# The National - Tuesday



## jeff t. (Jul 24, 2003)

With the weather and current rate of progress, I wonder how many of the series this week will be split tests.


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## K G (Feb 11, 2003)

I would bet most of them will be split until later in the week or at least until after the next blind series is run.

Seems like I read somewhere that their fourth series will have water in it, which means it won't finish today....more than likely, depending on today's 2nd/3rd series callbacks and the amount of time it takes to do the fourth series test, it'll take the majority of the day Wednesday. That circumstance may increase the toll taken by the combined 2nd/3rd series finishing today......the BIG cut probably won't come until after the 4th, or at best after the 5th.

I'm sure their mechanics will be honed to a fine point which will help tremendously....kudos in advance to the workers! ;-)

kg


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## jeff t. (Jul 24, 2003)

Gwen Jones said:


> Where did we get to in the rotation before the trial shut down last night? Who is first starting dog today and what time were they to get started? I am confused by which thread to read to keep up with the dog work.


They started with #82 at 7:04 a.m.

http://08nrc.blogspot.com/2008/11/off-and-running.html


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## Karen McCullah (Feb 28, 2007)

K G said:


> I'm sure their mechanics will be honed to a fine point which will help tremendously....kudos in advance to the workers! ;-)
> 
> kg


Yes, huge thanks to all the workers who put on the National, especially those gunners/throwers/blind planters who are sitting out in the rain while they try to run dogs.


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## david gibson (Nov 5, 2008)

Wiredlabz said:


> Yes, huge thanks to all the workers who put on the National, especially those gunners/throwers/blind planters who are sitting out in the rain while they try to run dogs.


is parking becoming an issue? i would imagine with all this rain that the parking lot field could get very soggy....best to bring the 4x4 probably?


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## windigo (Sep 25, 2008)

Hey, Howard!! Welcome to Texas and the National. Just watched your blinds. Great job! See you Saturday.

Patsy


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

no chance to catch up until Thursday, 70% chance of thunderstorms today, still 17 dogs to run here which means a late morning start for the 4th, anticipated 15+/- drops here


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## Shayne Mehringer (Jan 3, 2003)

surfgeoD300 said:


> is parking becoming an issue? i would imagine with all this rain that the parking lot field could get very soggy....best to bring the 4x4 probably?


There are great roads at Kammerer's... just stay out from under the drip lines and everything should be ok.

SM


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## K G (Feb 11, 2003)

Shayne Mehringer said:


> There are great roads at Kammerer's... *just stay out from under the drip lines* and everything should be ok.
> 
> SM


Wasn't that Ken's sig line for a LONG time?  

There's a great story behind that one regards,

kg


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

thanks to Hurricane Ike there are many fewer drip lines


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## david gibson (Nov 5, 2008)

latest radar looking awfully threatening for late morning into the afternoon.....


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## Karen McCullah (Feb 28, 2007)

ok, city girl talkin' here...what the heck is a "drip line"...or do I even wanna know?


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Wiredlabz said:


> ok, city girl talkin' here...what the heck is a "drip line"...or do I even wanna know?


the drip line of a tree is the imaginary line on the ground which approximates the outer limbs therefore defining the zone of tree root structure, Post Oak trees are VERY unforgiving of human intrusion and parking anything heavy under the drip line can potentially damage or kill the tree


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

"We" created a thread for just callbacks/updates on the dogs....I'll update it as soon as we get the callbacks - note there were 2 handles I missed from the 1st series - #79 and 84, I'll update it when I do the update for the callbacks to the 4th.

FOM


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## Russ (Jan 3, 2003)

The call backs have been announced, but I only have one


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

Posted on Vicki's blog.....
dropped 1,5,12,14,17,18,30,40,52,98,101,103


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## Bud Bass (Dec 22, 2007)

The call back summary on WRC is way behind, is anybody surpose to be keeping it updated on a regular basis? Bud

http://www.working-retriever.com/08nrc/summary.htm


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

11 dogs dropped: 1, 5, 12, 14, 17, 18, 30, 40, 52, 101 and 103

Will update the list in a few minutes...

Note, this was editted, mistake on the callbacks, 98 is back, it was announced at the National (see Vicki's blog)


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## MKaty Gutermuth (Aug 17, 2004)

Real bad storms in the area.. Katie


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Looks like they are post poned - test dog did run.....


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## Karen McCullah (Feb 28, 2007)

EdA said:


> the drip line of a tree is the imaginary line on the ground which approximates the outer limbs therefore defining the zone of tree root structure, Post Oak trees are VERY unforgiving of human intrusion and parking anything heavy under the drip line can potentially damage or kill the tree


Ah, got it, thanks! 

My pops was scheduled to shoot today...I don't like imagining him out there in the pouring rain with lightning and a gun!

Although I love that kind of weather. Wish I coulda gone!


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## AmiableLabs (Jan 14, 2003)

I just got an email from Ann Heise --

_We have very bad weather here now. . . .The rain is thick and we have lightening, heard 4-8 inches 
in Houston predicted and that will come our way--it has arrived.

It's still pouring so hard and I am parked backways and cannot see the line from here._


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## Arturo (Jan 10, 2004)

There is a line of thunderstorms right over Montgomery Tx. They form a line from southwest to northeast and they are moving northeast. It looks like Redbird Meadows Ranch is going to be in the middle of it for a while. The map shows RED right over the trial grounds. If it turns to purple .... you all gonna die. JUST KIDDING!
I am 30 miles due south of Montgomery and I am starting to see more blue sky and sunshine. I'll send it your way.


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## JS (Oct 27, 2003)

EdA said:


> the drip line of a tree is the imaginary line on the ground which approximates the outer limbs therefore defining the zone of tree root structure, Post Oak trees are VERY unforgiving of human intrusion and parking anything heavy under the drip line can potentially damage or kill the tree


and I would love to go along the next time you go snipe hunting. Pulease.

Call me skeptical regards. 

JS


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

I updated the callbacks list - if I made a mistake please let me know. I made the "assumption" they would stick to the annouced rotation even with a combinded series - someone correct me if I was wrong in that assumption.....

FOM

Edit - first correction - 98 should of been called back (see Vicki's blog)


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## Arturo (Jan 10, 2004)

EdA said:


> the drip line of a tree is the imaginary line on the ground which approximates the outer limbs therefore defining the zone of tree root structure, Post Oak trees are VERY unforgiving of human intrusion and parking anything heavy under the drip line can potentially damage or kill the tree


I'm with JS here. I only know of one person that believes that. It could be two people if you believe it Ed. I did notice you said potentially!
Of course that one guy owns the trees so ...... case closed!


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## AmiableLabs (Jan 14, 2003)

RE: post oak trees

From THIS WEBPAGE --

_Three things that post oaks don't like and may not survive are:
1. Standing in water
2. Trying to grow in shade
*3. Having their roots disturbed or their soil compacted.*

If you want a post oak in your yard, you'll probably have to plant it yourself. The acorns germinate in the fall, so look for them right now and plant them soon.

If you're building in an area where there are already post oak trees, *don't drive on the ground under them. The best way to protect them during construction is to install a fence that encompasses the entire area beneath their canopy.*_


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

When is the workers party? Wednesday evening, right?

The weather isn't helping with time management.....has there been any other National recently that was hit harsh by weather like this one?

FOM


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

the first dog (#41) just ran & handled on the long retired


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## Arturo (Jan 10, 2004)

AmiableLabs said:


> RE: post oak trees
> 
> From THIS WEBPAGE --
> 
> ...


Yea but ..... all that stuff was written by a tree person. Do you really believe that? O.K. maybe I know 4 people that believe it now ..... me included! Cause I believe everything I read on the innernet! UhOh I see the trail started up again. No more bs postin' here fore me. Montgomery is right on the back edge of the red line of thunderstorms. Should be clearing up soon .... but more coming ..... it will be hit or miss!


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## david gibson (Nov 5, 2008)

AmiableLabs said:


> RE: post oak trees
> 
> From THIS WEBPAGE --
> 
> ...



ok, let me get this straight - yesterday i created a storm of controversy and total pandelerium by posting questions/comments about rules and strategies _*directly related to the actual series being run at the time.*_

yet i was chastised and castrated for breaching the etiquette and disturbing the harmonious sanctimony of only posting dry facts about call backs.

and you guys get away with talking about trees???? _trees???_

and there are those that say conspiracies and favoritism dont exist in retriever trial worlds.....:lol:


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

surf,

Yup. 

Don't worry about it.....post away....

FOM


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## Ted Shih (Jan 20, 2003)

Just spoke with Mark Rosenblum, who tells me that it is still raining like a SOB, but that it is lightening up

Chester Mooring is throwing the long bird, Marty Fluke the short retired bird, and John Caire is throwing the flyer. 

Dog 47 is on the line.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Approximately half an hour to run 6-7 dogs.....must be a quick test. What are the odds with the weather being like it is, that they will finish the test?


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## david gibson (Nov 5, 2008)

FOM said:


> Approximately half an hour to run 6-7 dogs.....must be a quick test. What are the odds with the weather being like it is, that they will finish the test?


what is the series being run today? i haven't seen a description yet....


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## Ted Shih (Jan 20, 2003)

I don't think that they finish today.


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## SteelGirl_1187 (Sep 28, 2005)

Surf, check out Vicki Lamb's blog on WRC for a good description of the test. She said the birds are hitting land and splashing.

Thanks for all the updates, Lainee!!! 

I heard the lines between the long middle bird and the sr are very tight. . . .


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## Buzz (Apr 27, 2005)

Ted Shih said:


> Just spoke with Mark Rosenblum, who tells me that it is still raining like a SOB, but that it is lightening up
> 
> Chester Mooring is throwing the long bird, Marty Fluke the short retired bird, and John Caire is throwing the flyer.
> 
> Dog 47 is on the line.


At least it's not rainy AND cold like it was in St. Louis a couple years ago. Hope everything dries out for the weekend!


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## JS (Oct 27, 2003)

surfgeoD300 said:


> ok, let me get this straight - yesterday i created a storm of controversy and total pandelerium by posting questions/comments about rules and strategies _*directly related to the actual series being run at the time.*_
> 
> yet i was chastised and castrated for breaching the etiquette and disturbing the harmonious sanctimony of only posting dry facts about call backs.


Well, that's cause are worried about what these guys think of you! :razz: :razz: :razz:
Hang around for a while and you will figure out everyone's little pet peeves.



> and there are those that say conspiracies and favoritism dont exist in retriever trial worlds.....:lol:


Who in the world told you THAT???? 

JS


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## JS (Oct 27, 2003)

SteelGirl_1187 said:


> I heard the lines between the long middle bird and the sr are very tight. . . .


Sounds like a true hip pocket according to the blog.

JS


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## AmiableLabs (Jan 14, 2003)

Surf,

You can post off-topic remarks, but if it is done in such a way that it does not drive an off-topic conversation it won't jack the thread. As you can see the tree discussion sort of died -- everyone got their say, no hard follow-ups, thread not jacked.

So feel free to say stuff off-topic! But if you want to start an off-topic conversation, best to start a new thread.

That is my say on the matter, I am done, I don't want to threadjack.


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## Ted Shih (Jan 20, 2003)

If I understood Mark correctly, there is cigar shaped water between the short retired and long retired marks.

A dog having recovered the short retired mark, might flare that mark.
A dog having recovered the short retired mark, might also flare the water

A dog having done either or both of the above could easily find itself setting up a big hunt in "idiot flats."

One other thing to think about ..
I believe that having a splash coincide with the fall of a mark, makes the mark more memorable to the dog

Ted


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## Arturo (Jan 10, 2004)

According to my weather map it looks like the lightning and thunder should return to Montgomery in about 5 minutes or less! It shouldn't last as long this time!


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

We have two known handles right now: 41 and 49....53 is at the line (from Vicki's blog)


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## david gibson (Nov 5, 2008)

AmiableLabs said:


> Surf,
> 
> You can post off-topic remarks, but if it is done in such a way that it does not drive an off-topic conversation it won't jack the thread. As you can see the tree discussion sort of died -- everyone got their say, no hard follow-ups, thread not jacked.
> 
> ...


dude i am not really confused, i was just making light of the matter...

how many series total are there? maybe its too early, but is there a chance it will end on Friday, or is it definite that the finals will be saturday???


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## DeWitt Boice (Aug 26, 2005)

photos up on WRC
http://www.working-retriever.com/08nrc/tues.html


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## Steve (Jan 4, 2003)

Buzz said:


> At least it's not rainy AND cold like it was in St. Louis a couple years ago. Hope everything dries out for the weekend!


Were you there. That Wednesday was the worst combo of rain and cold that I ever experienced. I was throwing one of the retired on the series they scrapped and got out of the field before the rain arrived.


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## cakaiser (Jul 12, 2007)

Haven't read the whole thing, but are the hen pheasants "splashing" too?
How well do wet pheasants hold up?
And how would that affect scent?
Will they be "dry" later?
Just asking,

Don't imagine any were too thrilled to run in the rain, either.

Luck of the draw....... right place, right time.


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## Tatyana (Nov 6, 2007)

#61 and #64 handled according to Vicki's blog.


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## duke7581 (Jan 17, 2008)

If someone gets a chance to see dog 59 run and give an update would love to hear it thanks.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

cakaiser said:


> Haven't read the whole thing, but are the hen pheasants "splashing" too?
> How well do wet pheasants hold up?
> And how would that affect scent?
> Will they be "dry" later?
> ...


If you look at the picture on Vicki's blog there is water every where! I'm sure all birds were splashing....


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

61 handled. 64 picked up. 65 did it with a hunt


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

word from gallery they will quit for the day possibly early 80's


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## zipmarc (Jan 23, 2006)

How about Dog #75?


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

zipmarc said:


> How about Dog #75?


My guess is as long as it is taking per dog, they have not gotten to #75 yet......


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

Yakkity just nailed it...she's clean thru 4th


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## JusticeDog (Jul 3, 2003)

email from the national.... identity not disclosed to protect a "mole."

We started up again around 12:35. It is not raining at all right now. 
> 
>Error on my email. Starting number for land triple is 40, not 66. Hope it doesn't rain anymore today. 
> 
>Actually, it's been pretty good. It rained yesterday for a couple of dogs, Today it didn't start to pour until we were ready to start land. So we finished the blinds in good shape, and halted until rain passed. 
> 
>So far I don't feel as if any dogs have been unfairly treated due to running in the rain. Rain is to move through by sometime on Thurs. So, if today is Tues. we only have 2 1/2 more days of rain....whoopeeee!


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

gun change and jane Patopea with merlyn are in 1st blind


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

Merlyn had big hunt, no word on #50 yet (that's for Roger)


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## zipmarc (Jan 23, 2006)

Kim - Thanks for the updates, much appreciated!


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

I have a friend in the gallery texting me


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

JKL said:


> I have a friend in the gallery texting me


Sweet....be careful, you'll be accused of being a mole


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## jeff t. (Jul 24, 2003)

JKL said:


> Merlyn had big hunt, no word on #50 yet (that's for Roger)


The blog is reporting #75 as a pick up

http://08nrc.blogspot.com/2008/11/unfortunately-another-help-pickup.html


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

FOM said:


> Sweet....be careful, you'll be accused of being a mole


I could keep it to myself!


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

JKL said:


> I could keep it to myself!


NOOOOOOO!!! Mole away, please!!!!


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

Report is Auggie did the test.


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## Karen McCullah (Feb 28, 2007)

jeff t. said:


> The blog is reporting #75 as a pick up
> 
> http://08nrc.blogspot.com/2008/11/unfortunately-another-help-pickup.html


oh no! 

I really wanted Jane and Merlyn to do well...bummer.


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

Wiredlabz said:


> oh no!
> 
> I really wanted Jane and Merlyn to do well...bummer.


Its just pretty special he was able to run. Merlyn broke a bone in his foot and has been benched for the last few weeks prior to the Natl. I saw him 2 weeks prior to the Natl and he had a splint on his foot.
They didnt know until days before if he would be able to run. Merlyn was running with very little to almost no pre-national training.


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## Guest (Nov 11, 2008)

Kim thank you so much for the updates


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## Karen McCullah (Feb 28, 2007)

JKL said:


> Its just pretty special he was able to run. Merlyn broke a bone in his foot and has been benched for the last few weeks prior to the Natl. I saw him 2 weeks prior to the Natl and he had a splint on his foot.
> They didnt know until days before if he would be able to run. Merlyn was running with very little to almost no pre-national training.


ooh, I didn't know that. I just wanted them to do well after Fargo's passing. I have a Fargo son and he's just such a love, as I'm sure his sire was and Merlyn is, and I've met Jane and she's so sweet.


It's tough when dogs and handlers you like starting dropping! This is the time though, around 4th and 5th when it starts getting serious and the black gloves come off! The judges' gloves I mean, haha! ;-)


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## lablover (Dec 17, 2003)

akblackdawg said:


> The call back summary on WRC is way behind, is anybody surpose to be keeping it updated on a regular basis? Bud
> http://www.working-retriever.com/08nrc/summary.htm


Is anyone NOT surprized about that? 
It's been that way for the last couple of years.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Also anyone note they have dogs listed as going out in the 3rd and then a single one as 2nd? Goofy....

FOM


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## Karen McCullah (Feb 28, 2007)

I noticed that and was wondering if the handler decided not to run the second blind? Or was the short one hacky so the judges said forget it to save time?


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

FOM said:


> Also anyone note they have dogs listed as going out in the 3rd and then a single one as 2nd? Goofy....
> 
> FOM


Maybe he failed the short blind.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Maybe.....


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

The video yesterday showed that dog doing a decent job in the 1st series. He must have failed, possibly picked up on the short blind.


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## zipmarc (Jan 23, 2006)

The best reporting is right here on RTF! And if Paul would just get Google Earth going so we could have topographic diagrams of the tests, we'll really be in Fat City.....


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## Arturo (Jan 10, 2004)

There is another round of thunderstorms bearing down on Montgomery. I hope those post oaks don't get to much water under the drip line!


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## Lady Duck Hunter (Jan 9, 2003)

Ted Shih said:


> Just spoke with Mark Rosenblum, who tells me that it is still raining like a SOB, but that it is lightening up
> 
> Chester Mooring is throwing the long bird, Marty Fluke the short retired bird, and John Caire is throwing the flyer.
> 
> Dog 47 is on the line.


It is funny seeing the posting times on some of these posts and thinking about where I was while all this was happening. 

I remember that Mark was on the phone, sitting in my chair back by the bird racks about this time. I was working the line with the birds and toting the birds back to the rack. I needed my rain coat because the 2nd wave of rain was about to hit and he was sitting on it. I hope I wasn't too rude when I first asked and then sort of moved him off my coat.

I'm scheduled again Thursday and Saturday, Going to go to the worker's party all cleaned up and dry....nobody will recognize me.


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## Udder Brudder (Jan 15, 2003)

Also anyone note they have dogs listed as going out in the 3rd and then a single one as 2nd? Goofy....

FOM


Luke NoGo'ed on that blind. That is what was told to me....UB


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Udder Brudder said:


> Also anyone note they have dogs listed as going out in the 3rd and then a single one as 2nd? Goofy....
> 
> FOM
> 
> ...


Now that makes sense.....


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## Lady Duck Hunter (Jan 9, 2003)

After the big rain that delayed the start of the 4th series. The judges decided to change the Pheasant hen on that #2 bird to a duck hen. So this was not a mixed bag, they were all ducks.

And bird #2 landed further right from the gunners than the photo showed, making the long retired and the short retired more of an inline.

Just wanted to post that info, if it matters to anyone.


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## cakaiser (Jul 12, 2007)

Lady Duck Hunter said:


> After the big rain that delayed the start of the 4th series. The judges decided to change the Pheasant hen on that #2 bird to a duck hen. So this was not a mixed bag, they were all ducks.
> 
> Just wanted to post that info, if it matters to anyone.


I think the judges did a good thing.


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## Lady Duck Hunter (Jan 9, 2003)

Definately. They are doing a great job dealing with the elements.


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## Bud Bass (Dec 22, 2007)

I am happy to see that Jack and Angel are still clean and hope that Howard and Bam will remain clean after running the 4th tomorrow. Bud


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## kiddcline (Nov 26, 2007)

FOM said:


> Note, this was editted, mistake on the callbacks, 98 is back, it was announced at the National (see Vicki's blog)


It's not good tease.


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## budsdad (Jan 28, 2008)

Lady Duck Hunter said:


> After the big rain that delayed the start of the 4th series. The judges decided to change the Pheasant hen on that #2 bird to a duck hen. So this was not a mixed bag, they were all ducks.
> 
> And bird #2 landed further right from the gunners than the photo showed, making the long retired and the short retired more of an inline.
> 
> Just wanted to post that info, if it matters to anyone.


They changed to ducks; they were a mixed bag of hens and drakes.


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## Shayne Mehringer (Jan 3, 2003)

JKL said:


> I have a friend in the gallery texting me


Your cheating on me??? I'm jealous!!! Just wait til i get back to Montgomery tonight... imma blow your phone up from the gallery tomorrow! Picture mail too. 

SM


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## Lady Duck Hunter (Jan 9, 2003)

budsdad said:


> They changed to ducks; they were a mixed bag of hens and drakes.


I stand corrected by the one who was throwing them....When I was receiving the ducks, only 2 drakes had come in from being shot flyers, so I what I saw was duck hens being used at that station, my mistake.


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## Lady Duck Hunter (Jan 9, 2003)

Vicki's Blog talkes about the ducks today.

I saw one Drake flyer land belly up on the road...that was a "pay $10 to the bird boys retirement fundbird" if I ever saw one...but it was the flyer which didn't seem to give anyone much trouble any way.

Say, when are you working again?


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## budsdad (Jan 28, 2008)

Lady Duck Hunter said:


> Vicki's Blog talkes about the ducks today.
> 
> I saw one Drake flyer land belly up on the road...that was a "pay $10 to the bird boys retirement fundbird" if I ever saw one...but it was the flyer which didn't seem to give anyone much trouble any way.
> 
> Say, when are you working again?


I am not sure when I am working again. U?


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## Lady Duck Hunter (Jan 9, 2003)

We are on the Schedule for 2-6 Thursday and Saturday. Most likely be there most of the day both days....not sure if We'll be out Friday to watch, depends on Dave's work (as in job) schedule.


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## JKL (Oct 19, 2007)

Shayne Mehringer said:


> Your cheating on me??? I'm jealous!!! Just wait til i get back to Montgomery tonight... imma blow your phone up from the gallery tomorrow! Picture mail too.
> 
> SM


When you didnt volunteer to be my friend I had to find another.........


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## SteelGirl_1187 (Sep 28, 2005)

FYI for the person checking on Dog #59 Brutus. . . . 

Ryan said he thinks it was an "above average job", small hunt on sr bird, and good job on long bird.


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