# Boykin Puppy



## JGorman (Mar 28, 2013)

Bringing one of these jokers home in a few weeks. Hoping mainly for a good buddy, but also planning on him picking up a few dead birds.
If you have a Boykin or have any experience with them I would love to hear your thoughts/advice.

Thanks, 

Joseph


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## Dale (Dec 21, 2003)

Great little dogs. Have a friend that has one, 32 pounds and full body carries a goose dokken. Can be seen on FB @ https://www.facebook.com/pages/Blackhawk-Labradors/435398216539115. 

Welcome to RTF. Where do you call home? 

Dale


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## JGorman (Mar 28, 2013)

Thanks for the welcome Dale, I'm from Columbus, MS, currently living in Starkville MS.


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## Hairy Dawg (Mar 8, 2009)

Good luck with your pup. I've had an awesome experience with mine. Reese topped out at 42 lbs., & for me, is perfect sized. He's been very easy to train & eager to learn & please. I'll never be without a Boykin again.


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## fishduck (Jun 5, 2008)

I am zero help in the Boykin department. But if you want to cross the state line and train later this summer let me know. I will have a lab pup that will be similiar in age. I train mainly in the Vernon area.


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## JGorman (Mar 28, 2013)

Hairy, sounds like a great dog and he looks good in your picture. Keeping my fingers crossed that I'll get lucky and be able to say the same things about mine some day.


fishduck, I appreciate your offer and will most likely be taking you up on it. I'm assuming you're the Mark in Vernon that Dustin trains with on Thursdays? I work with him at Marathon, and he's one of the main reasons I'm trying to get serious about learning how to train a dog.

Thanks again, looking forward to meeting you.


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

We have four Boykins in our training group. I like all of them. They are birdy, energetic, and fun to watch. If I were you I would try to be in contact with other Boykin owners who might be able to guide you in your training.

Also, I have hunted with Rebel who is the LI Delta Waterfowl official mascot. He's quite a dog.

Good luck!


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## fishduck (Jun 5, 2008)

You are welcome anytime! My younger dogs are in swim by now. Should have pups on the ground by the 12 th. That pup will be similar in age to yours.

A little dog named Stoney cured all of my Boykin snobbery. They are awesome little dogs!!!

I am trying to keep Thursday afternoon open for training. If interest maintains it will develop into a nice training group.


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## logy (Oct 27, 2010)

gdgnyc said:


> We have four Boykins in our training group. I like all of them. They are birdy, energetic, and fun to watch. If I were you I would try to be in contact with other Boykin owners who might be able to guide you in your training.


This is some good advice. These dogs are very eager to please and they are a BUSY breed. Very rarely is max ever still. But they can do the work of a lab. 

Max is about 35 lbs. This is him with his first goose








These little dogs can help you get out of the dog house very fast! I might have exploited his cuteness a couple times


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## Fire Angel (Jan 3, 2003)

Best of luck with your new pup! I have only been around a couple but they were great little dogs.


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## Huck18 (Jan 17, 2012)

They are great little dogs. If trained properly they can do anything a lab can do. As someone has already said they are very very busy dogs. Mine loves to chew on his kong non stop in the house or play his own hide and seek game with it. They are great little retrievers and IMO probably one of if not the most versatile working dogs out there. My boy picked up a ton of ducks this season and even a few geese. He will be two years old tomorrow, we are one pass away from his Senoir title. I have always had labs before I got a Boykin and now I will never be without a Boykin they will steal your heart.


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## Huck18 (Jan 17, 2012)

This is him at a Senior hunt test in College Station, TX. Clik the pic and the video should load.


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## Quackwacker (Aug 16, 2011)

You should drive over to Clinton S.C this weekend. The best of the best will be there competing in the Boykin Spaniel Nationals. Friday and Saturday.


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## logy (Oct 27, 2010)

LBD is popular LOL! 


Nice dog huck!


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## Quackwacker (Aug 16, 2011)

Here is a Boykin at her first hunt test. She has had some OB training and has handled very few birds. She is going through FF right now and doing great!

http://youtu.be/JVFOXA00gdc


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## Huck18 (Jan 17, 2012)

Quackwacker said:


> You should drive over to Clinton S.C this weekend. The best of the best will be there competing in the Boykin Spaniel Nationals. Friday and Saturday.


Not all of the best of the best will be there as Hank and I won't be able to make it out.


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## swampboy91 (Mar 20, 2013)

Best of luck with your new pup!


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## BlaineT (Jul 17, 2010)

Yeah just go the Clinton house this weekend. Youll be in brown dog overload by the time you leave.


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## fishduck (Jun 5, 2008)

MidSouth Boykin Spaniel Retriever Club would put you in touch with most of the local Boykin folks. I only know of one Boykin hunt tester locally and he is outside of Jasper Alabama.


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## Rick Vaughan (Sep 4, 2012)

_*I judged several Boykins in JH/SH tests in NC and SC last fall, and each dog earned my respect and picked my interest...I am seriously thinking that my next retriever will be a Boykin. Good luck with your puppy, I hope to read lot's of positive postings about him on this forum!*_


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## leemac (Dec 7, 2011)

If your living in Starkville, walking a Boykin pup around a certain University campus will be a VERY effective hunting technique. Just be careful, I almost got a ticket doing that years ago. The officer kept insisting I was hunting over a baited field.


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## JGorman (Mar 28, 2013)

Wow guys, thanks for the great responses. Y’all are getting me even more excited to bring him home in May.

For those of you who’ve trained a Boykin is there anything particularly different from training a Lab that sticks out in your mind?

And leemac if you’re talking about what I think you’re talking about, while my wife has no problem with me chasing birds, I’m willing to bet chasing tail feathers of a different kind wouldn’t go over so well.

Thanks again everybody, I’m looking forward to learning all I can from this site.


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

JGorman said:


> Wow guys, thanks for the great responses. Y’all are getting me even more excited to bring him home in May.
> 
> For those of you who’ve trained a Boykin is there anything particularly different from training a Lab that sticks out in your mind?
> 
> ...


Talk to Boykin people for that one. I have noticed differences but since I don't own a Boykin and since I only know four, I hesitate to make any comments.


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## logy (Oct 27, 2010)

JGorman said:


> For those of you who’ve trained a Boykin is there anything particularly different from training a Lab that sticks out in your mind?



You can use the same program you would use on a lab, BUT they are not labs. They take longer to develop, they are softer, they get bored with doing the same drill over and over. Just go at their pace and you will be okay. Male boykins are a lot easier to train than females. If you want I can pm you my phone number and you can give me a call if you want to talk over the phone.


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## dgengr (Nov 28, 2012)

JGorman said:


> Bringing one of these jokers home in a few weeks. Hoping mainly for a good buddy, but also planning on him picking up a few dead birds.
> If you have a Boykin or have any experience with them I would love to hear your thoughts/advice.
> 
> Thanks,
> ...


*A Boykin????? i think those are for girls.. get you a real hunter like mine..*


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## BlaineT (Jul 17, 2010)

JGorman said:


> Wow guys, thanks for the great responses. Y’all are getting me even more excited to bring him home in May.
> 
> For those of you who’ve trained a Boykin is there anything particularly different from training a Lab that sticks out in your mind?
> 
> ...


Ive trained several. I do OB the same as labs. I do force fetch the same as labs. I decheat the same as labs. I throw the same marks as labs doing qual work. i run the same blinds. 

Is there a difference. yeah i guess so for some of the work. They all catch on certain skills and concepts differently. but so do most other breeds as well. Read your dog. Train the dog you have. 

ive got 2 right now that are about the same age and at the same point in training. 1 took nearly no time to get forced to a pile out to 100 yards but took way yonder longer than normal to stop on a dang whistle. the other one took forever to get forced to a pile the way i demand but stopped on the whistle en route the first session and started taking both back casts. 

im trying to learn to balance better as we all need to. My 2 year old dog was picking up legit 300 yard marks at 11 months old but took nearly his whole 2nd year to de-cheat through our program. and still needs refresher sessions. I've learned of my holes in training as anyone training a dog should learn to see and fix. hopefully before its too late and causes you problems. 

not all of them (but most of the ones ive trained seem a little slower to mature than most labs). So i guess the best advice is slow down and do everything thoroughly. be prepared to seek help when you come to a place that is a road block and try different tactics. 

I've trained a few labs and now own a really talented young one myself. I am amazed most days by the time it takes her to catch on certain things that have taken my boykins much longer to grasp. 

I love my boykins and will always have one or more. But in my humble and worthless opinion to build a dynamic duck dog and competitive dog to todays standards- you are going to be better off doing it in a lab. Of course their are exceptions but generally speaking- don't expect your pup to come out of the womb doing the work. (too many people get a boykin thinking thats whats gonna happen). 

Keep it slow, have high standards, learn your dog, and have fun.


Maybe after about 300 more boykins ill have this training stuff figured out...


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## JGorman (Mar 28, 2013)

dgengr said:


> *A Boykin????? i think those are for girls.. get you a real hunter like mine..*
> 
> View attachment 12248



Now here we were having a nice, mature conversation and you just haaaad to throw in your two cents..... Jerk 


logy and Blaine, thanks for the insight. This is my first dog so I don't have any experience training labs to compare against, but most of the training material I've come across is focused on more typical retrievers so I was curious if there was anything I should keep an eye out for.


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## BlaineT (Jul 17, 2010)

JGorman said:


> This is my first dog so I don't have any experience training labs to compare against, but most of the training material I've come across is focused on more typical retrievers so I was curious if there was anything I should keep an eye out for.


Just train the dog as any of the well established comprehensive programs suggest. And when you come to a place your dog is struggling call someone that has experience with them and try and determine if its just your dog being a dog, or if its your boykin being a boykin.


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

JGorman

Check your PM's.


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## dgengr (Nov 28, 2012)

JGorman said:


> Now here we were having a nice, mature conversation and you just haaaad to throw in your two cents..... Jerk
> 
> 
> logy and Blaine, thanks for the insight. This is my first dog so I don't have any experience training labs to compare against, but most of the training material I've come across is focused on more typical retrievers so I was curious if there was anything I should keep an eye out for.


Now see.... dont get all pissy. I used to have one of those and he was MHRCH........ "Master Hunter Retriever Champ".... Ok well maybe not but he was a MEANT "Master Eater and Nap Taker"....... I would have put him up against any dog in the world at taking naps...


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## JGorman (Mar 28, 2013)

gdgnyc said:


> JGorman
> 
> Check your PM's.


I don't have enough posts to reply with a PM, but thank you for the info. I will definitely keep that in mind.



dgengr said:


> Now see.... dont get all pissy. I used to have one of those and he was MHRCH........ "Master Hunter Retriever Champ".... Ok well maybe not but he was a MEANT "Master Eater and Nap Taker"....... I would have put him up against any dog in the world at taking naps...


Harley was indeed a bulldog among bulldogs. *observes moment of silence*


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## helencalif (Feb 2, 2004)

Besides being "busy" and slower to mature than Labs, what other traits do Boykins have? How are they in the house?

I ask because our son in law fishes and would love to have a dog in the boat with him. He also hunts... ducks and pheasants. Years ago he had a Brittany Spaniel and loved it. I don't think he has ever heard of a Boykin. It sounds like a dog that would fit his needs. Our big black Labs are just too big for his small fishing boat. His ideal dog would be a house-companion dog, too. You know... sit next to you on the couch and watch TV with you type of dog. 

Tell me more about Boykin personalities...


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## dgengr (Nov 28, 2012)

Harley was indeed a bulldog among bulldogs. *observes moment of silence*[/QUOTE]


Yes Sir he is very missed. Now in memory of him i want to take a nap....


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## JGorman (Mar 28, 2013)

helencalif said:


> Besides being "busy" and slower to mature than Labs, what other traits do Boykins have? How are they in the house?
> 
> I ask because our son in law fishes and would love to have a dog in the boat with him. He also hunts... ducks and pheasants. Years ago he had a Brittany Spaniel and loved it. I don't think he has ever heard of a Boykin. It sounds like a dog that would fit his needs. Our big black Labs are just too big for his small fishing boat. His ideal dog would be a house-companion dog, too. You know... sit next to you on the couch and watch TV with you type of dog.
> 
> Tell me more about Boykin personalities...




Your son in law's situation seems very close to mine. I'm hoping for a dog to hang out in the boat while I fish, be a good house pet for my wife while I'm at work, and still go get a duck. Based on the research I've done the Boykin seems like a perfect fit. I realize a lab can easily fullfil those roles as well, but size comes into play because my wife doesn't want a huge dog in the house.


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## Huck18 (Jan 17, 2012)

Mine stays in the house when we are home he sleeps in the bed with my wife and I every night. They are fine in the house but because they are busy they can get into some trouble. No different than any other house dog they just need something to keep them busy besides your shoes or socks or toilet paper. I use a kong to keep mine occupied he is absolutely crazy about that damn thing. He will hide it from his self under the couch or under a blanket and the have a ball hunting it up after he hides it from himself. Some days I work from home and he can be found laying at my feet under my desk. One thing that needs to be taught is the "place" command. So if the dog is being annoying or just too busy running around the house I tell him "place" and point to his bed or place mat and keep him there while I go about my business. Boykins are very energetic dogs so they need to be ran and worked as much as you can just to burn off some of that energy. As far as hunting out of a smaller boat they are the best there is, mine loves to jump up on the front deck of my 14 foot Jon boat and go as fast as we can go. He thinks he is the captain of the biggest ship in the world and he is much easier to get in and out of the boat than a 80 pound dog. As far as training them like others have said you train them just like any other dog but learn how to read your dog, they do get bored with doing the same drills over and over. All in all anyone looking for a smaller retriever or upland flusher can't go wrong with a Boykin. They can even be trained to point and flush on command if that's your cup of tea. You can PM me or give me a call if you want.


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## frontier (Nov 3, 2003)

helencalif said:


> Besides being "busy" and slower to mature than Labs, what other traits do Boykins have? How are they in the house?
> 
> I ask because our son in law fishes and would love to have a dog in the boat with him. He also hunts... ducks and pheasants. Years ago he had a Brittany Spaniel and loved it. I don't think he has ever heard of a Boykin. It sounds like a dog that would fit his needs. Our big black Labs are just too big for his small fishing boat. His ideal dog would be a house-companion dog, too. You know... sit next to you on the couch and watch TV with you type of dog.
> 
> Tell me more about Boykin personalities...


I've owned and bred Boykins on a limited basis for the past 20 years along with my Labradors of almost 30 years. Unique personalities every one, some sensitive, some stubborn, and others very tractable just like Labs. Many of my clients are similiar to your son's situation...just wanting to transition to a smaller family type gun dog. I like this article written a few years ago and it seems to help many who are interested in the breed.
http://www.gameandfishmag.com/2010/09/24/hunting_hunting-dogs_gf_aa056302a/ The breed is AKC recognized now as well and can participate in AKC spaniel and retriever hunt tests as well as other venues if AKC registered.

Health issues are a definite challenge in this breed. Sadly, many breeders do not even do basic OFA health clearances before breeding on parents. ACVO eye clearance, OFA cardiac, OFA patellas, and Exercise Induced Collapse (EIC) are other concerns. There are also certain lines that seem to contain more epilepsy, severe skin and food allergies, and aggression, and overshot and undershot bite.


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## leemac (Dec 7, 2011)

helencalif said:


> Besides being "busy" and slower to mature than Labs, what other traits do Boykins have? How are they in the house?
> 
> I ask because our son in law fishes and would love to have a dog in the boat with him. He also hunts... ducks and pheasants. Years ago he had a Brittany Spaniel and loved it. I don't think he has ever heard of a Boykin. It sounds like a dog that would fit his needs. Our big black Labs are just too big for his small fishing boat. His ideal dog would be a house-companion dog, too. You know... sit next to you on the couch and watch TV with you type of dog.
> 
> Tell me more about Boykin personalities...


I got my Boykin, Sport, 15 years ago this spring. I buried him this past October. I got him when I was in college and he lived with me, not just in the house but everywhere for his first year. When I began my Boykin ride they were touted as the "Dog that won't rock the boat", stemming from their heritage in the low country of S.C.. I was fortunate enough to go to college with a fella by the name of Lem Boykin at ABAC in Tifton GA. If you've studied much of the history of LBD's you'll recognize the name. The Boykin family still raised cotton in S.C. when Lem and I last spoke. Boykins were bred to be small eager hunters for retrieving and turkey hunting. When I bought Sport, thats what I got.

Boykin's have changed tremendously in the past fifteen years. 

My boy was a big one, or so I thought when he was young at a very muscular 34 pounds. It seems that they have been bred to be larger now.

They have a rep for being hyper. Yes, if things that pulled his trigger were introduced (birds) he would loses his cool but he rode shotgun in my Jeep or in the front seat of a jon boat and enjoyed being with his human as much as any dog I've seen. He was dang sure more laid back than my lab when he had plenty of people time.

He wasn't aggressive, but he didn't like his space to be invaded either. I learn quickly to let him pull the cuckleburrs from his coat. That said if you rode to far without give him a little love he would rest his paw on the console intill you paid him some attention.

As far as water attitude, well, its a thousand wonders he wasn't eaten by an alligator. He liked to swim more than any dog I have ever seen. If he found water, he went swimming, for as long as he wanted to (i mean like 20 minutes straight) no matter if you wanted him to or not. Before the alligators got bad on the main lake on Lake Eufaula, he would go water skiing with me. On a beach break, if a low flying bird came by he would give chase and if it worked out just right he would swim so far off the bank I would get nervous and go get him in the boat. I'm talking 5-600 yards out to sea and no sign of turning around.

He was vocal, on a chase, as was bred for early on in Boykins. They were originally used to find and bust up flocks of turkeys in the fall for a hunter to call back together. He would bark (yip really) every step as he chased a crippled dove all the way across a peanut field.

He was the best dog I have had the privilege of owning, or being owned by. His heart was ten times bigger than his body. I almost lost him duck hunting a lily pad pond when he was three. I sent him on a retrieve and he got tangled in the pads. Just before his nose went under, he made it to a log and climbed on. He took one really deep breathe, saw the duck twenty yards further and was launching off the log as I caught his back leg from the front of my gheenoe. He wined like a mad man until I poled to open water and sent him for his duck. For that reason, I've switched to a lab as my hunting, retriever. As big as Sports heart was, he didn't have the hind quarters to back it up. He picked up lots of doves and quail after that hunt, but no more ducks. I grew up with Brittneys and own one now. If you son in law likes a Britt as a pet, a Boykin would be at least as good of a choice.

JGorman, I just saw that you said you were "living" in Starkville. Don't want you're wife mad at me or you but I was thinking you were a college kid and I promise that curly furball was a 10-1 favorite over labs on campus back in the old days!


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## JGorman (Mar 28, 2013)

leemac you're thinking right, I just got married and am trying to finish up at school (wrap it in maroon and white, if you will). While I'm sure he'll be a lady killer, Lord knows that's the last thing I need. I've about bitten off more than I can chew with the one cute little sorority girl I was lucky enough to snag... Don't need any more.


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## Bob Mac (Feb 28, 2012)

Waiing on a Brandwine pup myself. did lot of research. tHEY ARE A GREAT BREED.


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## Duckme (May 31, 2012)

never seen one, going to look them up good luck


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## logy (Oct 27, 2010)

helencalif said:


> Besides being "busy" and slower to mature than Labs, what other traits do Boykins have? How are they in the house?
> 
> I ask because our son in law fishes and would love to have a dog in the boat with him. He also hunts... ducks and pheasants. Years ago he had a Brittany Spaniel and loved it. I don't think he has ever heard of a Boykin. It sounds like a dog that would fit his needs. Our big black Labs are just too big for his small fishing boat. His ideal dog would be a house-companion dog, too. You know... sit next to you on the couch and watch TV with you type of dog.
> 
> Tell me more about Boykin personalities...


The boykin personality is amazing. They just want to be with you. Max will follow me room to room and he will plop down right by my feet and look up at me as if he is saying "What can I do for you master?". They have a tendency to really attach to one person in the family. They are a very versatile hunting dog they will hunt up-land, they will excel in the dove field, and you can even hunt them out of a canoe without worrying about it tipping. Max has never meet a stranger. Max is very well behaved in the house. He has chewed somethings up, but honestly it was when he was a little puppy. He has his toys and he will only play with them. 

This breed has won me over and I'm going to stick with them!


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

I just would be careful as to where I got my Boykin from. I get the feeling that a split in the breed may be possible.


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## crackerd (Feb 21, 2003)

gdgnyc said:


> I just would be careful as to where I got my Boykin from. I get the feeling that a split in the breed may be possible.


You mean like springers, cockers and oh, almost every other spaniel, and Labs, goldens and oh, almost every other retriever? That's real helpful advice, y'all keep it coming.



helencalif said:


> Besides being "busy" and slower to mature than Labs, what other traits do Boykins have? How are they in the house?


They rate excellent with the proviso you give them enough work *outside* the house. As house gundogs their chores include vacuuming 










along with pest control












along with pillow dusting










And in 25 years' experience with them, they ain't necessarily slow to mature, either, but they can live a long time with their exuberant maturity, as in still working 










at what they do best at 12 years old - and with any luck, getting a well-bred Boykin, the end of their work's still a ways off.

MG


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

Crackerd, that is exactly what I mean. I noticed that you left out Chessies and we both know why.

I wouldn't have commented on Boykins unless: 1) I have already seen different "types" 2) I have spoken to Boykin owners 3) I have looked at some websites and 4) I personally know someone who is a nonhunter but greatly interested in showing Boykins.

As for Goldens, I was very careful with my choice. I refused to settle rather than select. I am not picking on Boykins, I am just saying that I believe at one time if you got a Boykin there was no question that it was a working dog. I am not so sure that it will remain that way.

Now let me ask you---Are there two competing registries for Boykins?

And yes, I will keep it coming. If I am casting pearls before swine, well so be it.

Don't forget, I am a Boykin fan.


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## frontier (Nov 3, 2003)

gdgnyc said:


> I just would be careful as to where I got my Boykin from. I get the feeling that a split in the breed may be possible.


 Not substantiated just more rumor... There is already a "split" it's in Boykin type and size which vary significantly even in the same litter and dependent upon the lines... I do agree with you about being many "careful" due to the irresponsible breeding practices of so many involved in this breed though. Boykins can be registered BSS, AKC, and UKC.


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## frontier (Nov 3, 2003)

Bob Mac said:


> Waiing on a Brandwine pup myself. did lot of research. tHEY ARE A GREAT BREED.


 Brandywine is an excellent choice and they also have a focus on health issues..several of their Boykins are OFA excellent in their breeding program and they test for Exercise Induced Collapse (EIC) as well as the other clearances for the breed..


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## fillmoregandt (Mar 27, 2012)

Fellow Boykin owner here in Birmingham. This is my first dog to train, and he's done pretty well. He was really young last summer when I really got after the training (turned 1 in January), but did really well during hunting season and picked up a bunch of ducks and quite a few doves. The light turned up for him and he's been great ever since. I'm hoping to take advantage of some spring training and really get him going.

Great dog though. Small but loves to go. Definitely follow up if you're ever in AL


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

Crackerd and others

Please comment on the Boykin Spaniel Society's position statement:



The Board of Directors of the Boykin Spaniel Society has reviewed and discussed, following input from several members of the BSS, several issues relating to the registration by its members with registration services other than the BSS, including primarily the American Kennel Club - Foundation Stock Service (the Non-BSS Registry). The Board believes that the breeding standards and policies that have been adopted by the Board and the members of the BSS best promote and maintain the attributes and standards of the Boykin Spaniel as improved in each succeeding generation relative to the breed’s hunting ability, interaction within the family and home, and most importantly, the breed’s overall health and that the Boykin Spaniel Registry (the OFFICIAL registry of the Boykin Spaniel) provides the best alternative among registration services. Alternatively, the Board believes that the Non-BSS Registry may encourage, foster or support breeding standards and policies that are inconsistent with the principles and objectives of the BSS (as set forth in its Constitution and Bylaws). In light of the foregoing, the Board recommends to its members against registration with the Non-BSS Registry. Although the Board does not support or condone different or unequal treatment or benefits for BSS members who choose to also be registered with the Non-BSS Registry or any other registration service, the BSS shall continue its proactive stance against registration with the Non-BSS Registry. The Boykin Spaniel Society, The Boykin Spaniel Registry and the Boykin Spaniel Foundation were established first in time and principle to protect and support the breed and the Board and officers and staff of the BSS have worked diligently in the past and will continue to work hard to improve the breed and make sure that the Boykin Spaniel remains the wonderful dog that it is. 


(From the Boykin Spaniel Society's website)


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## Dave Flint (Jan 13, 2009)

The BSS was the original registry for Boykins & they were acutely aware of the inevitable breed split that occurs in practicality every sporting breed registered by the AKC. They hoped to avoid the fate of "bench-bred" versions of their hunting dogs. In the 90s though, a group of Boykin owners who disagreed w/ that position, set themselves up as a "parent club" for the purpose of getting the AKC to recognize their dogs. 

Most of the Boykin owners I know register their dogs w/ both because they want to access the AKC hunt tests but are sympathetic to the concerns of the BSS

My impression is that there has been quite an uptick in interest in the breed since their AKC recognition. I think it's reasonable to be concerned for the future of the breed based on what has happened to so many other sporting breeds


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

That is exactly what I was referring to. My understanding is that there are some very strong feelings re AKC recognition.


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## Dave Flint (Jan 13, 2009)

gdgnyc said:


> That is exactly what I was referring to. My understanding is that there are some very strong feelings re AKC recognition.


The same thing played out with the Border Collie at around the same time. Chronicled very well by Don McCaig
http://www.amazon.com/Dog-Wars-Border-Battled-American/dp/0983484503/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpt_8


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

I really like Boykins and was kind of hoping that it wouldn't happen.


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

Dave Flint said:


> The same thing played out with the Border Collie at around the same time. Chronicled very well by Don McCaig
> http://www.amazon.com/Dog-Wars-Border-Battled-American/dp/0983484503/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpt_8


Looks like a good book. I think I'll read it.


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## 8ptDuck (Jul 27, 2012)

JGorman said:


> Thanks for the welcome Dale, I'm from Columbus, MS, currently living in Starkville MS.


JGorman PM Sent


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## frontier (Nov 3, 2003)

gdgnyc said:


> Crackerd and others
> 
> Please comment on the Boykin Spaniel Society's position statement:
> 
> ...


 There's a whole history here (including lawsuits, etc.) of which I am privy. I register my litters in all three registries, AKC, BSS, and UKC so my clients can participate in whatever venues they choose. BSS had an opportunity to take the lead and be the AKC parent club for the Boykin Spaniel when approached, but took a different direction. So my feeling is some BSS members need to stop the bully tactics, non fact-based propaganda, and criticism of those breeders and owners who choose to register in AKC so their dogs can participate in multiple-purpose AKC events. 

This is nothing new, and goes on in almost every breed seeking or recently recognized by AKC.

And to the OP, Joseph, congrats on your new Boykin pup.


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## crackerd (Feb 21, 2003)

On the whole I agree with Terrie, who's done right by the breed for a long time. I'm biased in thinking, inevitably, that AKC recognition is great for the Boykin if only in offering eligibility in the best retrieving venue (my opinion). But that's not the only benefit. Nor was it the intent of the splinter group that became the official parent club upstaging the Boykin Spaniel Society. However, there's more vigilance and focus now on health issues in the breed by dint of AKC status - and I hope Terrie agrees that Boykins because of it are bred better now than ever.

I'm pro-Boykin Spaniel Society and it's been my registry from the start, as I've not started a pup since the breed went AKC. (The next one will be AKC and who knows? maybe their eligibility will be not just for hunt tests but field trials too.) But it's worth noting that Boykins only got a real breed rescue organization about a decade ago through volunteers' initiative, not from any BSS motivation; until then Boykins sort of struck me, sadly, as the disposable gundog with almost as many discards as the pointer people jettison when their dogs don't "turn out."

I'm not slagging on the BSS, but my perception is Boykins have gotten "healthier" since they went AKC (in part by Boykin puppies now commanding higher prices and breeders aware that without health clearances they won't get those kinds of prices for their pups). And that's a good thing in the end. I really don't see Boykins as a showdog split, even though there is great disparity in appearance (within the same litter, as Terrie noted). The great majority of them are workers even if it's only at bringing back a tennis ball thrown by their 8-9 year old youngster, and I see them following the model of their forebears, the Chessie, into the showring as far secondary to what they do afield. Or tertiary behind what they do afield and what they do on the arm of a sofa as little brown serotonin dispensers - not a more companionable housedog out there.

MG


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## Quackwacker (Aug 16, 2011)

Whats hurting the breed right now is people are finding out what really good all around dogs they are. The largest breeder in the nation doesn't have a single dog at the Boykin Spaniel National Field Trial this weekend. They breeds for $$$$$ only. Boykins and two or three other breeds at the same time.


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## Kona East (Aug 15, 2009)

That is my biggest fear; that people are finding out what great dogs they can be and now the folks are coming out to jump on the latest bandwagon. I experienced this first-hand when someone had two dog bought over the internet and then bred them at two years of age and with no health testing, no proven hunting ability. His telling comment was that the dogs could be sold at a higher price than the Labs. I passed on that guy and several others when I searched for a dog.
I bought my two from a breeder that has been in it for many years, done health testing and hunt tests. His dogs are top ranked titled producers in the HRC and has records of health checks. I truely bought my first dog; just for a pheasant dog; but he is such a great dog I had to get another. We have done AKC hunt tests, HRC hunt tests and the Boykin upland tests. Both of mine are active but are very willingly set at my feet while I chill out at home. 
My older dog is great to have at childrens parties were he delights the kids doing all sorts of tricks for them. When our HRC club had a kids camp I lent him out to a young man to run in the hunt test set up and obedience activites. My younger dog is hopefully my introduction to waterfowl hunting.
My advice to buyers is do your homework, excepect to wait a bit for your pup and when you get that adorable creature, do obedience with and sociallize him or her. They are only small in size not in heart!


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## frontier (Nov 3, 2003)

Quackwacker said:


> Whats hurting the breed right now is people are finding out what really good all around dogs they are. The largest breeder in the nation doesn't have a single dog at the Boykin Spaniel National Field Trial this weekend. They breeds for $$$$$ only. Boykins and two or three other breeds at the same time.


As far as breeding for $$$$$ only, there are many high volume Boykin breeders who register BSS and have been doing that for years and years and do not even test breeding stock for hips at a minimum. Please P.M. with the answer as to who in your opinion is "largest breeder in the Nation". I would guess we are probably equally apalled but for different reasons. My focus being on health issues in the breed, which in my opinion is the biggest issue facing Boykins due to increased popularity and irresponsible breeding practices.


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## Briogirls (Dec 16, 2008)

I have three Boykins..... PM me if you ever get stuck on a training issue


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## crackerd (Feb 21, 2003)

Magnanimous offer. Saw a lot of "Ch"s on your site but not anything with HRC in front of that CH, or much of anything field-related _*after*_ the dogs' names, either - nothing at all with any Boykins. What training issues, exactly, would you help a handler come unstuck on with their Boykins and what program would you use in so doing?

MG


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## fishduck (Jun 5, 2008)

Maybe I was wrong but I didn't read that comment as a knock on the breed. Simply an offer for training advice for a new retriever owner. 

To the original poster. Take a road trip & train with the North Alabama HRC crew. I will introduce you to a gentleman who knows just a little about the breed. His credentials now include another win at the Boykin nationals and he also took 4th this year with his other pup Pelham. Way to go Butch and Stoney!!!


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## gdgnyc (May 4, 2009)

crackerd said:


> Magnanimous offer. Saw a lot of "Ch"s on your site but not anything with HRC in front of that CH, or much of anything field-related _*after*_ the dogs' names, either - nothing at all with any Boykins. What training issues, exactly, would you help a handler come unstuck on with their Boykins and what program would you use in so doing?
> 
> MG



Be fair, Crackerd. Someone offered to help with training.

1) I didn't know that titled parents were required to get a good litter (Poika of Handjem is an OS but had no titles)
2) If you read the poster's credentials as an animal trainer (assuming you're talking about Briogirls), they look OK to me
3) What program are you using that you would recommend? That is far more helpful than sarcasm.
4) I saw HT titles on her curlies. I think she just may walk the walk as well as talk the talk


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## zsimp07 (Jan 6, 2013)

My boykin puppy was just born on the 19th. I'm going to go see her probably next weekend. I'm very excited to bring her home. I'm from the Boykin's home state though. If you want a book for training that's just boykin related, check out just ducky publishing, they have a book with an emphasis on training boykins. Sorry if someone already posted this, I'll admit, I skipped to the end to post that for you.


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