# Banded acquires Avery



## blake_mhoona (Mar 19, 2012)

Don't know if yall saw or not but Banded Holdings has acquired Avery.

http://www.arkansasbusiness.com/article/106369/banded-holdings-acquires-avery-outdoors-of-memphis

I assume this includes their sport dog lineup of products as well.


----------



## fowlminded (Mar 8, 2010)

I think they are going to continue to operate under seperate entities, but banded controls the holdings


----------



## Scott Krueger (Jan 25, 2008)

just trash buying trash...


----------



## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

Choc24/7 said:


> just trash buying trash...


What's wrong with Avery? I love their duck hunting gear, particularly like their various sized kits.


----------



## Dave Kress (Dec 20, 2004)

#3 I take exception to your negative post ! 
While I do believe you are entitled to your opinion and it's that an opinion - I feel exactly the opposite way. 

Avery and their products, service and people have been nothing but supportive of our dog sport. Change occurs in life and I wish them nothing but success and continued prospers growth 
Dk


----------



## Jmoods (Jul 15, 2015)

John Robinson said:


> What's wrong with Avery? I love their duck hunting gear, particularly like their various sized kits.


Keels fall off, paint chips, horrible customer service, know it all pro staffers. Just a few things.


----------



## i_willie12 (Apr 11, 2008)

I think those 2 post above are the only 2 post on the internet in the last 2 years supporting and saying avery is a good brand!!!!! I thought you guys were joking but your clearly not..... There are people out there still to this day waiting on Big order shipments of decoys for more than 2 years Avery is way behind on all shipments, i believe from some of the other post around the web that 1/2 of their front office people and people in customer service were "let go", shows you how well they worked with people As far as there hunting gear goes Jmoods covered it... Cheap plastic, paint has fallen off for years, plastic just cracks if you look at it wrong I pulled some decoys out of the box at cabelas once and the paint was off of almost half of them!


----------



## DOE CREEK FARMS (Apr 13, 2015)

I think the only reason people don't like banded is because of Belding.
Just my opinion.


----------



## Dave Burton (Mar 22, 2006)

All of my diver decoys are GHG bought about 8 or 9 years ago I have several doz and use them a lot. I only had one keel break off and that was probably because it was in the bottom of a huge bag tossed around in the boat for all of those years. Paint is holding up well on them as well. I have no problem with any of the Avery stuff other than I didn't like the Ruff stand and bought a Banded stand and like it a lot better. 




Jmoods said:


> Keels fall off, paint chips, horrible customer service, know it all pro staffers. Just a few things.


----------



## Dave Burton (Mar 22, 2006)

Why would that be ,just curious. I have watched the show a few times and seems ok to me. I usually have no reason to dislike someone unless they do me wrong



DOE CREEK FARMS said:


> I think the only reason people don't like banded is because of Belding.
> Just my opinion.


----------



## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

Never used their decoys; the way we are with dogs, my hunting buddy is with decoys. All of our decoys are hand carved cork by him. He has won quite a few ribbons in decoy carving contest across the country. Avery supplied mucho gifts at the workers party at this years national. I won a kit bag and camo floating shotgun case. Both items seem to be very high quality.


----------



## roseberry (Jun 22, 2010)

in my own business career mergers and aquisistions were a constant. outdoor products are no different than any other products. this is just business.

in 1994 i met avery's founders in a small storefront shop on summer avenue in memphis. i was on the memphis chamber board of directors and stopped by with a chamber staff member who was a former frat brother of the guys at univ miss. at that time they had a "boat blind that was collapsable" and were working on a "floating blind bag". very innovative......at the time. a dozen years later these young men had developed two of the most recognizable brands in waterfowling and outdoor products, "avery" and "greenhead gear". two of my best friends are/were employed at avery. since then, other brands whose products you may actually like were also developed by former staff memebers of avery too.

this is a small business, managed and grown by people, and nobody is perfect. i view avery as a huge success in the world of small business. it may well have been too huge a success in the last few years and founding leadership likely lost it's rudder. i don't know. i do trust banded holdings will sustain the prominence of these brands.

as for dog products, i have been friends with david carrington for over twenty years. we hunted together for fifty plus days a season for over a dozen of those years. while hunting, we discussed his opportunity at avery before he ever took the job. i am proud that in a very short time david created *the* dominant brand in dog gear......out of thin air. david is a good guy and does what he says. his products have served me well and he has supported hunting, hunt tests and field trials beyond what could be expected of a "new startup" company.

i wish avery, david, the memphis staff and banded holdings success.

as for decoy paint, i have shot more duck over bleach jugs than most have shot. paint is overrated!;-)


----------



## Chesapeake (Jun 18, 2015)

I've always liked the hexabumper but, in general, I don't associate Avery with high quality. Never mind that their stock issues are indicative of prioritizing cheapest manufacturing policies (I'd bet that they're putting huge single production runs up for bid) over quality consistency and consistent stock.


----------



## smok'in gun (Mar 31, 2009)

It was nice meeting you John at the NAHRC HT this past weekend, I don't know David personnally but have had contact with him a few times by phone and email and him and his Avery staff are always quick to respond and very helpful. I've used several Avery products over the years and most I liked, some I didn't. I hope they continue to produce the products that I do use and like.

Jeff Warren


----------



## Illini Coot Killr (Feb 21, 2011)

Don't throw David Carrington and the sporting dog side of Avery in with the decoy and duck hunting side of Avery. 

Dog side = Nice
Duck side = Douche


----------



## DoubleHaul (Jul 22, 2008)

Illini Coot Killr said:


> Don't throw David Carrington and the sporting dog side of Avery in with the decoy and duck hunting side of Avery.
> 
> Dog side = Nice
> Duck side = Douche


Thanks for the succinct take  I have never thought that much of Avery, but will say the new bumpers are pretty decent. At least they aren't rocks.


----------



## Terry Marshall (Jan 12, 2011)

Dave Kress said:


> #3 I take exception to your negative post !
> While I do believe you are entitled to your opinion and it's that an opinion - I feel exactly the opposite way.
> 
> Avery and their products, service and people have been nothing but supportive of our dog sport. Change occurs in life and I wish them nothing but success and continued prospers growth
> Dk


I totally agree with Dave, Avery has been the best in support of the Dog World, as has Purina, both of whom I support. If you buy Avery products through some other source but a bona fide retailer like cabela's or lions Cty etc perhaps you are opening yourself up to problems. I don't care what I buy from Cabelas, if I don't like it because it smells funny they will gladly take it back, no questions asked. Let them deal with Avery, why aggrevate yourself for a few $ in savings. I don't use Avery exclusively but I don't have a single issue with the products, especially the 3' bumpers (love them).


----------



## EdA (May 13, 2003)

David Carrington is a class guy, Avery is a big supporter of retriever performance events, if that is not enough for you to be supportive then you should reexamine your loyalties.


----------



## BJGatley (Dec 31, 2011)

Agree ^^^^^^^.


----------



## RF2 (May 6, 2008)

EdA said:


> David Carrington is a class guy, Avery is a big supporter of retriever performance events, if that is not enough for you to be supportive then you should reexamine your loyalties.


Well said.


----------



## mizzippi jb (Jan 22, 2014)

This pretty much sums up Belding.....


----------



## Chesapeake (Jun 18, 2015)

EdA said:


> David Carrington is a class guy, Avery is a big supporter of retriever performance events, if that is not enough for you to be supportive then you should reexamine your loyalties.


I respect your opinion but my buying decisions are based upon quality and value. At best, things like corporate culture or community involvement are tertiary considerations but, in practice, more often than not, it is a time breaker between equal products because such considerations don't improve upon the product's intended purpose.

Lastly, give Judy a big "Go Bruins!" for me.


----------



## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

EdA said:


> David Carrington is a class guy, Avery is a big supporter of retriever performance events, if that is not enough for you to be supportive then you should reexamine your loyalties.


I agree, plus I like their wide variety good quality hunting products. Maybe not so much the decoys.


----------



## BonMallari (Feb 7, 2008)

Chesapeake said:


> I respect your opinion but my buying decisions are based upon quality and value. At best, things like corporate culture or community involvement are tertiary considerations but, in practice, more often than not, it is a time breaker between equal products because such considerations don't improve upon the product's intended purpose.
> 
> *Lastly, give Judy a big "Go Bruins!" for me*.


You might want to brush up on current events in the FT game...the current titleholder of Mrs Aycock belongs to Janet Steiss DVM and she is an AUBURN staffer, so that would be "War Eagle" ;-)


----------



## Lpgar (Mar 31, 2005)

Me thinks that actually Dr. Steiss being a graduate of the University of Guelph in Ontario would make her a Griffin.


----------



## TonyRodgz (Feb 8, 2010)

EdA said:


> David Carrington is a class guy, Avery is a big supporter of retriever performance events, if that is not enough for you to be supportive then you should reexamine your loyalties.


I agree a 100%


----------



## Scott Krueger (Jan 25, 2008)

Dave Kress said:


> #3 I take exception to your negative post !
> While I do believe you are entitled to your opinion and it's that an opinion - I feel exactly the opposite way.
> 
> Avery and their products, service and people have been nothing but supportive of our dog sport. Change occurs in life and I wish them nothing but success and continued prospers growth
> Dk


ok,,,that is your opinion!!!,,,their decoys, blind bags and gun cases are garbage...had had them all and didnt last a season...,,,,their bumpers are decent at best...best product they make are the atb trainers...belding is a true winner...


----------



## Steve Strong (Jan 14, 2013)

Avery's boat parka for my pup is the best for my purposes w/the handles, zipper and flotation. Zipper is a bit of a pain, but my boy can rip out of a velcro only closure. I soap up the zipper to slide better and make a bigger loop to pull w/a zip tie.


----------



## Centerfield Retrievers (Jan 28, 2007)

EdA said:


> David Carrington is a class guy, Avery is a big supporter of retriever performance events, if that is not enough for you to be supportive then you should reexamine your loyalties.


Well said! Until you chair a national fund raiser, you have no idea how short the list is. Our sport is built on the backs of volunteers and the FEW loyal sponsors who support us and our dogs. Gratitude and respect is a small price to ask for that support. 
Thank you David and Avery for stepping up every year for the dogs!


----------



## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

i_willie12 said:


> I think those 2 post above are the only 2 post on the internet in the last 2 years supporting and saying avery is a good brand!!!!! I thought you guys were joking but your clearly not..... There are people out there still to this day waiting on Big order shipments of decoys for more than 2 years Avery is way behind on all shipments, i believe from some of the other post around the web that 1/2 of their front office people and people in customer service were "let go", shows you how well they worked with people As far as there hunting gear goes Jmoods covered it... Cheap plastic, paint has fallen off for years, plastic just cracks if you look at it wrong I pulled some decoys out of the box at cabelas once and the paint was off of almost half of them!


Hey Nathan or Cody,

Please update your username or signature line with your name.

You guys run HRC, right? Maybe you should think about whether David and Avery Sporting dog support your club or your venue before you take more shots at them.

Chris


----------



## Chesapeake (Jun 18, 2015)

Centerfield Retrievers said:


> Gratitude and respect is a small price to ask for that support.
> Thank you David and Avery for stepping up every year for the dogs!


Amen, gratitude and respect for sure. However, I don't care how much they spend on or where they market, I don't believe in brand loyalty without regard to product quality. I wouldn't do it with my kids' food and I wouldn't do it with my dogs' food.


----------



## jollydog (Jul 10, 2006)

I could not agree more with what Dr. Ed had to say.
I personally find the products from Avery top quality and 
use them daily in training. Working with David Carrington 
from Avery is always a good experience and he is loyal to all the 
dog enthusiasts out there. 
They say a picture is worth a 1000 words - here are two retrievers 
fighting to get the Avery Bumper. The well made and improved Avery bumper as 
Avery works hard to give the consumers what they ask for.
They also just improved their EZ Birds to be more what dogs would want to retrieve.
I can tell you in the Texas heat we use them daily. My point is they work hard to manufacture products 
that we, the people who play the dog games and hunt, ask for improvements on.
Also you people who knock them probably don't turn down all the Free stuff they give out at all the events and 
the free seminars they put on across the country.
We don't say Thank you enough to them IMHO so 
Thank you Avery and David Carrington for all you do for us who love to run our dogs and hunt.
The majority do appreciate you, but most of them are not ones who will post on a forum.
Also the few complaining here are ones who probably like to stir the pot and complain.


----------



## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

Wow, I had no idea people were upset with Avery. I'll admit my experience is limited to in-store retail sales, DU banquets and their support, but I remember having to modify army surplus gear along with the occasional Hodgman camo parka. Now I feel spoiled by all the cool options we have in specialized waterfowl gear, it seems like Avery has been a leader in that transition.


----------



## oneshotlu (Mar 12, 2014)

mizzippi jb said:


> This pretty much sums up Belding.....


HAHA!!! Love this! Not sure about Belding as I 've never met him personally, but I hunted with one of the guys on his show a few years back and he thought he was hot sh*t!!


----------



## Charles C. (Nov 5, 2004)

Chesapeake said:


> You should read your own Terms and Conditions for posting on this forum because I don't see a name requirement anywhere. If it is a requirement, I'd suggest changing your terms to reflect that policy and then offer the new terms for a user to either accept or reject. Actions outside the scope of that agreement could be actionable.
> 
> Btw, I haven't done anything but respectfully offer my opinion that brand loyalty based upon event sponsorship (PURINA, Avery, etc) isn't something I'd do.
> 
> Thanks, Chesapeake


Actionable? Are you suggesting he could be sued for doing what he wants with HIS website? He could change your name to Fartmaster or even outright ban you and leave you no recourse. Everyone is a legal expert on the internet.


----------



## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

David Carrington is a class guy. He's also a friend.

Avery has worked very hard to support the retriever games and the retriever people. 

I'd like for David and his colleagues to see how much the true retriever folks appreciate what they've done for our sport.

For those who choose to be outspoken, negative and anonymous, I'd like for Avery to be able to see who those folks are too.

I don't have time to play games folks. This resource is here for the well-being of the retriever community. It is not here to be hateful.

If you want to keep an anonymous handle, please think about the sort of stuff you post on here. 

Chris


----------



## Illini Coot Killr (Feb 21, 2011)

Chris Atkinson said:


> David Carrington is a class guy. He's also a friend.
> 
> Avery has worked very hard to support the retriever games and the retriever people.
> 
> ...


Nobody on here has attacked David Carrington. All including me have been supporting of him. Most (not all) have praised Avery's dog products. I use some of them, bumpers, dog vest and find their performance satisfactory.

It's quite clear folks are talking about their dissatisfaction with Avery's watefowling gear and the customer service or lack thereof. I'm pretty sure you have been able to discern the difference in their comments.

There have been numerous dog food threads on this site bashing one brand or another. Don't recall you requiring anonymous posters identify themselves. Never the less my signature line is now changed.


----------



## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

Thank you for updating your signature line Mark I do appreciate it.


----------



## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

I don't have a lot of Avery gear (hex bumpers, ATB, dog hut, heeling sticks and ruff stand) but I have been well satisfied. I have only had one experience with their customer service and I was pleased.


----------



## Terry Marshall (Jan 12, 2011)

WOW that's all I will say, except to quote a famous Texan "come on man"


----------



## Golddogs (Feb 3, 2004)

EdA said:


> *David Carrington is a class guy, Avery is a big supporter of retriever performance events, if that is not enough for you to be supportive then you should reexamine your loyalties*.


Agree 100 %. And for those who are bitching about the quality, you get what you pay for and most of the GHG is good entry level gear. Want something better, pony up boys.


----------



## Ted Shih (Jan 20, 2003)

Avery has been a huge supporter for the dog games, something I appreciate greatly.
Avery has also supported the Burns, Farmer, Rorem, Trott seminars, something I also appreciate greatly

David Carrington is a class act, who I appreciate greatly
I love the Avery hexabumpers and am in the process of converting over entirely to them.

As for those who are unhappy with your experiences with Avery, I am sorry.

But, I have always believed that if you are going to pee on someone's leg, you ought to at least identify yourself.


----------



## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

I agree with Ted. Man up.


----------



## Charles C. (Nov 5, 2004)

Tom Jefferson said:


> If he had followed through with the *posting of personal information against the will of a poster*, which is a breech of the terms and conditions, a contract between user and website, it would leave him exposed to any financial damages.
> 
> I could tell you stories of how crazy people get about YELP reviews. I know of attorney that was terminated after a partner tried to strongarm them into deleting a negative yelp review after the negatively reviewed company's ceo figured out who it was (the review was too specific), linkedin stalked them, found an investor that was a client of the firm, and had him threaten to end the business relationship. The attorney reviewed was about a personal matter. The company wasn't a client. On and on. They ended up receiving a couple of million dollar settlement, about 5 years of salary and bonuses, after threat of a wrongful termination suit (save your performance reviews).
> 
> ...


No one was forced to do anything against their will. You can either play be the rules (or the requests of its owner) or not play at all. It's so easy a caveman could do it.


----------



## Charles C. (Nov 5, 2004)

Tom Jefferson said:


> "The rules" are literally the terms ans conditions that are agreed upon during the registration process. For example, when facebook decides to change the rules, all users are allowed to accept the new rules and continue usage or reject and terminate usage.
> 
> Here was the threat "Please include your real name in your signature line, or else I can update your username with your real name." and it was made in this or similar form to multiple users.


I'm not going to read the terms and conditions because I have better things to do, but I'm pretty sure something in those terms indicates that the owner/administrator can ban/remove anyone from the forum that he wants.


----------



## BJGatley (Dec 31, 2011)

Tom Jefferson said:


> "The rules" are literally the terms ans conditions that are agreed upon during the registration process. For example, when facebook decides to change the rules, all users are allowed to accept the new rules and continue usage or reject and terminate usage.
> *
> Here was the threat* "Please include your real name in your signature line, or else I can update your username with your real name." and it was made in this or similar form to multiple users.


I believe there is a difference between "please" instead of "you will do" and "you will update" don't you think?


----------



## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

A famous saying, if you can't out your name on it, it's not worth saying. Who said that? Will Rogers? Horace Greely?


----------



## classact2731 (Apr 23, 2011)

Quote Originally Posted by Tom Jefferson View Post
"The rules" are literally the terms ans conditions that are agreed upon during the registration process. For example, when facebook decides to change the rules, all users are allowed to accept the new rules and continue usage or reject and terminate usage.

Here was the threat "Please include your real name in your signature line, or else I can update your username with your real name." and it was made in this or similar form to multiple users.




Funny, because I read that as a choice either put real name on the signature or if they wanted he would change the the user name from a handle to real name as he has done for many many people. I don't think he was threatening to expose anyone secret identity more a if you w3ant to sling mud own it or leave.but I don't assume to speak for him or anyone else.


----------



## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

classact2731 said:


> Quote Originally Posted by Tom Jefferson View Post
> "The rules" are literally the terms ans conditions that are agreed upon during the registration process. For example, when facebook decides to change the rules, all users are allowed to accept the new rules and continue usage or reject and terminate usage.
> 
> Here was the threat "Please include your real name in your signature line, or else I can update your username with your real name." and it was made in this or similar form to multiple users.
> ...


Thanks Scott, I just started a new thread to clarify this.

You understand correctly.

I'm not making anyone keep using this site. 

I'm not making anyone create a new account these days under their real name. 

Some have valid reasons for anonymity. As long as they use the resource without identifying themselves as a risk to the site or to this site's users, they can continue to have the anonymity and the ability to post here.

Once someone shows reason otherwise, I'm going to ask for some accountability.

Thanks, Chris


----------



## Buncoboy (Feb 3, 2015)

blake_mhoona said:


> Don't know if yall saw or not but Banded Holdings has acquired Avery.
> 
> http://www.arkansasbusiness.com/article/106369/banded-holdings-acquires-avery-outdoors-of-memphis
> 
> I assume this includes their sport dog lineup of products as well.


Last year I trained dogs 364 days, had to take one day off to pick up a new pup. I hunted 4 to 7 days a week for 4 months on top of that, and each time I used AVERY products. In those 364 days I never had one problem with their products, and I am extremely hard on all equipment. The dogs also used vest in the cold weather, and I am thankful for the quality of the vest, bird and dog products. Thank you AVERY !


----------



## Gawthorpe (Oct 4, 2007)

Chris:
I located the servers of the of the anonymous posters attached to this thread. All can be explained by this location.


----------



## MooseGooser (May 11, 2003)

THIS!!!


*"It is far easier to spit on the work of others than it is to produce something better yourself."*

And just to be clear, Some here will say outrageous things even when they sign their name to it!!
I have been on the receiving end of this situation also, to the point I asked Chris to let someone else have my banner spot!

I love RTF!!! I am very appreciative of what Chris does here!


----------



## MooseGooser (May 11, 2003)

ANNND The Private message button isnt the answer either.. Some things are better off unsaid!!


----------



## swliszka (Apr 17, 2011)

Play nice and fair should be the "Golden Rule." Understand that what you post here on RTF shows up in the strangest places on the internet- this is a a "public" forum. Just saying...


----------



## smok'in gun (Mar 31, 2009)

I watched Belding's show every week the 1st couple of years and really enjoyed it, but I haven't seen it in awhile now. (trying to wean myself from TV all together) Anyway me and a couple of friends were running the TN River hunt test in Union City about three years ago and staying at a clubhouse at Reelfoot. We were eating at Boyette's and Chad and his crew were there, when they were leaving I spoke to him and he stopped and talked to us for 10 minutes after his people had already left. He was very nice and seemed down to earth, not like his supercharged persona you see on TV. I was so impressed I bought a Banded jacket and have used it 3 years and love it.

Jeff Warren


----------



## Illini Coot Killr (Feb 21, 2011)

MooseGooser said:


> THIS!!!
> 
> 
> *"It is far easier to spit on the work of others than it is to produce something better yourself."*
> ...


Nobody is spiting on Chris or David Carrington of Avery. I appreciate the efforts of both of them on behalf of the sporting dog world. I will continue to purchase some Avery dog traing products. (If they would get with the times and let you buy direct off the internet it might help.) The market place however most decidedly "spit" on Avery and their waterfowl hunting products. From my limited experience with them they earned it fair and square.

In the the last week or so someone was asking about the best bumper to purchase. Some said Avery. Others said they purchased Neuman and Bennets 20 or 30 years ago and were still using them. Several others, me included said times have changed and NB bumpers are not what they used to be. Point is no one got all pissy about that thread, demanded identities.


----------



## quackaholic (Aug 26, 2013)

I think Avery has ran into the same thing a lot of companies dealing with Chinese plastic. The quality is sometimes great, and sometimes ducks. All manufacturers are trying to increase bottom lines. That's a free market society. If you want cheaper or even affordable sometimes, pay for it. 
As far as Belding is concerned...I loved the first season of his show. He explained his set ups, his calling techniques, and it was very informative. But he went the entertainment direction as most shows do. His personality may or may not be what you like or don't like on TV. Turn the channel. I do. 
My Avery gear has been very durable. I have also seen guys identical stuff that wasn't. But I am seeing similar stuff all over.


Michael Melton
[email protected]
(423)620-1465
Just in case I have offended.


----------



## Illini Coot Killr (Feb 21, 2011)

Besides what else am I supossed to do. Training was coming along nicely when my dog ran a staub in his foot. It became infected, two weeks before our first qual. Then Mahoona starts a thread to remind of all my paintless, keelleels decoys and somebody I've never met says I ride the short bus!


----------



## HarryWilliams (Jan 17, 2005)

Hang in there coot season is just around the corner.  HPW


----------



## TroyFeeken (May 30, 2007)

Avery products are largely rebranded from another manufacturer, ie china.

Their new version of hexabumpers are pretty nice now that they're not like throwing rocks. I'm bummed that you can't seem to find their boaters vests for late late season hunting in the white color or even the thin vests in white. Kind of a bummer. Hopefully mine hold up for many more years.

They burned a lot of bridges with retailers in the last 5 years because of requiring them to order a certain volume of product and that included product that didn't work in their area, such as snow goose decoys when that isn't hunted in that stores area. Their decoys themselves are ok, however they did help to spur along all the other manufacturers in their decoy wars. Before it was only a couple brands and now a Mack's catalog is filled with different brands.


----------



## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Illini Coot Killr said:


> Nobody is spiting on Chris or David Carrington of Avery. I appreciate the efforts of both of them on behalf of the sporting dog world. I will continue to purchase some Avery dog traing products. (If they would get with the times and let you buy direct off the internet it might help.) The market place however most decidedly "spit" on Avery and their waterfowl hunting products. From my limited experience with them they earned it fair and square.
> 
> In the the last week or so someone was asking about the best bumper to purchase. Some said Avery. Others said they purchased Neuman and Bennets 20 or 30 years ago and were still using them. Several others, me included said times have changed and NB bumpers are not what they used to be. Point is no one got all pissy about that thread, demanded identities.


Some get it some don't, this is Chris's site so he gets to make and enforce the rules, don't like it start your own site...oh wait someone else did that but now it's gone. &#55357;&#56841;


----------



## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

Illini Coot Killr said:


> Besides what else am I supossed to do. Training was coming along nicely when my dog ran a staub in his foot. It became infected, two weeks before our first qual. Then Mahoona starts a thread to remind of all my paintless, keelleels decoys and somebody I've never met says I ride the short bus!


Mark,

The original request for identity was directed at someone else, not you. You just wandered in and referred to an Avery product as "douche" at an inopportune time, which seemed vulgar to me at the time. So I asked you to join in the addition of real names.

Thanks again for adding your name to your signature line.

Chris Atkinson

P.S. if you can put yourself in the shoes of a guy like David, who has been very strongly promoting the retriever sports, and he's going through a major corporate "shakeup", maybe you can see why folks will ask him to explain why the company provides the economic support that they do. This is someone's career that we're talking about. Someone who has been very, very supportive of us and our venues and games.

When a site like RTF has folks slamming them, it is likely to give David some cause for some explanation. 

The short bus comments were not directed at you, I'm sure of that.

Thanks, Chris


----------



## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

Illini Coot Killr said:


> Nobody is spiting on Chris or David Carrington of Avery. I appreciate the efforts of both of them on behalf of the sporting dog world. I will continue to purchase some Avery dog traing products. (If they would get with the times and let you buy direct off the internet it might help.) The market place however most decidedly "spit" on Avery and their waterfowl hunting products. From my limited experience with them they earned it fair and square.
> 
> In the the last week or so someone was asking about the best bumper to purchase. Some said Avery. Others said they purchased Neuman and Bennets 20 or 30 years ago and were still using them. Several others, me included said times have changed and NB bumpers are not what they used to be. *Point is no one got all pissy about that thread, demanded identities.*


Mark, 

Have you ever been through a corporate takeover or a buy out? Have you ever poured your heart and soul, along with 12 months a year of your life, for several years into one fulltime project and then have it suddenly turn on a dime? 

I hope you have.

If so, please put yourself back in that place, and then compare that to some folks complaining about one product. 

That's the difference.

I have no idea how many times Neuman and Bennetts folks have spent thousands of dollars and weeks of their personal time attending National Retriever events. (I'm guessing zero) I doubt that many folks on this board have spent time working events with an N&B employee. I doubt many folks can name an N&B employee off the top of their head. ( I know I can't)

David is part of our community, and works pretty darn hard to keep the Avery Sporting Dog Brand involved in supporting what we do.

If you have trouble seeing that and appreciating it, maybe it's time to look from a different perspective. 

There is no comparison between the two situations. 

Chris


----------



## Clint Watts (Jan 7, 2009)

Illini Coot Killr said:


> Besides what else am I supossed to do. Training was coming along nicely when my dog ran a staub in his foot. It became infected, two weeks before our first qual. Then Mahoona starts a thread to remind of all my paintless, keelleels decoys and somebody I've never met says I ride the short bus!


Not sure if you were trying to be funny, but that right there is funny. Regards from a fellow short bus rider.


----------



## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

Chris Atkinson said:


> Mark,
> 
> Have you ever been through a corporate takeover or a buy out? Have you ever poured your heart and soul, along with 12 months a year of your life, for several years into one fulltime project and then have it suddenly turn on a dime?
> 
> ...


I have a retriever buddy who lives in Klammath Falls and was very involved with the last National that was held there. He approached Neuman and Bennetts about supporting the National in some way or at least making their presence known. Most of us who have been in the game for any amount of time remember when N&B bumpers where not only the only show in town, but the quality of their product was the best as was their customer service. My buddy was shocked at how uninterested in the National they were. They either didn't recognize the tremendous opportunity that had with over a hundred of the best dog people right in their backyard, or they just couldn't care less. Very disappointing. 

Regarding Avery I had no idea of all the drama, I am pretty detached, but this thread has filled me in and I hope for the best for them. I sure appreciate how virtually everyone who attended the workers party got some cool Avery gear, that was very nice on their part. Yes, my loyalty can be bought.


----------



## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

Illini Coot Killr said:


> Besides what else am I supossed to do. Training was coming along nicely when my dog ran a staub in his foot. It became infected, two weeks before our first qual. Then Mahoona starts a thread to remind of all my paintless, keelleels decoys and somebody I've never met says I ride the short bus!


Sorry about your dog's foot, at least you still have your sense of humor.


----------



## David Lo Buono (Apr 6, 2005)

Avery and High quality in the same sentence....That's funny


----------



## David Lo Buono (Apr 6, 2005)

Chris Atkinson said:


> Thanks Scott, I just started a new thread to clarify this.
> 
> You understand correctly.
> 
> ...



I've noticed the Lack of "real name" usage over the better part of a year now... I'm just curious what's the deal Chris? A few years ago their was the big "renaissance" on RTF ...The rebirth of each member who cast aside his/her handle....They even used to get their own special born again thread welcoming them back....


----------



## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

http://www.retrievertraining.net/fo...Name-Change-Push!/page9&highlight=change+push

David. 

The this is what you reference. It is still in full force. 

Please call me. I sent my phone number.


----------



## David Lo Buono (Apr 6, 2005)

Chris Atkinson said:


> http://www.retrievertraining.net/fo...Name-Change-Push!/page9&highlight=change+push
> 
> David.
> 
> ...


 I'm not going to get yelled at again am I??? Once I put the termites to bed I'll give you a ring....


----------



## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

David Lo Buono said:


> I'm not going to get yelled at again am I??? Once I put the termites to bed I'll give you a ring....


No obligation. But I have much more detail that I can share if you really want some answers. 

I don't think I've spoken with you for a dozen years or so!


----------



## Raymond Little (Aug 2, 2006)

Let's put this bull $&it to bed guys. The resource is here for us to use not bash and trash people who give back to our sport. If you don't want to adhere to the rules do like peewee Herman and beat it. CA is as good as they get when it comes to guys I would want next to me in an alley fight. If he asked me to tone it down (he has), I would thoughtfully comply. S$[++^? in the bed you sleep in is stupid, so think about where you plan to sleep.

Go Benson Regards


----------



## Todd Caswell (Jun 24, 2008)

Not Sure I have any decoys the paint hasn't chipped off of, or basses that have not broke.. But I'm thank full that when I call or email for donations or support for an event no matter what the venue I get SUPPORT from the Avery bunch, can't say I get that from any other company,...


----------



## roseberry (Jun 22, 2010)

my duck guns have no finish/blueing. they rust.
my duck boat is beaten to hell, its engine has no skeg, its blind is bent but functional, its trailer has no lights.
my stationary blinds are "weathered in" (rotting and in need of repair)
my duck straps are stretched and strained beyond their capacity!

when someone says, "my decoys have chipped paint!", i figure they also complain to other manufacturers for making their condoms too large!;-)


----------



## JusticeDog (Jul 3, 2003)

I guess there are different ways to look at everything. Avery does do a great job ay supporting retriever events, and it's much appreciated. But, companies also understand that not everything is perfect. And sometime they use honest feedback to improve their products. Now certainly, there are some internet cowboys that aren't exactly presenting that feedback in a constructive manner, but these days, the power of social media can be quite persuasive. 

And providing feedback doesn't mean you have to be at odds. I had a great conversation with the Purina folks about Dr. Tim's. A couple of dogs at the NARC were feeding it, and they wanted to know more about it. Purina knows that I cannot feed it to FC AFC ruckus, but they are also well aware that FC HONOR, who is now 13 1/2, has been eating Purina pro plan for all of his life. They know how much I appreciate their support.


----------



## BJGatley (Dec 31, 2011)

roseberry said:


> my duck guns have no finish/blueing. they rust.
> my duck boat is beaten to hell, its engine has no skeg, its blind is bent but functional, its trailer has no lights.
> my stationary blinds are "weathered in" (rotting and in need of repair)
> my duck straps are stretched and strained beyond their capacity!
> ...


ROFLMAO...Bout had a heart attack on that one.  The sad thing is your are right. There are those who will never be contend and will run their life that way.


----------



## Illini Coot Killr (Feb 21, 2011)

"Mark, 

Have you ever been through a corporate takeover or a buy out? Have you ever poured your heart and soul, along with 12 months a year of your life, for several years into one fulltime project and then have it suddenly turn on a dime? "

Not a corporate takeover but I did spend nearly 28 years with Illinios DNR. Busted my bum on that job but loved it and moved along the career ladder nicely. However, the last 6 were with Rod Blagojevich as Governor. Talk about turning on a dime! I tell people I had a great career for 22 years and a job for the last 6. So if the situations are somewhat comparabale I do understand.


----------



## Illini Coot Killr (Feb 21, 2011)

Clint Watts said:


> Not sure if you were trying to be funny, but that right there is funny. Regards from a fellow short bus rider.


Only in regards to the short bus.


----------



## Brad B (Apr 29, 2004)

I've had zero problems with any Avery/GHG and I run about 80-90 doz. decoys in a commercial operation for about the last 4 years That includes dekes, vests, stands, bags, you name it. No failures is pretty good in my book. I called David C. once and he's never met me at all but he treated me like an old friend and took the time to answer my questions and get me what I needed despite him trying to work his way through a busy airport to pick up someone. Sounds like a pretty good guy in my book. I've had nothing but good service from Avery and have had no issue ordering dog products direct from their website.
Thanks to Avery for your support in our sport and I hope they don't let the merger alter their good track record or product line.


----------



## Dwayne Padgett (Apr 12, 2009)

There's not a decoy company out there that hasn't gone thru paint problems on decoys. I know of two, other then Avery, that have been down that road in the last 3 years. Look around the forums and everyone's waders leak, everyone's raingear leaks. Every company has happy customers and every company have unhappy customers.


----------



## moduckin (Nov 2, 2004)

At least we have the "short bus" post to take away from all this!


----------



## Migillicutty (Jan 11, 2014)

roseberry said:


> my duck guns have no finish/blueing. they rust.
> my duck boat is beaten to hell, its engine has no skeg, its blind is bent but functional, its trailer has no lights.
> my stationary blinds are "weathered in" (rotting and in need of repair)
> my duck straps are stretched and strained beyond their capacity!
> ...


haha I can't stop laughing. You win the Internet!


----------



## Steve Thornton (Oct 11, 2012)

I hunted many a day in my buddy's boat with an Avery blind and its held up well, love the bumpers they make, as for decoys, yes the paint chips some, touch em up or pay double the price for those made in OK that don't. I have an Avery Sporting dog hat that I got in a gift bag for working a hunt test and its a great hat. Nice looking and fully lined. 

So so the point is this: We all have opinions on just about everything and the anonymity of the Internet persuades some to be less civil than they might or might not be in person. If someone is rude to me, especially on more than one occasion, I will not associate with that person as I greatly value civility, courtesy and consideration. I believe those who post here and the companies like Avery have the same right to not associate with anyone they choose. We can't do that if people hide behind anonymity. 

As as for this forum: I'm green as grass when it comes to dog training. On my first dog, a Chessie, and have been training only for year. From this venue I have gleaned some very key nuggets of information that have helped me immensely. We will likely title in Senior Hunter this year and its no exaggeration that we probably could not have made it this far except for some of the info I found here. 

Chris A. Many thanks for this forum and your diligence in keeping it a valuable resource as opposed to what it could be. 

steve


----------



## waterdog711 (Jan 18, 2011)

I have handled a few Avery products over the last 25 years and spent the majority of the hot summers here with an Avery visor shielding my face on hot days.

Can't dispute anyone else's experience, but suffice it to say I am a fan of Avery and always appreciate seeing their banners at events. 

The larger issue here (in my opinion) is maintaining the civility and common purpose all the users bring to this forum. 

I have practiced law 40-60 hours a week for the last 26 years. This site and spending time with my training friends is my safe haven - _the antithesis of dealing with lawyers all day, every day_. 

I support Chris and everyone else that wants to keep the conversation going and give everyone their say - as long as it remains civil...

Thomas McGrath


----------



## blind ambition (Oct 8, 2006)

Our club is hosting the Canadian National Master Hunt Test, and I can tell you that although we are a relatively small event in an equally small market, Avery has stepped up in a very generous way and their donation of equipment and raffle items will be crucial to the success of this event. For anyone who loves field work, please support those companies who support you.


----------



## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

EdA said:


> David Carrington is a class guy, Avery is a big supporter of retriever performance events, if that is not enough for you to be supportive then you should reexamine your loyalties.


Spot on Ed.


----------



## Sleepyg (Nov 13, 2007)

Avery Sporting Dog/David Carrington have sponsored my home club every time I asked for help. 
I have attended at least a half dozen Avery sponsored seminars.
W/o the Avery support my home club would not be as strong as it currently is.
Thank you Avery/David Carrington for making my dog training hobby easier for us amateurs!


----------



## Hunt'EmUp (Sep 30, 2010)

IMO for what it's worth, Banded a newer company has come out with a lot of new products for what we do; some are good others not tested; but they are trying new products and new ideas. Avery an Older company, seems to have fallen in to the old companies approach of cut your line as much as possible and sell only the staples (tried and true) stuff; little newer stuff. and often times the older stuff is impossible to find unless you order manufacture direct, even then. Ex; I have a 7yr. Avery kennel pad that I picked up at Cabela's it has lasted well; but I can't find that pad anymore (only Mud-river pads; I've bought 2 of them they don't hold up). Now I can go online and order the Pad, pay shipping and all that, but even doing it that way it's only offered in one size, and I've down graded to smaller kennel, so it might or might not fit, which I could only find out after it's shipped. However, Now I'm seeing Banded gear showing up in stores I frequent, if they took over avery, mayhaps I'll see more of their gear in stores I frequent and not have to go about ordering stuff I can't put my hands on. Avery also has the history and good will of supporting the sport, which might aid banded in breaking into the industry. The merger might help out both companies, and most importantly make things easier for me . If it doesn't whelp leaves an opening for a another company that can do those things; got to love capitalism.


----------

