# training Golden Retrievers



## Golden6824 (Mar 28, 2010)

I have two golden retrievers I am training for field work. 

The older one has no field lines in his pedigree. He loves birds but doesn't have a lot of courage and gets discouraged easily.

The younger one is half field lines. He does have a lot more drive and courage than my other dog. But he is still a golden, and I have had several people tell me that goldens just train differently than your average lab.

I have found someone that is willing to train me and my dogs, but he has only ever trained high drive field labs. He is learning that training my dogs is not the same as training what he is used to working with. Does anyone have any advice I can pass along to him on things you would do differently working with a golden vs. working with field labs?

Jodie


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## Juli H (Aug 27, 2007)

First of all, you really have to make sure you have the appropriate color and style of bandana for each dog. 

That said, I am sure someone with more 'fluffy' exp will give you some ideas.  
Juli


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

Golden6824 said:


> I have two golden retrievers I am training for field work.
> 
> The older one has no field lines in his pedigree. He loves birds but doesn't have a lot of courage and gets discouraged easily.
> 
> ...


I'm no expert on retriever training but I'll share my personal experience with you. You won't like my advice. I had a golden once. Damn craziest dog I ever had. Very intelligent, devoted and friendly; but it had about every bad habit that exists for a dog. Digger, escape artist, roamer, barker, couldn't learn where to crap etc. etc. I now own a Lab who is so eager to please, has no bad habits and is healthy as they come. My advice ............Get a Lab.


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## Jeannie Greenlee (Apr 15, 2009)

First of all you need to find a program and stick with it. Secondly, goldens, especially the non-field variety, usually don't handle pressure as well as a lab. They tend to think too much and you can shut them down.
Work the program you choose. Be patient. They can do it. If you PM me with where you are located I might be able to help you find someone that knows goldens in your area.

Fluffy owner


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## Laura Heyden (Aug 14, 2009)

depittydawg said:


> I'm no expert on retriever training but I'll share my personal experience with you. You won't like my advice. I had a golden once. Damn craziest dog I ever had. Very intelligent, devoted and friendly; but it had about every bad habit that exists for a dog. Digger, escape artist, roamer, barker, couldn't learn where to crap etc. etc. I now own a Lab who is so eager to please, has no bad habits and is healthy as they come. My advice ............Get a Lab.


You won't like my response to your post...Seems like your Golden was neglected and kept in a kennel with not much interaction with the family. All the habits you listed are from a bored dog! You got a lab, and it seems he/she are more than happy to live the kennel life.

Seriously, there are good and bad in all breeds. You can't judge all dogs of a specific breed by one experience. All the Labs I have owned were slugs with NO personality. Is that to say all Labs are bad? No. However, I prefer Goldens as I like a thinking dog and one with personality.


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

TripNDooley said:


> You won't like my response to your post...Seems like your Golden was neglected and kept in a kennel with not much interaction with the family. All the habits you listed are from a bored dog! You got a lab, and it seems he/she are more than happy to live the kennel life.
> 
> Seriously, there are good and bad in all breeds. You can't judge all dogs of a specific breed by one experience. All the Labs I have owned were slugs with NO personality. Is that to say all Labs are bad? No. However, I prefer Goldens as I like a thinking dog and one with personality.


Sorry, I've never 'kenneled' a dog in my life. They are all family dogs. I do agree you can't judge all dogs by an individual. I'm sure there are a lot of great goldens out there. But from my experience, and a lot I've read, Goldens require a lot more attention than a lot of other breeds. Maybe because they're so smart they get bored. I just drew a bad straw I guess. 
I've owned several breeds of dogs over the years. I had a Pyrenees that was just about as bad as the golden too. Also owned Irish Wolfhounds and Newfoundland that were awesome balanced dogs. And a few mutts. This is my first lab. He is the easiest dog I've ever had to handle.


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## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

TripNDooley said:


> You won't like my response to your post...Seems like your Golden was neglected and kept in a kennel with not much interaction with the family. All the habits you listed are from a bored dog! You got a lab, and it seems he/she are more than happy to live the kennel life.
> 
> Seriously, there are good and bad in all breeds. You can't judge all dogs of a specific breed by one experience. All the Labs I have owned were slugs with NO personality. Is that to say all Labs are bad? No. However, I prefer Goldens as_ I like a thinking dog and one with personality_.



Then get a chessie! JK, but the op really needs to get with a trainer or group that knows goldens.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

depittydawg said:


> I'm no expert on retriever training but I'll share my personal experience with you. You won't like my advice. I had a golden once. Damn craziest dog I ever had. Very intelligent, devoted and friendly; but it had about every bad habit that exists for a dog. Digger, escape artist, roamer, barker, couldn't learn where to crap etc. etc. I now own a Lab who is so eager to please, has no bad habits and is healthy as they come. My advice ............Get a Lab.


 
*Whatever. You just need to be smarter than your dog-obviously a problem for you.*

Golden6824-Find a good training program and stick with it-each dog is different and you have to be able to adapt training of that program to what works for your individual dog, but having a consistant program is important. Also-hook up with someone who isn't a "labs only, goldens suck" person-that is just a recipe for disaster. Each breed brings something unique to the table-it's the people who recognize and appreciate that good dog work that I want to associate with in this game. You will learn from each dog and you will be become(if you have half a brain) a better trainer with each dog-so your first dog may not be a MH or FC....so what. What you learn and take from that experience of training in the field for the first time is priceless. 

Good luck.

*Juli-I'm going to church to nite to work some more on my attitude!!!!


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## Goose (Oct 7, 2003)

depittydawg said:


> I'm no expert on retriever training but I'll share my personal experience with you. You won't like my advice. I had a golden once. Damn craziest dog I ever had. Very intelligent, devoted and friendly; but it had about every bad habit that exists for a dog. Digger, escape artist, roamer, barker, couldn't learn where to crap etc. etc. I now own a Lab who is so eager to please, has no bad habits and is healthy as they come. My advice ............Get a Lab.


You should have stopped after the first 6 words in your first sentence.


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## Frenchy (Jul 9, 2005)

First of all every dog is different, and goldens are no exception. It has been my experience though, that you need to train them with a little more patience. Simplify and TEACH like any dog, but sometimes you have to get creative with goldens. Mine wasn't much into drill work, so I had to disguise it into something a little more interesting to keep his spirits up. 

Gotta admit though, I do have a young lab now, but that first Golden has made me a golden fan for life. There is just something a little bit more personal with a golden.


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## Golden6824 (Mar 28, 2010)

I would love to train regularly with a golden person, but they don't exist in my area. I am the only person around here that does anything with goldens...there's not even a golden conformation person in this area. I am sending my puppy to a golden breeder/field trainer/obedience trainer for a month this summer, but she is too far away for regular trianing.

The person I am training with is taking me under his wing, wants to mentor me, and is charging me nothing. He has nothing against my dogs, he just isn't used them. 

As far as getting a lab....I am doing field work to have another area to spend time with my dogs with, not getting a dog to do field work with. My dogs are my love, the sport is secondary.


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## Frenchy (Jul 9, 2005)

Golden6824 said:


> I
> 
> The person I am training with is taking me under his wing, wants to mentor me, and is charging me nothing. He has nothing against my dogs, he just isn't used them.


I think you are in good shape! In the end you need to learn to read YOUR dog and train to his personality.


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## DSemple (Feb 16, 2008)

Kibbles and Praise

No pressure except to reinforce thoroughly taught and learned lessons.


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

Pals said:


> *Whatever. You just need to be smarter than your dog-obviously a problem for you.*



What a rude comment. I swear I've never seen as many rude, obnoxious people as this website.


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## Furball (Feb 23, 2006)

depittydawg said:


> What a rude comment. I swear I've never seen as many rude, obnoxious people as this website.


Dude -- in the words of any five year old -- you started it! 
Someone asking about training their breed and you remark that you owned one, he was the worst dog you ever had, and that they should forget it and get a lab. Seriously, THAT was rude. Be a little more constructive with your advice next time.


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## golden dude (Oct 19, 2009)

depittydawg said:


> What a rude comment. I swear I've never seen as many rude, obnoxious people as this website.


Hey- most people don't just sit there and smile when they, or their chosen breed are insulted. That is not uniqe to this Forum.

Your assesment is WAY OFF!

Fluffies rule!
Steve


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

Furball said:


> Dude -- in the words of any five year old -- you started it!
> Someone asking about training their breed and you remark that you owned one, he was the worst dog you ever had, and that they should forget it and get a lab. Seriously, THAT was rude. Be a little more constructive with your advice next time.


I recited the experience I had with a dog. For that I was personally insulted. Sorry, that crosses the line. If someone wants to site a different experience, I'd love to hear it. But hold back on the personal insults please. It is uncalled for.


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## Juli H (Aug 27, 2007)

Pals said:


> *Juli-I'm going to church to nite to work some more on my attitude!!!!


I sure hope you go early and stay late. ;-);-);-) 

depitty-dog....if there is one thing that will get people riled up, it is when someone infers that 'their' breed of dog is not the 'right' breed of dog... especially if that person (the 'inferer) has very little experience with that breed. Take Bubba for instance, I'd bet a moose backstrap that he has NEVER had a chessie, but damn if he isn't always giving his 2 cents worth! :twisted:

Also - once you get to know the 'regulars', you do get a sense of general of their individual character...For the most part, people on RTF are a wonderful group. 

Juli


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## Evan (Jan 5, 2003)

Golden6824 said:


> I have two golden retrievers I am training for field work.
> 
> The older one has no field lines in his pedigree. He loves birds but doesn't have a lot of courage and gets discouraged easily.
> 
> ...


Jodie,

I once asked the late D.L. Walters a fairly common newbie question. "What's the best retriever; a Lab, a Golden, a Chessie?" He replied "A good dog is a good dog. He doesn't know what breed or color he is, and he doesn't know what it says on his papers. He's just a good dog. That's the dog for me."

Currently I'm bringing up another Golden, one of many I've trained over the years. I've trained all retriever breeds, and have had good & bad of all kinds. It's not breed specific to get a good dog. It has more to do with a trainer's willingness to learn a solid method, and adapt it to the individual dog.

Evan


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

Juli H said:


> I sure hope you go early and stay late. ;-);-);-)
> 
> depitty-dog....if there is one thing that will get people riled up, it is when someone infers that 'their' breed of dog is not the 'right' breed of dog... especially if that person has very little experience with that breed. Take Bubba for instance, I'd bet a moose backstrap that he has NEVER had a chessie, but damn if he isn't always giving his 2 cents worth! :twisted:
> 
> ...


Whatever. I can't see it myself. I guess because I've had many breeds of dogs over the years. I loved them all. And sometimes the best decision was to find a new home for a dog that didn't fit in with our family. Best for us, best for the dog. Sorry if I insulted anyone by relating a bad experience I had with a golden retriever. I'm sure there are some wonderful stories people have re: their Golden's.


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## Juli H (Aug 27, 2007)

It wasn't the fact that you wrote about your golden and his 'troubles'...it was that you then _inferred_ all goldens are like that and the OP would be better getting a lab...

You didn't have any specific advice about what the OP could do to help him understand what training methods were best for goldens...(unlike mine, which was extremely helpful, I think! :twisted 
Everyone that has posted that dogs (no matter the breed) are individuals and should to be trained in the way that best suits their needs, is correct.

Juli


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## Evan (Jan 5, 2003)

There are good and bad of any breed. Sometimes the "good" can be very, very good!










*FC AFC OTCH FTCH AFTCH Can MOTCH TNT's Stanley Steamer UDX, WCX, MH, OBHF, FDHF, OS *

Stanley is the sire of my young Golden. Below is his DAM.










UH HRCH GMH Doublegold Spitfire ** MH WCX GRCA OD, Qual placements... with owner/trainer Anne Everett

Stereotypes are rarely accurate.

Evan


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

Juli H said:


> It wasn't the fact that you wrote about your golden and his 'troubles'...it was that you then _inferred_ all goldens are like that and the OP would be better getting a lab...
> 
> You didn't have any specific advice about what the OP could do to help him understand what training methods were best for goldens...(unlike mine, which was extremely helpful, I think! :twisted
> Everyone that has posted that dogs (no matter the breed) are individuals and should to be trained in the way that best suits their needs, is correct.
> ...


Funny. The "get a lab" quote was entirely in jest. Perhaps I should have added a smiley face. Some folks just take this doggy business way to seriously.


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## golden dude (Oct 19, 2009)

depittydawg said:


> Funny. The "get a lab" quote was entirely in jest. Perhaps I should have added a smiley face. Some folks just take this doggy business way to seriously.


We don't take "doggy business" too seriously. It is only as important as all our available time, ambition, money, passion, etc.

Steve


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## Juli H (Aug 27, 2007)

depittydawg said:


> Funny. The "get a lab" quote was entirely in jest. Perhaps I should have added a smiley face. Some folks just take this doggy business way to seriously.


 
yes....a smiley face, or wink would have been better...the reason being everything you wrote before the suggestion was serious in nature. There was nothing written or inferred to lead us to believe you were anything but serious and so we all thought you were serious...

don't worry, the breaking in doesn't take long.;-)

Juli


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## Howard N (Jan 3, 2003)

> There is just something a little bit more personal with a golden.


Dave, the best part about owning a golden is that you can accessorize them with different colored bandanas.


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## Steve Amrein (Jun 11, 2004)

depittydawg said:


> I'm no expert on retriever training but I'll share my personal experience with you. You won't like my advice. I had a golden once. Damn craziest dog I ever had. Very intelligent, devoted and friendly; but it had about every bad habit that exists for a dog. Digger, escape artist, roamer, barker, couldn't learn where to crap etc. etc. I now own a Lab who is so eager to please, has no bad habits and is healthy as they come. My advice ............Get a Lab.


Please dazzle us lowly dumb golden owners with the lab titles you have gained. 

Most of the time people comment when they have something of value to ad to a thread.


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## Amy Read (Nov 15, 2007)

Where are you located? There might someone close enough to evaluate the dogs (and you) and provide some input. 

We currently have a training group of non-regulars: several Goldens and Chessies, a Flat Coat, two Irish Water Spaniels and a poodle. I guess we should get a token Lab or two. Most of the people are new to field and could not find anyone to help them either. And before I get any rude comments, two of the Goldens are QAA/MH and there are other titles in the group as well.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

Howard N said:


> Dave, the best part about owning a golden is that you can accessorize them with different colored bandanas.


 
ok I have a confession: today I bought a bandanna. Said I never, NEVER, never would do it, but here is the deal: It is a pink breast cancer symbol bandanna. Weezie is going to wear it proudly. 

As for being rude, don't think so. It didn't come across in jest, looked serious like the rest of your post. 

Everyone knows fluffs take no crap regards,


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## Frenchy (Jul 9, 2005)

Howard N said:


> Dave, the best part about owning a golden is that you can accessorize them with different colored bandanas.


Thats what I said....You can Personalize them!


Don't worry Howard, one of these days you too will see the light!


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## Tim Carrion (Jan 5, 2003)

IMHO you shouldn't limit your search to a "golden expert" but instead look for someone that has experience training retrievers. This goes beyond a specific "program" expert to someone that understands training. 
Your local FT/HTclub would be the first place to look. Search for the person that has had multiple dogs at the level you aspire to over multiple years. Chances are they have had to try various methods for different dogs. These will be the people that will see your current problems and help you prevent your future ones. 

Tim


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## duk4me (Feb 20, 2008)

Amy Read said:


> Where are you located? There might someone close enough to evaluate the dogs (and you) and provide some input.
> 
> We currently have a training group of non-regulars: several Goldens and Chessies, a Flat Coat, two Irish Water Spaniels and a poodle. I guess we should get a token Lab or two. Most of the people are new to field and could not find anyone to help them either. And before I get any rude comments, two of the Goldens are QAA/MH and there are other titles in the group as well.


That is about as diverse as it gets. It would be great watching that many different breeds training together. Sure wouldn't have to worry about people mistaking whose dog is theirs.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

Good move deleting that post!!!!

If you notice Steve has beside's golden's a black lab, he likes retrievers. We generally try to be nice about peoples dog's, nothing will start a war faster then insulting a man's dog or his favorite beer. 

Did your experience with your golden sour you on the breed? Is that correct? What type of breeding did this dog have behind it? What was it's history? With you from a pup? Did it have consistant training? What type of training did the dog get if any? Was there another dog with it? All those factors and more play a much bigger role in how a dog behaves then the breed. There are no bad dogs, only bad dog owners.


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## Hunchaser (Jun 15, 2009)

I've learned a lot training my first Golden. Until Magic came along I worked mainly with labs. From my point of view Goldens are half dog and half teddy bear. Use more praise than force. Magic loves to please so let that assist your training.

I run the pack (7 dogs) along the river for about 2 miles every day. They learn about cover, birds, water and develop boldness. Also good for their physical and mental well being.

Keep the sessions short and have fun with your dog.


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## Steve Amrein (Jun 11, 2004)

Howard N said:


> Dave, the best part about owning a golden is that you can accessorize them with different colored bandanas.


I have them to match all the FT ribbon colors. The dogs are color blind but I like Blue the best.


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## duk4me (Feb 20, 2008)

Pals said:


> Now you went and did it....................this ought to be interesting.
> 
> If you notice Steve has beside's golden's a black lab, he likes retrievers. We generally try to be nice about peoples dog's, nothing will start a war faster then insulting a man's dog or his favorite beer.
> 
> Did your experience with your golden sour you on the breed? Is that correct? What type of breeding did this dog have behind it? What was it's history? With you from a pup? Did it have consistant training? What type of training did the dog get if any? Was there another dog with it? All those factors and more play a much bigger role in how a dog behaves then the breed. There are no bad dogs, only bad dog owners.


For a second I ws trying to figure out what I went and did again. lol

One thought did come to mind about the diverse training group. Just think with an accidental breeding or two all the designer breeds that could result.


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## Becky Mills (Jun 6, 2004)

depittydawg said:


> I'm no expert on retriever training but I'll share my personal experience with you. You won't like my advice. I had a golden once. Damn craziest dog I ever had. Very intelligent, devoted and friendly; but it had about every bad habit that exists for a dog. Digger, escape artist, roamer, barker, couldn't learn where to crap etc. etc. I now own a Lab who is so eager to please, has no bad habits and is healthy as they come. My advice ............Get a Lab.


Really? I've got a Golden and he's the best dog on my truck.
Its a fact regards,
Becky


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

There are no bad dogs, only bad dog owners.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, I have to take exception to that. Although I would agree that dogs are neither good nor bad. They are animals. But there are dogs that have behavioral issues that have nothing to do with their owners that make them unsuitable as pets. 
Let me pick a different breed so you folks won't take it so personal. When I was a teen my uncle purchased a German Shepard Dog. He was police officer and loved the breed. He paid top dollar for the dog from a very respectable breeder. In fact, the breeder was one who often provided dogs to law enforcement agencies. The dog was certainly trainable. He invested time and money working with it. It was actually one of the best trained dogs I've ever seen. It would obey instantly on command.
But it had a problem from the start. It was afraid of people, shy or whatever you want to call it. As such, it would often lash out when it's fear impulse was activated. The owner worked with this dog for years. It never got over the shyness. Whenever they took the dog anywhere, which was very often, or whenever they had visitors, the dog had to be restrained. When the dog was about 5 years old another defect emerged. It had hip dysplasia. Over the next few years he spent a fortune on the dog and of course eventually it had to be put down.
This dog had serious behavioral issue from the start. Now suppose you explain to me how the owner of this dog was a "bad owner". Would he have been a "bad owner" if he would have got rid of the dog once he knew it was a fear biter? 
My point, and the point of my original post was that sometimes the best decision is to accept the fact that the animal is not the right animal for your needs. A lot of people seem to think that if they purchase a dog they are morally obligated to take care of it indefinitely irregardless of its behavior. That's nonsense. There are limits. Sometimes the best solution is to find a home that is more suitable to the dog. It's better for the dog, and the people involved. 
I can site two examples including the Golden I mentioned earlier that I did just that. I recognized fairly early that the dog wasn't a good fit for our family. So I found a home that was a good fit. For the Golden in question it went to a home were it would get a lot of attention. In fact it would probably be the center of attention most of the time. Hopefully it worked out for the dog. It worked for me. My life was a hole lot less stressful once the dog was gone.


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## Furball (Feb 23, 2006)

depittydawg said:


> My point, and the point of my original post was that sometimes the best decision is to accept the fact that the animal is not the right animal for your needs. A lot of people seem to think that if they purchase a dog they are morally obligated to take care of it indefinitely irregardless of its behavior. That's nonsense. There are limits. Sometimes the best solution is to find a home that is more suitable to the dog. It's better for the dog, and the people involved.
> I can site two examples including the Golden I mentioned earlier that I did just that. I recognized fairly early that the dog wasn't a good fit for our family. So I found a home that was a good fit. For the Golden in question it went to a home were it would get a lot of attention. In fact it would probably be the center of attention most of the time. Hopefully it worked out for the dog. It worked for me. My life was a hole lot less stressful once the dog was gone.


Well that's nice and most people will not disagree.
But what about the original post in this thread prompted you to reply with this advice? The original post said nothing about being unhappy with her dogs, her dogs being unhappy, or anything of the sort. They simply wanted advice on training differences between breeds. 

Personally, all the problems you stated your golden had are symptoms of a dog left to his own devices and given little training or supervision. Digging means the dog is left outside unattended. Escaping means he was not contained well enough and left unattended. Roaming means he was allowed too much freedom and was not trained to come when called. Barking means he was probably left alone and bored. Not being housebroken is 100% lack of effort from the owner. Now where does the breed come into this equation? I can tell you about labs that are all that in more. Nothing you mentioned had ANYTHING to do with retriever training. 

You know normally I don't spend any time with people with your mentality but you don't seem to understand what you wrote was insensitive and demeaning to those of us who are quite happy and successful with goldens. It's this attitude that sours people to the sport in general. It's always a risk that when I walk to the line with my big fluffy golden, that before I even call for the first mark the judge has a bias because it's not a black dog. Thankfully this is not the case most of the time! If you personally want a lab, that is great, best of luck to you. But don't stomp on those of us who have chosen something different, in case you haven't noticed goldens are quite successful in every sport they play.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

Furball said:


> Well that's nice and most people will not disagree.
> But what about the original post in this thread prompted you to reply with this advice? The original post said nothing about being unhappy with her dogs, her dogs being unhappy, or anything of the sort. They simply wanted advice on training differences between breeds.
> 
> Personally, all the problems you stated your golden had are symptoms of a dog left to his own devices and given little training or supervision. Digging means the dog is left outside unattended. Escaping means he was not contained well enough and left unattended. Roaming means he was allowed too much freedom and was not trained to come when called. Barking means he was probably left alone and bored. Not being housebroken is 100% lack of effort from the owner. Now where does the breed come into this equation? I can tell you about labs that are all that in more. Nothing you mentioned had ANYTHING to do with retriever training.
> ...


 
As Amy and Sue would say: DING DING DING WINNER WINNER CHICKEN DINNER!!! Good post Anney.


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## Jared77 (Oct 7, 2009)

Depittydawg;

So you had a bad experience. So what?! You really feel that was something beneficial to the original poster that you had a Golden with issues? Really?? The original poster is obviously happy with her dogs and is looking for some insight to training her dogs because she's the only Golden person at a Lab party. I know the feeling I've been there myself a few times.

If you can't offer something constructive as many others did, then why do you feel the need to say anything at all? And telling someone to "get a Lab" isn't constructive either. You obviously didn't train the dog to any working level or to even overcome any of the issues you posted; you pawned it off on someone else as you said in your last reply. So if anything that only reinforces that you have no real training experience with a Golden. So next time something like this is brought up, just skip the thread and save everybody the displeasure of dealing with your ignorance on the matter.


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## labguy (Jan 17, 2006)

Deppitty..............Speaking from experience I think you'd better give it up there bud. This is a no win situation. 

Sooner or later some overly sensitive type will suggest you "grow a set" or "get a life" or ask you to "meet them in the back alley at noon" or start plotting your immenent demise. 

To the original poster..... Re-Read Tim Carrion's advice. It's the best response to your question so far.

Good luck.


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## Lenore (Apr 2, 2010)

Seriously? Four pages of being rude to each other and only a few that actually answer the OP's question. Yes, the post that got everyones hackles up was read as serious, then they said they were joking. Let it go, help the OP that started the thread. 

As for the original question: You know your dog best, try several ways, see how your dog reacts. Pick on what works best and stick to that, it doesn't mean that sometimes you can't use other methods. I have a dog that you say a firm NO and his day could be ruined if you don't add a praise in there quick or at least smile at him, the other is the exact opposite. 

Good luck!


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

Jared77 said:


> Depittydawg;
> 
> So you had a bad experience. So what?! You really feel that was something beneficial to the original poster that you had a Golden with issues? Really?? The original poster is obviously happy with her dogs and is looking for some insight to training her dogs because she's the only Golden person at a Lab party. I know the feeling I've been there myself a few times.
> 
> If you can't offer something constructive as many others did, then why do you feel the need to say anything at all? And telling someone to "get a Lab" isn't constructive either. You obviously didn't train the dog to any working level or to even overcome any of the issues you posted; you pawned it off on someone else as you said in your last reply. So if anything that only reinforces that you have no real training experience with a Golden. So next time something like this is brought up, just skip the thread and save everybody the displeasure of dealing with your ignorance on the matter.


Ahhhh. Another example of the high level of character to be found here. Let's play a game. How many times and how fast can we insult someone who has the audacity to say something I disagree with... You go first. Oh, my mistake. You already took your turn. Guess you win.


----------



## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

Lenore said:


> Seriously? Four pages of being rude to each other and only a few that actually answer the OP's question. Yes, the post that got everyones hackles up was read as serious, then they said they were joking. Let it go, help the OP that started the thread.
> 
> As for the original question: You know your dog best, try several ways, see how your dog reacts. Pick on what works best and stick to that, it doesn't mean that sometimes you can't use other methods. I have a dog that you say a firm NO and his day could be ruined if you don't add a praise in there quick or at least smile at him, the other is the exact opposite.
> 
> Good luck!



Correction. Four pages of several like minded people being extremely rude to one person who said something they didn't want to hear.


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## Steve Amrein (Jun 11, 2004)

Lenore said:


> Seriously? Four pages of being rude to each other and only a few that actually answer the OP's question. Yes, the post that got everyones hackles up was read as serious, then they said they were joking. Let it go, help the OP that started the thread.
> 
> As for the original question: You know your dog best, try several ways, see how your dog reacts. Pick on what works best and stick to that, it doesn't mean that sometimes you can't use other methods. I have a dog that you say a firm NO and his day could be ruined if you don't add a praise in there quick or at least smile at him, the other is the exact opposite.
> 
> Good luck!


All dogs train different. Some are soft and sensitive, some are hardheaded and some have endless bottom. Some are poutty and some can excel despite the trainer. The bread does not make any difference. What does make a difference is you ability to adapt a training program that suits you and you dog. I suggest the OP defines what the goals are and work with some proven training methods and get with a training group that has similar goals. Lastly for deputy, if you look and AA dogs on purely a statistical basis the lab is in 3rd place. Goldens and Chessies have more success its just they are 1% or less of the FT population.


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## Steve Amrein (Jun 11, 2004)

depittydawg said:


> Correction. Four pages of several like minded people being extremely rude to one person who said something they didn't want to hear.


Maybe you could re post your comments about me again. You post about being rude to you. Its OK for you dish it out but not take it.......

BTW a few folks PM'd me the gist of your comment, whats your profession again ?


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## Becky Mills (Jun 6, 2004)

Deppity, bless your heart. You sure do have folks riled up now, don't you? You might wanna lay low. Most of the A Team, quarterbacked by Felony Melanie, hasn't even shown up yet.
Just trying to help in the worst way regards,
Becky


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## Lenore (Apr 2, 2010)

depittydawg said:


> Correction. Four pages of several like minded people being extremely rude to one person who said something they didn't want to hear.


I was being more PC and pointing out that this rampant arguing over a miscommunication is stupid. Which is not helping the OP in one way...


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## kgiff (Aug 28, 2009)

Golden6824 said:


> I have two golden retrievers I am training for field work.
> 
> The older one has no field lines in his pedigree. He loves birds but doesn't have a lot of courage and gets discouraged easily.


and



Golden6824 said:


> As far as getting a lab....I am doing field work to have another area to spend time with my dogs with, not getting a dog to do field work with. My dogs are my love, the sport is secondary.


Hey me too! I'm still pretty new to all of this so I don't have a lot of advice. 

My older golden is 8 (and has no field in his pedigree). He was introduced to birds just over a year ago and is very soft. I'm not force fetching him and I won't be using an e-collar with him. But I'm taking that natural love of the game and working that with patience and lots of praise. He earned his first JH leg about 6 months after being introduced to a bird and came very close to passing the WC this spring after taking the winter off. My expectations for him are different than my younger dog, but he's still having fun playing the game. 

I'm glad you found someone to work with. I'm still looking for someone to work with that is relatively close to me.


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## Guest (May 5, 2010)

Becky Mills said:


> Most of the A Team, quarterbacked by Felony Melanie, hasn't even shown up yet.


Oh, I'm here! This one's just not worth my time. I've got bigger fish to fry. :twisted:


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## Glenda Brown (Jun 23, 2003)

I just pulled up RTF at this moment. I don't have any bigger fish to fry so I will give a response. I was given a pretty rough time when I started with my Goldens in field trials and hunt tests. I would like to prevent others from encountering some of what I did. I even had a couple of men who would walk out of the field and refuse to throw for me since I was running a Golden----after I had spent a lot of the day throwing for them and their Labs. They are no longer in the game, I am!

I have trained and competed with both Goldens and Labs. My first field dog was a Golden and I began training him with Tom Quinn's book in one hand and Luke sitting by the other hand. Luke earned an AFC, MH, UDT and had four Open seconds and 44 1/2 all age points---I am writing that because I knew nothing about training for the field and there were none of the wonderful training manuals and DVDs out there that there are now. If I could do that with a Golden, then any of you can as well. Luke always lived at home and was a housedog. I tend to be rather stubborn and both the dog and I loved what we were doing and we refused to let others set our goals. 

My Goldens are trained in the same manner as my Labs. You set the same standards for both breeds. There are some differences---among all my dogs. As stated here earlier by Evan, I think a "good dog is a good dog". I have had and have Labs that need to have modifications made in their training because of what their personalities are not because of their breed. It has been the same with my Goldens. Different personalities in dogs appeal to different types of persons---we see this in the Lab community as well---those who always like bitches and a certain type of bitch; those who have wild out of control Labs and love them; those who prefer a more aloof dog compared to those who like a more personable one; etc.

If you would like to get started with your Golden in the field, there are many valuable resources out there available to you. If you go to the Golden Retriever Club of America's web site www.grca.org you will find a list of reference material and a field contact list which may list persons in your area who might be able to help you get started. The
Golden Retriever News offers articles to help newcomers and then to help you as you progress. The Field Education Committee of the GRCA is there to help beginners as well as those who want to move to a higher level learn the delights of field work with their Golden.

If not for my Golden, I would not be involved in this marvelous sport which has given so much to me. Don't let the naysayers stop you. What is interesting and rewarding is that some of the greatest support I have ever received for my Goldens has come from Lab persons.

None of my Goldens has ever worn a bandana and they have been strong water dogs. 

One of my Labs did wear an outfit which he thought was rather embarrassing, but he was at a tea party (when it had a different meaning than it does currently) with two grand daughters!

Glenda


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## D Osborn (Jul 19, 2004)

Melanie Foster said:


> Oh, I'm here! This one's just not worth my time. I've got bigger fish to fry. :twisted:


Yeah, so not worth it. Anything I say will be started with
Darlin..... and ended with How Niiiiiice.:roll:

To the OP-Tim was right, Anney was right, and Glenda is almost always right until she talks about dressing up the labs. But this comes from someone who put a flower on her golden's head Who then failed utility with Style all weekend

Moving on...


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## Golden6824 (Mar 28, 2010)

Just to let everyone know, I didn't give someone's ignorance of my wonderful breed a second thought. Those of you who know me from the golden retriever forum (Loisiana - Conner and Flip) know that I love my goldens and that obedience trials are my first passion. 

Field is an area we are enjoying expanding to, but if it turned out my dogs couldn't even pass a WC or JH, I'd just shrug and move on to something else. I'm not looking for an FC/AFC dog, just to do the best I can with the dogs that I have and love. 

BTW, the lab trainer that I'm working with really likes my dogs, especially Flip, whom he calls my "little spitfire" - all 47 pounds of him.

Jodie


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## Glenda Brown (Jun 23, 2003)

Hi Jodie:

Just a warning----- I only wanted a WC on my OTCH Golden (mom of Luke who I mentioned earlier). 

Field can become an addiction. Having an obedience background is extremely beneficial for both you and your Goldens in doing field work. My "basics" if you could even call them that for Luke were based on what I had done in obedience. Luke did not have an e-collar on him until he was over four-----I did not like the way I saw it used when I initially did field work and was afraid to use it until I knew how to use it properly. 

Have fun---that's what it is all about for both you and your dogs. You will meet some absolutely wonderful persons while doing field work. I hope it brings to you as much pleasure and joy as it has to me.

Glenda


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## Howard N (Jan 3, 2003)

> One of my Labs did wear an outfit which he thought was rather embarrassing, but he was at a tea party (when it had a different meaning than it does currently) with two grand daughters


Pictures??


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## labguy (Jan 17, 2006)

IMHO, Golden owners have no reason to be defensive about their dogs abilities. 

From what I've seen, these dogs can and do run with the best there is. The number of Goldens to Labs entered in FT's and Ht's and their success ratio indicates some pretty impressive numbers. 

Much as I hate to admit it, I think that pound for pound, they are probably better natural markers than Labs. 

Personally, I wouldn't own a Golden because of the grooming issues, but I think their abilities in Field trials and Hunt tests have spoken volumes...........much more so than defending them over the internet.


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## mrosspa (Oct 11, 2009)

Glenda:

It's good to see your post. I've not seen you down at Prado for any Hunt Tests lately. It is always a joy to speak with you. Thank you again for your help when I was just starting out training my poodle.

Michael (The guy with the poodle)


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## alynn (Apr 5, 2008)

Glenda, thanks for the thoughtful post AND thanks for all the good work on the GRCA field education committee.


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## Dave Flint (Jan 13, 2009)

I think the field-bred Golden is the best kept secret in the gun dog world.


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## Golden6824 (Mar 28, 2010)

For all those that sent me private messages of encouragement, thank you. 

It has taken me two full years of searching to find someone willing to work with me on a regular basis. It's easy to find someone willing to take your dog from you for several months and train them themselves. It's been much more difficult for me to find someone who lives close by who would work with _me_ at least once a week. And from the few times we have worked together, I can see that we have some very different philosophies in training. (while I have no problem using corrections in training, I don't consider "wear his ass out with the heeling stick" an appropriate correction for my dogs). But for the obedience portion of field training, I'm okay with our differences because I feel comfortable enough with my own knowledge of training to be able to do it my way.

It's the actual field part, like running marks, that I don't feel confident enough in my knowledge of yet. For instance, a couple of weeks ago, we were doing some walking singles with my older dog Conner. On about the third or fourth one, he put his nose on the bumper and then walked off. I walked in, ear pinched him to the bumper, and then set him up to rerun it. Trainer gave a "hey, hey" and my dog purposefully avoided looking. Then he gave a duck call, which perked the dog up, and he successfully ran the mark.

My instinct was to stop there, to end on success. But the trainer said to keep going. I was stuck between thinking I knew my dog versus listening to the guy with multiple MH's. I went ahead and did some more marks and my dog did great on them.

Jodie


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## Judy Chute (May 9, 2005)

Nicely done, Jodie!! .........Enjoy your time in the "field" just as you do with your obedience training and trialing  

You have a great attitude..and just as great love and respect  ...for your Golden Retrievers.. a recipe for certain succuss in whatever venue!

Best!

Judy


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## Judy Chute (May 9, 2005)

Steve Amrein said:


> I have them to match all the FT ribbon colors. The dogs are color blind but I like Blue the best.


Good one, Steve!!!!!!!!!


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## Kenneth Niles Bora (Jul 1, 2004)

2tall said:


> Then get a chessie! JK, but the op really needs to get with a trainer or group that knows goldens.


 
Carol,
All a Golden Retriever is, is a metro-sexual Chesapeake with hair extensions and a fashion consultant. ;-)


.


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## Bait (Jan 21, 2004)

Ken Bora said:


> metro-sexual Chesapeake


You are the MAN, Ken!  That's good stuff!


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## depittydawg (Apr 20, 2010)

Ok one last post to incite all the rabid Golden Boys and Girls here. The fact that I had one that didn't fit our family needs at one time notwithstanding, I think Golden's are wonderful dogs. 
But I'll also say that some of the Golden enthusiasts I've encountered here appear to be of low character. After a barrage of insults, innuendos and accusations Steve Boy now wants to know what I do for a profession. Why? Because I said I had the audacity to convery a bad experience with a golden... I've had my intelligence insulted, my competency insulted, negative innuendo's spead about me, my character insulted, my right to an opinion questioned, and many other insults flung at me from several posters on this site. 
Last word from me on this folks, you really give your dogs, this web site, and the overall sport a bad name with this kind of Juvenile behavior. Better luck next time someone says something you don't want to hear. Try to fight the group think urge and the drive to collectively stone the messenger of that which you don't want to hear. 
And for you steveie wonder boy... I'll cross the line cause you certainly earned it. You a Ahole buddy. Plain and simple


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

> but it had about every bad habit that exists for a dog. Digger, escape artist, roamer, barker, couldn't learn where to crap etc. etc.


The only way a dog gets these habits is if he is running loose with no supervision for many hours. You don't have to be a rocket scientist or a Golden owner to figure that.


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## Laura Heyden (Aug 14, 2009)

When something starts growling, it's best to quit poking it! Don't diss our dogs.


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## Golddogs (Feb 3, 2004)

depittydawg said:


> Ok one last post to incite all the rabid Golden Boys and Girls here. The fact that I had one that didn't fit our family needs at one time notwithstanding, I think Golden's are wonderful dogs.
> But I'll also say that some of the Golden enthusiasts I've encountered here appear to be of low character. After a barrage of insults, innuendos and accusations Steve Boy now wants to know what I do for a profession. Why? Because I said I had the audacity to convery a bad experience with a golden... I've had my intelligence insulted, my competency insulted, negative innuendo's spead about me, my character insulted, my right to an opinion questioned, and many other insults flung at me from several posters on this site.
> Last word from me on this folks, you really give your dogs, this web site, and the overall sport a bad name with this kind of Juvenile behavior. Better luck next time someone says something you don't want to hear. Try to fight the group think urge and the drive to collectively stone the messenger of that which you don't want to hear.
> And for you steveie wonder boy... I'll cross the line cause you certainly earned it. You a Ahole buddy. Plain and simple


You want a piece of cheese with your whine?

I've met an A-hole, and believe me Steve is no A-hole.


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## Pals (Jul 29, 2008)

Dippitydawg--No not true you posted a really crappy thread and then deleted it-that was his reference. I read it and you crossed a line-just like your last post.


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## luvgld (Jan 24, 2010)

Been lurking for a long time, but wanted to log on to say “Stay with it Jodie!” You’ll have the time of your life.

My golden is from conformation lines and is in training now for his SH. His sire was one of the top conformation goldens in the country, but also has a lot of performance titles after his name. I knew nothing about field work when I got my boy, but when he won the puppy stakes at a local golden retriever club event I knew that had to change. It has been a blast. And, uhmm, yes, he has been called “Fluffie” 

One of my favorite articles about the differences between labs, goldens and chessies is by Amy and John Dahl. Unnfortunately, I can't post the "url" because I don't have enough posts. Maybe someone else can post the link?

Ann
Dallas


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## Steve Amrein (Jun 11, 2004)

depittydawg said:


> Ok one last post to incite all the rabid Golden Boys and Girls here. The fact that I had one that didn't fit our family needs at one time notwithstanding, I think Golden's are wonderful dogs.
> But I'll also say that some of the Golden enthusiasts I've encountered here appear to be of low character. After a barrage of insults, innuendos and accusations Steve Boy now wants to know what I do for a profession. Why? Because I said I had the audacity to convery a bad experience with a golden... I've had my intelligence insulted, my competency insulted, negative innuendo's spead about me, my character insulted, my right to an opinion questioned, and many other insults flung at me from several posters on this site.
> Last word from me on this folks, you really give your dogs, this web site, and the overall sport a bad name with this kind of Juvenile behavior. Better luck next time someone says something you don't want to hear. Try to fight the group think urge and the drive to collectively stone the messenger of that which you don't want to hear.
> And for you steveie wonder boy... I'll cross the line cause you certainly earned it. You a Ahole buddy. Plain and simple


Well thanks deputy. I am glad you think so. The reason I asked your profession is think you may be in the law enforcement field. With your deleted post that you wont man up to repost you threaten me and then I believe the "term bring it little man" was used. I would think if a person is in the law enforcement field would not be threatening and taunting someone and now calling me a ahole would be in a little better control of themselves. 

Sorry your 1st Golden did not work out and I am sure its in a better place. I am also sorry that you can dish it out and not take the heat when you spout off something that you are wrong about. I am also sorry to the original poster that came to this site looking for help. 

If you want to insult me and cuss me further maybe you should just send it in a PM so as not to further embarrass yourself. I am also posting my real name and except for threads like these I am not ashamed to do so.


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## Maxmbob (Jan 27, 2010)

luvgld said:


> Been lurking for a long time, but wanted to log on to say “Stay with it Jodie!” You’ll have the time of your life.
> 
> My golden is from conformation lines and is in training now for his SH. His sire was one of the top conformation goldens in the country, but also has a lot of performance titles after his name. I knew nothing about field work when I got my boy, but when he won the puppy stakes at a local golden retriever club event I knew that had to change. It has been a blast. And, uhmm, yes, he has been called “Fluffie”
> 
> ...


Did a Google search on Amy and John Dahl and found the article. Good information, thanks.


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## signgirl (Jun 4, 2006)

You are all wasting your time trying to reason or even explain your viewpoints to this guy!

A few years back there was a guy on a Canadian forum (eventually banned) who had exceptionally thin skin, loved to play the victim and twisted every comment, constructive or not, into a personal attack to which he had to defend himself...mostly with vindictive comments. He was also the "world's foremost dog authority", having once run a JH.

After a while, his rants were treated as entertainment...everyone waiting to see just how far or often he could step into the poop.

He appeared from oblivion and has thankfully retreated from whence he came.


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## red devil (Jan 4, 2003)

http://www.oakhillkennel.com/library/breeds.html


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## goldensrule (Feb 20, 2010)

To the OP,
My first trained Golden was out of a FC dog. I got lucky to have a good dog and even more lucky to find a good mentor. My mentor was lab person. Usually had 2 to 3 labs working. We would occaisionally train with other amatuers and I was fortunate to be able to throw a lot of marks for a local pro with 16 dogs on his truck. I had the only Golden.

I cannot remember a single instance of changing a drill or a set-up to suit my golden. We changed things based on her abiltities and needs, but no different than we changed things for labs.

I have FF about 6 Goldens now and and equal nimber of labs. This is limited experience, but I have yet to find a need to change the system because I was working with a lab versus a Golden.

I read John and Amys article and found a bit of truth to it. 

In fact if you look at the picture below youll see the kind of issue Amy talked about with Female Goldens not having enough "GO". If anyone has any advice on how to correct this let me know. Id like a bit better water entry.












For Dippty,
I think the reason some of us Golden folks get a bit sensative is that theres a precentage of lab folks that dont give us due respect and wont ever. Not the majority in my opinion, but they are there. Secondly your comments were out of line.
Im in your area and if you would like to get together and throw some bumpers let me know. It wouldnt hurt either of us and I think you might gain a bit of knowledge about Goldens.


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## Maxs Mom (Sep 17, 2009)

goldensrule said:


> To the OP,
> 
> In fact if you look at the picture below youll see the kind of issue Amy talked about with Female Goldens not having enough "GO". If anyone has any advice on how to correct this let me know. Id like a bit better water entry.


I can't help you with your problem but I would LOVE to try some dock jumping with her!  Wish my girl had that going into the water. 

Ann


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## Bubba (Jan 3, 2003)

goldensrule said:


> To the OP,
> My first trained Golden was out of a FC dog. I got lucky to have a good dog and even more lucky to find a good mentor. My mentor was lab person. Usually had 2 to 3 labs working. We would occaisionally train with other amatuers and I was fortunate to be able to throw a lot of marks for a local pro with 16 dogs on his truck. I had the only Golden.
> 
> I cannot remember a single instance of changing a drill or a set-up to suit my golden. We changed things based on her abiltities and needs, but no different than we changed things for labs.
> ...


What we got here is photographic evidence that someone flings Rugs.

PETA regards

Bubba


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## red devil (Jan 4, 2003)

more examples of the wonders of photoshop


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## duk4me (Feb 20, 2008)

Steve Amrein said:


> Well thanks deputy. I am glad you think so. The reason I asked your profession is think you may be in the law enforcement field. With your deleted post that you wont man up to repost you threaten me and then I believe the "term bring it little man" was used. I would think if a person is in the law enforcement field would not be threatening and taunting someone and now calling me a ahole would be in a little better control of themselves.
> 
> Sorry your 1st Golden did not work out and I am sure its in a better place. I am also sorry that you can dish it out and not take the heat when you spout off something that you are wrong about. I am also sorry to the original poster that came to this site looking for help.
> 
> If you want to insult me and cuss me further maybe you should just send it in a PM so as not to further embarrass yourself. I am also posting my real name and except for threads like these I am not ashamed to do so.


Steve,

You are a s%$#@%%$#@@#$$%^^$$^^^, Pals well she is a %%$$##))__**^^%##@!$$^%##, Steph well she is just a @@##$$%%^^$#$&%^^&$$%$, and the felon sorry but momma said I just couldn't use that kind of language.


----------



## Steve Amrein (Jun 11, 2004)

duk4me said:


> Steve,
> 
> You are a s%$#@%%$#@@#$$%^^$$^^^, Pals well she is a %%$$##))__**^^%##@!$$^%##, Steph well she is just a @@##$$%%^^$#$&%^^&$$%$, and the felon sorry but momma said I just couldn't use that kind of language.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA !!!!


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## Guest (May 7, 2010)

Steve Amrein said:


> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA !!!!


I'll second that. :lol::lol:


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## goldensrule (Feb 20, 2010)

The trick to rug flingin is getting the head and body aligned so they hit the water properly. Sideways gets fewer points!


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## Creek Retrievers (Jul 1, 2005)

Two strikes against me! I own a GSD and Goldens! 

I think Golden owners are a unique breed in themselves and their bark is often worse than their bite, well except for Melanie, but she has all her shots!

To the OP, find the best retriever trainer in your area and work with them. Join a retriever club and start your formal retriever education.


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## Laura Heyden (Aug 14, 2009)

Creek Retrievers said:


> I think Golden owners are a unique breed in themselves and their bark is often worse than their bite, well except for Melanie, but she has all her shots!


Oh, I don't know about that. You can say what you will about me, but start bad mouthing my dog, it's best to stand clear. Then again, there are agressive genes that sometimes get passed along even in the best of bloodlines. ;-)


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## Diane Brunelle (Jun 11, 2004)

> You can say what you will about me, but start bad mouthing my dog, it's best to stand clear.


We feel the same way....bad mouth my dog and you are my enemy for life......

Diane, Steve and Max


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## Maxmbob (Jan 27, 2010)

depittydawg said:


> Ok one last post to incite all the rabid Golden Boys and Girls here. The fact that I had one that didn't fit our family needs at one time notwithstanding, I think Golden's are wonderful dogs.
> But I'll also say that some of the Golden enthusiasts I've encountered here appear to be of low character. After a barrage of insults, innuendos and accusations Steve Boy now wants to know what I do for a profession. Why? Because I said I had the audacity to convery a bad experience with a golden... I've had my intelligence insulted, my competency insulted, negative innuendo's spead about me, my character insulted, my right to an opinion questioned, and many other insults flung at me from several posters on this site.
> Last word from me on this folks, you really give your dogs, this web site, and the overall sport a bad name with this kind of Juvenile behavior. Better luck next time someone says something you don't want to hear. Try to fight the group think urge and the drive to collectively stone the messenger of that which you don't want to hear.
> And for you steveie wonder boy... I'll cross the line cause you certainly earned it. You a Ahole buddy. Plain and simple


There you going pushing the string again!


----------



## Dave Burton (Mar 22, 2006)

goldensrule said:


> To the OP,
> My first trained Golden was out of a FC dog. I got lucky to have a good dog and even more lucky to find a good mentor. My mentor was lab person. Usually had 2 to 3 labs working. We would occaisionally train with other amatuers and I was fortunate to be able to throw a lot of marks for a local pro with 16 dogs on his truck. I had the only Golden.
> 
> I cannot remember a single instance of changing a drill or a set-up to suit my golden. We changed things based on her abiltities and needs, but no different than we changed things for labs.
> ...


How many people did it take to throw that golden that far out into the water? J/K ,cool pic


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## Bubba (Jan 3, 2003)

Creek Retrievers said:


> I think Golden owners are a unique breed in themselves and their bark is often worse than their bite, well except for Melanie, but she has all her shots!


That is for sure the case with Miss Becky - unless it ain't your day and she happens to wing ya with her tooth.

She will be Hell on wheels if she ever finds them store boughts regards

Bubba


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## Dan Boerboon (May 30, 2009)

Juli H said:


> First of all, you really have to make sure you have the appropriate color and style of bandana for each dog.
> 
> That said, I am sure someone with more 'fluffy' exp will give you some ideas.
> Juli


Well look at the labs with bandanas. I especially like the pink one. Never see one of my goldens in a bandana or any other clothing.
























Love my goldens and they are an excellent breed. I've run in HT because they are pass fail and haven't wanted to run FT as I've heard to many stories about good dogs failing just because they weren't a BLM, even the other color labs fail. But I am trying the FT game this year as I enjoy the game its not just about passing, I'll know how well or poorly my dogs did no matter what the judges score, or the comments from the lab owners.


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## labguy (Jan 17, 2006)

Red retrievers said:


> Love my goldens and they are an excellent breed. I've run in HT because they are pass fail and haven't wanted to run FT as I've heard to many stories about good dogs failing just because they weren't a BLM, even the other color labs fail. But I am trying the FT game this year as I enjoy the game its not just about passing, I'll know how well or poorly my dogs did no matter what the judges score, or the comments from the lab owners.


Sorry, I just can't let this one go without comment. 

I don't believe for a minute that any honorable person (judge) would purposely place a dog lower because of its breed. What would this type of behavior possibly do for the integrity of the game?

I have however, many times, seen people bitch and whine about not placing in a trial or passing a hunt test and then calling "breed biased" when their dogs were clearly not up to the standard of the day.

I think people do themselves and especially their breed of choice a disservice by these types of comments.

If there was evidence of breed biased then it should have been brought before the FT or HT committee.


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## Creek Retrievers (Jul 1, 2005)

labguy said:


> Sorry, I just can't let this one go without comment.
> 
> I don't believe for a minute that any honorable person (judge) would purposely place a dog lower because of its breed. What would this type of behavior possibly do for the integrity of the game?
> 
> ...


I agree, a good judge is there to judge a dog's working ability, not a particular breed. Good dog work is good dog work, and should be judged like that. 

Red Retrievers, how many tests and trials have you run?


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## Dan Boerboon (May 30, 2009)

Creek Retrievers said:


> I agree, a good judge is there to judge a dog's working ability, not a particular breed. Good dog work is good dog work, and should be judged like that.
> 
> Red Retrievers, how many tests and trials have you run?


I don't know why it matters how many HT or FTs I've run when my post was concerning what I have been told by those that have and do run in FTs. But if it helps I've been running HT for 6 years have never run FT as I've been told, only hear say, that if its not a BLM your chances of placing are not very good. I have been told this by experienced trainers and handlers that have quit the game for that reason. There are individuals that won't play the game if it isn't a BLM they are running. I don't have the statistics but perhaps someone here does of the top dogs what is the percentages of the variou breeds and colors? Not numbers but percentages. The numers won't lie. If there is a differance in the number of dogs of a breed or color entered and the number that place perhaps the myth could be disproved. Or it could prove that judges ar not color blind, or BLMs are just the best FT dogs.

Only once did a fault a judge in a HT for my dog not passing and that was because the judges changed the test twice as no dogs were passing and did not rerun the dogs that had already run, mine was one of them. The AKC official didn't know what to do. I have heard that those judges were disciplined and have not judged since. Other than that instance I have never faulted anyone but myself for my dogs performance.


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## Howard N (Jan 3, 2003)

Poor guy, he looks so ashamed. 

I laughed out loud when I saw this pic.


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## Guest (May 8, 2010)

Pete said:


> Would you say Golden Owners are soft or sensitive in general


I was thinking more like embarrassing. I do have some other comments (imagine that!) but will decide how much energy I have to share them later.


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## Creek Retrievers (Jul 1, 2005)

Red retrievers said:


> I don't know why it matters how many HT or FTs I've run when my post was concerning what I have been told by those that have and do run in FTs. But if it helps I've been running HT for 6 years have never run FT as I've been told, only hear say, that if its not a BLM your chances of placing are not very good. I have been told this by experienced trainers and handlers that have quit the game for that reason. There are individuals that won't play the game if it isn't a BLM they are running. I don't have the statistics but perhaps someone here does of the top dogs what is the percentages of the variou breeds and colors? Not numbers but percentages. The numers won't lie. If there is a differance in the number of dogs of a breed or color entered and the number that place perhaps the myth could be disproved. Or it could prove that judges ar not color blind, or BLMs are just the best FT dogs.
> 
> Only once did a fault a judge in a HT for my dog not passing and that was because the judges changed the test twice as no dogs were passing and did not rerun the dogs that had already run, mine was one of them. The AKC official didn't know what to do. I have heard that those judges were disciplined and have not judged since. Other than that instance I have never faulted anyone but myself for my dogs performance.


I am not sure if there has been a statistical analysis done for field trials but last I read and heard as someone already posted, compared to the population of field trial dogs and their given breed, Chessies rate number 1 for field trial success, Goldens are number 2, followed by Labs at number 3. 

For people like the OP just starting in the sport, your original post made it sound like trials and tests are breed bias but you run them anyways. 

If you feel that the sport is breed bias, then you may want to find another dog sport. In the ten plus years I have run mostly hunt tests and now trials, only once have I walked away feeling like I was unjustly dropped at a trial and it had nothing to do with the breed of dog I was running.


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## talingr (Feb 4, 2006)

Howard N said:


> Poor guy, he looks so ashamed.
> 
> I laughed out loud when I saw this pic.




Howard,
First of all, I don't know what you are doing following a Golden thread 

But.... you have to admit, that blue does compliment the black coat! 

Linda


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## Golddogs (Feb 3, 2004)

Pete said:


> Would you say Golden Owners are soft or sensitive in general
> 
> Pete


"There are no soft Goldens, only soft Golden owners."

author unknown


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## Guest (May 8, 2010)

Red retrievers said:


> I've been told, only hear say, that if its not a BLM your chances of placing are not very good. I have been told this by experienced trainers and handlers that have quit the game for that reason.


Wwwwait, experienced trainers have quit the field trial game because they couldn't place if it wasn't a BLM? How experienced were they? On this coast, even Gonia, Patopea & Sargenti are having success with Goldens and I don't think they're going to quit anytime soon. ;-)



> There are individuals that won't play the game if it isn't a BLM they are running.


No offense, but duh. That is a personal preference, no?

Side note, Becky, "anyway*s*" is not a word.


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## Bait (Jan 21, 2004)

Melanie Foster said:


> Side note, Becky, "anyway*s*" is not a word.


It can be.
I know it is in parts of central PA.


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## DarrinGreene (Feb 8, 2007)

Pete said:


> Would you say Golden Owners are soft or sensitive in general
> 
> Pete


LOL Let's take Bait, for instance! 

~ducking~


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## Bait (Jan 21, 2004)

DarrinGreene said:


> LOL Let's take Bait, for instance!
> 
> ~ducking~


I like to call it, "being in touch with my feminine side." 
The chicks really dig that.


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## Troopers Mom (Nov 19, 2005)

Bait said:


> I like to call it, "being in touch with my feminine side."
> The chicks really dig that.


No, I have to disagree. I think its all in the way you wear your bib! 

Arleen


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## Bait (Jan 21, 2004)

Troopers Mom said:


> No, I have to disagree. I think its all in the way you wear your bib!
> 
> Arleen


I don't know if there's a feminine way to wear a bib. But, combined with the right attire it could work. Such as the right boxers, boxer-briefs, a kilt, or even John Daley-type golf pants........who knows, you have to accessorize.


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## dnf777 (Jun 9, 2009)

Golden6824,
I've owned three goldens, and they ran the spectrum from hard-charging to very soft. The soft dog would do everything I asked of it, I just had to ask him in a different way. Evan's posted quote says it all.
In general, I quit listening when someone starts making rash generalizations about dog breeds. Yes, there are some differences, buy they're all individuals, and deserve our attention, efforts, and confidence, until proven otherwise.

I wouldn't send my kids to a school where the teachers made comments about "all the blond kids" or "all the black kids"?? Nor would I take advice from a trainer with such prejudices.


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## D Osborn (Jul 19, 2004)

> Side note, Becky, "anyway*s*" is not a word.


It is in the south. Just like Darlin and how Sweeeet, like Iced tea.


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## Creek Retrievers (Jul 1, 2005)

Melanie Foster said:


> Wwwwait, experienced trainers have quit the field trial game because they couldn't place if it wasn't a BLM? How experienced were they? On this coast, even Gonia, Patopea & Sargenti are having success with Goldens and I don't think they're going to quit anytime soon. ;-)
> 
> No offense, but duh. That is a personal preference, no?
> 
> Side note, Becky, "anyway*s*" is not a word.


Sorry Melanie, my early vernacular did not consist of the queen's language. Ya, over der, and anyways occasionally slip out at times!


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## Golden6824 (Mar 28, 2010)

Okay, had to share what my trainer said to me this morning when me met up. 

His exact words were "If we keep training together and Flip keeps it up, you're gonna make me go out and buy one of them golden retrievers. I like the fire in that little guy."

Yay for goldens!! 

Jodie


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## Laura Heyden (Aug 14, 2009)

Jodie,

I'm so glad things are going well with your trainer. I sure enjoy working with mine.

Laura


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## Suzanne Burr (Jul 13, 2004)

labguy wrote: "I don't believe for a minute that any honorable person (judge) would purposely place a dog lower because of its breed. What would this type of behavior possibly do for the integrity of the game?"

Unfortunately, it has happened. It was a long time ago in an Open stake. My bitch was being run by the pro who trained her. She took 4th and later on one of the judges took his dog (lab) to the same pro for training. The judge said to the pro he just couldn't bring himself to give a golden a better placement than that. Now, the pro is dead, the judge is dead, and the dog is dead, so nobody left but me and I can honestly say, it hasn't happened again to me or any of my fluffies, rug rats, swamp collies, or whatever you want to call them...........personally I just call them good dogs.
Suzanne B
who now needs to get back to lurk mode and earn some money to feed those good dogs.


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## labguy (Jan 17, 2006)

Suzanne Burr said:


> It was a long time ago in an Open stake. My bitch was being run by the pro who trained her. She took 4th and later on one of the judges took his dog (lab) to the same pro for training. The judge said to the pro he just couldn't bring himself to give a golden a better placement than that.QUOTE]
> 
> This is all just more hearsay.........You don't know that the judge meant it. He could have been joking around as "one lab owner to another".
> 
> ...


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## Howard N (Jan 3, 2003)

I've never seen any breed bias from judges in trials I've gone to.

I did over hear a couple of old timers, years ago, talking about judging, their assingments, and dogs . The way they talked, just between themselves, I wouldn't be surprised if it did happen. I know they had predudices against a couple of the same outlaw dogs and were not to shy about how they through these dogs out, labs though


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## Chance Raehn (Dec 18, 2008)

It sure would be nice if instead of wasting our energy fighting with each other, we used this energy for fighting organizations that are against us all and all of our breeds.

All dogs are cool, regards


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