# What is the best age to pick up a new Lab Pup



## Jerry Beil (Feb 8, 2011)

Any suggestions? I've heard 49 days to 12 weeks.

Thanks!


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## Bryan Detwiler (Feb 8, 2011)

49 days and not a second later.


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## freefall319 (Jan 31, 2010)

In my experience most pup's are spoken for or gone by 12 weeks. Here in Cali I know you can't pick up your pup until it is 8 weeks old. When I was in the market I was trying to find them around the 5-6 week age range. At that point they are moving around and you can start to see thier personality coming out. That's just my .02


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## mjh345 (Jun 17, 2006)

7 to 8 weeks. Definitely NOT before 7 weeks
You can't fly a puppy before 8 weeks


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## Doc E (Jan 3, 2003)

mjh345 said:


> You can't fly a puppy before 8 weeks


Find a Lawyer and Vet who are in cahoots and you can.



.


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## Ironwood (Sep 25, 2007)

Depends on the breeder. Some like to see the pups exposed to a lot of different elements. Pup trust mom more than anyone. They will follow where she goes. The second aspect is the limitations are set by the mother as she has had enough of them nursing with their sharp little teeth well established. Pup learn the auditory and physical posture from mother. A third point is some vets and all airlines will need to see a health certificate for the pup to fly at eight weeks.
Talk to your breeder or do some research trough your local vet.


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## RaeganW (Jan 1, 2011)

pieinmyface87 said:


> 49 days and not a second later.


Myth: http://www.calibertollers.com/49daymyth.htm

If your breeder is doing their job, that is handling the pups daily, not doing anything to overtly crush hunting instincts, and in general doing anything more than sticking them in a run and putting down food twice a day, your puppy will benefit more from the extra week of litter socialisation than an extra week of individual socialization. From a really good breeder doing lots of litter enrichment, I'll let them keep the pup as long as they want. I hate doing socialization though, I'd just as rather leave it up to someone else.

Of course, if you have a stick-em-in-a-run-and-forget-about-em breeder, earlier is better. But I wouldn't count on getting a good hunting dog from them in the first place.


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## Bryan Detwiler (Feb 8, 2011)

RaeganW said:


> If your breeder is doing their job, that is handling the pups daily, not doing anything to overtly crush hunting instincts, and in general doing anything more than sticking them in a run and putting down food twice a day


Seems like a big if. Although, if you did your research beforehand, maybe not so much. 'Ole Wolters made quite the impression on me back when I first read Water Dog.


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## Labs a mundo (Mar 20, 2009)

I can only speak for Labs, but.......49 days.

I'll say it again.
*49 days*


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 23, 2004)

Richard Wolters was a much better writer and sporting goods salesman than he was a dog trainer. In fact, after training his first dog, when he tried to train his second dog he was force to turn the dog over to a pro.

The claim of the 49th day is based upon a terrible mis-interpretation of the work of Clarence Pfaffenberger. The article is quite good and to the point.

I won't let a dog go any earlier than 8 weeks.

Eric


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## Leddyman (Nov 27, 2007)

I started getting mine on the 49th day back in the Wolters heyday. There may be nothing to it, I couldn't say, but it has worked for me. All 49 dayers have been good dogs. The only washout I had was a dog I took at about 12 weeks and he came with bad habits. And personality trouble...something happened to him in those 12 weeks.

49 days may be nothing, but I'll bet by 49 days they don't have bad habits.


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## windycanyon (Dec 21, 2007)

8 wks here. The extra week does a lot of good from what I've seen over the years and I don't do it just to spend a bunch of extra time and $$$ either. I feel better about the vaccination status of the pups, and my ACVO feels better about waiting til 7.5 wks to do CERFs too. Works for Guide Dogs too apparently. Illegal in some states to sell younger than 8 wks too.


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## John Lash (Sep 19, 2006)

I like 49 days too.


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## Joe Dutro (Nov 20, 2007)

Day 49 for me also.
Joe


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## Doc E (Jan 3, 2003)

49 days to 56 days



.


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## john fallon (Jun 20, 2003)

The early socialization period which is done by the mother and by interaction with the other puppies in the litter, takes place during the period from the 3rd to the 12th week, separation from the mother and the siblings at shall we say 49 days cuts this period by 30%. when viewing the normal shipping window

With this in mind I would opt for 56 days .

john


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## Dave Flint (Jan 13, 2009)

Eric Johnson said:


> Richard Wolters was a much better writer and sporting goods salesman than he was a dog trainer. In fact, after training his first dog, when he tried to train his second dog he was force to turn the dog over to a pro.
> 
> The claim of the 49th day is based upon a terrible mis-interpretation of the work of Clarence Pfaffenberger. The article is quite good and to the point.
> 
> ...


I can't believe how many people still buy into that. My ideal would be around 10 wks to make my pick but I don't know any breeder that would want keep them that long.


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## Laura McCaw (Jul 28, 2010)

Just from my experience on buying our pups, we got one at the 49 day mark, BEST in my opinion. One at 8 weeks because she had to be flown here, bad with biting, barking, jumping, but I guess that is a puppy thing? I would have thought different after our 49 dayer.

Then our other at 12 weeks, wow, what a disaster. I am trying to teach better habits than what she has. I mean, all pups from different litters, so this all could have been just coincident (sp?) with when I took them, but the boy I got at 7 weeks learned sit on day one, he has the most birdiness, has learned his OB quickly and he is very respectful, also he would rather focus on me since I have worked with him starting at 7 weeks also... unlike the other 2. I still love them all though.  Oh and they are much older now.. this was just an example of my experience at getting them at different ages.


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## GLFLYER (Jun 29, 2004)

7-8 weeks,,,,,8 weeks only if flying.


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## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

Leddyman said:


> I started getting mine on the 49th day back in the Wolters heyday. There may be nothing to it, I couldn't say, but it has worked for me. All 49 dayers have been good dogs. The only washout I had was a dog I took at about 12 weeks and he came with bad habits. And personality trouble...something happened to him in those 12 weeks.
> 
> 49 days may be nothing, but I'll bet by 49 days they don't have bad habits.



Ya know, I sure hope 8 weeks is ok, because thats how old mine will be win I fly out to get him Tuesday


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Let's see: 

Flash was 10 weeks old - turned out just fine, spoiled rotten Momma's boy.
Bullet was 8 weeks old - turned out fine, another spoiled rotten Momma's boy.
Ranger was 9 weeks old - turned out fine, spoiled rotten Daddy and Momma's boy.
Tango was 8 weeks old - turning out just fine and is well on his way to being a spoiled rotten Daddy and Momma's boy.

If you have a good breeder who properly socializes the pups there is no issue with getting them at 8 weeks.

The whole 49 day thing....yeah, yeah....if any pup I buy is going to be ruined by being with their litter mates for a week longer, then I really don't want a pup out of that litter...

FOM

And yes there is a theme going on with my dogs - they are spoiled rotten Momma's boys!


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## Leddyman (Nov 27, 2007)

2tall said:


> Ya know, I sure hope 8 weeks is ok, because thats how old mine will be win I fly out to get him Tuesday


I'm guessin' you'll be alright.


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## tom (Jan 4, 2003)

I'm old enough to remember when 6 weeks was the norm. Then RW came along and 49 days became gospel. Since it became possible to do CERF at 8 weeks, many of us want to do that eye exam before we release our pups. The odd part is that 8 weeks has become the norm now, (law in some states) but most don't bother with why it became the norm.
I do think it is wise to re-home pups before they reach 10 weeks of age because of the development of fear memory.
So IMHO it depends on who the breeder is, and what they do with their pups from 5 weeks until they go to their new homes.

Intro to live birds at 5 weeks


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## Howard N (Jan 3, 2003)

I've gotten several at 49 days. It's fine, but the pups are so small and helpless. I would much rather get them at 8 weeks as long as the breeder is good with it and spends some time with them.

I really would like to have them by 9 weeks. They're learning so much then that I'd like to guide what they're getting in to...... er,, learning.


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## roseberry (Jun 22, 2010)

nchank,

i have picked up pups on day 49 they turned out *ok*, 

i currently have a blf i had to pick up on day 42. she seems to be turning out *ok* (hillman dvd thru session 13), 

i have an 18 month old clf i picked up at 91 days and he's doing *ok* (a friend purchased this dog, put in his back yard then got sick and passed away, took the pup to help the widow).

let's face it, maybe i am just an *ok* trainer. lol 

i like seven weeks because they are really cute at that age and a little more secure than at six weeks. i have never seen evidence that any mysteriously negative or positive impacts occur develpmentally that can only be attributed to the day you picked up your pup.

we give excuses about performance at a trial or test because 1. the sun was better for those that ran early. 2. the judges suck 3. the wind changed on me etc...etc......... but did you ever hear a pro say "we were right there in the tenth series...i just can't explain it.... we had it won then, bam the wheels ran off. i told my client (the ceo of dean slitter) not to pick that puppy up in his lear jet on the 46th day!"?

IMHO it is all about the ride home with us and what we do, every day after that. the number of the day that ride takes place is just a good thread topic.

john mc


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## ReedCreek (Dec 30, 2007)

Most of my pups are being placed beginning at 8 weeks. I am doing tons of socialization on them; exposing them to everything I can, including, but not limited to, beginning steps towards housebreaking, crate training/exposure; different surfaces, sounds, people, kids, dogs, cats, walks in the woods, birds, etc. They are climbing on various levels, doing steps, tunnels, toys that bounce, toys that make noise, big floppy toys, etc., etc., etc. I do have two that are leaving at 7 weeks because new owners are absolute advocates of the 49th day theory (they are heavy into obedience and/or agility). I would not let pups going to pet homes (especially with children) go earlier than 8 weeks. I believe that the socialization and exposure I am giving to these pups will far outweigh any 49th day theory. The extra time with their littermates and even their limited exposure to Mom is (IMO); very valuable....plus, I love them and will miss them (probably the real reason I want to keep them longer)


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## huntinman (Jun 1, 2009)

roseberry said:


> IMHO it is all about the ride home with us and what we do, every day after that. the number of the day that ride takes place is just a good thread topic.
> 
> john mc


bingo

.


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## Losthwy (May 3, 2004)

There is info out there on this subject which can be had with a little searching and reading. Generally most research of K-9s supports the 7 week date or a little later.

http://www.totaldogtraining.com/day-49.htm


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## windycanyon (Dec 21, 2007)

ReedCreek said:


> I do have two that are leaving at 7 weeks because new owners are absolute advocates of the 49th day theory (they are heavy into obedience and/or agility).


And this I really do not understand, esp since puppy structure is barely starting to become clear at 7 wks and lord knows, you need a nice structured dog to hold up to agility esp. Temperament isn't as clear cut at 7 wks as it is at 8 either. I am watching my pups nearly daily that last week (7-8 wks) to see if their bodies are "staying together" nicely or not. The only pups I'll let go even a couple days early (and that is after well checks and CERFS are done at 7.5 wks) are those that I'm not watching for myself. They are usually pet pups that I've already excluded for one reason or another.

Pat Hastings (show judge who does puppy evals) states that a performance puppy needs to have the best possible structure it can-- it's more important for this group than the show group by far because of the work and stress on the body. I have to wonder if more performance breeders took the time to evaluate their litters for sound hocks, balanced angles, etc, if we'd not see fewer "injuries" (cruciates, etc) in our athletes. Pat is one who firmly believes the best age to evaluate structure is 8 wks +/- 3 days. 

This link was posted on a show forum yesterday regarding minimum age for puppy sales in certain states: http://www.animallaw.info/articles/ovuspuppysaletable.htm Anne


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 23, 2004)

I really don't care if folks want to take a puppy at 49 days. They just won't get one from me.

Let's take this to the absurd. Puppies are whelped starting a 11:30 PM on Jan 1 and continuing on to 7 AM on Jan 2. Which day is the magical 49th day? Do you 49-dayers require that the puppies be marked and select only from among the appropriate group...some one day and some the next? What about any puppies that are left on day 50? Should they be sold at fire-sale prices since they'll never be able to bond properly?

The 49th day is a myth and it perverts some fairly important science in dog behavior.

Eric


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## tom (Jan 4, 2003)

windycanyon said:


> And this I really do not understand, esp since puppy structure is barely starting to become clear at 7 wks and lord knows, you need a nice structured dog to hold up to agility esp. Temperament isn't as clear cut at 7 wks as it is at 8 either. I am watching my pups nearly daily that last week (7-8 wks) to see if their bodies are "staying together" nicely or not. The only pups I'll let go even a couple days early (and that is after well checks and CERFS are done at 7.5 wks) are those that I'm not watching for myself. They are usually pet pups that I've already excluded for one reason or another.
> 
> Pat Hastings (show judge who does puppy evals) states that a performance puppy needs to have the best possible structure it can-- it's more important for this group than the show group by far because of the work and stress on the body. I have to wonder if more performance breeders took the time to evaluate their litters for sound hocks, balanced angles, etc, if we'd not see fewer "injuries" (cruciates, etc) in our athletes. Pat is one who firmly believes the best age to evaluate structure is 8 wks +/- 3 days.
> 
> This link was posted on a show forum yesterday regarding minimum age for puppy sales in certain states: http://www.animallaw.info/articles/ovuspuppysaletable.htm Anne


I'm with you, I spent a lot of time with Pat learning how movement equates to structure, and how poor structure leads to injuries. The "puppy puzzle" really does work, once you understand it.


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## suepuff (Aug 25, 2008)

Eight weeks here....the last two weeks are the best, but a lot of work. My guys are exposed to so much the last two weeks....baby agility equipment, birds, all different surfaces, obedience articles...etc... and they get temperament tested between 7 - 8 weeks, eyes CERF'd then and structural evaluation.... any earlier and it's not reliable. Plus they spend more time interacting with the adult dogs... it's a great two weeks...

Sue Puff


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

Eric Johnson said:


> I really don't care if folks want to take a puppy at 49 days. They just won't get one from me.
> 
> Let's take this to the absurd. Puppies are whelped starting a 11:30 PM on Jan 1 and continuing on to 7 AM on Jan 2. Which day is the magical 49th day? Do you 49-dayers require that the puppies be marked and select only from among the appropriate group...some one day and some the next? What about any puppies that are left on day 50? Should they be sold at fire-sale prices since they'll never be able to bond properly?
> 
> ...


I had a client long time ago that insisted on the 49 day thing and was severly stressing over it because he wanted to get the pup at exactly 49 day,s and he didn't have first pick, and first pick was going to come at 50 days on a Saturday. I finally told him the puppy was born after midnight and he relaxed. This was an educated person, but how incredibly naive to believe his puppy would somehow be emotionally scarred. After that I decided I was not going to cater to irrational people and the puppies go when I think they are ready. Some need more time because if they are in a big litter they can be slower to mature, as can a c-section litter, or a little that didn't wean readily. One person publishes a book, as you said, misinterpreted and based on research from a different era when pups were raised without as much socialization, and the myth hangs on. Where is the common sense? People that are inflexible are often rigid and adhere to time tables, with one schedule for all.


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## Devlin (Jan 19, 2006)

I'm certainly no expert, but I got my Sadie when she was about 8 weeks old. She was amazing even then, and continues to be so now in my humble opinion. 

For the trip home, she traveled in her crate for a 5 hour drive from hell from northern San Diego County through LA traffic back up here to "Sort Of Southern California" without a sound. We only stopped once to air her...she slept quietly the rest of the time. To this day, she's comfortable with road trips of 8-10 hours a day for at least two consecutive days (stopping to air a couple of times en route).

IMHO, the bonding that happens with getting your pup as soon as possible is critical. It also gives you an opportunity to start with training games when the pup is still young enough not to have developed (or started to develop) bad habits. My girl has been an incredible family member, and is also a focused, responsive "machine" in the field. I don't what more I/we could ask for.

So: when is the best time to get a pup? ANYTIME, I say (gotta love those puppies!)...but for us the approximately 8 week old age was perfect. It seems to work out best for both of you in the short term and the long term, as well.


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## hotel4dogs (Aug 2, 2010)

Show breeders and people who evaluate litters for show go along with this. A puppy's structure at 8 weeks (plus or minus 3 days) is vitually identical to what it will be as an adult. Not so at 7 weeks or 9 weeks.




tom said:


> I'm with you, I spent a lot of time with Pat learning how movement equates to structure, and how poor structure leads to injuries. The "puppy puzzle" really does work, once you understand it.


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## Jerry Beil (Feb 8, 2011)

Thanks for all the replies.

We got our last pup at 12 weeks, and he was pretty much all I could have asked for. Not sure how it happened, but we found his litter right as soon as we were looking, had pick of the male pups, and they were all there still at 12 weeks.

I think with this litter, we're going to get him at 7 weeks - not sure if we could stand to wait any longer, or if we should. Haven't talked to the breeder on this yet, but have talked to a few trainers I know and got the valuable feedback here.

I think another variation is when the other pups are getting picked up. I'd think that would have an impact on things as well.

I've ordered the Smartworks whole shebang, and am looking forward to getting that and getting going on planning etc. I used mainly the 10 Minute Retriever by John and Amy Dahl and Dog Training the Kohler Method with our last dog. The Dahl's were a great help in training him both by reading and talking and visiting with them. I'm hoping to supplement that with what I can learn from the Smartworks program...

Thanks again for the input!


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## gman0046 (May 7, 2009)

49 days with our yellow Lab female. House trained in less then a week.


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## gregjohnson (Nov 30, 2006)

Just read an article in Gundog promoting the benefits of the puppies being kept by the breeder until 12 weeks - claims to be the answer.

I personally have always bought into the 49th day theory. My recent litter had a majority of the puppies going home on the 49th day but I had 2 puppies that were kept until the 60th day. Feedback from all of the buyers have indicated similar personalities and behavior from the puppies. I really try to emphasize good socialization and I think that minimizes transition issues - my opinion.


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## John Shoffner (Jan 27, 2009)

I suggest waiting until the puppy is 8 weeks old. The extra week with the mother and littermates is a plus. 

Most airlines do not require health certificates now. I picked up my oldest lab in CA and made sure I had one just in case. I have brought puppies home on Delta and Northwest (now one in the same) and neither required one. I would suggest checking with the airline though ahead of time just to be sure.

John


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## 2tall (Oct 11, 2006)

The very best age to bring a pup home is the age he is at when you go get him! Seriously, of our three one came home at 9 weeks, one at 7 and this last one at 8. All that mattered was how WE interacted with them during the transition from the litter and that they were healthy. Just make sure that when you do get pup home, you have a week or more to devote completely to him! One week for a lifetime of love, pretty good deal.


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

gregjohnson said:


> Just read an article in Gundog promoting the benefits of the puppies being kept by the breeder until 12 weeks - claims to be the answer.
> .


Whoever wrote that article never raised litter of active field puppies. That's the reason I never renewed my subscription to that magazine because they publish that kind of stuff.


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## Keith Stroyan (Sep 22, 2005)

6 - 12 weeks - perhaps 7 or 8 best all-around, but for more than 12, the pups should be separated. Most of the pups we raised went at 7 weeks because the "49 day" thing has so many believers. I didn't see harm in up to 12 and their personalities are a little more formed later. I don't see any harm in 7 weeks if the pup goes home to lots of attention. (Mine sleep in a crate next to the bed for a couple of months.)


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## helencalif (Feb 2, 2004)

ErinsEdge said:


> Whoever wrote that article never raised litter of active field puppies. That's the reason I never renewed my subscription to that magazine because they publish that kind of stuff.


I am with you. 12 weeks - are they crazy? 

Most of our litter of 12 are going home tomorrow. Next time we have a litter, they are going home at 7 weeks if they are not flying somewhere.

This litter has the same personalities at 8 weeks that they did at 7 weeks. They are just bigger.


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## Keith Stroyan (Sep 22, 2005)

ErinsEdge said:


> ... After that I decided I was not going to cater to irrational people ....


We'll miss you here on RTF ;-)


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## cakaiser (Jul 12, 2007)

ErinsEdge said:


> Whoever wrote that article never raised litter of active field puppies..


LOL, you betcha on that one.
Just the idea of keeping a litter till 12 weeks is exhausting.
One pup is plenty of work.....;-)


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## Maxs Mom (Sep 17, 2009)

I have a friend who breeds Malamutes she was telling me to leave my puppy at the breeder until she was 12 weeks. First of all my breeder would have probably given her away, 12 weeks the timing would NOT have worked for me (can we say Christmas) and lastly I WANTED MY PUPPY!!!!!

I like the dog to get to know ME while it is still impressionable. Besides I think Gabby's mom was long done with her and her brother before 8 weeks. Why hold out another month? 

I have picked up a lot of pups (BYB) at 6 weeks, they all did fine too, but I do whole heartedly feel 8 weeks is a MUCH better age or at least as close as you can get to it.


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