# Advice needed - dog won't eat, losing weight -long



## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

This is not Lab related, but is dog related. I have a 16 mo Great Pyrenees that is now only eating sporadically. He originally presented with some listless behavior and loss of appetite. This happened the weekend of 6/14-6/15.

I took him in to the vet on the 17th at which time he weighed 109 lbs. His gums were pink, physical exam was normal and he was still active and did not seem to be in distress.

Over the next week, he would only eat about every other day. Still I was not too concerned as he seemed bright and active. However, when I took him in on the 24th for follow up, his weight was 94 lbs. He had lost 15 lbs. in a week.  At this point, I was *very* concerned. We did blood work and everything is WNL. Heartworm was/is negative. I went home with instructions to change his food, as he might have food sesitivities.

As an interesting aside - when the Vet was explaining the food sensitivity problem to me, he commented that it was similar to a gluten sensitivity in humans. He then went on to try to tell me what that meant. What he did not know is that I was diagnosed with Celiac Disease in 1983 and have been on a Gluten Free diet since then. One could say I am familiar with food sensitivities.

We got some ZD food for Louie and went home again. He is still not eating consistently. I don't know what he weighs now (He's to heavy for me to lift) but he's starting to look skinny -though it's hard to tell under all that hair. At his time, we have tried 7 different brands of foods, rice, yogurt, pumpkin, chicken and ground beef. None of these seem to entice his appetite.

Yesterday, my vet recommended we go down to the Veterinary Referral Center of Colorado for an ultrasound and more blood work. We did so. The ultrasound was clear, confirming there is no obstruction. We did a test for Addison's and I will get the results on Monday. I am getting pretty scared. This is a very young dog and the apple of my eye.

Any thoughts, suggestions and tips you might have would be very welcome.


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2008)

hmmm....

Did your vet check his teeth and mouth? Any chance there's a chipped tooth or something more superficial that's simply making it painful to eat?

Also, another remote possibility... I had a dog that had a pinched nerve or something of that sort in his back and it was uncomfortable for him to go to the floor for the food bowl -- initially we thought he just didn't want to eat. So maybe elevating the food bowl if you don't already...

And how about something like gas or upset tummy related to allergies or something similar? Does he get gassy or bloated? 

Are his lymph nodes ok? I assume they would have felt these at some point in all your visits...

-K


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## D Osborn (Jul 19, 2004)

I had a female who did this-something as simple as a pepcid AC 1/2 hour before eating, Amoxi with the meal cleared up the bacterial infection. We figured was an ulcer.I went back to basics. oatmeal with whatever meat they will eat ( mine hate chicken)
Ask the vet if you can try this, as sometimes they are not hungry because their tummy hurts.
Another thing, go with what Kristie suggested. Check for plastic stuck in teeth, anything like that. Cost a young collie his life


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## 3blackdogs (Aug 23, 2004)

What about running a tick panel? That's one of the first things vets look at in our area. I don't know what your tick-borne disease intensity is, but it's *bad *here. We have Lyme, lepto, anaplasmosis, erlichia, Rocky Mountain, babesiosis. Some of the symptoms can be subtle.


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## taylormade (Mar 2, 2006)

Is he having any diarrhea at all? If so, absolutely demand that your vet run a test for EPI, Endocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency. This is most often seen in GSDs, but is present in many breeds. Basically, their pancreas doesn't produce the enzymes to allow them to digest food, so no matter how much they eat, they lose tremendous amounts of weight. Some EPI dogs continue to eat ravenously, but look like skeletons because they're getting no nutrition from the food. Others quit eating because their tummies are upset.

EPI often goes undiagnosed until dogs are in crisis.

WB


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2008)

3blackdogs said:


> What about running a tick panel? That's one of the first things vets look at in our area. I don't know what your tick-borne disease intensity is, but it's *bad *here. We have Lyme, lepto, anaplasmosis, erlichia, Rocky Mountain, babesiosis. Some of the symptoms can be subtle.


OOOOOooooo, yeah, yeah, yeah, this reminded me....

If we think there might be something tickborne, we don't even bother running the panel... Just put the dog on doxycycline. Cheap and sometimes fixes everything!! (esp things that can't be diagnosed!)

-K


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## fishduck (Jun 5, 2008)

When my buddies BLM had a similiar problem the vet put him on a diet of boiled chopped chicken cooked in rice. Dog ate and put on weight very quickly. Similiar to the oatmeal and meat but some dogs will eat chicken and rice better. Try them all and find something the dog likes until you get a definitive diagnosis.

Hope for the best
Mark L.


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## john fallon (Jun 20, 2003)

Get blood work done............ Could be Kidney problems?

john


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2008)

Is it safe to assume that he's been checked for an obstruction? I know Allie's (fishing line that cinched up her small intestine and eventually killed her) didn't show up on ultrasound. She had no appetite, either, but all bloodwork was ok until "the end" (yuck).


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

The ultrasound yesterday showed no obstruction in his GI tract. $$=Ouch. I have checked his mouth for obstuctions and there are none there.

He is active and barking as Pyrs do and does not seem to be in distress. However 15 lbs. in a week has gotten me pretty scared. He would not eat again tonight and I have tried cooked chicken, ground beef, rice, yogurt, potatoes, pumpkin.

The vets are at a loss.


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## Tim Thomas (Jan 31, 2008)

Kristie Wilder said:


> Is it safe to assume that he's been checked for an obstruction? I know Allie's (fishing line that cinched up her small intestine and eventually killed her) didn't show up on ultrasound. She had no appetite, either, but all bloodwork was ok until "the end" (yuck).


Kristie

Not to bring up what ifs or bad memories, but is there something that would have identified the obstruction you mentioned........just thinking ahead. You never know with these garbage disposals.

Thanks
Tim


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

Thanks folks for the replies. We have had all the blood work done including tick panels. All is negative so far.

Kristie - please call me if you get a chance. My number is in your PM's.


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## cakaiser (Jul 12, 2007)

If it were me, I would try to get to some state of the art vet school as soon as possible. Is there one close to you, around here, if local vet can't figure it out, off to Auburn.

I, too, would be extremely concerned by these symptoms. When a dog won't eat chicken, beef, and has that kind of weight loss, something is really wrong. My first thought was kidneys, but you said negative on the blood work.

Hoping for the best


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2008)

slidinstar said:


> Kristie
> 
> Not to bring up what ifs or bad memories, but is there something that would have identified the obstruction you mentioned........just thinking ahead. You never know with these garbage disposals.
> 
> ...


No problem...

An MRI **MIGHT** have caught it.

And a barium swallow would have caught it -- where you check for an obstruction. BUT we had no reason to think there was an obstruction. Honestly, the first thing that came to my mind when she started getting sick at the master national (and it KILLS me because she had done such a beautiful job on the first series, I was so excited for her) was an obstruction. And I thought - no way, she doesn't get into anything and her symptoms didn't quite match. She was still having some bowel movements, she didn't appear to have much of any abdominal pain, etc. etc. I had two different vets look at her several times over the remaining days at the master national and both concluded it wasn't an emergency. Just seemed like some sort of upset tummy, nothing that seemed like it needed emergency attention. Just keep her on some meds until I got home so Joie (husband, vet) could take care of her... I felt comfortable with that.

Then she got home, it continued, her lethargy got worse... Joie did everything he could do. But she was 11 years old and we started to assume it was a cancer that we couldn't find -- and we weren't going to put her through chemo or do anything invasive... So we tried to keep her comfortable.

So I guess exploratory surgery (something we wouldn't have done immediately at her age and given her symptoms, which were mild til the end) or barium swallow would have found it.

It breaks my heart to think that we could have saved her, but what was happening didn't make sense and didn't seem that bad til the end. She was strong and just didn't let on how bad it was... That's the problem with labs. 

I still have the baggie that holds the contents of her small intestine in the freezer. I can't bring myself to throw them away. It's a frozen glob of poop looking stuff with monofilament in it. It really hurts terribly... And Joie was so devastated that he couldn't save her. He was absolutely distraught at the end. The whole thing was so damn awful.

OK, I know you didn't ask for that!! Thanks for the therapy!!! (sorry!!)

-K


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## Tim Thomas (Jan 31, 2008)

Thanks for that...I know first hand how it can be bittersweet. I'm in a small town with a reliable Vet, but get concerned occasionally when thinking about the what ifs...I too have some medical training and many years with horses that have taught me to always have a watchful eye and conservative approach.....that said, I hope I would notice something out of wack. My fear is that I may not know all the options available to determine the culprit. Again, thanks for the input.....everything happens for a reason....Mojo, hope all works out with the pup...I'll be praying.

Tim


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## GBUSMCR (Oct 5, 2004)

You might consider a restriction or partial blockage.
I have a GRM that we thought had food allergies. He would have bouts were he ate well, and then would not eat for a day or two. In a work up for a biopsy, Dr. Willard at TX A&M thought my guy had a partial blockage. The area of concern was not visible on x-ray but was seen on the sonogram. Long story short, surgery removed about 1/3 of the small intestine that was severely dilated with scaring. The path report could not tell what caused it but the thought was he had eaten something that caused damage and the scarring. Hope you find out what the problem is and get him well.
FWIW


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## dr_dog_guy (May 25, 2003)

Pancreatic insufficiency sounded like a very good thing to check. My little bitch went from 55 lbs to 30 lbs before it was diagnosed. She also ate rocks, probably desparate for nutrition any sort, which caused a blockage,so the ultimate diagnosis was very difficult. Shes now back at her fighting weight, but it was a very close call.

I do hope you get the cause pinned down very soon! Its extremely scary when somethings wrong and you don't know what.


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

Thank you all for the ideas. We'll be back to the vet on Tuesday and calling CSU tomorrow. I'll let you know what we find out.

I hesitated to bother this list with our problem, but I was wrong. I am very grateful to all of you.


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## cakaiser (Jul 12, 2007)

Maybe you could call them Sunday, could be wrong, but seem to remember Auburn emergency open 24/7. Be sure to insist you must be seen right away!

Auburn has super duper type ultra sound, MRI, maybe CSU the same.

Keeping a good thought


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

Thanks for that. I called CSU yesterday and they suggested we wait until Monday. I hate to say this but, though I am not poor, I am also not rich and that is a consideration. ER visits are pretty expensive and given he is not in distress, we have decided to wait this out until tomorrow. 

I hope I do not sound callous about this because I am worried sick. At the same time, I have to balance this situation with the rest of my life. After all, if I can't pay my mortgage, all would be moot, as Louie would have no place to live.

Nontheless, thank you. I very much appreciate your input. By posting on this forum, I have gotten more ideas about this than I have from some of the best vets in the country. How great is that?


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## cakaiser (Jul 12, 2007)

Understood, you're right, likely to be expensive.


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## dr_dog_guy (May 25, 2003)

I didn't realize you were in Colorado. CSU was where Molly (pancreatic insufficiency) was diagnosed, and it was only this winter.

I hope it is something simple and fixable.


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

Yes I am in Colorado and am going up to CSU tomorrow. Would Pancreatic insufficiency show in the blood work?


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## dr_dog_guy (May 25, 2003)

It should in part There was a suite of things they looked at. 

hey did catch the problem essentially "out of the blue". All of my focus (and thus description) was on the rock-eating blockage and subsequent surgery, thus internal problems, so they picked up the problem based on symptomology and the blood work rather than on what I was telling them about the probable source of the problem. Don't be shy about asking them specifically (not that you would). 

Very best wishes!


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## dr_dog_guy (May 25, 2003)

I was so relieved we had a diagnosis and that she wasn't going to die that my recollection of this is hazy. I'll go pull the file and see what they did.

I know there was an endoscopy but it turned out to be not particularly helpful. Exploratory surgery was already scheduled when we got the diagnosis.

If the file says anything different, I'll post back shortly.


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## Becky Mills (Jun 6, 2004)

We're pulling for you and Louie and praying hard for a diagnosis and a cure - please, please keep us posted.
Take care,
Becky


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

I have a sick dog as described in this thread. I am a very private person who does not often post here, but still feel like I belong. When I got very concerned on Friday, I was grasping at straws. I had done due diligence, but it never hurts to check every source. So I did. To all who have responded, thank you.

When I posted about my dog's (not a retriever breed) problem, I received incredible support from many of you. You have my thanks -once again.

Chris (this is the other Moira ) This forum not only entertains, it is a great resource for information. Thank you for hosting and moderating it. Miss Vicky, thanks you for moderating.

I will let you know how Louie does.


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## SHANNON (May 30, 2008)

Hope everything goes well and definitely dont want to place bad thoughts in your head but i had a very similiar experience with my weimeraner. Her blood work looked great, losing weight with no appetite, etc. After numerous vet visits without a diagnosis we went to a college with a very appreciative vet school. it was determined that she had cancer probably due to a microchip malfunction. Not sure if this was true but they placed her on meds, removed the chip, and she put on a little weight. Unfortunately I lost her this past Christmas. She was very strong to the end. Local vet states that if we would have caught it earlier that it might have been curable. Push for answers and pray for a recovery. aGood luck and im sorry to hear about your sickness. Hoping for the best! May God bless and be with you.


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## Andy Carlson (Jan 3, 2003)

I have no suggestions to offer, but I will keep you and Louie in my prayers for a good outcome. 

Andy


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## D Osborn (Jul 19, 2004)

I wish you all the luck, and hope things go well. I took a cat to CSU years ago, they were very kind.
I think one reason we all can give ideas is most of us have been there done that. We could do a poll on vet bills on one animal-Whistler's feet alone have easily run me close to 6 or 7 thousand. PS-my other vet may have figured out why-his infection years ago weakened the nail and allows it to spit into the nail, and get infected Carbon's latest was close to 1800.00 We did 750.00 in one day of tests.(did I mention I teach school in SC?)I have spent way too much time at UGA vet school, but have a great friend due to it. I am a now a firm believer in the two good vet thing-often another set of eyes on the same problem works so well, but egos are hard to manage.
Good luck, and keep us posted. They are very nice there, and will work with you money wise. I will keep my fingers crossed.


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## john fallon (Jun 20, 2003)

Is the dog drinking a lot of fluid?

John


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

> Is the dog drinking a lot of fluid?


Yes, but no more than usual. One of my first thoughts was diabetes, but I don't think that's the case. Glucose levels were WNL.

Was that where you were going with that question? If not, and you have another thought, would you care to share that?

Many thanks for your time John and I appreciate your input.

They tested for Addison's on Friday and I should get results today.


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## HiRollerlabs (Jun 11, 2004)

If you think it might be an allergy, there is a blood test (around $100 I am told) from petallergylab.com (TX lab) that tests for food/environmental allergies. I have not used this lab. I was told about it by Bob ?Glass when I was helping him draw blood for his pythiosis study.

Good luck and hope you find the problem/cure.


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

MoJo,

This forum is great for getting through the rough times with dogs.....I know I've cried on the RTF shoulder many times.......

I have no suggestions for your current situation, other than I'll keep him in my prayers. Keep us posted on what you find out from CSU.

FOM


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## pupaloo (Jan 6, 2006)

Moira,

Just got home from Julie's seminar, and saw this post. I hope you are getting some answers today, but I wanted to put a few suggestions down just in case...

If he is acting normal other than not eating-normal urine and stool, normal activity and attitude-I would suspect that it is something directly related to eating. Dogs are pretty simple-if eating hurts, then they won't much. I would think if it was in the mouth you would have other indications-mostly a change in attitude, less play, etc.

Maybe an ulcer? Or acid reflux, or IBD? Try giving him pepto bismol for a couple of days (it will make his stool darker), and see if that helps. You might want to consider an exam with a scope including a biopsy of the stomach if tests continue to come up negative.

Please keep us updated, and take good care-Marlana


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## john fallon (Jun 20, 2003)

I'm still thinking Kidney.

john


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## pupaloo (Jan 6, 2006)

Any update?


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

Louie started to have bloody diarrhea on Monday afternoon. We had gone in to his regular vet that day for x-rays that showed a lot of gas but nothing irregular that would indicate an obstruction. He was uncomfortable from the diarrhea, but otherwise barking and guarding as he usually does.

I took him down to the ER on Monday night for another evaluation. He had the blood drawn for an Addison's disease test done on Friday and that was negative. On Monday night they did a fecal exam and found some blood in his stool and elevated WBC's. Infection, possibly.

They sent me home with some Iams canned food, the generic equivalent of Flagyl and asked me to come back for an endoscopy. I did not do so as there is no way I could leave work during the day yesterday. Also, at that time he was not in distress. I did not want to subject him to a very invasive test that was perhaps not necessary.

He ate the canned food the next night; 1/2 can then went into his crate asking for more. His regular vet recommended adding Reglan to the mix to calm down his gut. He got his first dose this evening. He is also on ZD canned food and ate another whole can this evening.

To Kristie and Becky - many thanks. You know what you did. To everyone else, I have no words that are appropriate to thank you as you need to be thanked.


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## Aussie (Jan 4, 2003)

Good luck with him+++++++ Think about the endoscopy, they are not too bad. On the other hand colonscopies well,....... enough said about MY last couple of weeks.


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## Guest (Jul 3, 2008)

Glad to hear he's eating... Please keep us posted...


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## Becky Mills (Jun 6, 2004)

So glad to hear our boy is eating. Please, please, please keep us posted.
Take Care,
Becky


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