# 2021 - National Retriever Championship - Cheraw, SC



## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

I'm looking forward to following along with the 2021 NRC. The weather is currently looking like it should be excellent. 94 entries (appears to be the final tally). 

A lot of fantastic dogs and handlers. Good luck to all! 

*Link to the Blog*: 2021 NRC


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Yes! Best of luck to all!


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Curious how many people on here know someone personally
1) running a dog(s) includes both amateurs and pros
2) working on a committee
3) owner of a dog qualified being run by a pro


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

I will start
1) I know 16 Amateurs running their own dogs
2) know all the pros except 3 (all early in their careers whose paths I have not crossed)
3) lots of people working on committees
4) 26 owners of dogs being handled by a pro
5) 76 dogs that I know owner and/or handler 
and I’ve been at this for 50 years, you’d think by now I would know everyone but then everyone does not know me either😉


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Familiar with some dogs, handlers and pros. Can't claim to know them. I have not looked at who is on the committees.


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

EdA said:


> Curious how many people on here know someone personally
> 1) running a dog(s) includes both amateurs and pros
> 2) working on a committee
> 3) owner of a dog qualified being run by a pro


1 - I "know" only three of the Am's running. Have met a few others but I wouldn't say I know them. I am familiar with some of the other Am names but not people that I have met or know. 
2- I have met 3 people that are on a committee. 
3 - Just a couple


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## Dave Kress (Dec 20, 2004)

I know most of them; envious as my team came up short ( again)?
headed over for the annual meeting and first few days
Best wishes to the whole bunch !


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## Andy (Apr 20, 2004)

An interesting question Doc ....
Presuming that "knowing" means more than just meeting them or judging them, I know 10 amateur handlers and 9 pros, plus 2 of the judges. 
I know quite a few of the officers and committee members. 
Striving to get back in the game at that level ... it ain't easy!


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

I’ll be throwing birds several days. Does that count?


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Kyle Garris said:


> I’ll be throwing birds several days. Does that count?


It counts extra in my opinion. The NRC happens because people like you, dedicated to the cause, take time off from work and family to work the trial while paying their own expenses. Without that it would never happen.


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## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

EdA said:


> Curious how many people on here know someone personally
> 1) running a dog(s) includes both amateurs and pros
> 2) working on a committee
> 3) owner of a dog qualified being run by a pro


2 Out of 3 ain’t bad. (Definitely not #3)!


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## Happy Gilmore (Feb 29, 2008)

I always liked Lanse's comment about friends lol


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

EdA said:


> It counts extra in my opinion. The NRC happens because people like you, dedicated to the cause, take time off from work and family to work the trial while paying their own expenses. Without that it would never happen.


Thank you for the kind words, Dr. Ed. That means an awful lot coming from you.


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## Gregg0211 (Feb 11, 2015)

EdA said:


> I will start
> 1) I know 16 Amateurs running their own dogs
> 2) know all the pros except 3 (all early in their careers whose paths I have not crossed)
> 3) lots of people working on committees
> ...


I dont know a single person, but I have favorites that Ive seen run. They might not win, place or show, but I thoroughly enjoy reading about them and hope to see a National one day. I kinda laugh when I see the SRS quote of "Where the big dogs run" because these are the big dogs. From a wannabe standpoint, this is the World Series, NFL World Championship and the College Natty all rolled into one!


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## bjoiner (Feb 25, 2008)

I am an assistant chief marshal. Been a week of hard work, but we’ll worth it. I will say all three of these judges have worked hard at making sure all the tests are fair to the dogs. I look forward to seeing the results of the past week’s work over each series next week. There have been many that have stepped up this week to help out, and I can’t thank them enough. There has also been several with a lot more experience than I have that have offered their help that has been much appreciated. Good week to come, guaranteed.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

Looks like the weather is going to be good all week.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)




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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Kyle Garris said:


> Looks like the weather is going to be good all week.


The two most important factors for a good worker experience are good weather and judges who get along.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

53. FC Meadow Woods Whispering Willow; I have only seen her run one time. The first series quad got the best of her and ate up the field. I remember because Jake did it near perfect, then I mishandled on the LB. She is an Aunt to my Lily and will have my attention.

5. FC-AFC Drake's Bay Izzy; A very nice girl, fun to watch, have seen her run several times. Her owner, Rick Wilke, is a good competitor and retriever man as well.

33. FC Heartbeat's Sweet Georgia Peach; Peaches is a very nice dog and there is no better handler than Andy. It is a rare occasion to see Julie at a field trial without a smile on her face.

52. FC-AFC Hyflyer’s Life In The Fast Line; Crash ran a very good Nat Am and has done well since then. Randy and Mary are among the best of the best in the field trial world.

Best wishes to all.


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

Nice first series today. How is it from the bird station Kyle?


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Anything the judges got was a bonus, the biggest thing two series finished on the first day. While it might not seem like it that is a very big deal.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

birddogn_tc said:


> Nice first series today. How is it from the bird station Kyle?


Here’s the view from short retired.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

Kyle Garris said:


> Here’s the view from short retired.
> View attachment 87876
> View attachment 87876


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

And….got to meet Bubba Joiner.


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

Kyle Garris said:


> And….got to meet Bubba Joiner.





Kyle Garris said:


> Here’s the view from short retired.
> View attachment 87876
> View attachment 87876


Thanks for sharing. Keep us posted


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## rble7117 (Jul 23, 2020)

I know FC AFC Abby’s Physician of Antioch, Luke. Sire to my female puppy.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

rble7117 said:


> I know FC AFC Abby’s Physician of Antioch, Luke. Sire to my female puppy.


Who’s the dam?


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## Frostyhollow (Feb 7, 2021)

When I booked my current pup over a year ago the breeder mentioned that the sire of his young dog, Tucker (44 this year) was running in last years NRC. In the process I started looking at what dogs show up regularly in pedigrees of winning or high placing dogs. 

Clearly there are many dogs that have a strong history and others that are talented but less well known. It looks like one heck of a competition.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

It appears that today's third series might resemble the third series of the NARC in terms of how many answers it gets.


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## rble7117 (Jul 23, 2020)

Kyle Garris said:


> Who’s the dam?





Kyle Garris said:


> Who’s the dam?


dam is calicreek’s one to remember, Remi


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

drunkenpoacher said:


> It appears that today's third series might resemble the third series of the NARC in terms of how many answers it gets.


Seems to be going slightly better now with improved lighting and wind conditions. A nice test.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

birddogn_tc said:


> Seems to be going slightly better now with improved lighting and wind conditions. A nice test.


I'm wondering what effect the change in wind direction has on the test? Is it giving up one or more birds?


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## David Maddox (Jan 12, 2004)

I know a few pros, amateurs, owners, and not as many dogs as I’d like to see there.
I worked, threw birds and had a setup dog for the 2020 NRC.
I’ve been in the gallery 2000, ‘04, ‘08, ‘12, ‘20.
I’ve also been honored to have had 3 pups run in the NRC with 1 as a Finalist in ‘09.
Lots of fun!!!
I always pull for a male to win just to see them become the “taste of the month(s)” as a sire😎


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## Peter Balzer (Mar 15, 2014)

The test is holding up and continuing to get some answers and moving slightly faster this morning through the first 10-12 dogs. About 9 mins per dog versus 11-12 mins yesterday. Thoughts on a 4th series? Water blind from same location?


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

It does feel like it is moving a little faster today. Who is there? What's the latest scoop?


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## David Maddox (Jan 12, 2004)

birddogn_tc said:


> It does feel like it is moving a little faster today. Who is there? What's the latest scoop?


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## David Maddox (Jan 12, 2004)

Looks like the 3rd series was a bugger!!! I believe there were 20 handles😳


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

16 dropped in the 3rd. 4th series: Water blind at Mallard Pond tomorrow.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

Scratch that. They started the water blind today.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Water blind, right up until the call backs those of us at home will know if a dog lined it, got picked up or was somewhere in between.


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

drunkenpoacher said:


> Water blind, right up until the call backs those of us at home will know if a dog lined it, got picked up or was somewhere in between.


lol. yep!


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)




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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

40% of he trIal done and 80% of the dogs still in, there is a bloodbath coming, probably more than one


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## Vance_kaz (Nov 3, 2018)

EdA said:


> 40% of he trIal done and 80% of the dogs still in, there is a bloodbath coming, probably more than one


I was thinking the same thing but will it be in the 5th?


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

EdA said:


> 40% of he trIal done and 80% of the dogs still in, there is a bloodbath coming, probably more than one


No doubt there is and there are a number of dogs bleeding already.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

It appears that the hen pheasant fliers are being uncooperative.


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## Vance_kaz (Nov 3, 2018)

drunkenpoacher said:


> It appears that the hen pheasant fliers are being uncooperative.


They must be eager to fly 3 in a row


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## labsforme (Oct 31, 2003)

Good flying hen pheasant can make a decent gunner look silly. Don't ask me how I know.🙄


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

labsforme said:


> Good flying hen pheasant can make a decent gunner look silly. Don't ask me how I know.🙄


A good thrower makes a difference too, even then they can be troublesome. A friend of mine will break the tip of one wing, he says it makes them fly straight. Could be just luck but they usually do. Against the rules in a trial anyway.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Vance_kaz said:


> I was thinking the same thing but will it be in the 5th?


It will start in the 5th, if you have problems better have a clean slate up to now


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## Gary M (Dec 5, 2008)

Did anyone see dog #81 Smokey’s rerun? His first no-bird was at 11:51. Blog doesn’t say anything about his rerun. Just curious.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Gary M said:


> Did anyone see dog #81 Smokey’s rerun? His first no-bird was at 11:51. Blog doesn’t say anything about his rerun. Just curious.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

I’ll be back first thing in the morning slinging birds again (I wasn’t there today.) Sounds like a tough test.


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## Don Smith (Mar 23, 2004)

I drove down there Sunday night to breed one of mine to Tucker. Stopped at the repro vet in Hartsville to board her for two days then went to the National got to see part of the third series Monday morning, then headed to the vet with Alex at 2. I stayed at the vet's until she was in recovery - we did a side by side with surgical AI. Finally checked into the motel that night (after being awake for 40 hours). Got to see some of the fourth series Tuesday morning, including getting to see Tucker 2 whistle the blind, then headed to the vet to pick my dog up. Got home at 9 last night. Whirlwind trip for sure, but really enjoyed seeing some of these great dogs run.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

View from the long retired.


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## Vance_kaz (Nov 3, 2018)

When do you think the 10th series will begin? I have to drop a dog off to Jason baker and would like to try and watch at least the last series


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## Trent Goree (Aug 10, 2005)

Vance_kaz said:


> When do you think the 10th series will begin? I have to drop a dog off to Jason baker and would like to try and watch at least the last series


Saturday


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Vance_kaz said:


> When do you think the 10th series will begin? I have to drop a dog off to Jason baker and would like to try and watch at least the last series


Lucky you!


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## Vance_kaz (Nov 3, 2018)

Tobias said:


> Lucky you!


Key word "TRY" lol I rather drive to SC instead of GA


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Vance_kaz said:


> Key word "TRY" lol I rather drive to SC instead of GA


In the words of a famous being there is no trying - there is only do or do not 🤣🤣


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

Tobias said:


> In the words of a famous being there is no trying - there is only do or do not 🤣🤣


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

75 degrees an 25% humidity is too hot to continue?


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## mjiorle (Mar 11, 2008)

Cover. And, that field can produce some BIG hunts. I'm sure the decision was not made lightly


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

One would assume that this possible eventuality was anticipated and thanks to everyone whose choice was the well being of the dogs. Having been involved with overheated dogs at a National Amateur as a worker and as a contestant I appreciate the thought process of the judges and the FTC.


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

Bummer. Hope all dogs are safe. Now how am I supposed to occupy my time... if I am not hitting refresh all day?


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Always better to be safe than sorry - no one needs the extra stress of worrying about a dog overheating on an extended hunt(s). Everyone deserves to play and not worry about whether they will have to pick up their dog due to overheating.


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

I'd love to hear how dog 60 will be judged tomorrow. Isn't it all marks thrown, but only judged on the marks that he did not pick up today?

Rex came to the line at 12:46 pm.

Left flyer - Rex hunted close to the guns, went behind the tree, and then deep and back to the guns. He went deep both up and down the hill and had an extended hunt.

The judges asked Ed to pick up his dog.

(He will rerun at the end of the series tomorrow.)


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## Gary M (Dec 5, 2008)

EdA said:


> One would assume that this possible eventuality was anticipated and thanks to everyone whose choice was the well being of the dogs. Having been involved with overheated dogs at a National Amateur as a worker and as a contestant I appreciate the thought process of the judges and the FTC.


Doc, with the forecast high of 78 tomorrow and the number of dogs remaining to run the 5th, it looks like they should be able to finish the series tomorrow before it gets too hot. Going forward then, with 5 series to go and temps being seasonal the rest of the week in the 60s, as a Judge, are there any adjustments necessary to finish this thing on Sat? Or do you just run the tests they have setup and get done when you get done?


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

From what I’ve seen/heard, expect lots of cuts going to the 6th.


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## Judd (Nov 29, 2012)

Tobias said:


> I'd love to hear how dog 60 will be judged tomorrow. Isn't it all marks thrown, but only judged on the marks that he did not pick up today?
> 
> Rex came to the line at 12:46 pm.
> 
> ...


Based off what the blog said it doesn’t sound like he picked a bird up?


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Judd said:


> Based off what the blog said it doesn’t sound like he picked a bird up?


Yes - I don't know why I was thinking he picked up the go bird. Just wasn't thinking I guess!!


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Gary M said:


> Doc, with the forecast high of 78 tomorrow and the number of dogs remaining to run the 5th, it looks like they should be able to finish the series tomorrow before it gets too hot. Going forward then, with 5 series to go and temps being seasonal the rest of the week in the 60s, as a Judge, are there any adjustments necessary to finish this thing on Sat? Or do you just run the tests they have setup and get done when you get done?


In 2018 we had 42 different tests that we did in setup, some were reversals in a field depending on the wind others completely different tests in the same field, all were accurately timed and diagramed by Jean Wu (an unheralded member of the crew). We lost 1/2 day due to icy roads between series 6 and 7 and the icy footing affected the placement of our line for the 7th series water blind. We were confident in the timing but we never got to do our favorite set of marks because the wind was wrong for an 8th or 9th series and it was too much test for earlier in the trial. We did not love our 9th series water marks but we had no good alternative and tweaked it, had one great mark and another that got many more answers than we anticipated plus the water was cold from an overnight freeze and I think affected some of the dogs so we got much more than we expected . They have lots off flexibility without sacrificing quality and it appears they could lose more than 1/3 of the field on this test. They are in good shape and their combined experience will not cause them to panic. I am told by a very reliable source that it has been hard and nothing suggests that it will not continue to be, as it should.


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## Gary M (Dec 5, 2008)

EdA said:


> In 2018 we had 42 different tests that we did in setup, some were reversals in a field depending on the wind others completely different tests in the same field, all were accurately timed and diagramed by Jean Wu (an unheralded member of the crew). We lost 1/2 day due to icy roads between series 6 and 7 and the icy footing affected the placement of our line for the 7th series water blind. We were confident in the timing but we never got to do our favorite set of marks because the wind was wrong for an 8th or 9th series and it was too much test for earlier in the trial. We did not love our 9th series water marks but we had no good alternative and tweaked it, had one great mark and another that got many more answers than we anticipated plus the water was cold from an overnight freeze and I think affected some of the dogs so we got much more than we expected . They have lots off flexibility without sacrificing quality and it appears they could lose more than 1/3 of the field on this test. They are in good shape and their combined experience will not cause them to panic. I am told by a very reliable source that it has been hard and nothing suggests that it will not continue to be, as it should.


That’s a great perspective and yes it looks like there will be significant losses on this test. 13 PUs alone so far. Just went back and re-read the 2018 Blog. You guys started with over 100 running dogs and were down to 37 called back to the 6th which was completed on a Wed. I don’t think the cuts will be that big tomorrow, but you never know. They’ll need to trim the field soon enough though to finish on Sat. I just looked at your 8th and 9th series and see what you mean. Forgot how cold it was that year. You guys sure had your hands full with the winter weather which caused late start times especially early in the week.


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## mjh345 (Jun 17, 2006)

Per the callback page there have already been 13 PU's and 12 Handles; and still 14 dogs left to run the 5th
My sources say there have been some {lots} of big ugly hunts in the 5th, as well as some dogs that were called back after the 3rd with far less than stellar work. Could be a few dogs with handles in then 5th called back, with a number of "clean" {non handles} dropped
Wouldn't be surprised to see a BIG cut after the 5th.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

mjh345 said:


> Per the callback page there have already been 13 PU's and 12 Handles; and still 14 dogs left to run the 5th
> My sources say there have been some {lots} of big ugly hunts in the 5th, as well as some dogs that were called back after the 3rd with far less than stellar work. Could be a few dogs with handles in then 5th called back, with a number of "clean" {non handles} dropped
> Wouldn't be surprised to see a BIG cut after the 5th.


A big cut would be 50%, that big?


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

I think it’ll be close.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Kyle Garris said:


> I think it’ll be close.


It is unwritten but traditional at Nationals that dogs get two major mistakes to be dropped however if the first mistake comes at a series with a big cut that does not always hold true. Generally a handle is a handle although there are varying degrees depending largely on what happened prior to the handle. A big hunt should count the same regardless of the test although a big hunt on a mark that caused few problems looks lots worse. I was told three dogs did not get wet on the water blind, those dogs are only a toe stub away from elimination. A big cut would be 35-40 dogs.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

EdA said:


> A big cut would be 35-40 dogs


40 it is


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

EdA said:


> a handle is a handle although there are varying degrees depending largely on what happened prior to the handle.


Meaning a big hunt before the handle?


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

drunkenpoacher said:


> Meaning a big hunt before the handle?


I would say a big out of the area hunt or what I call a blankout handle when the dog doesn’t have a clue and is handled early because it had no recollection of the mark. Often those handles look better on paper because, since the dog had no recollection of the mark, it was compliant. In my opinion blackouts are worse because the dog had to be handled to the area from a distance.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

EdA said:


> I would say a big out of the area hunt or what I call a blankout handle when the dog doesn’t have a clue and is handled early because it had no recollection of the mark.


What I call a "Big Hunt" is a hunt out of the AOF.
A friend who is a very experienced judge once told me, a handle or big hunt, it makes no difference, the dog didn't mark the fall. He was speaking generally, not absolutely.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

drunkenpoacher said:


> What I call a "Big Hunt" is a hunt out of the AOF.
> A friend who is a very experienced judge once told me, a handle or big hunt, it makes no difference, the dog didn't mark the fall. He was speaking generally, not absolutely.


Some handles are better than some big hunts, much depends on the circumstances prior to the handle. Going to the area, hunting, failing to find, and leave handles are much better than handle to the area of the fall handles.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)




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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Kyle Garris said:


> Dr. Ed,
> Traditionally, what are the 8th and 9th series? They still haven’t used the Wood Duck pond or the water at Goose Pond (they can go as big as they want there.) If my memory is correct, when the NRC was here last time that’s what they did, a huge set up at Goose Pond for the 10th.


One more set of land marks and one more set of water marks and maybe some combination of land and water marks for the last 3 series. 8 could be a land quad or a combo land/water marks, 9 probably big water marks, and 10
big land quad with multiple fliers although they could flip 9 and 10


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

Double digit North wind predicted for today. Should be interesting!


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## Gary M (Dec 5, 2008)

Kyle Garris said:


> Double digit North wind predicted for today. Should be interesting!


On the long middle retired, have you seen any dogs take a piece of the first pond? Hard to tell from reading the blog but they did mention it was on line.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

It’s been almost an hour since the last update, what’s up Kyle?


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

Unfortunately, I’m not there today. (Darn job!) But I’ll be there tomorrow.


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## joeyrhoades (Feb 23, 2015)

What is Interference?

Think that is the first time I have seen that one.


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## Gary M (Dec 5, 2008)

joeyrhoades said:


> What is Interference?
> 
> Think that is the first time I have seen that one.


I’d like to hear what happened as well. Sometimes it’s attributed to the honor dog interfering with the running dog. Not sure what happened in this case


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## joeyrhoades (Feb 23, 2015)

Gary M said:


> I’d like to hear what happened as well. Sometimes it’s attributed to the honor dog interfering with the running dog. Not sure what happened in this case


Yes, that is the one I am referring to.

I am guessing either the honor dog or somehow the "retired" gunners did something


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

joeyrhoades said:


> What is Interference?
> 
> Think that is the first time I have seen that one.


This from a friend who is there
the photographer’s camera started clicking. Luke became interested in it and didn’t see the left retired or flyer.


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## joeyrhoades (Feb 23, 2015)

EdA said:


> This from a friend who is there
> the photographer’s camera started clicking. Luke became interested in it and didn’t see the left retired or flyer.


Interesting. Thanks for the clarification and information.

I have seen way less distract a dog.


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## Peter Balzer (Mar 15, 2014)

Fun observation but, I believe there are 7 female handlers pushing deep into this NRC! Very nice to see for the sport. Not sure how this compares to years prior.

Might have to go back and see what the ratio of guys to gals on the full 94 dogs.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Peter Balzer said:


> Fun observation but, I believe there are 7 female handlers pushing deep into this NRC! Very nice to see for the sport. Not sure how this compares to years prior.
> 
> Might have to go back and see what the ratio of guys to gals on the full 94 dogs.


Maybe more meaningful for the health of the game what is the percentage of amateur handlers and how many of them are female. There professional female handlers by memory, Ty Rorem, Lynn Troy, and Luann Pleasant.


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## Peter Balzer (Mar 15, 2014)

EdA said:


> Maybe more meaningful for the health of the game what is the percentage of amateur handlers and how many of them are female. There professional female handlers by memory, Ty Rorem, Lynn Troy, and Luann Pleasant.


Best guess is around 22ish handlers are amateurs and probably 7-8 of those amateurs are women. I have a very short frame of reference but at first blush it seems more diverse than prior years.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Amateurs have generally been handlers of 1/4 to 1/3 of entries In the NRC. I don’t think the percentage of female handlers has changed much, just some new faces.


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

By my count, at the start of the event there were:

29 Total Amateurs
21 Male Amateur Handlers
8 Amateur Female Handlers

14 Total Female Handlers
8 Am Female Handlers
6 Pro Female Handlers


Here is a breakout of the female handlers for those interested


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## Ron in Portland (Apr 1, 2006)

birddogn_tc said:


> By my count, at the start of the event there were:
> 
> 29 Total Amateurs
> 22 Male Amateur Handlers
> ...


Don't forget Bente with #90, Oskar...


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

Ron in Portland said:


> Don't forget Bente with #90, Oskar...


Oops, thanks. Didn't catch that name. Fixed in above post.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

birddogn_tc said:


> By my count, at the start of the event there were:
> 
> 29 Total Amateurs
> 21 Male Amateur Handlers
> ...


What about all the other genders?


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

drunkenpoacher said:


> What about all the other genders?


You mean the bitches and sons of bitches? LOL

looks like the callbacks to the 9th have been posted. Good luck to dog 24


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

18 dogs dropped (several without a handle.) Several hours to announce callbacks. Dr. Ed…?


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## J. Marti (May 2, 2014)

EdA said:


> I was told three dogs did not get wet on the water blind, those dogs are only a toe stub away from elimination.


If the line to the blind went through the water, wouldn't not getting wet be an automatic elimination for failing to challenge the blind? Or is previous work in the previous series considered so strongly that failure to get wet on a water blind isn't automatic elimination if the dog's previous series work was stellar? 

Because each series is so difficult and it is such a long championship over many days, I can understand why the judges need to keep considering the totality of each dog's work. On the other hand, I have watched friends' dogs get booted out of a hunt test for failing to challenge the blind. 

Just asking.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

Kyle Garris said:


> 18 dogs dropped (several without a handle.) Several hours to announce callbacks. Dr. Ed…?


Too many dogs, not enough time?😳


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## mjh345 (Jun 17, 2006)

J. Marti said:


> If the line to the blind went through the water, wouldn't not getting wet be an automatic elimination for failing to challenge the blind? Or is previous work in the previous series considered so strongly that failure to get wet on a water blind isn't automatic elimination if the dog's previous series work was stellar?
> 
> Because each series is so difficult and it is such a long championship over many days, I can understand why the judges need to keep considering the totality of each dog's work. On the other hand, I have watched friends' dogs get booted out of a hunt test for failing to challenge the blind.
> 
> Just asking.


It is kind of a tradition at Nationals, to avoid dropping many dogs on the blinds


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## RetrieversONLINE (Nov 24, 2005)

mjh345 said:


> It is kind of a tradition at Nationals, to avoid dropping many dogs on the blinds


I agree, but I do not recall a single USA or CDN National in which no dogs were dropped on all blinds!


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

I don’t think it is traditional at all, it is an individual judge decision. A failure is a failure and I think should be handled accordingly. If blinds don’t matter why waste 40% of the trial on them. I know more than a few former National judges who agree with me, two of whom I judged with. Generally time constraints affect the first and sometimes second land blind but at least one, preferably two blinds in the trial should be at the minimum a weekend Open blind quality.


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## RetrieversONLINE (Nov 24, 2005)

EdA said:


> I don’t think it is traditional at all, it is an individual judge decision. A failure is a failure and I think should be handled accordingly. If blinds don’t matter why waste 40% of the trial on them. I know more than a few former National judges who agree with me, two of whom I judged with. Generally time constraints affect the first and sometimes second land blind but at least one, preferably two blinds in the trial should be at the minimum a weekend Open blind quality.


You are right Ed, in that Traditional is probably not the best word. Perhaps, it should be the word customary or commonplace since it is often said that Nationals are won by marking! Also as you well know, often blinds at Nationals, especially water blinds, are quite different than many all-age weekend blinds. This is especially true in the USA Nationals where judges with huge entries seldom have time for long time -consuming water blinds. Often National water blinds involve relatively little water. Although that can make the blind very challenging it’s not like a weekend blind! And, yes, blinds are an important part and should be judged and at the VERY least considered when picking the winner, I believe the National winner should always be the best all around dog and grievous blind behaviour should not be ignored despite good marks.


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## EdA (May 13, 2003)

RetrieversONLINE said:


> You are right Ed, in that Traditional is probably not the best word. Perhaps, it should be the word customary or commonplace since it is often said that Nationals are won by marking! Also as you well know, often blinds at Nationals, especially water blinds, are quite different than many all-age weekend blinds. This is especially true in the USA Nationals where judges with huge entries seldom have time for long time -consuming water blinds. Often National water blinds involve relatively little water. Although that can make the blind very challenging it’s not like a weekend blind! And, yes, blinds are an important part and should be judged and at the VERY least considered when picking the winner, I believe the National winner should always be the best all around dog and grievous blind behaviour should not be ignored despite good marks.


I understand well the time constraints, I have been there at every level from worker to field trial chairman, from contestant to judge but a meaningful blind need not be a time consuming affair. Time efficiency on water blinds depends on a difficult entry which produces some pickups and a land route home. My single regret in 2018 we never had the time to do a National caliber land blind but we did have not one but two challenging water blinds and dogs with abject failures were dropped.


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## David Maddox (Jan 12, 2004)

Well, well, well…the 8th series bloodbath hath shown it’s ugly face!!!


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

RetrieversONLINE said:


> I agree, but I do not recall a single USA or CDN National in which no dogs were dropped on all blinds!


We were discussing that during training today. Is this the first time it has happened?


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Six tests of the National open with zero dogs dropped. Has that ever happened?


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## Gary M (Dec 5, 2008)

10th is complete! Now we wait for the results. A number of dogs did not have a handle through 10 series. Who will it be and how many finalists?


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Just waiting for someone to mention something about 'clean' series'... (having been on the receiving end of that 'correction')

I'd like to see Tucker win but it seems like a few dogs are sitting good!


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## RetrieversONLINE (Nov 24, 2005)

If you go by the blog, there is a clear winner and a very close second BUT we all know not to do that!


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

Curiously silent?


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## Vance_kaz (Nov 3, 2018)

Congrats to Alvin and Luke. It's awesome someone from Maryland won it


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## Marvin S (Nov 29, 2006)

RetrieversONLINE said:


> If you go by the blog, there is a clear winner and a very close second BUT we all know not to do that!


I miss the days when there was someone who knew dogs doing the commenting.


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## Tobias (Aug 31, 2015)

Congratulations to NFC Luke and his team!!!


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## birddogn_tc (Apr 24, 2015)

Marvin S said:


> I miss the days when there was someone who knew dogs doing the commenting.


I am very appreciative of the blog and the people that spend extremely long days writing notes about each dog and posting for us to see and read. It’s always been my understanding that blog is intentionally watered down and I’m fine with that because I know it. 
But I am very grateful that people still spend the time to do it. Keeps me very interested in a sport I love.


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## drunkenpoacher (Dec 20, 2016)

birddogn_tc said:


> It’s always been my understanding that blog is intentionally watered down


It has to be worded in the most positive way possible.


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## Judd (Nov 29, 2012)

birddogn_tc said:


> I am very appreciative of the blog and the people that spend extremely long days writing notes about each dog and posting for us to see and read. It’s always been my understanding that blog is intentionally watered down and I’m fine with that because I know it.
> But I am very grateful that people still spend the time to do it. Keeps me very interested in a sport I love.


I totally agree. I’m gonna miss hitting refresh throughout the day.


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## Gary M (Dec 5, 2008)

RetrieversONLINE said:


> If you go by the blog, there is a clear winner and a very close second BUT we all know not to do that!


Dennis, was the dog who won the one you had in mind?


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## DavidC (Feb 2, 2015)

Judd said:


> I totally agree. I’m gonna miss hitting refresh throughout the day.


I've tried to get Verizon to change my "senior citizen" data plan to give me more data in November and June, but no dice!!!


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## RetrieversONLINE (Nov 24, 2005)

Gary M said:


> Dennis, was the dog who won the one you had in mind?


Maybe, but I know better than to answer that for future bloggers! I did say “we know better than that!” However, I do appreciate the hard work done by the reporters. I did it for several years for the Canadian Nationals. There is little question the descriptions are not only conservative, but nothing like being there. And only the judges have all the real data! It really challenges the value of the dog blow by blow accounts as opposed to really good test analysis and descriptions of how the test changes and affects the dogs and handling. There was some of that in the past but it was considered biased to those yet to run, so has been curtailed also! Rock and Hard places!


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## bjoiner (Feb 25, 2008)

EdA said:


> This from a friend who is there
> the photographer’s camera started clicking. Luke became interested in it and didn’t see the left retired or flyer.


This is actually incorrect. There was interference, but it was not the photographer. They did ask him if he was taking pictures, but he was not. I am 100% positive of that. I was there. The photographer puts a lot of effort into concealing himself and takes pride in it. I just don’t want incorrect information getting out.


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## moscowitz (Nov 17, 2004)

Congratulation Alvin and Luke.


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## Bubba (Jan 3, 2003)

EdA said:


> This from a friend who is there
> the photographer’s camera started clicking. Luke became interested in it and didn’t see the left retired or flyer.


I'm wondering why a digital camera that "clicks" is allowed any where near the line?


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## crackerd (Feb 21, 2003)

Vance_kaz said:


> Congrats to Alvin and Luke. It's awesome someone from Maryland won it


Score one for the good guys - Bravo, Hatch

MG


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## bjoiner (Feb 25, 2008)

Bubba said:


> I'm wondering why a digital camera that "clicks" is allowed any where near the line?


Being the cameraman didn’t distract any dog over ten series it is anon issue. Most of his pictures are on the return. Mark runs dogs and knows when not to photograph.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)




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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

View from the 10th series short retired.


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## Zach Fisher (Jan 16, 2015)

Kyle Garris said:


> View from the 10th series short retired.


Tough sledding on that bird. I kept thinking the sun would move around and give it up in the afternoon. The guns were more visible but that mark really stumped the dogs ...except for a couple.


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## Kyle Garris (Oct 27, 2005)

Being retired I couldn’t see squat but I could hear them run past and could tell the few that really nailed it.


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## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

In my 3 hour shift, i only saw 1 dog truly nail the test. And he won! So exciting to finally get to see the big show!


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## bjoiner (Feb 25, 2008)

2tall said:


> In my 3 hour shift, i only saw 1 dog truly nail the test. And he won! So exciting to finally get to see the big show!


He was the only one to drill the 8th as well.


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## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

bjoiner said:


> He was the only one to drill the 8th as well.


Alas, I was not there for the 8th. I saw the 1st, 5th and 10th.


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## crackerd (Feb 21, 2003)

Bubba, appreciation for your being there throughout - and both appreciation and gratitude for your "being there" in official capacit(ies) for NFCs to come. Sammie's not on here, but to her, too, a chorus of "For she's a jolly good lass" from the NRC.

MG


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