# Who breeds BIG labs?



## LabBroker (Dec 2, 2013)

I started looking for to buy a male black lab pup about 2 weeks ago. One of my criterias was that the sire be at least 85 lbs, with 95 being even better. I am still wanting the athletic field trial build and I am having a hard time finding breeders who are breeding these bigger labs. It seems there are more people breeding bigger chocolates males, and I do see a lot more larger yellow females but I can not seem to find many that that are either are kicking out black pups. I am sure if I was to wait a while one would pop up. Anyhow, the reason for my posting this thread to was ask if anyone can give me names of kennels or breeders that they are known for breeding larger athletic labs (not the full English breed) so at least I can start researching and find one that has a little do soon. I would like to buy between now and the end of January.
For what it is worth, my current retired lab is 100 lbs, his dad was 100 lbs. I have enjoyed the larger dogs, I have nothing against the smaller dogs. I have passed up a lot of litters that had some beautiful sires and dams because they were all under 80 lbs.


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## BigKahuna13 (Mar 6, 2009)

Trying to understand your post. What would be your personal benefit or the function of owning a "Big" lab?


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## mjh345 (Jun 17, 2006)

You are looking for a dog that doesn't fit and would be out of compliance with the breed standard.
Responsible breeders try to protect the integrity of the breed and thereby comply with these standards
Good Luck


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## Happy Gilmore (Feb 29, 2008)

Maybe someone knows the name of the yellow dog Bill Sargenti runs in the open. Looks like a Mastiff.


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## yellow machine (Dec 7, 2005)

Try another site that lists BIG lab breeders. Smells of a troller


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## firehouselabs (Jan 23, 2008)

Unfortunately, while it seems that the main criteria you are looking for is size, that is generally not even in the top five on the list of criteria for *most *members on this board. That isn't to say that someone may or may not chime in with a breeder or two where they got their "block head, 100lb" or whatever the latest catch phase is now a days. Generally speaking, if this is your main criteria for a lab- look at ads in your local paper and online paper classifieds. They are filled with ads where the size of the parents are the main selling points. Just be aware that the size of the dog does not "make up" the dog. In other words, health, temperament, intelligence, and a willingness to follow orders, should ALL be placed above cosmetic attributes such as size and color. Because of this, breeders on this forum typically breed labs in the range of 55-80lbs, which is within/closer to the breed standard. 
Now, that is my opinion as a breeder and a former owner of a lab that was 115lbs at working weight. I might add, he was a mixture of show/field trial lines which is one of the reasons that he was so big, and we got lucky that he grew correctly and without health problems.


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## Happy Gilmore (Feb 29, 2008)

firehouselabs said:


> Unfortunately, while it seems that the main criteria you are looking for is size, that is generally not even in the top five on the list of criteria for *most *members on this board. That isn't to say that someone may or may not chime in with a breeder or two where they got their "block head, 100lb" or whatever the latest catch phase is now a days. Generally speaking, if this is your main criteria for a lab- look at ads in your local paper and online paper classifieds. They are filled with ads where the size of the parents are the main selling points. Just be aware that the size of the dog does not "make up" the dog. In other words, health, temperament, intelligence, and a willingness to follow orders, should ALL be placed above cosmetic attributes such as size and color. Because of this, breeders on this forum typically breed labs in the range of 55-80lbs, which is within/closer to the breed standard.
> Now, that is my opinion as a breeder and a former owner of a lab that was 115lbs at working weight. I might add, he was a mixture of show/field trial lines which is one of the reasons that he was so big, and we got lucky that he grew correctly and without health problems.


He could assume that because this is RTF all the health criteria would all be present because of the site reputation allowing him to look for the remaining attributes he prefers?? just a possibility??


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## dpate (Mar 16, 2011)

As someone else mentioned I doubt you'll get a good field line lab breeder using very large size as a breeding criteria. Extremes in size are probably one of the last things breeders look for so if you're insistant on getting a VERY large, good field bred lab, it will probably have to be an anomaly.


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## Lpgar (Mar 31, 2005)

That big Yellow Dog the late Sherwin Scott's Ralph puppy?? He is huge and extremely tallented


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## Happy Gilmore (Feb 29, 2008)

Here's one that comes close to your criteria- Dog Sargenti has running AA is probably 110lbs. 

He's probably 90-ish? 85 is probably fighting weight
http://www.legacylabs.com/Emmitt.htm


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## Happy Gilmore (Feb 29, 2008)

Lpgar said:


> That big Yellow Dog the late Sherwin Scott's Ralph puppy?? He is huge and extremely tallented


I believe that is the one. Made a big open test I watched look easy.


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## DoubleHaul (Jul 22, 2008)

Paul "Happy" Gilmore said:


> Here's one that comes close to your criteria- Dog Sargenti has running AA is probably 110lbs.
> 
> He's probably 90-ish? 85 is probably fighting weight
> http://www.legacylabs.com/Emmitt.htm


We have an Emmitt pup who is almost a year and is going to be a big boy. If he fills out more he could be 85 or so. I sure hope not 100, though. Tall is nice for land blinds but 100 lbs could stress his joints.


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## mjh345 (Jun 17, 2006)

Pike was a big boy


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## LabBroker (Dec 2, 2013)

Guys thank you for the replies. This is one of the things I am trying to understand about breeding. I figured that since more sires I am seeing range from 74 to 80 lbs , this must be the standard that most breeders are looking for. I also get the fact that the 75 lb dog probably can have more endurance over the long haul. All that being said, my current lab which quickly hit 90lbs and stayed 95 to 105 lbs through most of his adult duck dog days before being retired. He was big strong and nothing got in his way while hunting. It was 18 - 36 duck days were the norm, 5 to 6 days a week when I was guiding duck hunts. He did not field trial however I would have loved to have fun him at some during his prime. 
I was hoping to find another dog that would have to potential to being a larger lab, it sounds like they may be hard to find.
I


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## The Snows (Jul 19, 2004)

Sent you a PM


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## brandon a (Sep 9, 2013)

Check out 3D retrievers, they dont normally have FT dogs, but plenty that play the hunt test game successfully and are bigger dogs.

It is where I got my pup and they are in your neck of the woods (conroe tx).

I wanted what you do except I have no interest in FT my pup. Unfortunately this site is mostly FT people and most of them couldn't care less about the color and size of their dogs. It is fine to shop for your personal preference, took me almost two years to find a breeding I was happy with and within my price range. My pups sire was an outside breeding and they dont have him at their kennel, but they have a chocolate male lab that Im pretty sure has some FC and AFCs on his pedigree.


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## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

Yeah there are definitely some cons to having such a big dog, health being the main issue but also field lab/upland and "big" dont usually mix. My dog is 9 months now and he is 86 lbs, definitely going to be the bigger dog you are looking for but it didn't come without a price, he had all kinds of growing pains and problems but now that we have him straightened out he is going to be an awesome dog. 

But no, unless you are in North Carolina, I can't help you with a breeder.


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## LabBroker (Dec 2, 2013)

The Snows, because I am new I have to post a few more times before the site will allow me to respond. I will send you a response to your pm here before to long but in the mean time, THANK YOU.

To the other, I appreciate you taking the time to respond and I will look into these kennels and or dogs and their future litters they sire.
I am also understanding as breeder most try to stay within the expected standards of what everyone is looking for. I think what some may have suggested is that I need to look for someone who is breeding large hunting labs with good blood lines rather than look for field trial bred litters......which does make sense. Thanks.


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## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

^^^ Exactly. Don't let people down play the big dogs though, there is definitely a place for them. In the duck blind, yes. 6 hour long upland hunts, probably not your best bet. That's why labs are such an awesome breed. All sorts of sizes, shapes, colors, probably the most versatile dog out there.


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## Gerald Kelley (Apr 26, 2010)

I myself like the looks for bigger dog! Some labs have started to look more like pointers than labs. My female is only around 65lbs. Im hoping my little boy will hit the 80-85 area.


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## Brokengunz (Sep 3, 2011)

you never know what yur gonna get, my litter out of 65 lb bitch, 85 lb male, two males over 100, one female 55, 
one male 65, two females 85 - 90. one male over 100 was one of the smallest pups at 7 weeks.


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## Brad B (Apr 29, 2004)

Larger isn't necessarily better. I understand your desire to replace your past dog with one just like him but that rarely if ever happens no matter what size they are. I've had numerous clients who think they want a 100 lb "block headed" lab but after some educated discussion they realize it's not really a deciding factor. I'm sure you've heard it's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog. I've got 50 lb females that would retrieve all day long next to your 100 pounder so what the dog weighs is really not what you should be looking at. Look for the right health clearances, proven performance in RECENT generations of the pedigree, and an educated and responsible breeder/trainer that can inteliligently answer your questions.

Good luck.


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## Kenneth Niles Bora (Jul 1, 2004)

LabBroker said:


> Guys thank you for the replies. This is one of the things I am trying to understand about breeding. I figured that since more sires I am seeing range from 74 to 80 lbs , this must be the standard that most breeders are looking for........




at the laybythedoor site "They" say what they are looking for


> *Size* - The height at the withers for a dog is 22-1/2 to 24-1/2 inches; for a bitch is 21-1/2 to 23-1/2 inches. Any variance greater than 1/2 inch above or below these heights is a disqualification. Approximate weight of dogs and bitches in working condition: dogs 65 to 80 pounds; bitches 55 to 70 pounds. The minimum height ranges set forth in the paragraph above shall not apply to dogs or bitches under twelve months of age.
> *Proportion* - Short-coupled; length from the point of the shoulder to the point of the rump is equal to or slightly longer than the distance from the withers to the ground. Distance from the elbow to the ground should be equal to one half of the height at the withers. The brisket should extend to the elbows, but not perceptibly deeper. The body must be of sufficient length to permit a straight, free and efficient stride; but the dog should never appear low and long or tall and leggy in outline. *Substance* - Substance and bone proportionate to the overall dog. Light,"weedy" individuals are definitely incorrect; equally objectionable are cloddy lumbering specimens.


you may have better luck with a Newfoundland, they duck hunt.


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## shawninthesticks (Jun 13, 2010)

Brad B said:


> Larger isn't necessarily better. I understand your desire to replace your past dog with one just like him but that rarely if ever happens no matter what size they are. I've had numerous clients who think they want a 100 lb "block headed" lab but after some educated discussion they realize it's not really a deciding factor. I'm sure you've heard it's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog. I've got 50 lb females that would retrieve all day long next to your 100 pounder so what the dog weighs is really not what you should be looking at. Look for the right health clearances, proven performance in RECENT generations of the pedigree, and an educated and responsible breeder/trainer that can inteliligently answer your questions.
> 
> Good luck.


My thoughts exactly. I always liked the bigger dogs until Indy, now a 70lb dog is my top end as far as size.


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## FieldLab (Aug 5, 2011)

I was like u and wanted a big male, well he is 93 lbs
Hunts ducks geese and pheasant, and hammers criple 
Geese but tires quickly in pheasant fields and when the temps
Hits 75 and sunny he tired quickly on long land blinds
Next dog 70-75lbs listen to this guys on here they know
A chessie may work too good luck


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## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

Bigger dogs are stronger, that's just nature taking it's course. They can handle tougher conditions, that's nature too, more body mass, more retained body heat. There are places for these larger bred labs. But like has been said time and time again, make sure you do your homework and get a reputable breeder and do some background research and make sure there are no genetic flaws that may pop up in these big boned dogs. 

The problem is, as with all dogs, no matter what their bloodlines are, you cannot completely breed out genetic issues that may pop up. It just happens. Some might say that it happens more frequent with the larger dogs, which may be true. Just be aware of this and pay close attention so you will be equipped to handle any situation that may arise. 

Goodluck. Post a picture if you find one.


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## Bigdaddysfishn (Dec 2, 2012)

*bigger dogs*

Might want to look at Ajtop retrievers. I have talked to Alain and as yourself he likes the bigger dogs also. I think he even has a litter in the classified section. He is in Canada but comes to the states for training.


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## Hunt'EmUp (Sep 30, 2010)

I too like a big lab, still it seems like my lot is to pick pups out of a male and female on the larger size, and ended up with a full grown 55lb lab. Oh well; I like them just fine and they might take it personal if you tell them they are runts .


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## Cedarswamp (Apr 29, 2008)

We had a FC AFC Whitie IV son out of a NFC AFC Storm's Riptide Star female that was 115 in his prime, 100 as an older dog and not working much. he was pretty proportional, just HUGE. My vet actually fussed at me when he got down to 89 lbs when I put him in the kennel. We lost him to bloat at 8 years old. Bred to one of our 55-60 lb girls, produced a female that was about 73 lbs, another about 68 lbs, a male here in training that is about 75 lbs, another male that was about 70 pounds at 1 1/2 year old.


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## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

Oh my Alison! I love that picture with the saddle on the dog!!!!! Just curious, do you know if any correlation has been made between size of dog and incidence of bloat?


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## mjh345 (Jun 17, 2006)

2tall said:


> Oh my Alison! I love that picture with the saddle on the dog!!!!! Just curious, do you know if any correlation has been made between size of dog and incidence of bloat?


Carol, I don't know of a link to bloat, but there is a link of big deep chested dogs getting torsion twist more often


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## Golddogs (Feb 3, 2004)

CodyC said:


> *Bigger dogs are stronger, that's just nature taking it's course. They can handle tougher conditions, *.


Which might matter if they are in a tug of war or pulling a car, but useless in a sneak boat or working upland all day. Have seen many more "bigger" dogs go down to stress or fatigue than standard or slightly smaller dogs. Have seen more go early also.


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## Richard Finch (Jul 26, 2006)

Longevity was always a concern of mine with the bigger dogs.... Endurance would be a close second... However, best of luck with your search friend...



Richard


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## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

Golddogs said:


> Which might matter if they are in a tug of war or pulling a car, but useless in a sneak boat or working upland all day. Have seen many more "bigger" dogs go down to stress or fatigue than standard or slightly smaller dogs. Have seen more go early also.


I clearly said they have their place.... 

I am not taking away from smaller dogs at all. I have had one that was a stout 60 lbs and she did fine. 

But honestly, hunting big water in rough conditions, retrieving geese and sometimes tundra swans, I would prefer a bigger dog. They are better equipped for it.


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## Cass (Sep 17, 2013)

LabBroker said:


> I am still wanting the athletic field trial build and I am having a hard time finding breeders who are breeding these bigger labs.


That's because bigger dogs aren't going to be at peak performance functionally next to a smaller dog. If you want something 80-100 lbs I think you want a show lab. A big dog isn't going to have the same kind of endurance.


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## Cedarswamp (Apr 29, 2008)

Carol, the vet said that was prob the #1 factor in him bloating. Doing online research, some of the other factors that increased the risk to bloat was male, older, out of shape, among a few other things. Elizabeth thought she could get him to carry it back to the barn for her...he just sat down lol. You always hear the saying "big enough to put a saddle on" well, he was, the stirrups weren't even touching the ground. He was as gentle as the day was long, he'd lay down to get down on a puppy's level to play with them. Elizabeth only weighed about 70 lbs right when he died, she could take him on leash anywhere she wanted to go. The ONLY time he drug her was one time we walked back to the pond to teach a puppy to swim, I had her hold him so the puppy could get the bumper after she started swimming behind him. She made the mistake of saying "Gauge SIT" after I through the bumper, he only heard his name...she ended up a bit wet that day...luckily she let go of his leash before she was in deep, she was only in a couple of inches of water, she's been swimming in that pond before on her own, so no biggie.


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## Losthwy (May 3, 2004)

LabBroker said:


> I started looking for to buy a male black lab pup about 2 weeks ago. One of my criterias was that the sire be at least 85 lbs, with 95 being even better. I am still wanting the athletic field trial build and I am having a hard time finding breeders who are breeding these bigger labs. It seems there are more people breeding bigger chocolates males, and I do see a lot more larger yellow females but I can not seem to find many that that are either are kicking out black pups. I am sure if I was to wait a while one would pop up. Anyhow, the reason for my posting this thread to was ask if anyone can give me names of kennels or breeders that they are known for breeding larger athletic labs (not the full English breed) so at least I can start researching...


An athletic field dog that is 100 lbs. is a contradiction. I doubt there are many, if any, breeders of quality field Labs; pedigrees with lots of letters in front of the names who purposely breeds for large size. Advertising such is a HUGH red flag.
FYI- English FIELD Labs look like their North American counterpart, as opposed to Show/Bench dogs from both parts of the world.


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## Purpledawg (Jul 16, 2006)

FT has its bigger dogs, maybe not 100lbs but 80 plus. Look at those out of Carbon, Grady, Patton and Ford for example. But picking a dog purely on size I wouldn't be too crazy about. You want to know how those lines may work out in your home environment.


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## LabBroker (Dec 2, 2013)

I appreciate everyone's thoughts on the subject. Like it was mentioned earlier, just because I am looking for a set of larger parents does not guarantee that I will end up with a larger lab, I may still end up with a 70 lb dog. 
I can also say that I know I do not want a a show dog, a new foundland, or a chessie. There are NFL receivers who are 6ft and there are some that are 6'5", both are athletic. One gets pushed around more than the other.....both can still get the job done. 
Chances are this next dog will only dove hunt 3 or 4 times a year, 5 or 6 duck hunts a year and maybe track a wounded deer or pig once every couple of years. Most of the time he will be the family pet and guardian over my wife and 2 young daughters. Even though my current lab has never been aggressive to ant person, his alert bark is enough to make anyone think twice about showing up at my house with bad intentions. New UPS drivers end up sitting outside honking. 
we are going to love the dog whether he is 70 lbs or 100 lbs. just don't hate me for wanting the 6'5" receiver on my team.


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## awolfe (Mar 2, 2011)

please check your pms


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## Meleagris1 (Dec 10, 2010)

When I was looking for my last lab I originally wanted a smaller male. I reluctantly went with a bigger male pup as I had pick of the litter and I felt he had what I was looking for. He is 85lbs now with a muscular athletic build, and is a very hard charging dog. Big can be great as long as its an athletic "big", and not a "keg with legs" big. My guy will rock and roll all day long for upland or ducks, is great in the cold weather, heavy and powerful enough to break snow crust and sheet ice, and absolutely crushes those big geese, which can be a handful for a lot of dogs. The added height also gives him, IMO, a little better perspective from the mat, and sometimes that extra few inches can make a difference (seeing the whole gunner, etc). Downside - he is a lug on the couch and he when he lays down you know it, but otherwise he is just about perfect for me.


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## Kenneth Niles Bora (Jul 1, 2004)

brandon a said:


> ..... Unfortunately this site is mostly FT people and most of them couldn't care less about the color and size of their dogs......


mostly????
pshaw
and them pesky FT folks do not like colors at all, by and large.
they all have black dogs


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## Tstreg (Dec 28, 2005)

Bark? I have a 49 pound female that sounds like a large rottweiler ready to tear your head off and eat you. She can hunt test and run with the best of them. She retrieves giant Canada's without a problem. I agree with "it's not the size of the dog in he fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog" None of us would trade our dogs for the world. good luck


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## LabBroker (Dec 2, 2013)

Awolf, I will email you later. Thanks for the pm.

melegris, no doubt you can relate to what I am saying and looking for.


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## Arnie (Nov 26, 2012)

*Big Labs*

Buying our first house nearly 40 years ago my wife and I decided we should get a dog. I was not a hunter and knew practically nothing about breeds but I though black labs looked neat. She got me one for my birthday. He quickly grew to 96 pounds. The house was horse property so we also bought two horses. We didn't know any better so we always took him with us on rides. He got into real great shape on all-day rides. He was a great tennis ball and Frisbee dog but it drove a neighbor who was an avid hunter nuts to see this dog "go to waste". He took us hunting and after seeing my dog work as if he'd been doing it his whole life (3 years) I was hooked.


Fast forward to when he was six we ran into someone on a duck refuge that had a big female he was looking to breed. I got pick of the litter. Dog number two grew to a lean and athletic 127 pounds! He also ran with the horses all day and hunted all day on extended upland and waterfowl trips. 


I bought a yellow female pup from quality hunting stock for the next generation. We had a mixed litter of yellows and blacks but I kept a black male. He also was a big athlete weighing in the mid 90's in his prime. One of his favorite hunts was for Chukar in Eastern Oregon. Enough said.


The next breeding was to a buddy's big yellow female. This time I kept a yellow male. He also weighed in the high 90's. We mostly hunted upland game. He kept in shape year round on four mile hikes retrieving bumpers the entire time.


Gage represents the current generation. He's the runt at only 87 pounds. He is lean with some rib showing but heavily muscled. He doesn't lumber. He is a hard charger without being "nuts". He's very sensible and steady. He's the first one to play the hunt test game and "dog people" are always asking when I'll be breeding him.


All of these dogs lived long and healthy lives without health problems. One was taken by cancer at 9 but the others lived about 13 years. 


Point is that any of these dogs would be the canine equivalent to NBA or NFL first round draft picks.


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## LabBroker (Dec 2, 2013)

Thanks for your addition Arnie and WOW 127 lbs! Now I don't feel like I am expecting to much looking for a lab to grow between 85. - 100 lbs.


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## SamLab1 (Jul 24, 2003)

Michael Jordan was no little guy. I'd say he was fairly athletic and very smart. I believe many are thinking John Candy body style as big. 

Do the larger athletic labs have as many ACL problems as seems to be common in the small labs?


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## Arnie (Nov 26, 2012)

SamLab1 said:


> Do the larger athletic labs have as many ACL problems as seems to be common in the small labs?


Good question. It brings to mind images of the high roller rockets charging out for a mark, over running it and slamming on the breaks. We've all seen them go tail over tea kettle to pin the bird. The forces on their joints has to be pretty high. It's probably equivalent to a big dog's weight putting pressure on the same joints. I don't know of any correlation between size and ACL problems. 

I think there's more risk to elbows in big dogs if they are allowed to jump from a tailgate. I don't let my dogs jump unsupported.


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## RJW (Jan 8, 2012)

Bigdaddysfishn said:


> Might want to look at Ajtop retrievers. I have talked to Alain and as yourself he likes the bigger dogs also. I think he even has a litter in the classified section. He is in Canada but comes to the states for training.


I agree. AJ uses terms such as Smart, big, strong and powerfull. I REALLY like his goals in regards to his breeding program that he is trying to achieve. Matter of fact, I have one of his pups laying here beside me as I type this. At this point, I consider him more of a friend than a "business arrangement" and have been talking to him regularly for close to two years. A year ago this past July, I drove up to Upstate NY to pick my little guy and two of his sisters up and meet AJ in person. Just an all around great guy to talk to and do business with, in my opinion. I do believe he was suppose to be down in the states the first week of Dec. delivering pups and meeting their new owners.


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## 3blackdogs (Aug 23, 2004)

Bigdaddysfishn said:


> Might want to look at Ajtop retrievers. I have talked to Alain and as yourself he likes the bigger dogs also. I think he even has a litter in the classified section. He is in Canada but comes to the states for training.


Alain's breeding program has Sherwin's "Ralph" as one of the foundation dogs. FC AFC (and NRC finalist) Ralph was a large, gorgeous and immensely talented dog with a wonderful personality. I saw a lot of him when was in Wisconsin, and just absolutely loved him. (The Ralph son that was referenced earlier is Aragon, who looks like a yellow "Ralph", and is now with Sargenti, I believe.)


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## Happy Gilmore (Feb 29, 2008)

3blackdogs said:


> Alain's breeding program has Sherwin's "Ralph" as one of the foundation dogs. FC AFC (and NRC finalist) Ralph was a large, gorgeous and immensely talented dog with a wonderful personality. I saw a lot of him when was in Wisconsin, and just absolutely loved him. (The Ralph son that was referenced earlier is Aragon, who looks like a yellow "Ralph", and is now with Sargenti, I believe.)


His elbows and leg bones are the size of a well fed steer. Cool looking dog. Easily over 100lbs and working at AA level competently.


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## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

Sally Koepke had a big boy named Vinnie who was very impressive.

I don't know what became of him, but she ran him on the tune up setup at Handjem when I was there June 2009. He was big, cool, and ran those things like he'd been trained on them by Sally. (she had just picked him up from the trainer - Van Engen, perhaps, and I believe Sally and he were running them cold)

Vinnie was the biggest field labrador I'd ever seen.

Chris


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## The Snows (Jul 19, 2004)

Chris Atkinson said:


> Vinnie was the biggest field labrador I'd ever seen.
> Chris


Bigger than your BIG yellow??? I would have sworn that dog was part Dane!! ;-)


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## The Snows (Jul 19, 2004)

Chris Atkinson said:


> Vinnie was the biggest field labrador I'd ever seen.
> Chris


Bigger than your BIG yellow??? I would have sworn that dog was part Dane!! ;-)


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## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

The Snows said:


> Bigger than your BIG yellow??? I would have sworn that dog was part Dane!! ;-)


Champ was a peanut compared to Vinnie! Vinnie was huge.


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## Lpgar (Mar 31, 2005)

I am pretty sure Vinny is retired living with Sally.....he was definately impressively big.

Aragon indeed is much like Ralph in many ways. Ralph became Sherwins favourite dog for sure. Aragon I am sure is at least 15lbs bigger than Ralph was and extremely tallented for sure.


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## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

CodyC said:


> I clearly said they have their place....
> 
> I am not taking away from smaller dogs at all. I have had one that was a stout 60 lbs and she did fine.
> 
> But honestly, hunting big water in rough conditions, retrieving geese and sometimes tundra swans, I would prefer a bigger dog. They are better equipped for it.


I guess we need to know what you mean by bigger. My 70 pound Golden excels in tough conditions retrieving Tundra Swans, that might be something a 45 lb female couldn't do, though I wouldn't bet on it. I was hung up on size after I fell in love with my first Golden who happened to weigh 85#s, then I got a 74 lb Golden out of FC-AFC parents who was lights out a better retriever. He's the dog in my avatar. Then Yoda came along, full grown 63 pounds and the best hunting dog I have ever owned or seen. By this time I say my favorite size or color is whatever dog I have. There is so much more that goes into being a great dog, size is way down on the list. I totally get it that you prefer bigger dogs, no way to argue with a preference, I will dispute your statement that they are better equipped. I don't think size matters at all.

Here's 70lb Gus with his Swan...


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## CodyC (Jul 28, 2013)

Those of you that had these big boys, do you remember how much they weighed at 9 months? I have a Male that is 85 lbs and he just turned 9 months the other day. I am trying to get an idea of what he is going to be mature. He is very solid and many people don't believe he weighs that much. He is very lean and muscular. His dad was 115 but his mom was only about 75.


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## The Snows (Jul 19, 2004)

Our recent breeding - sire is 78 lbs, dam is 71 lbs .... Yesterday was 6 month birthday and he weighed 70 lbs! Not exactly the size of pup we were expecting! As someone mentioned earlier you can't always plan for size. Lean and muscular ... I just hope we have a box on the truck big enough for him!! LOL!


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## LabBroker (Dec 2, 2013)

Now see how nice this tread has gotten once we thinned out all the big dog haters.  Again I want to thank everyone for your help. We have had internet issues at work the last two days but I will be getting back with some of you, returning pm, emails, and or calls. I think I am on the right track, you guys have pointed me to a few people who breed the kind of labs I am looking for and I feel like I am much closer to finding our family our next puppy.


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## Loran Marmes (JR) (Jan 19, 2013)

i believe alex washburn has a male that is "big" i believe its legend...


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## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

Loran Marmes (JR) said:


> i believe alex washburn has a male that is "big" i believe its legend...


It is Legend and he is a big boy. I like him!

Chris


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## Happy Gilmore (Feb 29, 2008)

Yeah but your Goldens have to deduct 10-15lbs for the handbag that goes with them filled with tennis balls, extra bandanas, flexi-leads complete with chest harness. Not to forget the zip lock baggies of cheese treats, liver, clickers and hotdogs.


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## Alain (Dec 9, 2005)

Hi LabBroker,

Pm send.
Interesting post.

Regards,


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