You can deny the FD access to your property to put a fire out. However you would not be able to collect any insurance money. You may get fined for illegal burning.


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## Steve Amrein (Jun 11, 2004)

Please lets us know how it turns out. Also if there is some way we can thank the lawyer that took the case.


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## duk4me (Feb 20, 2008)

Pals said:


> No kidding Nancy-- let's see the crazy lady or as I refer to her, DFB, stole a dog that is: QAA, MH, MACH and a OTCH. A national obedience invitational finalist and one of the top golden boys in the nation. But hey--he isn't even worth the price of your car stero according to Illinois stupid laws! I know these dogs really well and it still gives me chills to think about what could have happened when the DFB took them.


Hey DFB were my Dads initials my feelings are so easily hurt.


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## Kelly Greenwood (Dec 18, 2008)

Pals said:


> *****Update*****
> 
> He he he he he..........
> 
> ...


 I never saw a follow up on this story and was wondering what the final outcome was??


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## Jason Glavich (Apr 10, 2008)

Kelly Greenwood said:


> I never saw a follow up on this story and was wondering what the final outcome was??


Curious as well.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

I'll have to ask what the final outcome was with this incident. I don't know how far it was pursued.


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## Willie Alderson (Jan 26, 2011)

Good dogs- that's a great idea. Though it's a pain and hassle to post the sign(s) I think it's a great idea. Better hope I don't catch someone in the act! Going to have to raise a bunch of money from all of you to bail me out!


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## tazman7 (Dec 8, 2011)

Nevermind, I just seen that this happened in Geneva..figures. Rich snobs.

I wouldn't expect any less from a crazed Illinois resident. Crazy people seem to be the norm around this neck of the woods anymore.


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## tazman7 (Dec 8, 2011)

Bill Davis said:


> You can deny the FD access to your property to put a fire out. However you would not be able to collect any insurance money. You may get fined for illegal burning.


And I believe this is false. Ill confirm this next shift.


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## Mike Smith (Mar 24, 2005)

It depends on where you are located. You have every legal right to burn your house down as down as long as it not presenting a a danger to your neighbors property etc. Some districts may require burn permits depending the size of your conflagration. But as far as I know in Texas they could tell us not to put it out. State and local laws would probably apply.


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## Bait (Jan 21, 2004)

Pals said:


> I'm going to be calling my lawyer as soon as the time is decent. I'm curious as to what the legal options are for this situation:
> 
> My girlfriend in Northern Illinois finished training and went out to lunch with friends. Dogs were locked(pad locked at bottom of crates) in the back of her truck. Truck topper was open, fans were on, dogs have water and are fine. By passer calls police, police arrive and determine dogs to be fine. By-passer insists dogs are not fine and prys open crates, puts dogs in her car and leaves. Officer did take down by-passers name and leaves card under wiperblade. Girlfriend finishes lunch, returns to empty truck, call officers card in panic, officer returns says that yes dogs were fine, crazy lady took them. Go to police station, crazy lady's returns dogs. Girlfriend manages to not punch crazy lady in face and the woman lectures her on the condition of her dogs. Dogs in question: OTCH, MACH, MH***. Male is proven stud. So my girlfriend is now past the I'm just thankful to have my dogs back stage and shock-is now wanting to press charges against the crazy woman and the officer. States attorney told her they won't touch it since she wants to pursue charges against the officer. What are her legal options?


I would still like to know how you kept her from punching the crazy lady in the face. Can't believe the cop let it happen and defends the fact that she did return the dogs. Soooooo, What? He had a crystal ball and KNEW all along that she would return them??????? What would his answer have been if she didn't?...."Ooops! I F'd up"??????????


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## Leslie B (Jul 3, 2009)

Depending on how you could document the value of the dogs, I would think that you could press criminal charges against the crazy lady and the police officer. Depending on the value of the dogs, it could easily be felony theft. The argument being that this is not any different than someone taking electronics out of a car. 

You would not need to have an attorney to press changes and if the cops refused to take the complaint then I would go directly to the district attorney's office and then to the office of internal affairs at the police department. Don't care what they say - I would file a complaint against both.

Hope we can find out that there were some consequences for the crazy lady and the cop.


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## cj6530 (Jan 18, 2011)

mostlygold said:


> This is one reason why I will only park my vehicle where I can see it.
> 
> I am in awe of your friend's self control. Just due to the sheer terror of having my dog's missing, I am certain I would have beaten that woman into the ground.
> 
> ...


I don't agree. I was at an AKC hunt test in texas this weekend and saw a number of dogs stuck in cars with the windows barely cracked in mid 80 temps. I am sure the dogs lived but it must have been terrible for them.


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## Micah Duffy (Jan 21, 2010)

Julie R. said:


> I'd never seen one, and the officer told me it took a reading of the temperature as he showed me the digital display. It looked sort of like a radar speed detector, kind of gun-shaped. You could well be right, but why would he say it could take the inside temperature? And even if it was just a surface area thermometer, there's no way even the outside temperature could've been 118 degrees--my truck has tinted windows and they weren't even hot to the touch outside. I know because I was trying to get him to look in the windows at the dogs lounging comfortably in their boxes not in any distress because the woman kept shrieking to the crowd that they were dying.


This is a temperature gun using infrared to measure temperature. Most cost less than a hundred bucks and are decently accurate from 3 to 5 feet. It measures temperature in a cone. The cone widens as it gets further away...like a shotgun shot. Depending on the distance the officer shot from he could have picked up residual temperature from the black top parking lot or from radiant exhaust coming from the truck running. You would also have massive heat rejection coming from the fan system running to keep the engine cool while idleing and to keep air moving to release heat from the condenser for the AC mounted to the radiator. These used as a tool in the right application help with minor temperature issues for the HVAC field. Only when used in CLOSE Range. Also for many different mechanical and auto troubleshooting. Not a reliable source unless used in close range and in the space conditioned. Otherwise you are measuring the area around it as well.


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## Jason Glavich (Apr 10, 2008)

> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Julie R.
> I'd never seen one, and the officer told me it took a reading of the temperature as he showed me the digital display. It looked sort of like a radar speed detector, kind of gun-shaped. You could well be right, but why would he say it could take the inside temperature? And even if it was just a surface area thermometer, there's no way even the outside temperature could've been 118 degrees--my truck has tinted windows and they weren't even hot to the touch outside. I know because I was trying to get him to look in the windows at the dogs lounging comfortably in their boxes not in any distress because the woman kept shrieking to the crowd that they were dying.





Micah Duffy said:


> This is a temperature gun using infrared to measure temperature. Most cost less than a hundred bucks and are decently accurate from 3 to 5 feet. It measures temperature in a cone. The cone widens as it gets further away...like a shotgun shot. Depending on the distance the officer shot from he could have picked up residual temperature from the black top parking lot or from radiant exhaust coming from the truck running. You would also have massive heat rejection coming from the fan system running to keep the engine cool while idleing and to keep air moving to release heat from the condenser for the AC mounted to the radiator. These used as a tool in the right application help with minor temperature issues for the HVAC field. Only when used in CLOSE Range. Also for many different mechanical and auto troubleshooting. Not a reliable source unless used in close range and in the space conditioned. Otherwise you are measuring the area around it as well.


Also on a side note this temp guns will not take temp of what is behind the glass only the glass itself.


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## rbr (Jan 14, 2004)

rabersin said:


> It Illinois, they are having a hard time convicting Blago when he is on tape, do you think they want to prosecute a "do-gooder" just trying to save dogs from the cruel life they're forced to live. Forget prosecuting them, sue her in civil court and sue the policeofficier and police department. Messing with hunting dogs anywhere in this country will get the attention of any jury. Get a good attorney and sue. Make her and the police pay money.


It's pretty hard for them not to press charges when someone has to physically destroy a pad lock to break into someones private property.

Bert


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## Julie R. (Jan 13, 2003)

Jason Glavich said:


> Also on a side note this temp guns will not take temp of what is behind the glass only the glass itself.


I distinctly remember him telling me it took the inside temperature. Must've been a scare tactic, but I also remember he was reluctant to take the temp. inside once I opened the truck door, but I insisted. Almost like they wanted to be able to lock me up....


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