# Todays Youngest HRCH dog in History of HRC



## robertnla

Congradulations to HR Benson Bobo's Kaw From Ouranos for earning his HRCH today at 7 months and 25 days old.. Making him the youngest dog of any breed to earn HRCH title beating the old record by 1 month. Benson has previously broke the HR record for a male of any breed to get HR title. He is derby training now. Wishing Benson the best of luck. Smile and he is chocolate... Sire GHRCH Gump x Dam HRCH Robert's Cash On The Line


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## Terry Marshall

robertnla said:


> Congradulations to HR Benson Bobo's Kaw From Ouranos for earning his HRCH today at 7 months and 25 days old.. Making him the youngest dog of any breed to earn HRCH title beating the old record by 1 month. Benson has previously broke the HR record for a male of any breed to get HR title. He is derby training now. Wishing Benson the best of luck. Smile and he is chocolate... Sire GHRCH Gump x Dam HRCH Robert's Cash On The Line


That's absolutely fantastic, most dogs at that age haven't even completed OB yet alone, triples, blinds, honor etc. Great job!


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## passthru

Wow, I can't imagine . . .


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## FieldLab

Amazing congrats !!!!!


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## championretrievers

A big congratulations to Jason and Benson on being the youngest titled HRCH in 31 years! Run Benson Run!


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## Rhett Riddle

Congrats bud. I knew the two of you could do it. It has been a fun road to get there. You set your goal, and achieved it. Now the real training starts.


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## Nick Toti

Any videos out there of the pup running the finished tests? Would be interesting to see.


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## Justin Allen

Makes you wonder about the difficulty of finished tests, or at least it does me.


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## Danny Castro

Justin Allen said:


> Makes you wonder about the difficulty of finished tests, or at least it does me.



Agreed, and what training program would one use to get a pup this young to that level?


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## windwalkers swan song

Justin Allen said:


> Makes you wonder about the difficulty of finished tests, or at least it does me.


 Do you think quotes were made when Ammo excelled so fast ?


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## windwalkers swan song

Maybe an ATTA BOY or Congrats ?


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## moscowitz

Big difference in running derby and the venue. Can't wait to see this pup running derby? Just a double


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## Buzz

windwalkers swan song said:


> Do you think quotes were made when Ammo excelled so fast ?



The thing is, there are a lot of trained attributes that go into a dog doing finished work isn't there? Ammo was picking up marks, which is considered a natural ability. It is amazing that a dog can handle at that age, really very amazing. I've only seen a couple of finished tests, and they both required the dogs to handle through old falls to pick up a blind. That can't be easy for a baby.


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## paul young

Justin Allen said:


> Makes you wonder about the difficulty of finished tests, or at least it does me.



Well, I can say from experience as a participant and as a judge, that there are Finished Tests and then there are *FINISHED TESTS.

*I'd like to see some video of this pup, as well.

Quite an accomplishment, at any rate. Congratulations!-Paul


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## Justin Allen

Ammo was marking birds, and lets please don't compare HRC at any level to field trials. Your talking apples and oranges at best. Never said its not impressive that the guys dog can pass finished tests while his baby teeth are falling out. Just that what does it say about what flies at a finished test?


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## paul young

Justin Allen said:


> Ammo was marking birds, and lets please don't compare HRC at any level to field trials. Your talking apples and oranges at best. Never said its not impressive that the guys dog can pass finished tests while his baby teeth are falling out. Just that what does it say about what flies at a finished test?


You're entitled to your opinion of finished tests, of course. And I agree that comparing HRC finished tests to FT's is apples to oranges. BUT......I have seen QAA Master Hunters fail a finished test or 3 over the years. Some of those tests are darned tough, others, not so much.

I don't want to hijack this thread, let's just agree to disagree, OK?  -Paul


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## windwalkers swan song

Justin Allen said:


> Ammo was marking birds, and lets please don't compare HRC at any level to field trials. Your talking apples and oranges at best. Never said its not impressive that the guys dog can pass finished tests while his baby teeth are falling out. Just that what does it say about what flies at a finished test?


 I'm not talking about comparing anything on any level I'm saying how bout we give the dog and his owner a little praise and congrats before throwing doubt about how difficult the test might or might not have been. (And you quote is true you never said it's not impressive.) That's my point !


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## Justin Allen

I'm not disagreeing with anything, just offering my opinion. I've run both venues so I've seen seen a little of both.


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## windwalkers swan song

Congrats to Benson and his Handler Jason


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## Casey A

Congratulations that is quite an awesome accomplishment! 

Now to the real question.... did you use hillmann or lardy?


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## Chris Atkinson

I've never seen Jason and Benson run an HRC test. But I did meet them when I was on business, stopping by Cooper Black WMA to check it out.

They were training on a water setup and were preparing to head to Nashville (Kim Smith's event) for, I believe, a Seasoned HRC test. This was in May. 

I had no idea that at that time, this dog was not even 7 months old yet. I knew the dog looked young, but had no idea he was that young! 

In that setup he ran a triple and the left hand mark was on a dike that offered a very tempting, cheaty, bankrun return. Jason calmly stopped the dog, cast him back to the right entry point, and tooted the pup in, on an honest water return. 

I had NO idea this dog was that young, but I do recall that at that time, the dog had not been collar conditioned.

What I came away thinking was: This is a smart, calm, good dog guy with excellent dog sense and training skills. This was a dog with a high level of intelligence and trust in his owner.

I am not the least bit surprised that this dog is HRCH titled. 

I am confident that we will read more of Jason and Benson as the dog advances into derby age. 

Congratulations Jason and Benson.

Even more important: To Jason and his wife, congratulations on the recent birth of your first child! What a great Spring you all have had!

Sincerely, Chris


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## Rhett Riddle

Nick Toti said:


> Any videos out there of the pup running the finished tests? Would be interesting to see.


Jason trains with me from time to time. I've been to several finished tests he has run Benson in. I've run the dog myself in training as well. The dog is a very special dog. He runs like a well trained 3 year old. This dog has a bright future. You will hear about him later. He gets better and better with every session and every test he runs. Jason saw his first hunt test in March. He had a goal, and he achieved it


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## windwalkers swan song

rhett riddle said:


> jason trains with me from time to time. I've been to several finished tests he has run benson in. I've run the dog myself in training as well. The dog is a very special dog. He runs like a well trained 3 year old. This dog has a bright future. You will hear about him later. He gets better and better with every session and every test he runs. Jason saw his first hunt test in march. He had a goal, and he achieved it


 simply awesome !!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## bjoiner

I'm more impressed with him being able to have time to train with a new baby in the house. That wife is more of a keeper than the dog. 

Congrats


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## Decoyin Drake

I was at the test as Iam a backwater club member. I was working the line when he ran both series and was within feet of him. Judges were Sam Melish and Leroy ? It was a nice "hunt " set up. While it wasnt the hardest test Ive seen it was no gimme either. The dog did nice work especially considering its age. Perfect no but no question on the pass. Water blind he was fat on initial line, but two left angle backs and he carried to the bird. Blind was about 7o yds. I say Nicely done. The handler then jumped in the pond not once but twice upon titling. He seemed like a very nice young man.


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## Raymond Little

UOduk84 said:


> Congratulations that is quite an awesome accomplishment!
> 
> Now to the real question.... did you use hillmann or lardy?


Neither, neither would condone pushing such a young animal through the Program just to be the youngest. They would see how it would create holes that neither could fix or patch in its lifetime. This is a milestone not an accomplishment and you only get one milestone. I have a Benny on this dog ever making the derby list.


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## Gregg0211

I agree! I want to see the tests that a 6-7 month old pup passed to get a finished title! Videos please!


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## Clint Watts

Great job Jason and Benson, the future is bright. Remember all those that said the same thing about a little Chocolate dog, prove them wrong. Sounds like you have a great team.


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## Raymond Little

Clint Watts said:


> Great job Jason and Benson, the future is bright. Remember all those that said the same thing about a little Chocolate dog, prove them wrong. Sounds like you have a great team.


Universe between hrch and derby champ scooter, t-ball and division A to be exact.


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## Jabelism

I was at that test this weekend. That dog was the talk of the test. I wish I could have seen them run. Congrats to them!


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## championretrievers

Give the dog and handler his due congratulations! There is a lot of difference between a derby and a finished test, marks are much longer and I'll give you more complex. However, there is no blind in the derby. Some people will always see the glass as half empty rather than half full. Hope the brown dog proves the pessimist wrong once again. Go Benson!


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## Casey A

Raymond Little said:


> Universe between hrch and derby champ scooter, t-ball and division A to be exact.


Absolutely, however he did say he is in TRAINING for derby now. He did not say he is running derbies now. Hope he takes his time to make sure he has a well rounded dog in the end. If he isn't collar conditioned as Chris mentioned, at least we know he is a great team player and trusts his O/H.


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## Raymond Little

UOduk84 said:


> Absolutely, however he did say he is in TRAINING for derby now. He did not say he is running derbies now. Hope he takes his time to make sure he has a well rounded dog in the end. If he isn't collar conditioned as Chris mentioned, at least we know he is a great team player and trusts his O/H.


Why would he care about the rounded ness of the dogs training now? 
Sometimes Ya Can't Go Back Regards


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## captainjack

Yes, 'they' did say the same about Ammo. Dennis Voigt published an interview with Bill & Mickie in Retrievers ONLINE a few years back, and Mickie said people kept telling them they were ruining that dog. 

One interesting note is that they never called the dog back for cheating. Mickie said they'd just kick her off and let her go. Said she would sometimes be dropped for cheating water and sometimes win even though cheating water. It depended on whether the judges judged the mark or the line. 

Ammo started running derbies at 6 months and 3 days of age. Placed 3rd at 7 mos & 1st the following week. 

The Petrovich's & Ammo were also able to train on some of the finest grounds and with some of the top field trial people in the Country. And they had the finances to run a derby almost every weekend (numerous times 2 per weekend) for 18 straight months. Even at least one Friday in Southern CA and Saturday in Washington State.

Interesting read about a clearly different philosophy on how to approach starting a young dog. I think it's safe to say that more often than not, going too fast leads to problems. But, if the dog can do it, keep going.


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## moscowitz

Ammo eventually ended up with Lardy during her sabbatical. She also traveled all over the country for Derby points. If you average the amount of Derbies run with placements you may be surprised. But at the end of the day Ammo is a great and special dog who has great owners who developed the dogs potential. The thing about hunt test venue seen a lot of youngest MH, senior hunter, etc. and have never seen the dog again. After derby the all age world begins.


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## Rhett Riddle

captainjack said:


> Yes, 'they' did say the same about Ammo. Dennis Voigt published an interview with Bill & Mickie in Retrievers ONLINE a few years back, and Mickie said people kept telling them they were ruining that dog.
> 
> One interesting note is that they never called the dog back for cheating. Mickie said they'd just kick her off and let her go. Said she would sometimes be dropped for cheating water and sometimes win even though cheating water. It depended on whether the judges judged the mark or the line.
> 
> Ammo started running derbies at 6 months and 3 days of age. Placed 3rd at 7 mos & 1st the following week.
> 
> The Petrovich's & Ammo were also able to train on some of the finest grounds and with some of the top field trial people in the Country. And they had the finances to run a derby almost every weekend (numerous times 2 per weekend) for 18 straight months. Even at least one Friday in Southern CA and Saturday in Washington State.
> 
> Interesting read about a clearly different philosophy on how to approach starting a young dog. I think it's safe to say that more often than not, going too fast leads to problems. But, if the dog can do it, keep going.



This dog has achieved a finished title before most of my dogs have completed force fetch. This dog completed this task with natural ability. Holes or not in his training at this point is irrelevant, because he is basically just now starting training with him. He can go any route he wants. He runs blinds as good as my older dogs, is an excellent marker, and has an incredible memory. If Jason sticks with the plan that he has come up with he is in the position to have a once in a lifetime dog. He's now training for derbies just like any other 7 month old puppy would be doing at his age. He won't run him in one until he is ready and feels he can win. He reached his goal training the way he felt the dog learned quick, through repetition and confidence. There's no way to say that he can't take a 7 month old dog and continue with a formal training program and with good guidance and make something special. Benson has the ability. 

And as for ease of the tests, who cares? It's still multiple marks and blinds. The dog has to do the work.


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## captainjack

Rhett Riddle said:


> This dog has achieved a finished title before most of my dogs have completed force fetch. This dog completed this task with natural ability. Holes or not in his training at this point is irrelevant, because he is basically just now starting training with him. He can go any route he wants. He runs blinds as good as my older dogs, is an excellent marker, and has an incredible memory. If Jason sticks with the plan that he has come up with he is in the position to have a once in a lifetime dog. He's now training for derbies just like any other 7 month old puppy would be doing at his age. He won't run him in one until he is ready and feels he can win. He reached his goal training the way he felt the dog learned quick, through repetition and confidence. There's no way to say that he can't take a 7 month old dog and continue with a formal training program and with good guidance and make something special. Benson has the ability.
> 
> And as for ease of the tests, who cares? It's still multiple marks and blinds. The dog has to do the work.


You posted this in reply to my post. Not sure what this has to do with my comment. Maybe you meant to quote another post?

But, none the less, most field trial dogs are not "training for derbies" at 7 months. Most are starting formal training which would be the same whether they plan to run derbies or not. Most 7 month olds would not be handling yet either so that puts a lot of distance between this dog and most every seven month old derby prospect. 

Enjoy the ride.


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## Rhett Riddle

I was just making a post in general Glenn. Not sure why I quoted you.


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## robertnla

What has your dog done??? HUH That's what I thought..
If you have a problem with HRC don't read the HRC related post and get your panties in a knot. 
Jason and Benson are not afraid of failure. Their team work has proven that. Jason has surpassed his goal with Benson. 
Anything else would be icing on the cake.


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## Chris Atkinson

UOduk84 said:


> Absolutely, however he did say he is in TRAINING for derby now. He did not say he is running derbies now. Hope he takes his time to make sure he has a well rounded dog in the end. If he isn't collar conditioned as Chris mentioned, at least we know he is a great team player and trusts his O/H.


I spoke with Jason on the phone yesterday to congratulate him live.

He was out on the job and Benson was riding shotgun next to him when I called. (I think the closeness of this guy with his one and only dog may be part of what's working for them. I think this is the kind of relationship that can make a pro concerned about an Amateur)

At the time I met them, in May, Benson was not CCd. Jason told me that he did get Benson CCd sometime during his run of the Finished tests within the last few weeks.

Raymond Little, you're my brother from LA. You're the man who drops pins on my iPhone when I land at Baton Rouge and need an authentic cajun fix. You're the man who hooks me up with Redfish and trout when I'm in the Jones department.

I would hate to take a crispy Ben Franklin postmarked Lake Charles that comes out of your account.

But I do think it would be fun to watch what these two do. I saw something pretty neat when I just stumbled upon them by accident. 

By the way, Jason mentioned the name of one of his mentors who is helping him prepare for derby. It's someone who's owned a FT dog with an "N" in the front of its name. *(Edit, actually, this mentor has more than one "N" associated with his/her career... I think also may have trained with a guy named Rex)

I'm not a betting guy. But I'm also thinking that there's no good reason to bet against Jason and Benson.

****************************************

Here's one other cool thought: Two Bensons hit some pretty cool goals on the same date. One a pretty neat accomplishment at a young age - the other having his girl Roxie win the National Amateur. _*Sunday was a good day to be a Benson!*_


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## robertnla

Chris your the man !! You always speak after you know the true picture. You always understand even if it is out the box. You always look at both sides. That is what makes a true trainer dog/handler relationship. It is also no dought why you were chosen to keep this place sane.
Well Spoken. TY 

Training is not a Science it is an Art.


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## FOM

I kind of agree with Raymond...there always seems to be a thread every so often about being the youngest to do this or that...congrats on that accomplishment, but I'd say the majority of those with experience cringed when they read the title or thread, I know I did. I thought in the back of my head, "I sure hope that dog is talented and can handle being pushed at a young age and if not, I feel sorry for the dog, hopefully it won't be a total wash." I think it's great they were able to meet their goal, but I also know that it's a long journey and the foundation has to be solid if you want a lifetime of enjoyment with your dog, once you put up the framing, walls and roof, it's a real PITA to try and shore up the foundation if it has cracks.

I'm sorry if others find it offensive, but to tell people not to read the thread if they aren't into HRC (or AKC or NAHRA) or not to post if they have nothing but positive comments is total bull. If people want smoke blown up their rear end and an atta boy for pushing a young dog to reach a goal that really shouldn't be attempted with 99% of the dogs out there, then don't post on a public forum. Maybe there needs to be a feature to where the OP and their groupies can censor out any opinion that doesn't meet their criteria? 

Not good at politically correct regards,

Lainee


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## windwalkers swan song

robertnla said:


> Chris your the man !! You always speak after you know the true picture. You always understand even if it is out the box. You always look at both sides. That is what makes a true trainer dog/handler relationship. It is also no dought why you were chosen to keep this place sane.
> Well Spoken. TY
> 
> Training is not a Science it is an Art.


 Very well said !


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## David McCracken

There is no question that Benson is a "special" dog driven by a handler that refuses to listen to what others say about failure. There are precocious people and precocious animals. Benson is a canine equivalent to Tiger Woods and I believe Jason will continue to push him because Jason doesn't think any goals are unattainable. I judged Benson in a Finished test at Old Hatchie and he was amazing for a 6 month old (at that time). Sadly, he did not pass our test, but I believe that was the first test he'd ever failed. He did pass the next day, however.


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## Jross0711

I'll agree Benson is a special dog, (Tiger Woods of dogs) I don't think so. I appreciate those that have opinions either positive or negative. The truth is he is a baby, I understand this. He is also apart of my immediate family and not looked upon as a dog or tool. I've simply taken what he's given me which is more than the average retriever can supply. Is it because of the bond between he and I? I have no idea. I can say that ever since he was eight weeks of age he hasn't left my side literally. He's next to me as I type this as a matter of fact. As stated above I am a goal driven individual especially when someone says it can't be done. Will I sacrifice the long term picture or product to prove a couple assholes wrong? No way, but my memory runs deep and I won't forget the new word/saying I learned today "Benny". Let's be clear, I haven't promoted Benson on this site or social media. Others involved with him directly or indirectly have. I do not ask them to. I do not take credit for where he is either. I've been fortunate to have the opportunity to be around some amazing dog people that have contributed to where he is at the moment. It's a team sport as mentioned earlier. In my opinion you're not going far in this game without good people around. To those that have helped and encouraged I would like to thank you and those that think he may shut down I respect that as well. Yes Tina, run Benson run!


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## NateB

My comment about this has nothing to do with the dog being discussed. I have never seen him and he sounds like an amazing animal. A once in a lifetime animal. When I see a thread titles like this I cringe too as I fear it encourages newer people to try to attain levels the dog is not ready for. There is a dog near me that attained its HRCH title at a very young age, took many tests to get enough passes, but has the worst line manners, is vocal, will not heel on lead without choking himself, etc. 
In THAT DOG'S case there are a lot of holes in his training and I would not let him in my duck blind. So that is my mental vision when I see a young dog title thread. My goal is a fully trained retriever that matures at its own rate, a dog that is a MH at 12 months will not necessarily be a better dog long term than one that reaches that level at 3 yrs. 

My congrats to Benson and his handler, he is what a human child would be called a savant, and I bet his handler is a bit special for the way he understands his dog, but for most people realize this is the oddity not the norm.


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## Rick Hall

Welcome to the forum, Jason. All the best to you and Benson.


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## DoubleHaul

FOM said:


> I kind of agree with Raymond...there always seems to be a thread every so often about being the youngest to do this or that...congrats on that accomplishment, but I'd say the majority of those with experience cringed when they read the title or thread, I know I did. I thought in the back of my head, "I sure hope that dog is talented and can handle being pushed at a young age and if not, I feel sorry for the dog, hopefully it won't be a total wash." I think it's great they were able to meet their goal, but I also know that it's a long journey and the foundation has to be solid if you want a lifetime of enjoyment with your dog, once you put up the framing, walls and roof, it's a real PITA to try and shore up the foundation if it has cracks.
> 
> I'm sorry if others find it offensive, but to tell people not to read the thread if they aren't into HRC (or AKC or NAHRA) or not to post if they have nothing but positive comments is total bull. If people want smoke blown up their rear end and an atta boy for pushing a young dog to reach a goal that really shouldn't be attempted with 99% of the dogs out there, then don't post on a public forum. Maybe there needs to be a feature to where the OP and their groupies can censor out any opinion that doesn't meet their criteria?
> 
> Not good at politically correct regards,
> 
> Lainee


Good post. Don't know the dog or the guy but if it kept Chris watching them train instead of heading for his favorite eatery they must be impressive and I wish them well. 

I too, was a little disappointed with the fans taking as personal attacks what I thought were well meaning warnings to the next guy who gets a pup and decides he wants to beat this record. No reflection on this dog or owner but the fact is that Benson (like rare others) are likely very special critters and not the norm. Just because Benson or Ammo or whatever can do it doesn't mean it is a good idea for me and my dog to try.

Kids, don't try this at home regards,


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## Camo9244

Unbelievable!!! Congrats!!


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## Becky Mills

DoubleHaul said:


> Good post. Don't know the dog or the guy but if it kept Chris watching them train instead of heading for his favorite eatery they must be impressive and I wish them well.
> 
> I too, was a little disappointed with the fans taking as personal attacks what I thought were well meaning warnings to the next guy who gets a pup and decides he wants to beat this record. No reflection on this dog or owner but the fact is that Benson (like rare others) are likely very special critters and not the norm. Just because Benson or Ammo or whatever can do it doesn't mean it is a good idea for me and my dog to try.
> 
> Kids, don't try this at home regards,


What DoubleHaul said. And a HUGE congratulations to Benson and his human. They both sound like really special critters.


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## John Robinson

Rhett Riddle said:


> This dog has achieved a finished title before most of my dogs have completed force fetch. This dog completed this task with natural ability. Holes or not in his training at this point is irrelevant, because he is basically just now starting training with him. He can go any route he wants. He runs blinds as good as my older dogs, is an excellent marker, and has an incredible memory. If Jason sticks with the plan that he has come up with he is in the position to have a once in a lifetime dog. He's now training for derbies just like any other 7 month old puppy would be doing at his age. He won't run him in one until he is ready and feels he can win. He reached his goal training the way he felt the dog learned quick, through repetition and confidence. There's no way to say that he can't take a 7 month old dog and continue with a formal training program and with good guidance and make something special. Benson has the ability.
> 
> And as for ease of the tests, who cares? It's still multiple marks and blinds. The dog has to do the work.


Seems like a good perspective on this incredible achievement. I don't feel a need to compare this dog to Ammo. If owned that dog I certainly wouldn't put that kind of pressure on myself or the dog, just keep training, advancing and see where it leads. For the record, I was running derbies against Ammo when she first started and I was one who thought it was a mistake to let her cheat over and over, guess I was wrong! Let's give this guy cudos and stop judging him or the dog, no matter what, it's impressive.


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## Kajun Kamakazi

I too would like to see a video of the dog in action.


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## championretrievers

Go Brown Dogs! That's all I got to say about that, Lol


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## blaktee

Jross0711 said:


> I'll agree Benson is a special dog, (Tiger Woods of dogs) I don't think so. I appreciate those that have opinions either positive or negative. The truth is he is a baby, I understand this. He is also apart of my immediate family and not looked upon as a dog or tool. I've simply taken what he's given me which is more than the average retriever can supply. Is it because of the bond between he and I? I have no idea. I can say that ever since he was eight weeks of age he hasn't left my side literally. He's next to me as I type this as a matter of fact. As stated above I am a goal driven individual especially when someone says it can't be done. Will I sacrifice the long term picture or product to prove a couple assholes wrong? No way, but my memory runs deep and I won't forget the new word/saying I learned today "Benny". Let's be clear, I haven't promoted Benson on this site or social media. Others involved with him directly or indirectly have. I do not ask them to. I do not take credit for where he is either. I've been fortunate to have the opportunity to be around some amazing dog people that have contributed to where he is at the moment. It's a team sport as mentioned earlier. In my opinion you're not going far in this game without good people around. To those that have helped and encouraged I would like to thank you and those that think he may shut down I respect that as well. Yes Tina, run Benson run!


Congrats Jason! Benson sounds like one cool dog. I really think the bond you have created with him sounds amazing. Hope to hear the word "Benny" a lot in the future!!!


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## Rhett Riddle

Benson ran his first Derby today at 9 and 1/2 months old. He ran an excellent trial, against some very tough competition. He recieved a JAM.


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## TRUEBLUE

Jross0711 said:


> I'll agree Benson is a special dog, (Tiger Woods of dogs) I don't think so. I appreciate those that have opinions either positive or negative. The truth is he is a baby, I understand this. He is also apart of my immediate family and not looked upon as a dog or tool. I've simply taken what he's given me which is more than the average retriever can supply. Is it because of the bond between he and I? I have no idea. I can say that ever since he was eight weeks of age he hasn't left my side literally. He's next to me as I type this as a matter of fact. As stated above I am a goal driven individual especially when someone says it can't be done. Will I sacrifice the long term picture or product to prove a couple assholes wrong? No way, but my memory runs deep and I won't forget the new word/saying I learned today "Benny". Let's be clear, I haven't promoted Benson on this site or social media. Others involved with him directly or indirectly have. I do not ask them to. I do not take credit for where he is either. I've been fortunate to have the opportunity to be around some amazing dog people that have contributed to where he is at the moment. It's a team sport as mentioned earlier. In my opinion you're not going far in this game without good people around. To those that have helped and encouraged I would like to thank you and those that think he may shut down I respect that as well. Yes Tina, run Benson run!


Congratulations to you and your dog. Sounds like you have a special relationship with him. Good luck on the rest of your journey with him.


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## Chris Atkinson

Huge congrats Jason and Benson!


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## huntinman

moscowitz said:


> Ammo eventually *ended up with Lardy during her sabbatical. *She also traveled all over the country for Derby points. If you average the amount of Derbies run with placements you may be surprised. But at the end of the day Ammo is a great and special dog who has great owners who developed the dogs potential. The thing about hunt test venue seen a lot of youngest MH, senior hunter, etc. and have never seen the dog again. After derby the all age world begins.


Not true at all

As for traveling all over the country... The dog was always running on someone elses home turf. Did the same in all age. It's one thing to be on familiar ground every week. something altogether different to be on new ground every time you get out of the truck.


----------



## huntinman

Huge congrats to Benson!

Not sure why some feel the need to rain on other's parade?

They did it in a big way to Ammo and were proven wrong in a big way. 

Looks like Benson is showing them too! Good dog!


----------



## cakaiser

huntinman said:


> Huge congrats to Benson!
> 
> Not sure why some feel the need to rain on other's parade?
> 
> They did it in a big way to Ammo and were proven wrong in a big way.
> 
> Looks like Benson is showing them too! Good dog!


Ditto, Why you can never generalize about all dogs. There are some pretty amazing dogs, at a very young age. Not many, but some.

I said, when Ammo started....dogs that are truly special, just have a way of shining through. Too early to say for Benson, but...
I bet he will too..


----------



## Raymond Little

That crispy Benny is ready to ship. I really hope he makes the list.


----------



## huntinman

Rhett Riddle said:


> Benson ran his first Derby today at 9 and 1/2 months old. He ran an excellent trial, against some very tough competition. He recieved a JAM.


Good boy!!!


----------



## Nate_C

I think it is fair to ask. What was the training program. How did he get the dog to handle, ie pile work - to - T - to - swim by? Ammo was running derbies which is just marking, mostly natural ability. All you need there in terms of formal work is OB and steady. Being HRCH the dog needs to be finished. That takes time. How did he do it?


----------



## TRUEBLUE

Is this dog related to Ammo?


----------



## robertnla

HEHEHEHEEE Go Benson and Jason.. We believe.  Several litter mates are looking promising. Saw one run her first season test last weekend and she did super work passing her first 2 test. I own a female litter mate and the Dam. Really like the dog. I really think GHRCH Gump x HRCH Cash was a winning combo for the chocolate world. Good Lord willing we are repeating this breeding soon.


----------



## Rhett Riddle

Benson ran three decent series and crushed the 4th. Not a placement but Benson received the Reserve Jam at Long Island Derby at his 2nd Derby.


----------



## Kajun Kamakazi

Wow. That's impressive. Congrats to Benson, I will be watching his career with interest. Do you have any other results from those derbies? Don't mean to hijack. Thanks


----------



## championretrievers

I see where he got a jam in his first Derby, Shrewsbury Retriever Club, yesterday( on Entry Express). Did he also get a Jam today at Long Island Retriever Club? Regardless, looks like an amazing young dog.


----------



## Rhett Riddle

championretrievers said:


> I see where he got a jam in his first Derby, Shrewsbury Retriever Club, yesterday( on Entry Express). Did he also get a Jam today at Long Island Retriever Club? Regardless, looks like an amazing young dog.


Yes he got the Reserve Jam today


----------



## mjh345

Go Benson!!


----------



## championretrievers

TRUEBLUE said:


> Is this dog related to Ammo?


Benson is out of GRHRCH UH Big Mamou's Run Forest Run MH MNH "Gump" ( FC AFC Land Ahoy x Peakebrooks Tiger Eye ***) x HRCH Roberts Cash on The Line "Cash"( FC AFC Blue Ryder x HRCH Cochise's Adorable Abigail JH).


----------



## Chris Atkinson

I saw them one time only and I was extremely impressed. Many old school retriever folks could learn from what these two have done - is my impression. 

My bro Raymond won't have to send the Benny. I never officially accepted the bet. But I forecast a few derby points for this pair at least. They're knocking on the door today and the pup won't age out for over a year.


----------



## championretrievers

*Benson's Sibling*

Lottie, owned by Norman Wilson, ran her first finished test and passed.She is Benson's full sibling, they will be 10 months old in a few days


----------



## Camo9244

rhett riddle said:


> benson ran three decent series and crushed the 4th. Not a placement but benson received the reserve jam at long island derby at his 2nd derby.


big congrats!!!


----------



## Dave Burton

I will get to see/compete against this dog Saturday in Md. Good luck to all.


----------



## labsforme

Nate_C said:


> I think it is fair to ask. What was the training program. How did he get the dog to handle, ie pile work - to - T - to - swim by? Ammo was running derbies which is just marking, mostly natural ability. All you need there in terms of formal work is OB and steady. Being HRCH the dog needs to be finished. That takes time. How did he do it?


Actually most of today's derby dogs are handling and probably doing Q work as they are running derbies. The days of derby stakes being raw talent are pretty much over. I am sure Ammo was being trained to above the level she was being run at.
Go Benson!!!!


----------



## RobinZClark

Congrats Jason and Benson! 

More important than the title you've earned is the amazing 24 x 7 relationship you obviously enjoy. I bet you've spent hundreds of blissful hours training and having fun. That is what is important. You are new to the sport and you've already got that figured out. I'm guessing that we'll be hearing plenty more about your triumphs!


----------



## Pam Spears

It boggles my mind that a puppy that young can have been through and absorbed all the training required to perform at that level. Obviously they are getting the job done, congrats to their handlers and trainers for getting them through it. I think I would prefer to take them slower myself, but that's just me.


----------



## moscowitz

Okay. Now what? Youngest FC/AFC maybe even youngest National Champion. Time will tell.


----------



## huntinman

Chavez qualified for at least one National while a derby dog. May have been titled as well.


----------



## moscowitz

Dave Mosha speaks of Chavez in very high regards. He loved that dog.


----------



## Rhett Riddle

Benson received his first Derby placement today. He got a 3rd at Southwest Georgia


----------



## Wayne Nissen

windwalkers swan song said:


> Do you think quotes were made when Ammo excelled so fast ?


Not exactly Ammo. It's a finish test. Different world


----------



## Bill McKnight

This has been an interesting thread to read. I want to comment about prodigious young dogs and why you have to watch them carefully. My current young guy, Gritz, has been an amazing dog to train. He turned two on 25 Feb. Ran the open today, quad with two pheasants and two ducks. Double retired with a check down bird about thirty feet to the left of the flier station and in front of a long up gun. He did a very nice job, getting all the birds. I tell you this to make a point about training young dogs bursting with talent and the dangers associated with it.

Gritz seemed to be effortless at doing poison bird blinds at a very young age, about 16 months. Under the arch, behind the gunner, outside the poison bird, it just didn't matter. I would always pick up the mark after running the blind. Because he could do it I continued to do it. "Well, let's see if Gritz can do this one". Next thing I know he is running a derby, looking at the bird on the ground, as he runs past it. Took me a while to understand all the poison bird blinds were confusing him on what I was asking him to do. Picked him up in a couple of derbies because of this. I was doing things with him because he could.....not because he should.....and it cost me. Fortunately, he is a forgiving dog and we are back on track.

If I have a message in all this its keep balance in what you are training on and trialing on. Just because they can doesnt mean you should. Pray you have a forgiving dog. Then enjoy the heck out of the dog and the amazing things they do.

I celebrate your joy in having such a talented young dog and for surrounding yourself with good people you listen to. Enjoy the journey!

Ronan Bill


----------



## Tyler Pugh

Just curious, how old was he when he broke the youngest HR title record?


----------



## deadriver

Rhett Riddle said:


> Benson received his first Derby placement today. He got a 3rd at Southwest Georgia


Nice job! Guess that answers that question that was posed 10 pages or so ago....or the bets against it. The comparisons to one venue to another aside, it was an uncommon dog that titled at that age and I would have been surprised if that did not equate to capability in derby arena if it was targeted and appropriately trained for...a good friend of mine started off with a JHwhen she was new into any retriever games and that ultimately became her first FC AFC which started her field trail career that goes to this day...

So, March of last year you saw you first test and you titled and HRCH and made the derby list a year later. That speaks to the dog and the trainer...

Keep aiming high and best of luck!


----------



## bamajeff

Tyler Pugh said:


> Just curious, how old was he when he broke the youngest HR title record?


5 months, I think


----------



## deadriver

7mos 25 days according the first post in the thread


----------



## bamajeff

deadriver said:


> 7mos 25 days according the first post in the thread


That was for his HRCH title. I think he got his HR title at 5 months


----------



## huntinman

Good dawg Benson!


----------



## mcpoland

huntinman said:


> Chavez qualified for at least one National while a derby dog. May have been titled as well.


Bill: Did you forget Lenny's Tug? There are several club derby trophies with FC AFC Chena River Tug engraved on them. She was also derby champ with as I recall 99 points.


----------



## rhillhouse

Sometimes I think we are pushing young dogs too hard? What is the reason? A dog doesn't hit their prime and maturity until they are 5-6-7 years of age. Comments?


----------



## huntinman

mcpoland said:


> Bill: Did you forget Lenny's Tug? There are several club derby trophies with FC AFC Chena River Tug engraved on them. She was also derby champ with as I recall 99 points.


Yes... Don't know how I could have, but the old memory ain't what it used to be! 

Len sure had a system with his pups and it worked extremely well as the records show...


----------



## moscowitz

WwhatWhat is his AKC name so we can look him up on entry express and see his derby career.


----------



## Ethompson63

*HRCH Benson Bobo's Kaw from Ouranos*


----------



## moscowitz

Thank you now I have an idea about the dog. Turns 2 in October plenty of time to get 10 points for Derby list. But not in Ammo's class.


----------



## Ethompson63

Yea I'd say he will make the derby list. Everyone keeps saying they're waiting for him to blow up and he might one day but hey he's a HRCH will derby points. That right there is enough success for many people. He may never make FC or AFC but I'm not sure of his owners intentions. I do know I'll be watching to see what he really ends up being.


----------



## moscowitz

It really doesn't matter what we think to the owner he is the greatest dog running.


----------



## Misty Marsh

Regardless, that is an impressive feat for a young dog. Got to have the maturity, talent, and trainability even if the owner/handler happened to " fish" for known weaker areas to run.


----------



## Jay Dufour

cakaiser said:


> Ditto, Why you can never generalize about all dogs. There are some pretty amazing dogs, at a very young age. Not many, but some.
> 
> I said, when Ammo started....dogs that are truly special, just have a way of shining through. Too early to say for Benson, but...
> I bet he will too..


Yup , mega dittos . In the nineties I had the youngest for a couple years , and it was the same reaction...... Cept no internet media ! She was just fun, and I had her on the truck running around running hunt tests. She passed first finished at 9 mos and titled at 11 . Her dad was that Big Boy Buddy . 
Have fun with your dog !!!!!


----------



## huntinman

Misty Marsh said:


> Regardless, that is an impressive feat for a young dog. Got to have the maturity, talent, and trainability even if the owner/handler happened to " fish" for known weaker areas to run.


WTH are talking about with the fishing comment? 

Why rain on anyones parade?

Any dog that can play the HT game at such an early age, then switch to trials and run derbies is pretty damn good in my book. Who cares where anyone runs?


----------



## Rainmaker

Misty Marsh said:


> Regardless, that is an impressive feat for a young dog. Got to have the maturity, talent, and trainability even if the owner/handler happened to " fish" for known weaker areas to run.


Pretty crappy thing to say, fishing for weaker areas to run. Really crappy, actually. I don't care who you are or who the dog is.


----------



## Misty Marsh

I thought that I was fairly complimentary. I was only referring to a couple of comments made earlier in the thread about running in weaker areas. Never meant to be derogatory.


----------



## huntinman

Not sure there are any "known weak areas" to run derby or any other stake... 

Everyone thinks their own circuit is the toughest. But, I think they are all tough.


----------



## duk4me

huntinman said:


> WTH are talking about with the fishing comment?
> 
> Why rain on anyones parade?
> 
> Any dog that can play the HT game at such an early age, then switch to trials and run derbies is pretty damn good in my book. Who cares where anyone runs?


lo
Hey Bill I'm confused as usual. Aren't HT judged to a standard? Maybe Nasty Marsh doesn't understand that. I dunno lol.


----------



## Rozet

Takes a special team! Very happy for you guys.


----------



## jforqueran

I would think no matter where the venue, a pup doing finished work at that young of a age should be a compliment within itself!


----------



## David McCracken

He didn't "fish" for judges. He ran some pretty tough tests all over the Country. I judged him twice and, unfortunately, he didn't pass either time. But, he did run an HRC test every weekend until he earned his title. I know a lot of the judges he passed under and their tests weren't gimme's.


----------



## Misty Marsh

This forum sure is quick to smell blood in the water and jump on a guy, heaven forbid someone say's something that doesn't appeal to the masses. I agree that the team is amazing and said as much. A couple others talked about running in certain areas that may not be as strong, and simply (mistakenly) said so. I have 70+ MH & 3 National master qualifications on my two dogs, so I have experience. I also know that a premium list can tell you who the judges are and what you can sometimes expect, and "yes" you can fish for weaker tests if that is your thing. even within a standard.


----------



## dgowder

huntinman said:


> Not sure there are any "known weak areas" to run derby or any other stake...
> 
> Everyone thinks their own circuit is the toughest. But, I think they are all tough.


Bill, I agree with you that there are no weak areas when it comes to derbies but they for sure don't get any stronger than the one he got his 3rd in. When you roll up to a derby and Jason Baker and Marc Pattons trucks are there you are running in the strongest in the country. Misty Marsh or anybody else who thinks that the owner cherry picked this derby to run have lost their minds.


----------



## moscowitz

I believe the third was in Long Island? Is that correct?


----------



## dgowder

It was south west ga this past Friday


----------



## badbullgator

Good for you! I don't care if they shopped test or if they were "hard enough" this is a huge accomplishment with a puppy. Congratulations. 
The only negative thing I can think of is that I have seen a lot of "youngest dogs" who were very good before the wheels come off as the dog hits adolescence. It is also easy to get ahead of yourself and later find the holes in your program. 
Still, it sounds like a very nice dog.


----------



## Camo9244

Rhett Riddle said:


> Benson received his first Derby placement today. He got a 3rd at Southwest Georgia


That is mega Awesome!!


----------



## Rhett Riddle

Congrats to Jason and Benson for their first at Cape Fear!!


----------



## cakaiser

Truly special dogs just have a way of shining through. They don't let much get in their way...
Big congrats!


----------



## BlaineT

Rhett Riddle said:


> Congrats to Jason and Benson for their first at Cape Fear!!


Like...........


----------



## huntinman

That's what I'm talking about! 

Congrats!


----------



## bamajeff

I guess the wheels are still attached and haven't came off just yet. LOL



Rhett Riddle said:


> Congrats to Jason and Benson for their first at Cape Fear!!


----------



## mjh345

Way to go Benson and Jason. What a special team
Keep up the good work


----------



## Chris Atkinson

I love it. 

Go Benson!


----------



## robertnla

Nice job Jason & Benson. Wishing you'll the best of luck.


----------



## Misty Marsh

That's a special team, Enjoy the ride.


----------



## championretrievers

What a special dog you have Jason, Congratulations!


----------



## Tommy Wallace

WOW. Congrats Jason & Benson they normally only come once in a life time, so grab your heart & hold on & Take It To The Limit.
Good Luck


----------



## Erin Lynes

Hmm..... is it a coincidence that so many of these super young achievers are chocolate, or is that brownie-brain power just a little extra special  Congrats on a remarkable achievement!


----------



## Sundown49 aka Otey B

congratulations .....enjoy the RUSH.......


----------



## Dave Farrar

Congrats! That is very cool!


----------



## Sleepyg

Go Benson Go!


----------



## Moosetogooseranch

Rhett Riddle said:


> Congrats to Jason and Benson for their first at Cape Fear!!


Way to Go Brown Dog!
Congrats on all your Success!!
Gives me Goose Bumps!
Micki


----------



## robertnla

Benson Gets another 3rd at South Jersey 4/15/2016. Not sure but someone told me all he needs is 1 more point to make the list.
Go Benson!!!


----------



## Rhett Riddle

Congrats to Jason and Benson on your 4th place finish at Maryland today. This puts Benson on the National Derby list with 6 months left before he ages out!


----------



## Chris Atkinson

Hahahaha!

To my Cajun Cousin in Lake Charles - no! NO. You do NOT owe me a Ben Franklin. I never accepted but I always believed. 

Plus, you have already done much much more for me than I could ask for. True friends are hard to find. And you are one. 

Benson and Jason. Enjoy! 

It is something special. 

Sincerely, Chris


----------



## championretrievers

Congratulations Jason and Benson, WTG!


----------



## Cooper

Training to have the youngest dog to acquire a title is definitely not the thing to do. It puts undo pressure on the dog before it gets the skills to be a reliable retriever cemented in. I'm not saying this is the case and hopefully not. I once witnessed a dog that achieved the status of being the youngest dog to make a HRCH. I felt so sorry for the dog as it had been made piggy because of the enormous pressure placed on it. in my opinion the dog that day should not have passed, but looking back, I'm glad it did as maybe the pressure on the dog was relieved after that. I think that if you will talk to reputable pros they will advise against it. Anyway congradulations on your accomplishment.


----------



## Misty Marsh

Cooper said:


> Training to have the youngest dog to acquire a title is definitely not the thing to do. It puts undo pressure on the dog before it gets the skills to be a reliable retriever cemented in. I'm not saying this is the case and hopefully not. I once witnessed a dog that achieved the status of being the youngest dog to make a HRCH. I felt so sorry for the dog as it had been made piggy because of the enormous pressure placed on it. in my opinion the dog that day should not have passed, but looking back, I'm glad it did as maybe the pressure on the dog was relieved after that. I think that if you will talk to reputable pros they will advise against it. Anyway congradulations on your accomplishment.


Kind of a backhanded compliment don't you think? I do not have the same opinion on this, and although some dogs do need the slow progression some do mature much faster and have the brains and drive to progress without penalty. This particular dog is this type of dog from what I gather and is anything but " piggy" and pressure cautious. And yes some pros will tell you to take all the time, because after all they get paid monthly and usually have a very short period of time to train that dog on a daily basis, or at least a good pro will have 20-30 dogs on his truck. In comparison that owner trained dog will benifit from being bonded to his owner and benefit from multi-session training regimens.


----------



## mjh345

Cooper said:


> Training to have the youngest dog to acquire a title is definitely not the thing to do. It puts undo pressure on the dog before it gets the skills to be a reliable retriever cemented in. I'm not saying this is the case and hopefully not. I once witnessed a dog that achieved the status of being the youngest dog to make a HRCH. I felt so sorry for the dog as it had been made piggy because of the enormous pressure placed on it. in my opinion the dog that day should not have passed, but looking back, I'm glad it did as maybe the pressure on the dog was relieved after that. I think that if you will talk to reputable pros they will advise against it. Anyway congradulations on your accomplishment.


I have the youngest MH, youngest to pass the Master National {one time and two times}, and the youngest QAA bitch in the country in 2014. She does not suffer from "being piggy from too much pressure"; ask anyone who has seen her run can attest


----------



## NateB

Misty Marsh said:


> Kind of a backhanded compliment don't you think? I do not have the same opinion on this, and although some dogs do need the slow progression some do mature much faster and have the brains and drive to progress without penalty. This particular dog is this type of dog from what I gather and is anything but " piggy" and pressure cautious. And yes some pros will tell you to take all the time, because after all they get paid monthly and usually have a very short period of time to train that dog on a daily basis, or at least a good pro will have 20-30 dogs on his truck. In comparison that owner trained dog will benifit from being bonded to his owner and benefit from multi-session training regimens.


Agree with your statement but the dog that can do what this dog did is rare, we should honor his accomplishment, but also realize "most dogs" cannot be expected to do that. And thus not give the general impression "everyone" should be doing this with their dog. Not saying anyone has, but the implication is there for the naive.
I compare to the current NBA game. Steph Curry and the Warriors are winning by shooting more "3"s than ever before. Does that mean all teams can win by shooting "3"s?? No because Steph is a very special and unique, possibly one of a kind player. Just like this dog is a very special and unique dog.

Personally the dogs I have seen that were pushed too fast were not piggy, but had horrible line manners, would not heel on lead without pulling, sloppy handling, etc. Too many things skipped to get the title, that will prevent them from becoming the very best they could.
So honor to the few that can do it well, just enjoy them for what they are, special.


----------



## Clint Watts

Raymond Little said:


> Neither, neither would condone pushing such a young animal through the Program just to be the youngest. They would see how it would create holes that neither could fix or patch in its lifetime. This is a milestone not an accomplishment and you only get one milestone. I have a Benny on this dog ever making the derby list.


Time to pay up


----------



## Clint Watts

Raymond Little said:


> Universe between hrch and derby champ scooter, t-ball and division A to be exact.


Looks like division A all the way Scooter.


----------



## bamajeff

Raymond Little said:


> Universe between hrch and derby champ scooter, t-ball and division A to be exact.


I hear hot sauce makes crow taste better


----------



## Danny Castro

Congrats to what this team has accomplished so far! but I think they are still about 2 1/2 pts shy of the NDL according to EE, but I am sure the will get it as they are trying hard and running many trials, good luck to you guys.


----------



## bjoiner

Danny Castro said:


> Congrats to what this team has accomplished so far! but I think they are still about 2 1/2 pts shy of the NDL according to EE, but I am sure the will get it as they are trying hard and running many trials, good luck to you guys.


Actually they have 10 points and are on the NDL. Derby points are counted differently than all-age. 4th=1, 3rd=2, 2nd=3 and 1st=5. 

Congratulations to to this young man on making the NDL.


----------



## Chris Atkinson

Cooper said:


> Training to have the youngest dog to acquire a title is definitely not the thing to do. It puts undo pressure on the dog before it gets the skills to be a reliable retriever cemented in. I'm not saying this is the case and hopefully not. I once witnessed a dog that achieved the status of being the youngest dog to make a HRCH. I felt so sorry for the dog as it had been made piggy because of the enormous pressure placed on it. in my opinion the dog that day should not have passed, but looking back, I'm glad it did as maybe the pressure on the dog was relieved after that. I think that if you will talk to reputable pros they will advise against it. Anyway congradulations on your accomplishment.


I thought this would be a fitting place to insert this: http://www.retrievertraining.net/fo...x-and-Tyra-Pup&p=289513&viewfull=1#post289513

That's just a really funny post by one of our growing list of deceased retriever community members. I wish I'd met Paul Rainboldt live. I never got the chance.

The thread is when Ammo was first acquired and it kind of documents the timeline as well as the comments made as Ammo made her progression. Of course we all know that Ammo set some records and got some pretty cool capitalized letters next to her name.

I'm so happy Benson is on the derby list. I was impressed the one and only time I saw them train. They had something special and it looks like it is continuing on.

Chris


----------



## Danny Castro

That's great wasn't aware it was scored differently! Congrats!


----------



## mjh345

Chris Atkinson said:


> I thought this would be a fitting place to insert this: http://www.retrievertraining.net/fo...x-and-Tyra-Pup&p=289513&viewfull=1#post289513
> 
> That's just a really funny post by one of our growing list of deceased retriever community members. I wish I'd met Paul Rainboldt live. I never got the chance.
> 
> The thread is when Ammo was first acquired and it kind of documents the timeline as well as the comments made as Ammo made her progression. Of course we all know that Ammo set some records and got some pretty cool capitalized letters next to her name.
> 
> I'm so happy Benson is on the derby list. I was impressed the one and only time I saw them train. They had something special and it looks like it is continuing on.
> 
> Chris


Great post, brother
Keep up the good work Benson


----------



## Rhett Riddle

Congrats to Jason and Benson on winning the Port Arthur Derby today. This gives the team 15 points with 5 more months to run


----------



## mjh345

Way to go Team Benson!!


----------



## Camo9244

Awesome!!!


----------



## Clint Watts

Great job, keep up the good work


----------



## Shako

Where do you go on the HRC site to find out the points to show the highest pointed dog currently?


----------



## bjoiner

Shako said:


> Where do you go on the HRC site to find out the points to show the highest pointed dog currently?


http://huntingretrieverclub.org/Point Club/Point_Club_4-8-15.xls


----------



## Tyler Pugh

I check RTF that much more than usual waiting for Raymond to join back in this discussion.


----------



## jhnnythndr

Nate_C said:


> I think it is fair to ask. What was the training program. How did he get the dog to handle, ie pile work - to - T - to - swim by? Ammo was running derbies which is just marking, mostly natural ability. All you need there in terms of formal work is OB and steady. Being HRCH the dog needs to be finished. That takes time. How did he do it?




Hahaha. Priceless. 

Lively thread!!


----------



## LGH

Wish i would have known he was running in PA. I would have liked to see him


----------



## Clint Watts

Tyler Pugh said:


> I check RTF that much more than usual waiting for Raymond to join back in this discussion.


Me also, we will probably be waiting for awhile.


----------



## dgowder

Benson is getting it done for sure. There is another young dog from Alabama who is doing impressive things as well. Docheno's Conecuh River Man doesn't age out until July , according to EE he is HRCH, JH, 3 master passes, qualifying 3rd, and derby list and has at least JAM'd every derby he has run. Obviously there are a few special young dogs that have a little extra something that sets them apart from even your better than average dogs.


----------



## paul young

How old is Benson now? -Paul


----------



## Chris Atkinson

It looks like Benson ages out of derby (two years old) on October 26, 2016.


----------



## paul young

He sounds like a really special dog. I see he will be at Central NY next week. Perhaps I will get to see him in Maine the following week?

Given that he has about 20 weekends of eligibility left in his Derby career, it is highly unlikely that he has a serious shot to be the National Derby Champion. To do that he would need at least another 70 derby points. That's not impossible, but he would need to average better than 3 points per start and run every weekend.

I know for a fact that I will never own a dog as talented as Benson, but if I did, I would end his derby career now and work toward shaping him into a consistent All-Age competitor.

I wish all the best to Jason and Benson going forward!  -Paul


----------



## Jacob Hawkes

Clint Watts said:


> Me also, we will probably be waiting for awhile.


He has more important things going than concerning himself with what a brown dog does in the derby.


----------



## Peter Balzer

Jacob Hawkes said:


> He has more important things going than concerning himself with what a brown dog does in the derby.


Yet he found the time in his day to talk smack on that dog . . .


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## Jacob Hawkes

If you never have things come up or change in your life, then more power to you. Believe you me, it will.


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## Peter Balzer

Jacob Hawkes said:


> If you never have things come up or change in your life, then more power to you. Believe you me, it will.


Maybe I'm missing something, but Raymond has time to post to three other threads today and to visit the POTUS forum so he has time. . .


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## Tyler Pugh

dgowder said:


> Benson is getting it done for sure. There is another young dog from Alabama who is doing impressive things as well. Docheno's Conecuh River Man doesn't age out until July , according to EE he is HRCH, JH, 3 master passes, qualifying 3rd, and derby list and has at least JAM'd every derby he has run. Obviously there are a few special young dogs that have a little extra something that sets them apart from even your better than average dogs.


I have been keeping an eye on this dog on EE. Really impressive so far! I have met his trainer, Chase Haws, a few times. He's a great guy and a great trainer as well.


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## Clint Watts

Jacob Hawkes said:


> He has more important things going than concerning himself with what a brown dog does in the derby.


Some folks are really good at running there mouths on this forum, down talking and denigrating others. You know the know it alls. Yet when they are wrong they don't stand up and admit it. I would be embarrassed to let someone else do the talking for me, man up. A little friendly ribbing is all this is. Some can dish it out, but they can't take it.

He did not have more important things to do when he was talking this dog and handler down in the beginning of this very thread. He was concerning himself with a brown dog then, in fact stated something about this dog not being able to do something in derbies, even betting Bennies and calling folks scooter. Man up, eat crow and move on.


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## Clint Watts

Peter Balzer said:


> Maybe I'm missing something, but Raymond has time to post to three other threads today and to visit the POTUS forum so he has time. . .


He is on here posting most days, guarantee he has been reading this thread also.


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## Chris Atkinson

Clint Watts said:


> Some folks are really good at running there mouths on this forum, down talking and denigrating others. You know the know it alls. Yet when they are wrong they don't stand up and admit it. I would be embarrassed to let someone else do the talking for me, man up. A little friendly ribbing is all this is. Some can dish it out, but they can't take it.
> 
> He did not have more important things to do when he was talking this dog and handler down in the beginning of this very thread. He was concerning himself with a brown dog then, in fact stated something about this dog not being able to do something in derbies, even betting Bennies and calling folks scooter. Man up, eat crow and move on.


OK. Are you done? He is a real man. 

Please look back and see who first forcasted derby success for this team. It was me. 

Raymond Little is a good man. 

The forecast for this team is a lot like stock picks. I thought the price would go up. Raymond thought it would go down. I chickened out and let him off the hook. 

Raymond did not take a shot at you. 

Enough. Jason is cool with it, based upon my recent dialogue via text with him. Maybe you should be too. 

- the Janitor


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## Clint Watts

I will man up after reading my last statement and say that it does read a little more harsh than I intended. Mr. Little I apologize, in no way did I mean to cause you any grief. Take care Scooter.

Janitor, I am done.


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## Jross0711

Its okay guys. The dog world is small enough that I'm sure Mr Little and I will cross paths one day. I've been fortunate in my short time to have been around some the best in the Feild trial game. They all will tell you, "you better have thick skin to play this game and be successful." Ive also observed some classy individuals like the late Steve Fergusson. I, like Mr. Ferguson always did, would rather handle myself with grace. So when that day does come that Mr. Little and I do meet. Hopefully I can put my hand on his shoulder and get a little laugh out it. On another note, Benson will have a running mate starting in June... Bullet x Xena, pups are currently five weeks old. Taking bets, nah just kidding.


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## mjh345

Jross0711 said:


> Its okay guys. The dog world is small enough that I'm sure Mr Little and I will cross paths one day. I've been fortunate in my short time to have been around some the best in the Feild trial game. They all will tell you, "you better have thick skin to play this game and be successful." Ive also observed some classy individuals like the late Steve Fergusson. I, like Mr. Ferguson always did, would rather handle myself with grace. So when that day does come that Mr. Little and I do meet. Hopefully I can put my hand on his shoulder and get a little laugh out it. On another note, Benson will have a running mate starting in June... Bullet x Xena, pups are currently five weeks old. Taking bets, nah just kidding.


Mr Ross, I don't know you but hope I get to meet you someday.
You are clearly a class act who fully understands how fortunate you have been to be blessed with Benson. It is refreshing to have you share your unbridled enthusiasm and passion for what you are doing. Your thoughts on Steve Fergusson mirror mine; what a class act he was!!
I know you are enjoying the ride with Benson and hope it is a long journey
Good Luck to team Benson
I believe the bond you have with Benson is a key part of your success


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## moscowitz

You do show a lot of class and I also look forward to seeing you at the line running a very good dog.


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## Raymond Little

Clint Watts said:


> He is on here posting most days, guarantee he has been reading this thread also.


Nope, this is the first time I have been to this thread since speaking with someone about it while I was fishing Saturday morning Clint. 

"Neither, neither would condone pushing such a young animal through the Program just to be the youngest. They would see how it would create holes that neither could fix or patch in its lifetime. This is a milestone not an accomplishment and you only get one milestone. I have a Benny on this dog ever making the derby list."RPL

The question was, which program and my response is above. I still maintain that it's not a good idea to push a young dog into to situations where he/she is unprepared to play. Chris A said it best when he used the stock analogy of him going long and me selling Short on Jason and Benson. I live my life from a Logical perspective not Emotional so, calculated risk are just that Calculated. Now, if I would have posted about my 12 year old throwing a 99 mph fast ball in U-12 baseball some would question that and rightfully so since keeping it together to really preform down the road may be difficult. As I see it, it's the same with pushing a dog to set a record that in the grand scheme of things really doesn't do much for his stock. 

Good Luck to Benson and Jason, hope the next few years are thrilling and fun.

No Jacob, being a "Brown Dog" had absolutely nothing to do with the Logic behind my original post. I actually owned one once and he was a nice animal who died before his time.


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## Clint Watts

Mr. Little, I went back and re-read some of my posts on this thread. It did start out as a little ribbing and that is all I meant. I took it too far after that and was put in check correctly by the Janitor. I apologize. You give and gave sound advice on this subject. Thank you sir.


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## Jacob Hawkes

Raymond Little said:


> No Jacob, being a "Brown Dog" had absolutely nothing to do with the Logic behind my original post. I actually owned one once and he was a nice animal who died before his time.


I merely said it was a brown dog. I have yellow ones. Most have blacks. There certainly was no negative connotation attached to it.


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## Rhett Riddle

Congrats on Jason and Benson. 2nd place at the central New York club derby. This makes 18 points.


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## Migillicutty

Awesome! Go team Benson.


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## mjh345

Migillicutty said:


> Awesome! Go team Benson.


Way to go Team Benson
Keep up the good work!!


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## Camo9244

Congrats!!


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## Rhett Riddle

Congrats again to Jason and Benson. They recieved fourth in the Del Bay Retriever club Derby today. This makes 19 points for the team.


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## Chris Atkinson

Well done Jason And Benson!


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## Rhett Riddle

Another good day for the Brown Dog. Congrats Jason and Benson. This makes 24 points.


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## Camo9244

WOW, how long before he ages out Rhett?


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## robertnla

correction He was whelped on 10/26/2014

GO Benson & Jason
We are doing a repeat breeding this week.


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## Rhett Riddle

Camo9244 said:


> WOW, how long before he ages out Rhett?


Four and 1/2 months left to go.


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## BJGatley

Rhett Riddle said:


> Four and 1/2 months left to go.


I agree....I thought we are as a team with us in showing our merits and those who have the games appreciate it as well. 
I hope and I hope we don't develop bias in our efforts. We should give thanks to those who in our dog family who have exceident the expectations in our sport.
My penny...


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## Parker M.

Huge congrats! Love following this thread


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## Ries74

My Gump pup was cruising in hunt tests quickly until her first heat cycle. They are great dogs Gump throws and with the right training they excel. Congratulations!


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## mjh345

Keep it up Team Benson


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## championretrievers

WTG Jason & Benson!


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## mizzippi jb

Congrats on all the early success! Seems to me like you and Benson, along with help from a good many knowledgeable people, assessed what YOUR team was capable of doing and then went out and did it......and keep doing it. Again, congrats from here.


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## David McCracken

Benson won first place in a Derby this weekend.


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## Migillicutty

Keep rolling team Benson! Enjoying your ride from afar


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## David McCracken

Is Benson running the HRC Grand this Fall?


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## Rhett Riddle

Second place for the team today. Makes 27 points for Benson. Congrats.


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## Chris Atkinson

Very nice. Congratulations Jason and Benson. 

Jason. Please be sure to kiss your wife and tell her how awesome she is for the support. 

Support her too and be best friends. 

Benson. - good dog!

- the JJ


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## championretrievers

WTG Team Jason & Benson! Also a huge congrats to Ben James & Pistol for their first place finish, also a team to watch!


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## Rhett Riddle

Congrats to Jason and Benson on getting 3rd place at North Alabama today. This third place finish gives Benson 30 points.


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## Camo9244

Rock on Benson!!


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## championretrievers

Proud to announce that Benson's sire is 5/5 at the Master Nationals. 3xGRHRCH UH Big Mamou's Run Forest Run MH41 MNH5 ** 'Gump'


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## Rhett Riddle

Congrats on a good run today for Jason and Benson. 2nd Place in the Blue Ridge Derby. This gives Benson 33 points with a couple trials left to run.


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## mjh345

Run Benson Run!!


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## brewbetter

Wow! And I thought my dog Tex was doing good getting her HR Title at 15 months! Good job Bobo!


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## robertnla

Brewbetter, That is a good job. You and Tex will get it done. Your well on your way.


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## brewbetter

Thanks. I've got a few months to extend her out a little and sharpen up her response to hand signals and the whistle before the spring hunt test season starts. We have a lot of fun every day.


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## Rhett Riddle

Congrats on a great Derby career for Benson and Jason. A lot of training and hard work paid off. They ended with their last trial today receiving 4th place and ending with 34 derby points. Benson also recieved 3rd place in his 2nd Qualifing last weekend. Great two weekends for the team before aging out. Congrats!!!


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## mjh345

Rhett, good to see you in St Louis.
Thanks for keeping us posted on Benson.
Nice to know he and Jason finished their derby career in the colors
Best wishes to team Benson going forward


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## Rainmaker

Nice job, nice career so far, making great memories. Good looking dog too.


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## saltgrass

Awesome team!!! Congrats Jason and Benson!!


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## Rhett Riddle

Good to see you too Marc. Glad your dogs are doing well!


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## Dave Burton

Benson looked good in 1st series of Q yesterday....not sure what happened after that I was sent home.


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## hawgsalot

moscowitz said:


> The dog is not a super dog it happens that's field trials. Keep in mind this dog ran a great many derbies. On retriever news it looks like he ran the third most derbies of any dog on the derby list.


Wait what happened?


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## Rick Hall

hawgsalot said:


> Wait what happened?


Moscowitzed.


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## Rhett Riddle

Congrats Jason and benson on their first all age win. 28 months old and won the Tar Heel amateur today. Congrats


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## John Robinson

Rhett Riddle said:


> Congrats Jason and benson on their first all age win. 26 months old and won the Tar Heel amateur today. Congrats


Yeah but he ran the third most derbies in history, so no big deal😀, right? 
Huge congrats for real, that's awesome.


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## birddogn_tc

Awesome. Congrats to Jason and Benson!


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## Rainmaker

Wow, congrats, that is really something!


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## Migillicutty

Ol Jason just keeps "ruining" this dog, right in to the winners circle. Congrats to team Benson. Heck of an accomplishment.


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## bamajeff

I hear crow tastes better with lots of Tony Chachere's


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## cakaiser

Special dogs are just that...special.
That is awesome, congrats!


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## mjh345

AWESOME!!!!!
Keep up the great work, and good luck going forward


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## Chris Atkinson

I am so happy for Jason and Benson!

Huge congratulations!

Not that I'm superstitious, but after looking back through this thread, I might hunt for a black Patagonia hat for when I break PJ out!


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## Camo9244

Congrats Jason and Benson!!


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## robertnla

Congrats to Jason and Benson on their journey together. May it be a long one.

Benson's Dam just had a litter of black and yellow yesterday.


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## saltgrass

Congrats to Jason and Benson


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## MooseGooser

What a great timeline to follow... Its been fun reading of the progress ,and the different comments...

Way to go Benson....Not many like you....

Jason... Don't know you but you must be a hard worker... Paid off Big time... Congrats...


Gooser


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## birddogn_tc

What's the latest with Benson?


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## Jross0711

He's been with Alan Pleasant since April.


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## Webfoot Retrievers

Congratulations way to go!


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## rjrogers

Nice hope he is doing well with him.


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## KEB

whats the latest with Benson, havnt heard a report in a while?


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## bjoiner

He got an amateur win in Spring 2017. Hasn't run but a few trials since then.


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## birddogn_tc

Doesn't look like Benson runs a lot of trials. What is the latest with him? Anyone?


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