# The future of retriever clubs



## Terry Johansson (Aug 24, 2009)

It seems to me that, at least in the Northeast, many retriever clubs struggle with the same dilemma: How do we attract and retain new members? 

I belong to three NE dog clubs and all of them are facing this issue. We have a core group of workers and organizers that put in a huge amount of hours and effort to put on great events. At times, new people come in, but they rarely stay for long. As a result we face cutting back on the number of events we host. We can't keep doing the same thing and expect things to change. 

So I am asking myself "What are we doing wrong?" "What can we do differently?" "What do newcomers to the sport need to get hooked and hang around?" etc. 

I am hoping that there are clubs out there that have come up with some fresh approaches to attracting and retaining new members that can share them with us. I am also looking for those of you that are newer to to the sport to tell me what a great club would provide for you, the member?

I have been involved in dog training all my life and with retrievers since 1996. My husband and I drag our kids to events all over New England, but we are the exception not the norm. What can our clubs do to survive among the competing priorities of everyday life?

Hoping for some great discussion!

Terry


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## Bob Walton (Jan 1, 2007)

Terry,
A few years back ,at a trial , a few of us were discussing the same issues.Most of our club members are getting older and can't do what they once could . A few newer members had joined but between young families and job issues ,they couldn't fill the void.So what we came up with was that Shoreline Ret. Club and Colonial Ret. Field Trial Club joined in a cooperative work agreement.As a member of either club , If you enter the other clubs events , you may be asked to work the event. It added to the work force of both clubs and we made a few good friends along the way.
This may be only a stop gap measure and not solve the problem but it makes putting on the Field Trials a little easier.
Bob


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## Zman1001 (Oct 15, 2009)

Your last sentence really gives you the answer. There is nothing you can do. Every club / organization. / etc that I am involved in has this problem. Life is different today than 10-20 and everyone's time is limited, no matter the type of club. 

It also is hard for newcomers as the old timers do not always want to give up the power, or even be open to mew ideas. I am not sure how many times I have heard tradition as a reason why a suggestion would not work. You hear enough of that and it does not take much to say forget it


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## ebenezer (Aug 19, 2009)

I was very optimistic at the beginning of this season as we had 5 new members. Over the summer we hardly saw any of them, come test weekend only one showed up for a short time. Now that the weather is cold and miserible (no more golf and boating) these guys want to come out and train. I am old and tired after a long season but we still make every effort to accomodate them. They just don't have the heart for the long hours it takes to train a dog, other things take priority and maybe rightly so. We will continue to make new people welcome and help the best we can and maybe the bug will take hold.


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## BonMallari (Feb 7, 2008)

IMO if there is one thing that the old guard has done poorly it has failed to mentor and nurture future talent and resources into the game..Yes the old guard is reluctant to relinquish power, but that same dynamic was present back in 70's...As for the "young guns" of the retriever world, many are flash in the pan, one trick ponies, who seem to hit the sport, get what they want out of it but give very little back to it

many of the old guard has made a lifetime commitment to the sport, and continue to serve the sport well, if there was one resource that many clubs fail to tap is the knowledge and savvy of those that no longer actively campaign a dog...There are quite a few "old timers" that have a wealth of knowledge and experience but because they no longer actively train and campaign on the circuit are forgotten and often overlooked, but that may also be similar to how we as a society treat our senior citizens and cast them aside when we seem to have no further use for them

just my .02


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## mountaindogs (Dec 13, 2010)

Thats my issue. I have 2 kids in sports with games on saturdays. We have practice 4 days a week after school between the 2 of them from after school until 7:30. I take 2 dogs with me a train while I wait but saturday training days are out. I can get to some tests but I do NAVHDA and pointing dog hunt tests and have training days for those that I usually miss  and I am starting rally. Did I mention that most of the foot ball games are travel games and in a rural county its up to 2 hour drive one way.....


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## mountaindogs (Dec 13, 2010)

The most useful thing clubs could do would be to have training days that might be on Sunday afternoon. But in this bible belt south I am sure that would be trouble for some.


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## JoeOverby (Jan 2, 2010)

There are a myriad of reasons the "young-uns" dont give as much as some of the "older" members and I won't sit here and make excuses for any of them. However, I will say that to truly be involved in this sport it takes more than just attending an event or two or joining a club. It is a lifestyle that we live. Many of my friends my age have young families, meager financial resources, and other "prioroties" in their lives. Our HRC club is comprised primarily of "young" board members and volunteers. Matter of fact, there are only 3 on the board over 40...our Prez, VP, SEC, Treasurer, and every single committee head is 35 or under. I hear every excuse under the sun at every single event we have as to why people cannot be in attendance. IMO, it is poor time management and poor prioritization...until I look at it from their shoes...that said, how do we attract and retain new blood? I don't know that its one thing in particular. Our club is comprised mainly of "our" training group. A bunch of like minded individuals doing what we love, sharing our time, talents, and other resources simply because we need each-others help, like one-another, and want to. Try putting some "younger" members in decision making roles. LISTEN to their thoughts and ideas. Believe it or not, we actually have some good ones from time to time. You want to attract and retain new members?? Easy, give them a reason to come and stay a while...give them a job....but don't boss them around. Make them an IMPORTANT part of the club's success and recognize them for their hard-work. IMO it's that simple...but then what the hell do I know...I'm one of these crazy retriever game fanatics....i just happen to be under 35.


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## blackasmollases (Mar 26, 2012)

I could not agree more with some of the last posts. Fear not the want is still out there. I wish I would of got involved long before being 37. But it is out there. Against my better judgement I'm gonna say it on here "being there are some club members that are also on here". Training days are great but don't send me an email the day before that its been moved or changed to the next day and excpect me to show up. I've spent not all but most of my last 6 mos.either working sleeping or working with my pup, or researching on what I can do to make him better. He has been gone since september for some training which I didn't feel I could do right at this point in time. But I tell you one thing when I get him back in a couple weeks we aren't gonna stop because its cold outside. I'll take the lead were the trainer left of and we will run with it all winter, granted it will probably be limited to weekends and for the most part no water "as it gets kinda hard around here in the winter". But I will still go out and set up marks for the little guy even if I gotta plow snow off the ground first. So for 1 second don't think the desire is not there, just don't suck it out of it. This is supposed to be enjoyable right?


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## Mike W. (Apr 22, 2008)

The reality is to be truly competitive in the sport you have to have a lot of time and the financial resources to play. Those two items are generally in short supply for most who are younger with families. When I say younger, I mean people with kids in high school or below. If those kids have any activities at all, field trialing is a tough line to tow.

The facts are the sport lends itself to somewhat older people, who have the ability to train regularly and leave their homes for 10-20 weekends a year. Nothing wrong with it, just the way it is.

My view is there will always be people coming up who are really into dogs, who also want to compete at a higher level than HT's. They will eventually migrate to FTs in the course of their dog careers.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Field trials have become too competitive requiring a substantial investment in time and money with the availability of good training grounds and to be successful having an above average dog is essential. It is not a pursuit that is compatible with the requirements of young people with families, sadly we are an aging activity which could disappear in a generation.


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## John Lash (Sep 19, 2006)

You have to have a good dog.

Dogs have to be your primary, if not only interest.

You have to be willing to give up a few weekends a year to judge and work at putting on a trial or trials. Actually it's amazing that trials still happen.


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## Sabireley (Feb 2, 2005)

Zman1001 said:


> Your last sentence really gives you the answer. There is nothing you can do. Every club / organization. / etc that I am involved in has this problem. Life is different today than 10-20 and everyone's time is limited, no matter the type of club.
> 
> It also is hard for newcomers as the old timers do not always want to give up the power, or even be open to mew ideas. I am not sure how many times I have heard tradition as a reason why a suggestion would not work. You hear enough of that and it does not take much to say forget it


When it comes down to it, few people help at the events, and those that do help are invaluable and appreciated. You help at your club events, and at the Blue Ridge events, which does not go unnoticed. We are all a little irrational about this sport when you consider the amount of time, money, and luck it takes to have even a little success. Stick around and you'll be an old timer before you know it.


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## REBEL RIDGE FARMS (Nov 27, 2010)

Clubs should be able to host what events possible for clubs to manage . Each club has limited help and grounds. The rules of the game according to AKC states a club must have an open. Many clubs lack the help to host and grounds for trials . We host 4 major trials and 1 double header dq.This weekend we are hosting a double header hunt test. Our help at the end of the season is tired of hosting trials for many who make a living at this game or do very little to help and don't appreciate the work involved in host these events.I have approached the retriever advisory board several times to allow clubs to have amatuers, derby , and qual events . If clubs needed the cash you could still have the open. It is about people having a good time with their dogs.


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## J. Walker (Feb 21, 2009)

Since no one else has said it, I will. One issue, frankly, is the treatment of dogs at some training days. The last couple of club training days I attended, there were several people absolutely lighting up young dogs with the collar. One horse's rear end in particular thought it would be a good idea to hold up the cheaty water blind scenario we were running to revisit swim-by with his young, poorly trained, inexperienced dog right in the middle of the line to the blind after his dog hacked up the water blind and, by gosh, that dog had to pay the price. The poor dog was screaming for all he was worth. (This same guy keeps handling and burning the same young dog on marks and wonders, I'm sure, why the dog still cannot mark. That poor dog hasn't been taught anything but has been punished for everything.) That same session, an old member who I've literally never seen lift a finger to help with anything not even so much as sitting in a chair and occasionally planting blinds, was burning up her young dog while he was out of sight after overrunning a blind when he had no idea why he was getting burned. When I say "burning up," I mean transmitter all the way up and holding the buttons down continuously so the dog was wrong no matter what he did. Afterward, she said, "If he keeps this up, I swear I'm going to kill him!" This was a dog about two years-old at the time. I wish I were joking or exaggerating but that is her actual quote. Fortunately, a club officer pulled the lady aside afterward and basically told her the she didn't want to see that kind of stuff at the training days. At a previous session, another older member just had to show a first time attendee how to get a reliable fetch so he took the dog behind the trucks and was literally dragging the horrified young dog by his ear while pinching it the whole time all the way to the bumper. That's the last time I saw that man and his young dog. Ask yourself, if you were new to training dogs and really wanted just a decent hunting dog to also be your buddy, if you witnessed that kind of thing early on, would you come back let alone brings your kids??? All it takes is one incident like this to sour any newcomer to retriever clubs and events. By no means am I saying it's the only issue or that everyone at training days is putting dogs through this kind of thing. However, the fact that this stuff is not unusual at all sure isn't helping things.


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## roseberry (Jun 22, 2010)

i am a member of two different retriever clubs. both have an extremely different focus.

first is the chattanooga retriever club. CRC is a field trial "event" club. we hold two four stake field trials in spring and fall. as best i can tell we have ~8 active members. i say, "as best i can tell" since there are no annual dues, no member lists, no membership drives, etc. i have declared myself a member by working the last four field trials and i observed that most all the other 7 i have declared as members were working those trials as well. our trial committee is made up of credible dog folk. i think most participants would say the CRC always puts on a pretty nice trial. we had 144 dogs in the fall event with a 30 pup derby. since "the crew of 8" can put on the event(usually with the help of a few participants/spouses) i don't really see this club growing. i am not sure it needs to?
note: carter hughes is event chair and he has saturday training at his place every weekend he is not at a trial. most of the CRC members attend these sessions periodically.

second is the north alabama hrc. nahrc is a "training" based club. we hold one spring hrc hunt test and have monthly club "training days" except for duck season. since this club was formed by several "small training groups" we all still train with our original groups and also "cross train" with the other small groups. we formed the club almost two years ago and have ~45 dues paying members. nahrc has different club members host the monthly training days on their grounds each month. we serve lunch, have drawings for prizes and venues for dogs of all ages and training levels monthly. our first hunt test was well attended and profitable and we had plenty of working members. we also have a christmas party where new officers are announced and our "nahrc dog of the year" traveling trophy is awarded. our membership's interests are diverse. for instanceto my recolection) we had at least twelve member dogs qualify for master national with five getting a plate, we have had four new MH titles, we have had seven HRCH, over a dozen HR and SH, we had one SRS am winner and other SRS placements, we had one QAA and two make national derby list and last but not least four that rank corporal or higher in the USMC. i know it is easy to get new folk interested in a new club and much harder to keep a club active and fresh throughout the life cycle. 

imho, growth means making training the focus and hosting tests and trials another "fun club activity". spread the responsibility and geography of training days. expect attrition as many people are in and out.....but when you identify those guys and girls in their twenties that really have the bug.....talk them into a two hole box and a new pup, step aside and make them club secretary.


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

EdA said:


> Field trials have become too competitive requiring a substantial investment in time and money with the availability of good training grounds and to be successful having an above average dog is essential. It is not a pursuit that is compatible with the requirements of young people with families, sadly we are an aging activity which could disappear in a generation.


Sadly I have to agree with Ed.


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## hughest (Oct 5, 2007)

J. Walker said:


> Since no one else has said it, I will. One issue, frankly, is the treatment of dogs at some training days. The last couple of club training days I attended, there were several people absolutely lighting up young dogs with the collar. One horse's rear end in particular thought it would be a good idea to hold up the cheaty water blind scenario we were running to revisit swim-by with his young, poorly trained, inexperienced dog right in the middle of the line to the blind after his dog hacked up the water blind and, by gosh, that dog had to pay the price. The poor dog was screaming for all he was worth. (This same guy keeps handling and burning the same young dog on marks and wonders, I'm sure, why the dog still cannot mark. That poor dog hasn't been taught anything but has been punished for everything.) That same session, an old member who I've literally never seen lift a finger to help with anything not even so much as sitting in a chair and occasionally planting blinds, was burning up her young dog while he was out of sight after overrunning a blind when he had no idea why he was getting burned. When I say "burning up," I mean transmitter all the way up and holding the buttons down continuously so the dog was wrong no matter what he did. Afterward, she said, "If he keeps this up, I swear I'm going to kill him!" This was a dog about two years-old at the time. I wish I were joking or exaggerating but that is her actual quote. Fortunately, a club officer pulled the lady aside afterward and basically told her the she didn't want to see that kind of stuff at the training days. At a previous session, another older member just had to show a first time attendee how to get a reliable fetch so he took the dog behind the trucks and was literally dragging the horrified young dog by his ear while pinching it the whole time all the way to the bumper. That's the last time I saw that man and his young dog. Ask yourself, if you were new to training dogs and really wanted just a decent hunting dog to also be your buddy, if you witnessed that kind of thing early on, would you come back let alone brings your kids??? All it takes is one incident like this to sour any newcomer to retriever clubs and events. By no means am I saying it's the only issue or that everyone at training days is putting dogs through this kind of thing. However, the fact that this stuff is not unusual at all sure isn't helping things.


Oh.my.goodness. I am 36 years old and have been involved in the HT game for 7 or 8 years now. Had my first experience been one like you have described I would have been OUT. Probably called the humane society or the police. Never to return to this game I now love. Today, with now 8 MH dogs, and 7 MN plates on the shelf, and on the board of my local club, someone else would probably be calling the police. Because I would come unglued on that freaking idiot. Grrrrrrr.


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## RedDog (Apr 27, 2010)

As a beginner has intended to join a somewhat local club for months (if not years)... I already feel guilty about not being able to give back enough as I'm such a beginner. I know I likely wouldn't be able to work both days at an event, maybe only one day or two half days. On the other hand, I know that's a bit unreasonable as that's part of the point of many clubs, and I have access to some land that they would probably like to use and I'm pretty invested in my dog doing well...meaning longer term involvement from me. 

At two other clubs.... just didn't work out for me. I wanted to train to a different level than the other club members and though I'm a beginner, I didn't want to take advice that could potentially set myself and my dog back in our training. It just wasn't a good fit for us, though I enjoyed the enthusiasm of the group and I appreciated their offers for help.


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## BonMallari (Feb 7, 2008)

RedDog said:


> As a beginner has intended to join a somewhat local club for months (if not years)... I already feel guilty about not being able to give back enough as I'm such a beginner. I know I likely wouldn't be able to work both days at an event, maybe only one day or two half days. On the other hand, I know that's a bit unreasonable as that's part of the point of many clubs, and I have access to some land that they would probably like to use and I'm pretty invested in my dog doing well...meaning longer term involvement from me.
> 
> *At two other clubs.... just didn't work out for me. I wanted to train to a different level than the other club members and though I'm a beginner, I didn't want to take advice that could potentially set myself and my dog back in our training. It just wasn't a good fit for us, though I enjoyed the enthusiasm of the group and I appreciated their offers for help*.


You bring up another dynamic that has been around since retriever clubs have probably been in existence..the retriever games are an individual sport,especially at a FT level

When a new member arrives if they are not at the same level of the general consenus of the club/training group they can either be a drag to that group, or the group can be a drag to the individual, add to that the fact that Mon -Thurs its all for one and one for all, but come Fri-Sun its may the best dog win

Retriever clubs and the tireless and unselfish people that make them go are the lifeblood of the sport, but sooner or later those people either get out of the game and if someone isnt around to pick up the slack or carry the torch, that club withers away


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## Terry Johansson (Aug 24, 2009)

This thread has generated some great discussion. 

Here are some things that I am taking away:

- The old guard has to be willing to step down. All too often we see folks running again for a position they don't want because no one else steps up. Maybe the "newbies" don't want to step on toes by running against someone?
- We need to organize training days and they have to be fun and rewarding. I'd love more thoughts on this. The scheduling of training days need to accommodate members with competing interests. 
- We probably need to help folks find a good dog! Maybe offer a puppy referral?
- Maybe a mentoring program for newcomers would help them understand what it takes?
- I think clubs may need to offer something that gives newcomers early success. It doesn't have to be at a licensed event, but I think it's hard to keep going if you feel like you can't compare to the highly trained dogs of other members. Not sure what form this should take. Thoughts?

I also want to point out that only one of the clubs I belong to hosts a trial. This issue is in the hunt test and breed clubs too. I saw one post where someone was worried about only being able to work a half day at an event. I chaired one event and was on the committee of two last year - I would be more than happy to take a half a day if that's what someone is able to give!


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## Steve Shaver (Jan 9, 2003)

Didnt read the whole thread and maybe this was mentioned but here is my thought.
New members are like new puppies. If the desire just aint there your not going to put it in them. Some are interested but not to the point that it is in others to stick with it. With puppies some things are more important than the retrieve and with some there is nothing more important than the retrieve. I have tried to help lots of new people that seem to be interested but most dont stick with it so I just wash them out and its on to the next puppy, or prospect.
Our clubs both FT and HT have numerous picnic trials where new people can come and learn. Some stay some dont. How many FC's are in any one litter of pups?


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## Losthwy (May 3, 2004)

IMO nothing will stop the decline of the FT game. The lost of trialing grounds, the lost of training grounds, eroding quality of judging, fewer amatuers, rise of "mega-owners", absentee owners, and the escalating cost to compete are irreversible.


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## cpmm665 (Jan 6, 2009)

Club organized training days and Special events such as Club tests seems to help with member retention for BCRC. At our annual meeting we ask for volunteers to sit on the training committee, we meet and set up dates and tentative locations for training, typically one Saturday and one Sunday per month. We send out an email to the members a week prior and ask for pre-registration so we have an idea of the skill level of attendees and their dogs. Some of our members also provide freezer space for birds which we use at our Club events. We kick off the season with a Flyer day, 2012 was largest we've had to date, we had 27 attend. We also host two Members only mock hunt tests which continue to be popular. We run JR., SR. and Master and all participants work in the field or judging.
As Club Secretary, I started emailing a set of documents to potential members upon membership inquiry. These include things like popular training programs, a list of vendors, basic and advanced needed training gear and a glossary of terms. Several veteran members also offer to mentor new folks. We also encourage new members to connect with others in their area to form their own training groups. 
BCRC averages 50-55 members per year and we do have the same "core" group stepping up to Chair events, however, the involvement of less active members has improved since we started offering the flyer day and mock tests. We have also had increased numbers of Master Hunters. I believe it is the responsibility of the dog owner to train their dog, not the responsibility of the Club, but, in my opinion folks join a retriever Club for training opportunities and education and this is paramount for member retention.


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## BonMallari (Feb 7, 2008)

Sugarwoods said:


> This thread has generated some great discussion.
> 
> Here are some things that I am taking away:
> 
> ...



my response in purple


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## Tim Carrion (Jan 5, 2003)

The days of the 3 day,4 stake FT are probably numbered but I am a bit more optomistic. FTs will always be a game that requires time and money.
The issue therefore is how to reduce time and money to get people started and retain them.
One thing that might help to attract new people would be the return of the AKC Sanctioned FT. These are 1 day events, they are competitive, D/Q/O levels can be offered,cost can be controlled with dead birds and an understanding that all participates must be willing to help. Area clubs can get together to offer an actual circuit and present yearly high point D/Q /O trophies. Prior to HTs, this venue provided training for handlers and judges.
The issues of declining available FT grounds, and true amatuer participation could be helped if clubs had the option of a 2-day/ 2 stake FT with a controlled entry( controlled in both dogs/stake and dogs/handler). This could help retain new members long term as opposed to "burning them out" at large trials.

JMOs

Tim

-


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## JoeOverby (Jan 2, 2010)

Tim Carrion said:


> The days of the 3 day-4 stake are probably numbered but I am a bit more optomistic. FTs will always be a game that requires time and money.
> The issue therefore is how reduce time and money to get people started.
> One thing that might helpto attract new people would be the return of the AKC Sanctioned FT. These are 1 day events, they are competitive, D/Q/O levels can be offered,cost can be controlled with dead birds and an understanding that all participates must be willing to help. Area clubs can get together to offer an actual circuit and present yearly high point D/Q /O trophies. Prior to HTs, this venue provided training for handlers and judges.
> The issues of declining available FT grounds, and true amatuer participation could be helped if clubs had the option of a 2-day/ 2 stake FT with a controlled entry( controlled in both dogs/stake and dogs/handler). This could help retain people as opposed to "burning them out" at large trials.
> ...


So I'm gonna spend money I don't have and take time off from a demanding entry level job and take time away from a newly started family to run a trial I am required to work if entered for no chance at a title or placement??? The only reward is a little league trophy at the end of the year IF there is an area circuit??? There aint no way to spin that to make it sound attractive to new members. Since my last post on this topic there has been some great discussion. I do think Steve Shaver is right though. There are only so many people who truly wanna be involved. As a club, you do everything in your power to retain those folks when they show up. The rest, you can't worry about because no matter how much coddling, begging, or encouraging you do they just arent interested enough to give what we feel is an adequate amount.


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## Miriam Wade (Apr 24, 2003)

BonMallari said:


> my response in purple


 Oops!! This is all that came up when I tried to quote you!

Bon, 

I agree with you 100% on your comment on the training days sometimes benefiting the more experienced folks than the new person you are trying to attract, but also have seen just the opposite. One of our New England clubs hosts training days that truly foster the person new to the club and training. There is someone standing on line with them offering advice as to how to run the setups and throwers are ready, able and willing to help the dog. I think it's a win/win for the newbie to have help as well as watch the experienced handlers and dogs to see what is possible with good training. I know a few people have gone on to become valuable and valued members of the club and it's in no small part to the fact that there isn't a clique or unfriendly atmosphere.

This same club has sanctioned trials that are fun, friendly and efficiently run. It's what got me to join.

Terry,

Sent you an e-mail, but I just looked at the club website. What I would recommend are what's already been suggested:

Training Days w/ mentors for the new folks

Sanctioned Trials and Club Test w/ the option of running out of contention for those that may need some help

A Training Day where you buddy up new folks w/ long time members to run stations, so that everyone has time in the field and new folks don't feel intimidated by not knowing what's expected of a bird boy.

Workshops/Seminars: A lot of us would love to have a workshop in our backyards with someone like Mike Lardy or Dave Rorem.

M


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## Labs a mundo (Mar 20, 2009)

*What do we need to Change?*

This thread IMO, is exactly what a forum like this is about. It's an opportunity to gather objective information that is affecting all of us in this sport.

In the last year I can't begin to say how often this has become a topic of disscussion over post training lunch. Like the responders we also have lost new members for most of the reasons already mentioned. This is what I beleive my club does well:

1. Monthly picnic trials. These have been held without fail since the mid 60's. They are treated with the same rules as a licensed event. Points and ribbons are awarded at the end of the day along with yearly trophies at the end of the year. 

2.We have a core group of trainers who are dedicated to Sat. and Sun. training. The only time this changes is if there is a licensed trial or picnic trial.

3.The experienced mentor the newcomers. They try hard to encourage new people.

4. We try .....try very hard not to overwhelm, or underwhelm new people. 

Even with these things in place we are losing new people. New members are overwhelmed by the amount of time required to train a dog to a successful level. Usually when they join they have a dog that has missed out on solid foundation work and the holes they've created are beyond repair.

The financial investment is often beyond what new people can committ to.

Having said this it would appear that it is the sport in it's current state that has created it's own flaws. How do we re-create a sport that an amateur can be passionate about? Do we need to put more emphasis on the amateur stakes?

There are some people who believe that the trainers who compete in hunt tests are a natural progression to field trials. I agree with this in priciple but I've been told that hunt test participants find field trialers intimidating. I once had a person say to me at a hunt test..." Once he gets his master hunter title it's straight to Open" It made me wonder if handlers don't find working and having success at a Qualifying level enough validation?

Hmmmm........... it's lot's to think about.
I've cross posted this on Canadian Hunting dogs because I think it's important to get a cross view from both sides.


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## Sarge (Feb 8, 2012)

Thank you to all the members of FT/HT clubs that work so hard to make the events possible.

As a relative new particpant in FT/HT I cannot comment on member retention. However, my most discouraging experience with the game came after completing all three series of a Master Test, waiting for the compilation of scores and judges eating lunch (over two hours), only to be told I did not receiving a qualifying score. It was a long drive home.

Retaining new particpants in the game will require some way to expedite the event process.


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## Miriam Wade (Apr 24, 2003)

Sarge said:


> Thank you to all the members of FT/HT clubs that work so hard to make the events possible.
> 
> As a relative new particpant in FT/HT I cannot comment on member retention. However, my most discouraging experience with the game came after completing all three series of a Master Test, waiting for the compilation of scores and judges eating lunch (over two hours), only to be told I did not receiving a qualifying score. It was a long drive home.
> 
> Retaining new particpants in the game will require some way to expedite the event process.


Do you mind if I ask if you have any experience working a test? You mention judges spending 2 hours eating lunch and going over scores. They just set up and sat through every aspect of the test you ran. No matter the weather they are there for the duration with very little opportunity for a break of any kind. That 2 hour lunch may have been the first chance they've had to breathe all day and have a bite to eat. I'll be honest- a 2 hour break in the MIDDLE of a test would annoy me, but in this situation they may have had a large stake. It's not always clear cut how things are going to add up until you look at the judge's sheets. Then there is the matter of discussing the dogs that one judge would like to pass and the other would not.

Hopefully you've workedan event in some capacity so you know that it's a lot of effort from long before handlers run to long afterwards. Don't just be a participant in terms of being a handler-help make the event happen!

M


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## Hunt'EmUp (Sep 30, 2010)

I don't know my experience with clubs is no matter your rooster 5-10 people work all the time, are at every event, and do a lot to get others involved. Memberships go up, a lot of events are hosted and still 5-10 people work, same people every event. The same people in setting up in the morning, who never have to "leave early", and end up staying late putting things away. Go on for a few years people eventually get burnt out, but membership still wants lots of training days and events, that majority of membership shows up to, but only 5-10 people work, sometimes pulling teeth to get people out of chairs. Soon 5-10 people get a tad bitter and begin to think that 5-10 people can run the club, exactly as they want with far less headaches and far less work, perhaps even get some training in on their own dogs every once in awhile. They close off the ranks, training days become private matters. It works out OK until a few of those 5-10 people decided to hang it up and then either a new group of 5-10 take over or the club dies.

So what did we start doing? We started assigning different shifts for training days and tests, a morning setup shift and a afternoon cleanup shift. You'd be surprised how happy, non-bitter willing to help out newbies, you can keep those 5-10 people, when there's a second shift (2-3 people) who shows up mid-day Sun, after a long weekend of testing to clean-up and tell the morning shift (6-7 people) to LEAVE everything's taken care of


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## Miriam Wade (Apr 24, 2003)

Hunt'EmUp said:


> I don't know my experience with clubs is no matter your rooster 5-10 people work all the time, are at every event, and do a lot to get others involved. Memberships go up, a lot of events are hosted and still 5-10 people work, same people every event. The same people in setting up in the morning, who never have to "leave early", and end up staying late putting things away. Go on for a few years people eventually get burnt out, but membership still wants lots of training days and events, that majority of membership shows up to, but only 5-10 people work, sometimes pulling teeth to get people out of chairs. Soon 5-10 people get a tad bitter and begin to think that 5-10 people can run the club, exactly as they want with far less headaches and far less work, perhaps even get some training in on their own dogs every once in awhile. They close off the ranks, training days become private matters. It works out OK until a few of those 5-10 people decided to hang it up and then either a new group of 5-10 take over or the club dies.
> 
> So what did we start doing? We started assigning different shifts for training days and tests, a morning setup shift and a afternoon cleanup shift. You'd be surprised how happy, non-bitter willing to help out newbies, you can keep those 5-10 people, when there's a second shift (2-3 people) who shows up mid-day Sun, after a long weekend of testing to clean-up and tell the morning shift (6-7 people) to LEAVE everything's taken care of


I'm going to stop after this. I don't disagree with what you wrote, but attitude can sometimes play a part. I know folks who have worked and not been respected in the process. You can't expect some new person to sit out in the canoe all day or plant the blind with no view of what's going on. I know some absolutely super folks who you would love to hunt and train with. These aren't whiners by nature, but really nice guys. After a couple of times being made to feel as though they were there only to work and not being offered any help, it no longer becomes attractive to them. It's a matter of give and take.

M


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## Bob Barnett (Feb 21, 2004)

There is a big disconnect between hunters and FT/HT people. I understand most HT/FT participants hunt but most hunters arent interested in the games. I am a non participating member of our local HRC. There isn't much there for me as a hunter. The games have taken on their own meaning and require training that isnt necessary for hunting. Look what training a dog has become to some. It is charts and diagrams, and piles, etc..Technical training isnt all that fun for most people. When you see the process from start to finish it makes sense but you throw a hunter in there and explain that you are making a point hot for de-cheating purposes they lose intrerest really quickly. 

I do some that of too and enjoy some of it but the competitive nature takes away enough that I dont participate much. 

These clubs are for people chasing titles and ribbons not about having fun with the dogs.


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## Justin Allen (Sep 29, 2009)

It sounds like you need to get rid of some of those people. Someone that knows whats going on needs to step in and teach in that situation.


J. Walker said:


> Since no one else has said it, I will. One issue, frankly, is the treatment of dogs at some training days. The last couple of club training days I attended, there were several people absolutely lighting up young dogs with the collar. One horse's rear end in particular thought it would be a good idea to hold up the cheaty water blind scenario we were running to revisit swim-by with his young, poorly trained, inexperienced dog right in the middle of the line to the blind after his dog hacked up the water blind and, by gosh, that dog had to pay the price. The poor dog was screaming for all he was worth. (This same guy keeps handling and burning the same young dog on marks and wonders, I'm sure, why the dog still cannot mark. That poor dog hasn't been taught anything but has been punished for everything.) That same session, an old member who I've literally never seen lift a finger to help with anything not even so much as sitting in a chair and occasionally planting blinds, was burning up her young dog while he was out of sight after overrunning a blind when he had no idea why he was getting burned. When I say "burning up," I mean transmitter all the way up and holding the buttons down continuously so the dog was wrong no matter what he did. Afterward, she said, "If he keeps this up, I swear I'm going to kill him!" This was a dog about two years-old at the time. I wish I were joking or exaggerating but that is her actual quote. Fortunately, a club officer pulled the lady aside afterward and basically told her the she didn't want to see that kind of stuff at the training days. At a previous session, another older member just had to show a first time attendee how to get a reliable fetch so he took the dog behind the trucks and was literally dragging the horrified young dog by his ear while pinching it the whole time all the way to the bumper. That's the last time I saw that man and his young dog. Ask yourself, if you were new to training dogs and really wanted just a decent hunting dog to also be your buddy, if you witnessed that kind of thing early on, would you come back let alone brings your kids??? All it takes is one incident like this to sour any newcomer to retriever clubs and events. By no means am I saying it's the only issue or that everyone at training days is putting dogs through this kind of thing. However, the fact that this stuff is not unusual at all sure isn't helping things.


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## Jerry Beil (Feb 8, 2011)

I kinda think there are challenges on both ends.

At the high end, with field trials, they've gotten so difficult that the average person isn't really capable of having any chance of success. It takes a combination of the right dog, along with an immense amount of high quality training. As it becomes more of a pro game, that continues to escalate to the point where a do it yourself trainer has a nearly impossible time competing against dogs trained professionally. The very nature of that is going to cause there to be less people running at that level. If I have my dog professionally trained, I don't really need a club to help me. I just show up at events and run my dog. The future of FTs are going to depend on people wanting to go to the next step after hunt testing, or wanting the competitive venue.

I think there's a ton of opportunity for hunt test focused clubs as long as the standard remains something that is attainable for a person and their dog without resorting to professional trainers. The challenge is that so many people have no idea of what a good retriever is really capable of. They get a decently bred dog, and mess around with sit and here and stay and roll over and beg and speak etc, and throw some tennis balls and the dog brings them back - WOW - what a great dog. They take it hunting and the dog's instinct kicks in and it goes and brings back some birds - Hey, I have a cracker jack retriever. They don't see how much more is possible, and some don't care. Heck, compared to hunt test or FT 6 moth old pups, these dogs basic obedience is usually appalling. Take a walk in the neighborhood and tell your dog to sit, and watch how amazed folks are with how well behaved your dog is. People just don't know.

If clubs want to grow memberships and get new people in, they need to focus on providing value to the people starting out. You're not going to get someone from I think I want a lab as a pet and might want to teach him to retrieve all the way to I want to run my dog in a field trial right away. You need to present training days that offer more than a hunt test setup, but instead run more drills that teach some of the concepts. Most of these are good for beginning dogs as well as advanced dogs, or can be adjusted for both. Similarly, new folks with less advanced dogs need to be made to feel comfortable running a setup in a much less demanding way. Instead of a triple with 3 100+ yard marks and a long tricky blind, they can move up and run them as 3 singles and skip the blind, but the majority of new folks don't realize their dog can't do the triple, so they need some mentoring, and need to see older members doing the same thing. 

As clubs, we need to get more information out there so people starting out with a retriever pup realize what these dogs are capable of. If your dog sits on command and comes on command, you've surpassed 95% of dogs out there. Folks take their dogs to Petsmart for a training class and think that their dog is as good as it can get when it sits sometimes and comes when you have a treat. When people see these dogs do some of the things they do in tests and trials, they're amazed and interested. Problem is they don't see that. Once you're involved, you can't see how invisible we are to the outside world. You might have to grow and nurture the interest over the lifespans of 2 or 3 dogs since most can't overlap to any large extent.


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## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

I look at retriever clubs two ways, there are retriever Clubs who's sole reason for existing is to host one or two field trials a year, and or hunt test, and there a clubs that are more geared to helping people train their dogs. When I started, the clubs I knew and was involved in did both and some still do. Presently the situation that works best for me is to be involved with a larger club in helping put on field trials and such, partake in the occasional Picnic Trials or other club days, but train on a daily or few times a week basis, with a smaller group of guys and gals who live nearby and have work hours that are compatable with mine. I also belong to a club that just puts on field trials. 

I am somewhat mystified at the old pictures of twenty and thirty-somthings that were competitive running field trials in the sixties and seventies, it must have been a very different game back then.

John


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## TN_LAB (Jul 26, 2008)

Hunt'EmUp said:


> So what did we start doing? We started assigning different shifts for training days and tests, a morning setup shift and a afternoon cleanup shift. You'd be surprised how happy, non-bitter willing to help out newbies, you can keep those 5-10 people, when there's a second shift (2-3 people) who shows up mid-day Sun, after a long weekend of testing to clean-up and tell the morning shift (6-7 people) to LEAVE everything's taken care of


I agree. I can't help but wonder if it wouldn't be a better idea to ask for folks to volunteer in shifts (AM, PM, 1st day, 2nd day, setup, teardown, etc.). 

I think more folks would help, if asked...especially if you aren't asking them to commit to the entire weekend. 

Club training days. Have a few of these every once in a while, and be flexible enough so that new folks can run something that is appropriate for their dog. Let em know that they aren't an inconvenience (may require splitting the training group up in to two groups).


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## Marvin S (Nov 29, 2006)

John Robinson said:


> I am somewhat mystified at the old pictures of twenty and thirty-somthings that were competitive running field trials in the sixties and seventies, it must have been a very different game back then. John


There were a few of us . The thing I see is the absence of grounds to put a stake the size of those today. & the grounds to practice those tests. When I started Richard Wolters was some malcontent that showed at the Montana State trial in Butte panning FT's. Today those same HT people are competing for less grounds with the folks that run FT's, so we're trying to do more with less & that don't work. & those same grounds have become a bunch of 20 acre plots. MT had no pro's - how many headquarter there during at the least part of the year?

Also in those days there were a lot more folks supporting the trials who were not competitors, you rarely see those people today .


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## Chad Baker (Feb 5, 2003)

I can tell you from a guy that runs a large construction company, Flea Mkt, redi-mix concrete company, and a car auction on Monday nights and has two small kids son 3 and daughter 6 Ft's are tough! My daughter is ranked 3 in the mini-hunter division with her Pony and she rides against mostly 10-14 yr old girls (don't have a clue why she would be competitive) and this daddy don't miss many horse shows! I'm going to be stepping away from Ft's except maybe 4-6 trials a year if that. I'm not going to miss my kids growing up. There will be time for Ft's after they leave home and grow up. Having a young family and finding time to train let alone run trials is tough but I have been able to this point to sqeeze it all in but that is coming to a end. I will support my club thru out but my family is going to be my first priority and that is the reason I see it so difficult for young people to be involved in Ft's. I may go to my second Ht next year and just see what they are all about and let the kids run the dogs and see if they want to get involved.
Chad


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## mostlygold (Aug 5, 2006)

I belong to 2 clubs presently. A FT club and a specialty breed club that was orginally founded by field people, so that is still a primary focus. In order to get and keep new members interested in the field aspect of our breed, we changed the way our training sessions were run. We split the session with the morning group being experienced dogs/handlers so that big setups could be done and dogs anywhere from SH to FT level could run them. Experienced members would help less experienced ones with how to run the set up. It gave everyone the opportunity to work on what they needed to and get trial like experience (our training sessions generally run between 35-50 dogs). The afternoon session was for new members, members with very young dogs or members who just want to pursue a JH or WC with their dogs. The emphasis was on teaching the dogs obedience, setting up simple marks and explaining how factors like wind, hills, cover, etc could affect the dog's marking, introducing the dogs to holding blinds, boats, decoys, gunners in the field, etc and teaching simple drills to help with marking and basic handling. The handlers also learned how to handle a shotgun, set up a winger, help a dog when needed and run the line. Running and working lists were made up and emailed to everyone several days prior to each session. Pre-registration was required to help with flyers and running orders. Everyone who ran a dog had to help out either in the field or on line. 

This system has worked out very well. Our experienced members (many of whom had stopped coming) were getting to run their dogs instead of doing all the work. The new members did not feel overwhelmed or embarrassed by what they or their dogs did not know. Best of all, almost ALL of our new afternoon session members volunteered to work in some capacity at our HT. They felt comfortable working in the field and learned a lot by watching dogs run.

Dawn


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## 8mmag (Jan 1, 2010)

Chad Baker said:


> I can tell you from a guy that runs a large construction company, Flea Mkt, redi-mix concrete company, and a car auction on Monday nights and has two small kids son 3 and daughter 6 Ft's are tough! My daughter is ranked 3 in the mini-hunter division with her Pony and she rides against mostly 10-14 yr old girls (don't have a clue why she would be competitive) and this daddy don't miss many horse shows! I'm going to be stepping away from Ft's except maybe 4-6 trials a year if that. I'm not going to miss my kids growing up. There will be time for Ft's after they leave home and grow up. Having a young family and finding time to train let alone run trials is tough but I have been able to this point to sqeeze it all in but that is coming to a end. I will support my club thru out but my family is going to be my first priority and that is the reason I see it so difficult for young people to be involved in Ft's. I may go to my second Ht next year and just see what they are all about and let the kids run the dogs and see if they want to get involved.
> Chad


No question you're going out on top! Don't miss the kids growin' up...you'll never get it back.


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## GoldenSail (Dec 16, 2010)

As young newbie I want to be more involved but I am limited at this time. Hopefully in a few years I can do more. It is a huge drag though to bring one dog and sometimes two people to help and get stuck volunteering for hours for those people who have 2,3,4+ dogs who then do not always help because they are busy running so many dogs. I really like the idea of signing up to volunteer for x amount of time or x task. Being able to participate and help out but at a level that is appropriate to involvement.


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## bjoiner (Feb 25, 2008)

The one thing you can do to build members and get them involved is to *call newer members individually* and ask them to train. Just hosting training days once a month, etc. ain't going to do it. It takes making someone feel wanted and welcome for most people to become involved. A lot of times newer people feel like they are an inconvenience to training groups because their dogs aren't to the same level. Have them run your dogs and help out developing theirs. Take a personal interest in the new ones that show some interest and get them hooked.


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## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

Chad Baker said:


> I can tell you from a guy that runs a large construction company, Flea Mkt, redi-mix concrete company, and a car auction on Monday nights and has two small kids son 3 and daughter 6 Ft's are tough! My daughter is ranked 3 in the mini-hunter division with her Pony and she rides against mostly 10-14 yr old girls (don't have a clue why she would be competitive) and this daddy don't miss many horse shows! I'm going to be stepping away from Ft's except maybe 4-6 trials a year if that. I'm not going to miss my kids growing up. There will be time for Ft's after they leave home and grow up. Having a young family and finding time to train let alone run trials is tough but I have been able to this point to sqeeze it all in but that is coming to a end. I will support my club thru out but my family is going to be my first priority and that is the reason I see it so difficult for young people to be involved in Ft's. I may go to my second Ht next year and just see what they are all about and let the kids run the dogs and see if they want to get involved.
> Chad


I have so much respect for guys like you. My long time training partner retired his six year old FC-AFC for exactly the resaons you state. I think it would be very cool to see a couple National Champions running some hunt test, more than cool, awesome.

john


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## blackasmollases (Mar 26, 2012)

These clubs are for people chasing titles and ribbons not about having fun with the dogs.[/QUOTE]

I just want to disagree with this statement. I am a hunter also. But my biggest enjoyment comes from working with and watching the dogs do their work. And doing it proficiently. I hunt wit some guys like you speak of and wish they would leave their dogs at home. Ribbons and titles are a bonus.


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## BonMallari (Feb 7, 2008)

John Robinson said:


> I am somewhat mystified at the old pictures of twenty and thirty-somthings that were competitive running field trials in the sixties and seventies, it must have been a very different game back then.
> 
> John


In many ways the game hasn't changed...Contrary to myth and folklore guys like Lanse,Roy McFall,and Marvin were not born old  They were the young guns on the circuit, they were the brash upstarts challenging the status quo, they were the ones clamoring for change back then...

The status quo consisted of August/Louise Belmont, David/Gretchen Crow and the Wallace's and Murnanes of the world....except that Mr/Mrs Belmont and the Crows actually ran their dogs in the Open on Friday, yes they had pro help Mon-Thurs, but they were right there competing with you, and if you were very lucky, they would even take you to dinner on Fri or Sat night

There probably wasnt as much of a class segregation as there seems to be now, and if there was the great equalizer was having a good dog that could compete and win

The pros of yesteryear was a like a traveling carnival show..I will never forget a story told to me by Joe Schomer of how he used to literally carry the fold out sitting chair for one of his well heeled clients, until he was told where to place said chair under the shade of the nearest tree..

the tests back then didnt have the length that appear now, but the terrain back then seemed to be tougher from the line to the bird

The one occurrence that has all but disappeared from today's FT venue is the Sat evening tailgate party, it was at events like that where people actually talked and got to know their fellow competitor away from the pressure cooker of the trial,it was a lot like the RTF forum except that you actually faced the person and called bs to their face instead of cross country like we do now...training philosophy discussions were just as heated,gossip was thrown about who was involved with whom, the Rex Carr people all stuck together, they used the same terminology, and they tried in vain to dispel the half truths and the myths that came with that methodolgy

So in many ways the game hasnt changed..only the players


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

John Robinson said:


> I am somewhat mystified at the old pictures of twenty and thirty-somthings that were competitive running field trials in the sixties and seventies, it must have been a very different game back then.John


As one of those thirty somethings I think I have a perspective which few currently active people have, and for anyone who thinks things have not changed review the winners of the National Championship Stake from the mid 60s to the early 80s, the winners were predominately amateurs.

The game has changed significantly and the competitive balance is skewed due to a number of good pros running 15-20 dogs every weekend, this is a relatively new phenomenon which has emerged in the last 15 +/- years. From the perspective of a lifer with a talented 4 year old my chances for the dog to experience success in the Open are enhanced by having him run in the Open by a top 5 pro rather than me.


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## suepuff (Aug 25, 2008)

EdA said:


> The game has changed significantly and the competitive balance is skewed due to a number of good pros running 15-20 dogs every weekend, this is a relatively new phenomenon which has emerged in the last 15 +/- years. From the perspective of a lifer with a talented 4 year old my chances for the dog to experience success in the Open are enhanced by having him run in the Open by a top 5 pro rather than me.


Ed, that's kind of sad....has the training changed that much over the years, dogs that much better, a combo of things? I would have a tough time with letting that go. I enjoy what I do with the dogs and what we accomplish. To think that in order to let a talented dog I own be competitive I'd have to send him off instead of doing the majority of the work myself is a little depressing....I don't mind sending a dog off, and I do, but the joy of the bond and working together towards a goal gives me that warm fuzzy feeling...sorry...girly thought interjected here. 

Sue Puff


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## BlaineT (Jul 17, 2010)

JoeOverby said:


> There are a myriad of reasons the "young-uns" dont give as much as some of the "older" members and I won't sit here and make excuses for any of them. However, I will say that to truly be involved in this sport it takes more than just attending an event or two or joining a club. It is a lifestyle that we live. Many of my friends my age have young families, meager financial resources, and other "prioroties" in their lives. Our HRC club is comprised primarily of "young" board members and volunteers. Matter of fact, there are only 3 on the board over 40...our Prez, VP, SEC, Treasurer, and every single committee head is 35 or under. I hear every excuse under the sun at every single event we have as to why people cannot be in attendance. IMO, it is poor time management and poor prioritization...until I look at it from their shoes...that said, how do we attract and retain new blood? I don't know that its one thing in particular. Our club is comprised mainly of "our" training group. A bunch of like minded individuals doing what we love, sharing our time, talents, and other resources simply because we need each-others help, like one-another, and want to. Try putting some "younger" members in decision making roles. LISTEN to their thoughts and ideas. Believe it or not, we actually have some good ones from time to time. You want to attract and retain new members?? Easy, give them a reason to come and stay a while...give them a job....but don't boss them around. Make them an IMPORTANT part of the club's success and recognize them for their hard-work. IMO it's that simple...but then what the hell do I know...I'm one of these crazy retriever game fanatics....i just happen to be under 35.



Joe is right on with our club. Somehow we just found a group of guys and a few ladies that enjoy training and working together. We have differing age ranges and of course differing levels of dogs. We have young guys new to dogs and a couple veterans that have been doing it as long as some of the guys have been alive. Fortunately we dont have the problem of guys not pulling their weights when we get together. No matter who shows up with whatever level of dog- there is someone that is willing to help him/her if they need it. We are all the kings of sarcasm so you better have thick skin but guys like Jim Hodges and Bruce Overby and Joe help all of us that need it. We'll set up whatever ANYONE needs for their dogs and let everyone have equal line time if they want it. working on concepts and training tips. And were constantly talking and planning the "next" hunt test and everyone has a JOB and is used to get the event pulled off. this was a small club that was struggling first few years but this fall we had over 300 dogs and 3 finished flights go off without a hitch all weekend, because everyone TOOK ownership in the Test, talked it up at other hunt tests and worked our tails off and had a great time. 

For those that are struggling to find a place. Heck do like I did. Find a pro somewhat locally to you that is involved with the club. Our local pro said- call or come by anytime (I'm NOT sure he thought I'd bug him as much as I do) when he first invited me...lol. But if they invite you- GO and don't get in the way and help anyway you can. I did it and now end up, up there just about every week sometimes 2 times a week.


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## Losthwy (May 3, 2004)

I don't believe anything can be done to save Field Trials as we know them today. It's fast becoming a game of pay to play, single owners with large numbers of dogs trained by professionals, trials run mostly on professional's properties. Judging will go from bad to worse. In the not too distance future even the live gunners will have to be hired. For the few who remain and can afford it there will be fewer clubs and events to run. Not my idea of fun.


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## Ironwood (Sep 25, 2007)

Losthwy said:


> I don't believe anything can be done to save Field Trials as we know them today. It's fast becoming a game of pay to play, single owners with large numbers of dogs trained by professionals, trials run mostly on professional's properties. Judging will go from bad to worse. In the not too distance future even the live gunners will have to be hired. For the few who remain and can afford it there will be fewer clubs and events to run. Not my idea of fun.


For myself I am an optimist
it does not seem to be much use being anything else.
-Winston Churchill

Make thngs happen. In the face of challenges, overcome them and succeed.

Things a club can do.

1. Advertise your club. Think of all the registered Labradors in North America. Get a conversation going with a person looking to buy a dog. Place the ad for the club in the pet section of the news paper. It might read. "Are you looking for a working dog? Before you buy call our club repesentative."

2. If you are a Field Trialer or Hunt Test person bring the perspective buyer up to speed on what the these trained dogs can do. Demonstrate your dog with some drills.

3. Look for opportunities to demonstrate at fairs or sportman shows what talent and skill the dogs possess.

4. Call the new members out to the one on one or small sessions and work on keeping it simple.

5. Demographics and the growing number of baby boomers with time on their hands presents an opportunity trial and hunt test clubs to tap into. The added bonus is the baby boomers are mature and patient with a good chance the last of their adult children will have likely left the house. After all the youngest is by now age 32.

6. The older demographic have resources and time. What they lack in energy and speed they more than make up for with good judgement and a steady hand.

7. In many newspapers there is a lifestyle sectionthis goes for radio and television. There is an opportunity for the professional writer to publish articles about the great recreational activity of field sport competition dogs. It may be incumbent upon the publishers of Retriever News and/or Retriver Journal to submit an article or make available a guest to talk about our sport.

8. Lastly regarding what to do and this will be hard for the hunter/trialer with an accomplished dog to act on is, take an aquaintance out to a trial or a hunt test even to the duck blind or on an upland hunt. You just may spark an interest that grows to a passion. At the least you will have one other person who could potentionally refer a person who would be mad keen to work with dogs.

9. Focus and enjoy working with your dogs. The real reward is advancing/progressing your dog. The ribbons will come if you do the work. One pro on the west coast shared a thought with me that the certifcate paper from the AKC stating the dog he trained had become a Field Champion seemed so in-consequential to all the training and trials he had done with the dog.


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## Terry Johansson (Aug 24, 2009)

Well said Ironwood! Those are all great ideas. 

One of our clubs does several demos thru the year and personally we have worked with VT Fish & Wildlife to do demos at conservation camps for years. We also include a retriever demo in the hunter's safety classes we teach. 

For the last puppy I registered the AKC sent a letter outlining local dog clubs that do breed, obedience, agility etc. Our AKC member retriever club was not on the list. Hmmm...

I think outreach in any form is important to promote our sport.


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## TN_LAB (Jul 26, 2008)

bjoiner said:


> The one thing you can do to build members and get them involved is to *call newer members individually* and ask them to train. Just hosting training days once a month, etc. ain't going to do it. It takes making someone feel wanted and welcome for most people to become involved. A lot of times newer people feel like they are an inconvenience to training groups because their dogs aren't to the same level. Have them run your dogs and help out developing theirs. Take a personal interest in the new ones that show some interest and get them hooked.


I agree. 

Our club requires an existing member to sponsor new members when they join. I can't help but wonder if it would make sense for the existing member to assume that responsibility? I suspect a number of them already do that, but it'd be interesting if the process was a bit more formalized (i.e. "we haven't seen Joe and his pup in a few months...anybody heard from him?").


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## Jeffrey Towler (Feb 17, 2008)

"It also is hard for newcomers as the old timers do not always want to give up the power, or even be open to mew ideas. I am not sure how many times I have heard tradition as a reason why a suggestion would not work. You hear enough of that and it does not take much to say forget it "

I agree with you Zman1001


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## DarrinGreene (Feb 8, 2007)

Before I say ANYTHING I want to thank all the great people in the local area here who make NJ, DE, MD the retriever mecca that it really is. I don't know of anywhere else you can run as many events within 3 hours of home as here. This is because of people who are generous with their time, expertise and great grounds. Thank all of you.

I don't have all the answers to this and maybe I have none but as an old marketing guy whose trained to find and retain new customer, I think each club has to look at the services they offer compared against the needs of the audience(s). 

What I mean there is... 

Look at people who have dogs in your area and do more with them than pet them on the couch.

Have a look at obedience clubs, agility clubs, waterfowl hunters and so forth. Host a training day and invite members of these other clubs to come out, even if they don't have a retriever. We all have a lot to learn from each other so partnering to an extent with a schutzund, obedience or agility club gives you people interested in competing with dogs that might become interested in what we do. We might have people interested in their venue also, in the dead of winter obedience and agility events PACK a local horse arena nearby me with hundreds of participants. 

This weekend in my area is a great example. There's a HUGE hunting test going on. Fall weather in the 50's. It's going to be a great weekend, but how many of our local obedience, agility and schutzund competitors know it's going on? Very few I'll bet. 

If we would get 2 or 3 people who happen to be in the area to come by and just have a look at what these amazing dogs can do, they may be back. 

Exchanging email lists with those clubs or notifying their leadership for distribution might attract some interested people. 

No one has additional time for this outreach type work, which is understandable given the work the existing board members are already putting in. Maybe the club could use someone whose sole job it is to recruit and retain new members? Someone who has the knowledge to extend the clubs reach into social media and establish some connections to other clubs locally?

Who knows if it would be worth the effort, but you won't find or retain new members without focusing on the issue and getting the expertise and effort in place to make it happen.


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## sparksaume (Jan 27, 2011)

I dont chime in often, but being a newcomer to the sport i figured why not. I bought a pup almost 2 years ago because I wanted a hunting dog. Not just a dog that could pick up a duck, but I wanted the nicest dog at the boat ramp on any given morning. So I looked up reputable breeders, spent time researching dogs, and titles. Because at the time I had no clue what FC/AFC, QAA, or MH meant but I wanted to learn. So I bought the dog and purchased Lardy's training DVDs. After watching the first few sessions I quickly learned that I would need some help along the way, or I was just going to need to give up. So I began looking for like minded people, that had knowledge of the sport and were willing to help me. I trained by myself for over a year before I got into a training club. I started posting on a forum that I was looking for people to train with, I offered to come throw birds or plant blinds for anyone that would respond. Sadly I never got a reply to my first post, So I started another one saying the same thing, hoping that it just got missed by the people that I was trying to reach. Eventually a couple of people read my post and contacted me. Since then I regularly train with one (almost on a daily basis). Another guy contacted me about the NAHRC and mentioned that his club would be hosting a training day (which happened to be less than 5 miles from my house),so I attended my first group training effort with a 13 month old that had been trained entirely by one person, without any bird boys, zinger wingers, bumper boys, or any other training aid. Since that day I have become good friends with several members of the club, and attend regularly the training days hosted by the club. My pup is now 21 months old, just finished running derbies, we never had any success by most of the people on here's measure, but for a first time trainer that started with 1 dvd I feel that I have accomplished something for myself.
I said all of that to show that it can take some time to track down these club members and clubs. The effort taken to get into one of these training groups can sometimes outweigh the perceived reward. People that are getting into these types of animals should have easy access to clubs for their region, and more so local contacts that they can reach out to. The internet is great but you can’t get the impression you are welcome as easily over the internet as you can if you can hear someone’s voice, so phone numbers should be included for people willing to be contacted by “new comers”. Its hard to say what can keep these people around, since life sometimes gets in the way. And you either get bit by a bug or you don’t.


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## Ted Shih (Jan 20, 2003)

Danny Farmer has a saying: You can't talk someone into Field Trials. And once they get in, you can't talk them out of it.

It is something you want to do, or don't. Like Steve Shaver wrote, some dogs have that desire, others don't. I am relatively new to the sport, and began in 1999. 

Since then, I have seen lots of people come, wanting to set the world on fire. 

Most of them are gone. Not because anyone stepped on them. 

But, rather because if you want to compete and win, it takes a great dog, time, money, training grounds, and training partners. It is hard. But, those who remain are those who want that challenge and revel in it.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Ted Shih said:


> But, those who remain are those who want that challenge and revel in it.


Or we are just stupid? I've often question my sanity, not only from a practical stand point but from the looming commitments just around the corner (my judging assignments, club FT to put on with no firm grounds lined up and a judge to be replaced, and trying to get in some training time).....there are only so many hours in a given day, only some much energy to expend...our club is shrinking fast and we have tried all sorts of things to get and keep membership up....I swear I have a couple screws loose....I threaten my dogs every day that I'm going to trade them in for goldfish....


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## Rick_C (Dec 12, 2007)

Miriam Wade said:


> I'm going to stop after this. I don't disagree with what you wrote, but attitude can sometimes play a part. I know folks who have worked and not been respected in the process. You can't expect some new person to sit out in the canoe all day or plant the blind with no view of what's going on. I know some absolutely super folks who you would love to hunt and train with. These aren't whiners by nature, but really nice guys. After a couple of times being made to feel as though they were there only to work and not being offered any help, it no longer becomes attractive to them. It's a matter of give and take.
> 
> M


This post absolutely hits the nail on the head, especially in the hunt test game. When I started I'd never heard of hunt tests or field trials. A couple months later I showed up at a hunt test the club I just joined was putting on (without a dog to run) to help. I was walked out to a gun station, shown how to load a winger and when to shoot the popper and given a brief summary of how the test mechanics would work. It was June with temps in the low 90's and I didn't come out of the field until we finished the second series of the Master that evening. Still I showed up the next day to do it all over again. Same with the fall test. It was again quite warm, I again showed up at 7 am and stayed until we were done with the work both days but there was one difference. By then I knew who the club members were and my blood boiled at not even getting a potty break while watching several of them sitting in the gallery chatting and socializing all day while I worked my tail off. 

Thankfully I was too excited about the game and loved watching the dogs work so I wasn't about to quit. I wanted a dog that could do the work I was watching (or at least what I could see of it from my gun station). I'm sure many, if not most, brand new people would have been so put off that they would have been gone, never to return. I think about that now when we have new people and make sure to rotate them out of the field and let them watch dogs from the line while answering any questions they may have throughout the weekend.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Rick_C said:


> This post absolutely hits the nail on the head, especially in the hunt test game. When I started I'd never heard of hunt tests or field trials. A couple months later I showed up at a hunt test the club I just joined was putting on (without a dog to run) to help. I was walked out to a gun station, shown how to load a winger and when to shoot the popper and given a brief summary of how the test mechanics would work. It was June with temps in the low 90's and I didn't come out of the field until we finished the second series of the Master that evening. Still I showed up the next day to do it all over again. Same with the fall test. It was again quite warm, I again showed up at 7 am and stayed until we were done with the work both days but there was one difference. By then I knew who the club members were and my blood boiled at not even getting a potty break while watching several of them sitting in the gallery chatting and socializing all day while I worked my tail off.
> 
> Thankfully I was too excited about the game and loved watching the dogs work so I wasn't about to quit. I wanted a dog that could do the work I was watching (or at least what I could see of it from my gun station). I'm sure many, if not most, brand new people would have been so put off that they would have been gone, never to return. I think about that now when we have new people and make sure to rotate them out of the field and let them watch dogs from the line while answering any questions they may have throughout the weekend.


This is how I got my start except not only was I insulted, but my dog was too - the jerk called my baby boy a couch potato! Yet here I am many, many years later...stupid me. You either fall completely in love with this sport or you don't...


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## Gun_Dog2002 (Apr 22, 2003)

I have been a member of 3 clubs almost 20 years now. The questions and comments in this thread haven't changed from 20 years ago. At the end of the day people do what they want to do. At the same time people have to find value in the club. That is unique to each person. From a pure training perspective, club days don't offer me much. I can use my grounds to put better tests together and run a string of dogs in half the time and get more out of it. However for me I stay and participate in clubs because I love dogs and I love helping people with their dogs. One club I'm in is a pure upland hunting dog club with both flushing and pointing dogs. Nothing they do is remotely close to HT/FT work. Yet I go every month I can because I enjoy helping people with gundog basics. They key to success is finding ways for people to have fun and find value. Not an easy task for any club

/Paul


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## PhilBernardi (Jul 17, 2010)

There needs to be conscious attempts to bring minorities into this sport. Like it or not, US demographics are changing. 

There needs to be focused recruitment of non-bird hunters into this sport too.


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## Gun_Dog2002 (Apr 22, 2003)

Phil makes a good point. The trends of today with young people are not geared towards outdoor sports, especially a unique sport like ours. If we keep going like this the future of our sport is FT/HT for XBOX

/Paul


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## Mary Lynn Metras (Jul 6, 2010)

We started to talk about this topic while out training this morning. This is my opinion and without condeming anyone which would be easy to do these are my comments.
One concern discussed was the ability to help the newcomer if there was an issue with his/her dog when he came out for the club fun day. 
If the issue was not taken care of because of time or whatever the newcomer left feeling as if they had not accomplished much. Maybe they thought their dog was not any good or maybe they felt no better than when they started that morning. To them, they learned nothing. I have experienced those feelings!
True or not newcomers expectations may not be what clubs are expecting of them. 
Maybe if one person were designated at the fun match, helped correct the problem (by simplifying or?) and told them one thing to work on, maybe it could be better experience for them. They could leave taking ownership or leave feeling better about the experience.
I vividly can remember back seven or 8 years ago how difficult, it was to fit in. 
I believe the statement one fellow made you have to have a good dog. Might even be a good black dog!
So often, people show up, totally uninformed, think their dog is going out there to do what all those other dogs are doing. They do not realize the work involved. 
I know I did not know what was expected! I can tell you owning HR Blackie I sometimes wonder why I am still marching along. We went down the wrong garden path repeatedly. It was costly both money wise, on the dog and myself. It was also bad for the dog.
I can also tell you I have seen much that did not impress me. I have had many comments made to me that were enough to put you off. I am persistence, do love my dogs and the sport and here I am. 
Then you get somebody who does want to help but really with too much information overloading you. When you go home, you are thinking what was that he said.
As a newcomer, you have to be prepared to sift through what info you have received. 
Move on each time with the information even if it is baby steps but be persistent. 
Get your questions answered-if you do not; keep asking. 
Do not be afraid to make a mistake that is how you learn. Take constructive criticism!
You have to be prepared to work long hours, poor weather and help wherever you can. 
Work with your dog because it takes many hours; maybe a couple dogs for you to be comfortable with the process, terminology and actual running of your dog. 
Best experience was this summer training those days with Al Arthur. Just sat and watched all day. Asked questions, assisted and ran my dog- so valuable. Gained understanding that I might not have gotten otherwise. Got opportunities that might not have come along. I recommend to newcomers to go for the day training with an experienced pro or person. Watch and learn!
You have to be persistent!
Those DVDs out now are a great help to explain but there is nothing like doing!! And that is if you really want to. Your attitude is number one and that is with anything in life.


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## Joe Dutro (Nov 20, 2007)

I have sat here and read this whole thread and I have a couple of comments.

As a younger member of our club, I'm 40, I don't see the older members as wanting to hold onto the power. But rather they know if they don't do the job no one else will. I joined OVRC 4 years ago. Became a board member 3 years ago. And became the president for the last 2 years. Most of the older (experienced) members have offered their advice anytime I ask. But very rarely do they tell me what to do. I may get told that "we've tried it in the past, but go ahead" when I have a new idea. Either way I have always felt welcomed.

In regards to attracting new members. Our club has done special training days at a local hunt club where we did not run our dogs. We advertised it. We had many hunters show up with dogs that couldn't find a food dish let alone a bird. We broke down into groups to work with them on an individual level. And at the end of the day we ended up with 3 new members all of which who are still ACTIVE members of the club. Another guy joined an HRC club and is a very active member there. It took a day out of our clubs training, but we did it to better the club, better our sport and hopefully better the dogs. We also went to a waterfowl show this past summer. 5 new members--- wll they stay? I don't know but I know 2 of them are looking like good members so far.

Keeping new members. One of the biggest complaints from members hear is that they get nothing out of a training day. You show up get to run maybe 2 set ups and spend the whole day there doing it. Where if I was by myself I could go out run 4 setups and be home by noon. And my dogs would get more out of it. I personally go to training days for the atmosphere so my dogs think they are at a test and I like to run last. Clubs need to keep new members entertained and help them out. If you don't why should they be there. Hire workers fr the training day. We charge $3 per club dog at a training day to help defray costs. NO non club dogs (client dogs) at our training days. Have lunch- bring a grill make it a fun training day. Does OVRC do this everytime-- NO but we are trying new things.

Hunt Tests: Last year I believe we did one of the best things we could do for members at our HT. Hired ALL workers for out in the field. Club mebers still do the marshalling, gunning of fliers and equipment stuff, but the people in the field are not members. They are paid. This has helped tremendiously with atitudes at the tests. If you can afford it- do it. 

In regards to age: I am 40 with a wife and 3 children- 15,13, and 9. I have 2 jobs, coach baseball in the spring, I've chaired 3 of the last 4 HT and as I said I am the president of our club (for this year anyway). Time for me is at a premimum. I love his sport I love waching dogs do their thing and I love seeing when all of your hard work pays off and the light bulb comes on and the dog understands. That is why I do it. That is why I am an active part of the club. Its not about me, its about the sport and the dogs. As for my family and involvement. Ty my 9 yr old ran his first HT this past June (see below). Abby, 15 is getting her own dog to train in Febuary. My wife took Rose and made her into a couch dog. Jessie, 13 is my bird girl and OB trainer.


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## cpmm665 (Jan 6, 2009)

Mary Lynn Metras said:


> We started to talk about this topic while out training this morning. This is my opinion and without condeming anyone which would be easy to do these are my comments.
> One concern discussed was the ability to help the newcomer if there was an issue with his/her dog when he came out for the club fun day.
> If the issue was not taken care of because of time or whatever the newcomer left feeling as if they had not accomplished much. Maybe they thought their dog was not any good or maybe they felt no better than when they started that morning. To them, they learned nothing. I have experienced those feelings!
> True or not newcomers expectations may not be what clubs are expecting of them.
> ...


I agree with many of your points which is why I stress educating new members. I too remember showing up at a Club training session and having absolutely no clue about what we were about to experience (what do I need to bring, how long will it take, how do I throw a bumper or operate a winger). I haven't been playing these games very long (5 years), so when I became Secretary of BCRC and began serving on committees, the New hadn't wore off. I made a very conscious effort to provide potential and New members with as much information as possible (training programs, supply vendors, what to to expect at a Club training session). The folks who were committed to putting a working title on their dog outlasted Joe Hunter every time especially when New folks were told the Club training session could be 6 or more hours of their weekend. That is another reason why I encourage New folks to utilize the membership list and connect with folks in their area, but as many of us find out, those smaller cliques already have enough folks in their groups. However, I still believe the Club training sessions to be valuable and inspirational if you have a mix of beginner and advanced and a competent/compassionate leader for the group.

One point that I find Newbs getting hung up on or resistant too is being advised to follow a dedicated retriever training program. It seems some feel their $30 membership fee includes the training of their dog. This isn't the case of course and why pro's are in business. The Retriever Club can however aid in making connections with folks who can assist you in learning the mechanics of running a dog and the training process. I was very fortunate when I started, I had a good dog and folks close by willing to help me learn for the cost of a few nights per week throwing birds.

The time commitment is tremendous if you want to train a competitive dog, and I see the most commitment from those with competitive spirits and those who just love doing activities with their dogs. Retriever Fever seems to be one of things you are all in or not. I did some agility with my dogs but it didn't hook me like HT's and Trials.

Again on the education theme, seminars; handling, judging, e-collar conditioning, etc. These are a draw and encourage retention. Who steps up to Chair these events? Probably one of the 10%'s who already has a full plate. 

Mentoring: I'm one of those sappy folks who believes in paying it forward and giving back. The most frustrating thing I've encountered in mentoring is folks who don't do their homework. If you can't or won't, that's what Pro's are for.

First time working an EVENT: Being understaffed at a HT or FT seems to be the norm, unfortunately for the Newbie, they don't know that, and whom ever is in charge of the workforce needs to convey that to the individual, as well as praising and thanking the heck to them. I wish all Clubs had the ability to rotate and spell the workforce, unfortunately it's not the norm and it's a blessing when someone in the gallery steps up to help.

Promoting via Social Media: Three years ago BCRC went almost an entire year with no Web Master to manage the site. I stepped up to at least do a Facebook page. The venue has worked well and makes us easy to find and refer folks to. It's easy to say, "do a search on Facebook for Black Creek Retriever Club". Facebook has been great for hosting our Club event pictures, training articles, meetings etc. As well as providing a direct link to our website with contact information.

What do Folks Want?: I believe that is a valid question for a Membership application. As is, How may we help you succeed? And, How will you Help US succeed in our Mission statement? Accepting a $25-35 membership fee helps pay the bills for sure, but who can you rely on for those one or two AKC events per year? 

We really are a small community in the grand scheme of life, and if we desire to maintain support groups for our addiction, we will find a way. The flip side of that is if we don't and Retriever Clubs die, that opens the door to privatization.


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## Glenn Norton (Oct 23, 2011)

Reading most responses, I note that we all know what the problems are, but seem to lack the ability to deal with them.
Most new people to our sport can only train their dogs on weekends or in the evenings. Most of our experienced Field trial folks are retired. They train during the day and hit the trial circuit for most of the summer. We, as a commumity, must perhaps make some adjustments in our training schedules, to accomodate the new people in our sport. This just might Help!!

Throughout North America, the people who work extremely hard at their local trials, are not always the Field Trial Keeners. They dedicate their time and their energy to Marshall, to Judge, to Cook and to make their trial a success and to support our great sport. Yet I have witnessed, on many occasions, where the Field trial elite, criticize the tests, the judgment of their dogs and the amateur like way a trial was run. This shamefull attitude does nothing to enhance our sport, it only serves to dishearten those who are being criticized and to turn them off of a sport they thought was understanding, thoughful and yes, FUN.
We should all take a long look in the mirror and recount the number of times we have done these very things. We say we do them for the betterment of the sport, when, in fact, we do them for our own desire to be smarter and more WISE than the other guy.
I have witnessed on many occasions the experienced trialer talking to the newer folks. Most of the time the conversations are providing helpfull advise and council, but all to often the conversations relate to picking at another another Field trialer or a Judge or a Test. This must really appeal to the new person in the sport, who is looking for, not only help, but comaraderie and a family of like enthusiasts. I myself have fallen victim to my own pettiness and I will make an effort to STOP IT.

Imagine the 1st time you had gone golfing and the mentors and wise ones you were golfing with, ridiculed your BEST EFFORTS. You would really want to get right back to it!! NOT LIKELY

Attitude is key. It can be positve or negative. It is really up to you. Now take that hard look in the mirror!!!!!!!


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## Cleo Watson (Jun 28, 2006)

Another observation for consideration. Those who originally started the clubs, nurtured it and brought in and helped novices train their dogs are all of a sudden 'old fogies', don't know anything and are dragging their feet into what the newbies think is the only way to go. They have changed the original concept of the club and push out the charter members. Very soon those who love and work the sport give up and let the newbies have it and down goes the club. Guess who gets the blame. Not the only reason for the decline but sure is a good one to think about. I know, I am one of those old fogies and tired of fighting a losing cause. (I'm outnumbered)


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## Sundown49 aka Otey B (Jan 3, 2003)

Cleo Watson said:


> Another observation for consideration. Those who originally started the clubs, nurtured it and brought in and helped novices train their dogs are all of a sudden 'old fogies', don't know anything and are dragging their feet into what the newbies think is the only way to go. They have changed the original concept of the club and push out the charter members. Very soon those who love and work the sport give up and let the newbies have it and down goes the club. Guess who gets the blame. Not the only reason for the decline but sure is a good one to think about. I know, I am one of those old fogies and tired of fighting a losing cause. (I'm outnumbered)


AMEN Miss Cleo!!


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## Steve Shaver (Jan 9, 2003)

Another thing that I think keeps new people away is getting whacked in the first series. I have seen a good number of minor stakes whack 50 to 75% of the dogs in the first series. Sometimes its because the judges want to get done because they have to judge another stake and are pressed for time.
A lot of times it's not about which dog does the best job it's about which dog can do the test period. The open is one thing but I dont think this should happen in the derby or qual. Pretty discouraging to new people. I have even seen this happen in DQ's that are trying to attract cross overs form hunt tests.
I have seen derbies and quals both where only 1 or two dogs finish the trial. No second thrid or fourth place not to mention jams


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## flatcoatfun (May 29, 2008)

This has been an awesome discussion! 

I am a member of many clubs from obedience, to breed clubs to field. They all have the same problems. 

Solutions - 
Communication - communication - communication 
It seems that the new members apprciate and thrive on the more information I can give. 

-- nametags for everyone at teaching days 
-- "teaching days" (instead of calling them training days) 
-- maps of the property so new people don't get lost trying to find where they are going
-- RSVP for training days (not required but appreciated and this has helped planning tremendously) 
-- an agenda of what drills and set ups will be offered sent out in advance of each "teaching day" 
--plan the dates of teaching days and events a year in advance if possible 
-- facebook and web site keep updated and active 
--Recruit "chairs" for different areas of responsibility (equipment, hospitality, marshals, training days) - and then encourage and help them to recruit their committee members this takes work! But it has paid off greatly for our club. Several of our chairs were very new to the club - but with the help and support of the experienced - they have really jumped in and have done a fantastic job. 
--I have to say that one of the things that helped our club the most - was bringing back a previous president who is also one of our landowners, he suprised us all by announcing at the annual meeting that his property would be available to all members to train on at any time - provided that they volunteer at one event per year. I'll tell ya - that first mock test we held the next month - I had volunteers lined up 2-3 deep - which was also great that people did not have to work all day, and they could run their dogs. 
--also identify volunteers with talent and interests and put them to work. One lady creates maps for a living - so she does maps for us. Finally after several years of looking - a new member said he had some web building skills - and man he has done an incredible job on our web site. 

Our club also had to face the reality that though we are an HRC club "for hunters, by hunters" the club member majority are people who Don't hunt and just want a title on their dog. We were not getting enough entries in our HT, so we switched to a one day Mock Test - and made more money and more people raved about that is what they needed - ability to practice in a HT like setting. Our Teaching days have gone from doing one big set up - where you stayed all day to run your dog once - to multiple areas for different levels- people love it. Then 2x a year we are holding a big Mock Test, and 1 x per year we are holding a HT. 

So in summary - communication - 
and Support new volunteers - if they don't work in one job, find a different one and give them lots of support until they are successful 

Thanks
Alison


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