# Hunt Test dress code



## Labs R Us (Jun 25, 2010)

I've recently heard that AKC will be making it mandatory at hunt tests for entrants to wear camo clothing. If so, do they mean the actual camo design or will solid green, brown, or tan clothing do the trick? Just wondering.


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## bandcollector (Oct 9, 2003)

Sitting down with my popcorn.


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## djansma (Aug 26, 2004)

this should be good !
but I like to wear my dark sandals 
and shorts and short sleve shirt but I do wear a camo hat

David Jansma


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## Scott Parker (Mar 19, 2009)

If it says proper hunting attire then your clothes should match the type of hunt your doing.


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## Byron Musick (Sep 19, 2008)

A dress code??? Its bad enough paying entry fees, now this?? This is sure to improve attendance...


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## mcnaugt (Nov 19, 2008)

What about the judges? Will they be able to wear a light colored T-shirt and their flip flops?


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## Buzz (Apr 27, 2005)

Personally I think that dress codes are dumb.

But then again, *me* commenting on this is dumb.

When I run dogs, I wear camo.

It just happens to be most appropriate for a winter goose hunt. ;-)

Could I show up and tell them that's what I'm simulating?

If I could just get my dog to not notice that there are a hundred other dogs and 50 vehicles to walk through on the way to the line.

If I was at a hunt test, I would get *really mad* to see anyone there running and not in proper attire.


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## Ken Newcomb (Apr 18, 2003)

Finely admitting that HRC understands Hunt Tests.....bwahahahahahaha


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## GulfCoast (Sep 24, 2007)

Who woulda thunk it!


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## Ken Newcomb (Apr 18, 2003)

If you guys need we (HRCers) could do a seminar on having a test with actual hunting scenarios in it.

OK I'm done couldn't help it.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

i'll believe it when i see it.........-Paul


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## Mstormc (Feb 18, 2010)

getting the next tub of popcorn.


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## Lenore (Apr 2, 2010)

I want to keep my eye on this... 

BTW: Nice signature line Mstormc


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## david gibson (Nov 5, 2008)

Scott Parker said:


> If it says proper hunting attire then your clothes should match the type of hunt your doing.


not quite. many tests are a simulated dove hunt on the morning then a simulated duck hunt in water, or a goose hunt, or a teal hunt, and i even had a snipe hunt test once.

the judges dont tell you what kind of hunt it is until the handlers meeting so how can you know?

camo shirt, brown/green/camo shorts, camo hat for me has never been rejected in akc or hrc.


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## TN_LAB (Jul 26, 2008)

Labs R Us said:


> do they mean the actual camo design or will solid green, brown, or tan clothing do the trick? Just wondering.


I'd wait for the rules to be written before stressing too much. 

FWIW, I bought a cheap camo button up shirt that lives in the truck. I must be an easy target, because I have been asked to button my camo shirt (wouldn't you know some of the othr handlers were wearing light tan t-shirts and/or denim and nothing was said ....oh well).


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## FOM (Jan 17, 2003)

Why are we worried about what a handler wears vs. what we are truly trying to do, test a dog's skill level? Makes no sense to me...

FOM


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## Kevinismybrother (Aug 3, 2009)

HRC won't let us even wear shorts in camo now, much less flip flops. 
I agree with with FOM - it is a hunting style TEST - not a realization simulation. 
If I wanted that - I'd turn on my Wii Bird Hunt game and get after it regards


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## kkimmes (Jan 7, 2010)

A bit off topic, but I have seen many ads in catalogs lately for camo hats that are white under the hat for easier handling.
Is this considered OK? AKC or HRC????
I dont have the guts to find out the hard way.


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## Brad B (Apr 29, 2004)

So divulge your source of this ever so popular rumor!


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## Ken Newcomb (Apr 18, 2003)

Kevinismybrother said:


> HRC won't let us even wear shorts in camo now, much less flip flops.
> I agree with with FOM - it is a hunting style TEST - not a realization simulation.
> If I wanted that - I'd turn on my Wii Bird Hunt game and get after it regards


I've been judging HRC tests in the Nebraska/Colo Region for some time now and I promise you can wear shorts at any test I am judging.


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## Rick_C (Dec 12, 2007)

Wow, must be a slow news day.


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## Chance Raehn (Dec 18, 2008)

Kevinismybrother said:


> HRC won't let us even wear shorts in camo now, much less flip flops.
> I agree with with FOM - it is a hunting style TEST - not a realization simulation.
> If I wanted that - I'd turn on my Wii Bird Hunt game and get after it regards


Not true. They do not differentiate between shorts and pants and what kind of shoes to wear. Talk to your field rep if you have further questions.


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## Losthwy (May 3, 2004)

Dress codes are senseless. A handler shouldn't be prohibited from wearing anything they choose.


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

I have never understood this issue. Let's say I have a game. This game has certain rules as each and every game does. You decide to play my game and then complain about my rules when things don't go your way or you decide they are contrary to what you believe?

That's what makes absolutely no sense to me. Play another game or start one to your liking. It's that simple.

It's kinda like an illegal immigrant comming into this country and then trying to tell the American people we should change the immigration laws, making it easier for them to get in.......Stupid!


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

FOM said:


> Why are we worried about what a handler wears vs. what we are truly trying to do, test a dog's skill level? Makes no sense to me...
> 
> FOM


 
Nobody is. The AKC cares little about HT anyway, why would they care what you wear. It aint happening but makes for a long thread


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## GulfCoast (Sep 24, 2007)

Kevinismybrother said:


> HRC won't let us even wear shorts in camo now, much less flip flops.
> I agree with with FOM - it is a hunting style TEST - not a realization simulation.
> If I wanted that - I'd turn on my Wii Bird Hunt game and get after it regards


You can wear camo shorts if you run under me.


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## Buzz (Apr 27, 2005)

kkimmes said:


> A bit off topic, but I have seen many ads in catalogs lately for camo hats that are white under the hat for easier handling.
> Is this considered OK? AKC or HRC????
> I dont have the guts to find out the hard way.


Maybe they want to insist on camo because Lord forbid the dog could actually see the cast you're trying to give.


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## Lee W (Jul 19, 2004)

Dman said:


> I have never understood this issue. Let's say I have a game. This game has certain rules as each and every game does. You decide to play my game and then complain about my rules when things don't go your way or you decide they are contrary to what you believe?
> 
> That's what makes absolutely no sense to me. Play another game or start one to your liking. It's that simple.
> 
> It's kinda like an illegal immigrant comming into this country and then trying to tell the American people we should change the immigration laws, making it easier for them to get in.......Stupid!


Amen ..........


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## Angie B (Sep 30, 2003)

Labs R Us said:


> I've recently heard that AKC will be making it mandatory at hunt tests for entrants to wear camo clothing. If so, do they mean the actual camo design or will solid green, brown, or tan clothing do the trick? Just wondering.


Oh I don't think that's the case..... Chapter 3 section15 states something totally different. The last hunt test judging seminar I attended was 2 months ago and that was never mentioned. 

Always check your background and make sure what your wearing makes you stick out.

Angie


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## Snicklefritz (Oct 17, 2007)

You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way...no excuses excepted, and I don't want to look at your pasty white legs.  But, I'm HRC. AKC can do what it pleases.

Go to Wally World and drop $20 on camo bib overalls. Put'em on for ten minutes, run your dog, and then tak'em off. The HRC clubs I'm familiar with provide camo clothing for those who are new and haven't heard, and for those recalcitrants among us.

But, I've often wondered if a Hawaiin Luau shirt would be camo for hunting in Hawaii. Makes sense...right?

Save fashion statements for the tailgate...

My 2cents,

Snick


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## Kenny Broussard (Aug 11, 2003)

I'm judging this weekend, you can bet I'm wearin' shorts, and hope to he!! that everyone involved is also. Gonna be hot. Pay attention to the dogs.........not what the people are wearing......


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Snicklefritz said:


> You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way...no excuses excepted, and I don't want to look at your pasty white legs.  But, I'm HRC. AKC can do what it pleases.
> 
> Go to Wally World and drop $20 on camo bib overalls. Put'em on for ten minutes, run your dog, and then tak'em off. The HRC clubs I'm familiar with provide camo clothing for those who are new and haven't heard, and for those recalcitrants among us.
> 
> ...


 
How many test have you judged now Chuck?


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Dman said:


> I have never understood this issue. Let's say I have a game. This game has certain rules as each and every game does. You decide to play my game and then complain about my rules when things don't go your way or you decide they are contrary to what you believe?
> 
> That's what makes absolutely no sense to me. Play another game or start one to your liking. It's that simple.
> 
> It's kinda like an illegal immigrant comming into this country and then trying to tell the American people we should change the immigration laws, making it easier for them to get in.......Stupid!


 
ummmmm.....ok but AKC rules don't say you have to wear camo. I think the problem is they (not really but in someones mind anyway) want to CHANGE the rules


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## Snicklefritz (Oct 17, 2007)

badbullgator said:


> How many test have you judged now Chuck?


What difference does it make, Corey?


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## Bubba (Jan 3, 2003)

GulfCoast said:


> You can wear camo shorts if you run under me.


If you run under me- you better be wearing something washable 
(Not to speak of being LOW and quick)

But I really don't give a damn what color it is. 

Never trust a fart regards

Bubba


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Snicklefritz said:


> What difference does it make, Corey?


 
Just asking. You said you would not let someone where camo shorts running under you. I am interested in you vast judging experiance why camo shorts would not be accetable? Why would long pants or coveralls be more accetable?

Good seminar huh? regards


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

badbullgator said:


> want to CHANGE the rules


God forbids someone that owns the game wants to change the rules! 
Lile I said, if you don't like it, don't participate in it. Participate in somnething else or start you own game, Very simple!


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## Riverdog SC (Oct 28, 2008)

Snicklefritz said:


> You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way...no excuses excepted,
> 
> Snick


I'll be wearing shorts on opening day of dove season on Sept. 4 in South Carolina......


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## HarryWilliams (Jan 17, 2005)

What was that rumor again? HPW


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

Just to be clear, as a judge, I also except running in camo shorts and shirts in the hot summer time.


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Dman said:


> God forbids someone that owns the game wants to change the rules!
> Lile I said, if you don't like it, don't participate in it. Participate in somnething else or start you own game, Very simple!


 
Written like a guy who bends over and takes it at every turn.


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

badbullgator said:


> Written like a guy who bends over and takes it at every turn.


and what does that mean?


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## Russ (Jan 3, 2003)

Snicklefritz said:


> You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way
> My 2cents,
> 
> Snick


I dove and duck hunt in camo shorts on warm days and get lots of shooting when I do. Does that make it OK for me? 

I usually wear white or orange when quail or pheasant hunting. I think the AKC should set up a more defined code of attire or not say anything about it. The current one is open to wide range of interpretations by handlers and judges. Some people come to the line with light gray long sleeve shirts and white cowboy hats while others are in full camo.

As mentioned above, a hunt test is a game with with rules. A dog should be able to take directions at a hundred yards with a camo clad handler. The exception is when the judge has the handlers positioned under a tree
in a dark shadow on a bright day. 

Russ


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Dman said:


> and what does that mean?


 
Your willing to accept a change just because "that is the way it is". That is foolish and not in the best interest of the sport. What would requiring camo add to testing a dog? So if they told you you have to shove a stick up your butt before you come to the line you would still have the take it or leave it attitude?


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## dnf777 (Jun 9, 2009)

Snicklefritz said:


> You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way...
> Snick


If I ran under you, of course I would honor your rules, or else I wouldn't be there.

But, haven't you ever hunted dove in Texas in September? 
I promise you ten times over I wear shorts while hunting dove, with my dog, in the real world. And I'm not alone.


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## Brian Skibicki (Feb 23, 2008)

Chance Raehn said:


> Not true. They do not differentiate between shorts and pants and what kind of shoes to wear. Talk to your field rep if you have further questions.


Thank you, Chance. Since you are our HRC Field Rep for Region 4, I appreciate you chiming in on this since it just makes sense.



Snicklefritz said:


> You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way...no excuses excepted, and I don't want to look at your pasty white legs.  But, I'm HRC. AKC can do what it pleases.


Chuck, as I recall from when you Apprenticed under me that I was wearing a Camo Shirt and Green Cargo Shorts. It was 90 degrees, hunt test held in Florida and it just made sense for that one. Another time we judged together we made a few people a little mad when I told them they needed to wear appropriate hunting attire for a duck hunt, it was cold and raining and it made sense for them to dress the way we asked them to.

Oh, and my legs were not THAT white and pasty! ;-)


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## Captain Mike D (Jan 1, 2006)

Snicklefritz said:


> You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way...no excuses excepted, and I don't want to look at your pasty white legs.  But, I'm HRC. AKC can do what it pleases.
> 
> Snick


Chuck,

Being from Florida and having grown up here hunting the salt marsh I have spent many mornings sweating my butt off, respraying OFF or something similar while waiting on ducks dressed in a camo T, a pair of khaki shorts and nothing else. No boots, no socks or anything. I think the only thing that kept me from having a heat stroke was the fact that I could cool off squishing cool mud up between the toes of my bare feet and wading into the water to put out and pick up decoys. 

We don't have no pasty white legs down here. If you were to judge for the club and insisted that people in camo shorts did not comply with proper attire I'm pretty confident the Hunt Test Commitee would either over rule your contention or refund anyone's money wearing a camo shirt and camo shorts. 

And just for the record I've seen a handful of handlers that I thought would be pretty darned impressive in a camo t and a matching thong 

Gooser need not apply :0


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

?


badbullgator said:


> Your willing to accept a change just because "that is the way it is". That is foolish and not in the best interest of the sport. What would requiring camo add to testing a dog? So if they told you you have to shove a stick up your butt before you come to the line you would still have the take it or leave it attitude?


It's called a "hunt test". Why isn't it called a "dog test" or better yet "a field trial"? My point is, there is a game where camo is not required. Play it! Still simple.


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## TN_LAB (Jul 26, 2008)

Riverdog SC said:


> I'll be wearing shorts on opening day of dove season on Sept. 4 in South Carolina......


I was sorta thinking the same thing. Lots of folks hunt in shorts during dove season.

Here's a visual for you guys: fig leaf w/full body camo paint 

Regarding the original post. I hardly care if AKC changes the rule to require camo (got me a cheap camo shirt that lives in the truck), but I sorta wonder Why bother? I guess they want to clear things up and flush out a lot of the khaki and denim shirts.


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## MooseGooser (May 11, 2003)

The only thing I have ever had said to me by Judges in Both venures is:

"Gooser would you PLEASE put some clothes on??"

Clothes suck!

Gooser


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

MooseGooser said:


> The only thing I have ever had said to me by Judges in Both venures is:
> 
> "Gooser would you PLEASE put some clothes on??"
> 
> ...


Having seen the evidence. I can understand that concern! :razz:


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## MooseGooser (May 11, 2003)

One word a caution though!

Dont EVER sit on a Plastic bucket,, In Nebraska ,,In July,,, In a thong!


Gooser


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

MooseGooser said:


> One word a caution though!
> 
> Dont EVER sit on a Plastic bucket,, In Nebraska ,,In July,,, In a thong!
> 
> ...


I just puked a little!


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## Buzz (Apr 27, 2005)

Dman said:


> ?
> It's called a "hunt test". Why isn't it called a "dog test" or better yet "a field trial"? My point is, there is a game where camo is not required. Play it! Still simple.


I get it now! The main difference between a field trial and hunt test is the attire!


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## MoJo (Mar 24, 2004)

I wore a black shirt to a Junior Hunt Test some years ago and was told I was not allowed to do that by the judges.  So I changed into the only green shirt I had - a turtle neck in 90 degree weather. That was not fun...

Not sure where that was part of the rules.


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

Buzz said:


> I get it now! The main difference between a field trial and hunt test is the attire!


Yeah. You're right.


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## Buzz (Apr 27, 2005)

Dman said:


> Yeah. You're right.


That's the same look I get from my wife when she says that.


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

Buzz said:


> That's the same look I get from my wife when she says that.


I hear ya.


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## john fallon (Jun 20, 2003)

I have a shirt that from 10 feet away looks like some kind of "camo" pattern but if asked, from a distance, you just cant place which one it is..... I was asked/told at the Master HT of a HT/Q by a judge who was closer than any live game bird would have gotten that it was not proper atire and was provided with a "camo" shirt that this judge happened to have with him at the line.

We crushed the setup but I never even bothered to leave the Q for the callbacks.

Will all the camo in the future have to be "official size and weight"
john


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## Snicklefritz (Oct 17, 2007)

badbullgator said:


> Just asking. You said you would not let someone where camo shorts running under you. I am interested in you vast judging experiance why camo shorts would not be accetable? Why would long pants or coveralls be more accetable?
> 
> Good seminar huh? regards


How much 'vast judging experience' is required to understand that HRC wants camo. 

If you're going to show off your lilly white legs to incoming birds, why not just hunt naked? Wearing camo shorts seems like a _non sequitor_ to me.

It tickles my fancy when someone ignores the arguement in favor of trying to discredit the witness. Very weak, Corey.

Snick


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## Snicklefritz (Oct 17, 2007)

SouthBryanLabs said:


> Thank you, Chance. Since you are our HRC Field Rep for Region 4, I appreciate you chiming in on this since it just makes sense.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ah, yes! I remember that test. I wore camo from head to toe, and I survived. Go figure it. So, we had HRC stressing camo, and you showed up as my senior judge in golf shorts. I had a few questions from handlers about that. And, it is my opinion that the color of your legs would have distrubed the hunt


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## Brian Skibicki (Feb 23, 2008)

Chuck: Here is what is says EXACTLY from the HRC rulebook:

_Judges, Hunt Marshals, Gunners, Bird Boys and Handlers must wear hunting clothes. Hunting clothes worn must be harmonious with the hunting environment, such as camo in waterfowl and dove hunting, white clothing if snow goose hunting. Gallery and spectators should not be in white or light colored attire that might interfere with the dog’s performance._

As I explained to you when we judged together the definition of hunting clothes is dependent on the conditions in which a hunt is being conducted. When I wear my shorts, (with tan legs I might add), on a hot day with a camo shirt or t-shirt it is in keeping with the hunting environment. When it was cold and raining and we were attempting to simulate a duck hunt the good folks wearing light colored clothing would not be what we would have had in a duck blind with us.


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

SouthBryanLabs said:


> Chuck: Here is what is says EXACTLY from the HRC rulebook:
> 
> _Judges, Hunt Marshals, Gunners, Bird Boys and Handlers must wear hunting clothes. Hunting clothes worn must be harmonious with the hunting environment, such as camo in waterfowl and dove hunting, white clothing if snow goose hunting. Gallery and spectators should not be in white or light colored attire that might interfere with the dog’s performance._
> 
> As I explained to you when we judged together the definition of hunting clothes is dependent on the conditions in which a hunt is being conducted. When I wear my shorts, (with tan legs I might add), on a hot day with a camo shirt or t-shirt it is in keeping with the hunting environment. When it was cold and raining and we were attempting to simulate a duck hunt the good folks wearing light colored clothing would not be what we would have had in a duck blind with us.


Exactly!!! Not complicated at all.


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## Captain Mike D (Jan 1, 2006)

Snicklefritz said:


> How much 'vast judging experience' is required to understand that HRC wants camo.
> 
> If you're going to show off your lilly white legs to incoming birds, why not just hunt naked? Wearing camo shorts seems like a _non sequitor_ to me.
> 
> Snick


SO just how many times do you go duck hunting over a decoy spread that you would not fashion some type of blind for concealment. 
If it was warm and humid, and I showed up to hunt with you because I was invited and you told me I couldn't cause you didn't like my legs I would tell you to pound sand.
Maybe instead of alienating folks with the fact that you don't like their shorts it would be pertinent for you and your co-judge to build some type of blind that really would make the test more realistic. Things that are normally accociated with a normal day hunting are encouraged at all levels in HRC- NOT just camo


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## Kevinismybrother (Aug 3, 2009)

> Not true. They do not differentiate between shorts and pants and what kind of shoes to wear. Talk to your field rep if you have further questions.





> You can wear camo shorts if you run under me.


Just saying, the Region 13 Rules Rep - a BIG fan of shorts - says we can no longer work on a tan while running our dogs.

sporting a farmer's tan regards


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## Labs R Us (Jun 25, 2010)

Woah...I never thought my innocent question would create such controvery. Sorry. I had just heard this issue discussed among our training group and thought I'd turn to this forum to clarify.


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## djansma (Aug 26, 2004)

I am judging a master this weekend and all handlers can wear shorts as long as the underwear is not on the outside but if you do where it on the out side 
it better not be white:razz:

just wear some darker or hunting type clothing and lets have some fun
besides I will be watching the dogs

David Jansma


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## Snicklefritz (Oct 17, 2007)

SouthBryanLabs said:


> Chuck: Here is what is says EXACTLY from the HRC rulebook:
> 
> _Judges, Hunt Marshals, Gunners, Bird Boys and Handlers must wear hunting clothes. Hunting clothes worn must be harmonious with the hunting environment, such as camo in waterfowl and dove hunting, white clothing if snow goose hunting. Gallery and spectators should not be in white or light colored attire that might interfere with the dog’s performance._
> 
> As I explained to you when we judged together the definition of hunting clothes is dependent on the conditions in which a hunt is being conducted. When I wear my shorts, (with tan legs I might add), on a hot day with a camo shirt or t-shirt it is in keeping with the hunting environment. When it was cold and raining and we were attempting to simulate a duck hunt the good folks wearing light colored clothing would not be what we would have had in a duck blind with us.


It was not cold and raining. But, I suppose the ducks can distinquish what is appropriate for the temperature, and also can distinguish between light colored clothing and skin tones?


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## Snicklefritz (Oct 17, 2007)

Captain Mike D said:


> SO just how many times do you go duck hunting over a decoy spread that you would not fashion some type of blind for concealment.
> If it was warm and humid, and I showed up to hunt with you because I was invited and you told me I couldn't cause you didn't like my legs I would tell you to pound sand.
> Maybe instead of alienating folks with the fact that you don't like their shorts it would be pertinent for you and your co-judge to build some type of blind that really would make the test more realistic. Things that are normally accociated with a normal day hunting are encouraged at all levels in HRC- NOT just camo


Mike you're really mistating my position. Our club does in fact provide camo coveralls for anyone who does not have appropriate attire. This may be because they are new to the sport, or because they just don't like the rules of the game. Either way, providing camo for them is a very hospitable thing the club has decide to do. No one need ask for a refund because they are not wearing proper attire.

As for building a proper blind, it is the clubs responsibility to provide materials to do so. That has not been my experience.

Ya know, Mike. You're making a mountain out of mole hill. You have made this a very public matter that involves more than just you and I, but our club as well, and HRC as an organization. I have no wish to air our laundry in a public forum. I'm surprised that you don't understand that. Check your email.

Chuck


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## Golddogs (Feb 3, 2004)

Use some common sense. No venue is *JUST LIKE HUNTING*. Try to honor the spirit of the reg's as far as required color of clothing and have some fun. I appreciate any handler trying to comply with approprate attire color wise, but they, and I need to be comfortable and safe. It is not that hard to go out and buy a olive drab t-shirt or tank top.

I have yet to see clothing, or lack ther of, make a dog remember a double or sit still on the honor.

Camo bikini regards


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## david gibson (Nov 5, 2008)

Labs R Us said:


> Woah...I never thought my innocent question would create such controvery. Sorry. I had just heard this issue discussed among our training group and thought I'd turn to this forum to clarify.


next time you ask a question and one of the first responses is "i am going for the popcorn" --- run. just run, or sit back and make some popcorn yourself.... ;-)


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## Losthwy (May 3, 2004)

Dman said:


> God forbids someone that owns the game wants to change the rules!
> Lile I said, if you don't like it, don't participate in it. Participate in somnething else or start you own game, Very simple!


This isn't our game? Is the tail wagging the dog?


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## limiman12 (Oct 13, 2007)

Out of curiosity, would you make someone wear a long sleeve shirt, if their arms were too light for you. Seems like short sleeves would be much more of an advantage then having bare legs, unless of course you are going to stand on your head to give casts with your legs.

Simulating a hunting experience, in the middle of the day, with forty people sitting behind you, two judges sitting by you , no or little blind, sitting on a bare shore on a white bucket, waiting in the truck for two hours then at the line for thirty seconds, instead of the other way around, yeah your right, wearing shorts makes a HUGE difference.


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## steve schreiner (Jun 15, 2009)

I only hunt when there is snow on the ground so be sure and bring your white coat or shirt ( short or long sleeve optional) and since it is cold bring a pair of black gloves to keep your hands warm .....or to just handle yuky ducks on Sunday..... proper attire for the special hunt you are on... Camo out lawed at my test.....I can't believe there is even a mention of attire... I judge dogs not the fashion show .The white inside of caps was mentioned earlier, some judges drop you if you take your hat of and use it as an aid for the dog to see you ...Let's get back to the days we were more interested in the dog work...In the early days it was nice to see some of the young ladies come to the line in halter tops and short shorts ...but I was a lot younger then and the wife said I could look but not touch......Steve S


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## Joseph Kendrick (Mar 19, 2010)

Wasn't the hunter on the front of HRC's mag in shorts in the picture taken at the Grand. If its good enough for the Grand then it should be good enough for everwhere....


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## Janet Kimbrough (Aug 14, 2003)

Dman....You are right on target. Follow the rules of the game YOU choose to participate in or find a different game.

I also will second what Chance said. There is absolutely nothing wrong with wearing camo shorts at an HRC hunt test. From Started thru the Grand. That is what I tell folks in Region 11 as the Field Rep. Well within the rules and spirit of HRC.

Janet


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## Dan Boerboon (May 30, 2009)

I prefer to hunt naked with camo body paint. As this is *MY customary hunting attire* and it is camo head to foot I'll try it at the next test. I'll probably get a ribbon as the judges will keep their eyes closed until I leave the line.


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## Furball (Feb 23, 2006)

limiman12 said:


> Out of curiosity, would you make someone wear a long sleeve shirt, if their arms were too light for you. Seems like short sleeves would be much more of an advantage then having bare legs, unless of course you are going to stand on your head to give casts with your legs.
> 
> Simulating a hunting experience, in the middle of the day, with forty people sitting behind you, two judges sitting by you , no or little blind, sitting on a bare shore on a white bucket, waiting in the truck for two hours then at the line for thirty seconds, instead of the other way around, yeah your right, wearing shorts makes a HUGE difference.


Bingo!

The last HRC test I went to I had a grand old time watching THREE new handlers at Started with Fisher's babies. What do I remember most about that day? How freaked out the judges made them ABOUT THEIR CLOTHING. Their dogs all passed and in fine form...but we all remember their pants. Now that is stupid.


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## Jerry and Freya (Sep 13, 2008)

How about having a "fashion show"???
Freya


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## Steve Shaver (Jan 9, 2003)

Dress code is stupid! I'd wear camo if I had to. At the hunt test level it doesnt matter what you wear. The dog doesnt care. The camo is for the people not the dog or anything else. People are strange! When I hunt I'm either wearing white or old faded brown Carhart coveralls that match the dead grass or tules I'm hunting in and for upland hunting I just wear plain ol everyday attire. Camos fine but to require it is ridiculous. Next thing you know it will have to be a specific pattern


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

well, a new day has dawned and i'm out of popcorn, so i guess it's time for some bacon and eggs......

page 8.......i figure it'll go at least 5 more.-Paul


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Dman said:


> ?
> It's called a "hunt test". Why isn't it called a "dog test" or better yet "a field trial"? My point is, there is a game where camo is not required. Play it! Still simple.


 
And it is sooooo close to hunting. There is a game that makes handlers wear camo and it is for hunters by hunters. Then there are other venues that have not be for hunters and are run by MANY (not me, but many) that do not hunt and have no intention of hunting. Just because a person does not hunt or want to dress up like a hunter to watch dead duck being tossed out of slingshots, does not mean that they cannot train a dog. 

Let's see a list of serious faluts

Dog breaks
Dog eats birds
Handler wears short
Handler does not wear camo.....
Woman has white hair and will not wear a hat

Yeah I can see how the last three are important to judging if a dog can work or not. I am still waiting to hear a real answer as to why what a handler wears has anything to do with what a dog does.


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

paul young said:


> well, a new day has dawned and i'm out of popcorn, so i guess it's time for some bacon and eggs......
> 
> page 8.......i figure it'll go at least 5 more.-Paul


 
Damn Paul chang your setting and you will only have three pages ;-)


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Snicklefritz said:


> How much 'vast judging experience' is required to understand that HRC wants camo.
> 
> If you're going to show off your lilly white legs to incoming birds, why not just hunt naked? Wearing camo shorts seems like a _non sequitor_ to me.
> 
> ...


 
Come on Chuck, please tell me why it matters to the dog work if I wear camo or a pink thong? Your telling me that those dead birds are going to be scared off by my legs? Really? You run a venue that wants head to toe camo so you don't scare the birds an yet they don't even use live birds. You experiance dose matter because if you knew crap about dogs you would know that what a person wears has exacty ZERO to do with what the dog does. After all isn't it about the dog work? Does a dog run marks better or worse if the handler has on shorts, camo, whate jacket...?? Come on really give me an answer to this.
You say no shorts and your answer is that my legs will scare birds and yet you call my argument weak? So you are judging on the fact that my legs will scare birds rather than on what the dog does when the DEAD birds are tossed. 
I have been asked to not come to the line from a holding blind because I had on running shoes. A friend of mine has white hair and she has been told to put on a hat. STUPID. How do shoes give an advantage? White hair? 
Lets see dog runs a triple nails it and the blinds but in your book since the handler had on shorts, white hair with no hat, or no camo the dog does not get a pass. Are you an adult or a freaking 10 year old?

I still ask the question how many test have you judged and at what level? What is the highest level you have titles a dog? They are useful to the discussion to udnerstand your understanding of what makes a good dog.

BTW - my butt might be lilly white but my legs are never white, this is florida Chuck I wear shorts a good 320 days out of the year ;-)


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## Brian Skibicki (Feb 23, 2008)

Tony and Corey, the fact is that the fellow in this thread referring to shorts being inappropriate is just plain wrong and he cannot arbitrarily impose some interpretation of a clearly stated rule. The vast majority of HRC judges use common sense when it comes to an issue like this, in fact 2 regional reps confirmed that fact in this thread. The rule clearly states that you need to wear clothing that is harmonious with the hunting environment. In HRC we are extremely proud of the fact that we are at our heart comprised of hunters and for hunters who want better hunting companions, and the appropriate clothing for the conditions which a hunt is intended to replicate are part of the scenario of the hunt.Over time the scenario aspect of the tests have certainly become less realistic, particularly at the local Club level, but there is an increased emphasis on improving upon that. As for how it effects the dogs performance, obviously it won't make your dog run a better blind but if a test is set up correctly it is intended to replicate the conditions which your dog, and partner in the field, as well as the handler might experience when giving those casts and the challenges of handling in hunting attire. In closing, if it is too warm to wear long pants, you can bet that this is one judge that will be wearing his appropriately colored shorts and I won't be breaking any rules while doing it.


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

splashbird said:


> I just sat here and read this whole thread. What a hoot. Judges really whine about someone wearing shorts? Holy crap, that's just funny. I've never seen or heard of that happening here in the South. The thread is really made good by those of you taking it tongue in cheek and having fun with it. I go to hunt tests to have fun with my dogs in the off season and to proof my training. I prefer venues that don't obsess about what you are wearing and judge the dog. If I get to a test and I'm told to wear something different, I'll do whatever I have to in order to appease the judges (usually). I make notes on every test that I run and judges that I run under; so I always know what clubs and/or judges to avoid in order to run tests that fit my opinion of what a test should be and how it should be ran. And when choosing where to spend my money, my opinion is the only one that matters. I hope that AKC doesn't force judges to begin obsessing about camo, but if they do I have plenty camo and I'll just deal with it. I just hope they don't start making us sit on a dang bucket. Looking forward to the fall season of tests...


You can wear pretty much anything you want at my test, I judge dogs not handlers. If AKC were to require camo I would no longer judge. I LOVE HRC, but my one dissagreement with them is their camo rules. I wear camo when I run HRC because it is the rules, but I cannot understand how it adds to the business of testing dogs.


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## Steve Peacock (Apr 9, 2009)

Kevinismybrother said:


> HRC won't let us even wear shorts in camo now, much less flip flops.
> I agree with with FOM - it is a hunting style TEST - not a realization simulation.
> If I wanted that - I'd turn on my Wii Bird Hunt game and get after it regards


REALLY, I let handlers wear camo shorts all the time! Haven't heard ONE word about no camo shorts, heck there were all kinds of handlers wearing camo shorts at the Spring Grand. I don't know where you heard this, news to me. 
Now my experience is just HRC, the only experience I have with AKC hunt tests is those handlers that come and run HRC tests. All I know is, HRC tests are supposed to simulate a day of HUNTING, thus our motto "For Hunters by Hunters". Therefore, we wear camo or hunting attire. Now you can never TRULY simulate an actual day of hunting in one 3 - 6 minute test, but we are trying to evaluate the value of our dogs as hunting companions. We are simulating waterfowl or dove hunts (upland is a separate test) so we wear camo, and it *DOES* affect the dog. EXPERIENCE has taught me that. Now as I have said, I have never run AKC hunt tests, so I won't say if you should wear camo or not. Some of the things you do in your tests *I* think are down right silly, but I am sure the reverse is true and not trying to start anything there, just saying the games are somewhat different. If your organization doesn't believe in wearing camo, fine by me but mine does, I enjoy the fact that we do and it gives me an excuse occasionally to buy no camo clothing for hunting.


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

My understanding is HRC seldom uses live birds-that would go a lot further toward a real hunting scenario than making people wear overalls in 95 degree weather. What about the young ladies? Would they have to wear the men's overalls to line? People that wear shorts seldom have pasty legs because they wear shorts all summer. I think the games would be much better off if the judges were watching what goes on in the field than being king for a day with dress attire.


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## Bill Davis (Sep 15, 2003)

Kevinismybrother said:


> HRC won't let us even wear shorts in camo now, much less flip flops.
> I agree with with FOM - it is a hunting style TEST - not a realization simulation.
> If I wanted that - I'd turn on my Wii Bird Hunt game and get after it regards


Wow I have never heard that one either. I have worn shorts and flip flops to the line and as a judge in HRC. 
If you prefer not to run HRC because of the Camo rule so be it. I run both AKC & HRC. In HRC I wear camo pants/shorts and a camo shirt. In AKC I wear a camo shirt and tan or darker pants/shorts.


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Steve Peacock said:


> REALLY, I let handlers wear camo shorts all the time! Haven't heard ONE word about no camo shorts, heck there were all kinds of handlers wearing camo shorts at the Spring Grand. I don't know where you heard this, news to me.
> Now my experience is just HRC, the only experience I have with AKC hunt tests is those handlers that come and run HRC tests. All I know is, HRC tests are supposed to simulate a day of HUNTING, thus our motto "For Hunters by Hunters". Therefore, we wear camo or hunting attire. Now you can never TRULY simulate an actual day of hunting in one 3 - 6 minute test, but we are trying to evaluate the value of our dogs as hunting companions. We are simulating waterfowl or dove hunts (upland is a separate test) so we wear camo, and it *DOES* affect the dog. EXPERIENCE has taught me that. Now as I have said, I have never run AKC hunt tests, so I won't say if you should wear camo or not. Some of the things you do in your tests *I* think are down right silly, but I am sure the reverse is true and not trying to start anything there, just saying the games are somewhat different. If your organization doesn't believe in wearing camo, fine by me but mine does, I enjoy the fact that we do and it gives me an excuse occasionally to buy no camo clothing for hunting.


 
Steve help me out here. It is easy to say it DOES affect the dogs, but how exactly does it affect the work they do. Now I have run a lot of dogs in both full camo, white, and other colors and I can tell you the dogs either can do the work or they cannot. I have also hunted with dog and worn shorts, full camo, jeans and a tee shirt and the dogs couldn't care less as long as I was shooting birds. Please give us a specific way that what you have on affects a well trained dog and after all that is what every venue is looking for is it not? For what it is worth I have had far more dogs fail AKC test that I have ever had fail an HRC test and yet I have NEVER worn camo in an AKC test.


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## Captain Mike D (Jan 1, 2006)

ErinsEdge said:


> My understanding is HRC seldom uses live birds-that would go a lot further toward a real hunting scenario than making people wear overalls in 95 degree weather. What about the young ladies? Would they have to wear the men's overalls to line? People that wear shorts seldom have pasty legs because they wear shorts all summer. I think the games would be much better off if the judges were watching what goes on in the field than being king for a day with dress attire.


I agree with most of what you have stated.
HRC does allows the use of live birds. In fact in upland tests live birds are used, and the dog must flush and then remain steady until released. I believe the reason they are not used more at the other levels is due to time management and limiting the size of the area of the fall.


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Captain Mike D said:


> I agree with most of what you have stated.
> HRC does allows the use of live birds. In fact in upland tests live birds are used, and the dog must flush and then remain steady until released. I believe the reason they are not used more at the other levels is due to time management and limiting the size of the area of the fall.


 
Mike
As you know our club uses them if the judges are willing in finished. I have to disagree with you on time management though. Our AKC test are far larger in numbers of handlers that participate, we sometimes use flyers in two series and still get it done. IMHO the size of the AOF is not increased significantly and even if it is we are testing the dogs ability to mark a fall after all, not hunt a specific area. 

BTW- I dont care if they are used in HRC or not, that is up to them....just saying


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## Jeff Huntington (Feb 11, 2007)

Snicklefritz said:


> You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way...no excuses excepted, and I don't want to look at your pasty white legs.  But, I'm HRC. AKC can do what it pleases.
> 
> Go to Wally World and drop $20 on camo bib overalls. Put'em on for ten minutes, run your dog, and then tak'em off. The HRC clubs I'm familiar with provide camo clothing for those who are new and haven't heard, and for those recalcitrants among us.
> 
> ...


What benefit does the dog gain by the handler wearing shorts?????? It its hot then why not wear shorts. I know many that dove hunt in camo shorts opening weekend.


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## Ken Newcomb (Apr 18, 2003)

Kevinismybrother said:


> Just saying, the Region 13 Rules Rep - a BIG fan of shorts - says we can no longer work on a tan while running our dogs.
> 
> sporting a farmer's tan regards


With all due respect to our Region 13 RR rep or our two Field Reps the HRC president or the National Field Rep. If any of them are saying this they are making up rules that do not exist.


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## KNorman (Jan 6, 2003)

Yawwwnnnnnn........

I run HRC HT's.
I run AKC HT's.
I run AKC FT's.
I judge HRC HT's.
I judge AKC FT's.

Every venue has it's quirks. Every venue is fun to run in it's own way. No venue is "better" than another...just that people are willing to bitch, moan, and denigrate the venue(s) they don't run.

Shut-up and prepare accordingly.

As to HRC "dress codes"....please wear "hunting attire" if you run under me. I'm pretty damn lenient cuz I'm watching your dogs and don't care what you're wearing, as long as it is in the spirit of the rules. (i.e. dark or camo is fine and I don't care if you wear shorts or long pants)


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## goosebruce (Jan 10, 2003)

so if the rational of the poster that doesnt want white pasty legs flairing dead ducks in his hrc test, Ive got a couple of black members in my club. Can they wear shorts? Do you have it in for ******? If they went on a duck hunt with me, I wouldnt make em put on a face mask... so by that rational THEY should be allowed on your king for a day hrc hunt to wear shorts. 

I bleed camo, and quote the hrc rulebook like a a tv preacher quotes the Bible. Your wrong on your short stance. Period. travis


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## Jason Glavich (Apr 10, 2008)

Snicklefritz said:


> But, I've often wondered if a Hawaiin Luau shirt would be camo for hunting in Hawaii. Makes sense...right?
> 
> Save fashion statements for the tailgate...
> 
> ...


I have seen someone wearing a white shirt, that was covered in palm tree pictures, it was a big print pattern or something like that, it looked like a snow covered green tree pattern till I got close it was pretty funny, they had the matching shorts and hat to go with it.

FWIW I wear camo at all tests akc or HRC because I dont like getting any other clothes messed up.

Also I wear shorts when hunting all the time,layout blind hides them anyway. And my duck blind does as well. And yes during dove and early goose I will never wear pants, 90+ mean shorts all the way.


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## KNorman (Jan 6, 2003)

Snicklefritz said:


> You can't wear camo shorts if you run under me. You wouldn't really hunt that way...no excuses excepted, and I don't want to look at your pasty white legs.  But, I'm HRC. AKC can do what it pleases.


With all due respect Snick... you are wrong. Read the rules please. 

Many HRC judges have chimed in on this thread and don't agree with your interpretation. I hope you've learned something.


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## Chris Rosier (Dec 27, 2008)

Im starting to think Im gonna have to give more thought to what I wear to a hunt test than I do to what I wear to church


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## Doc E (Jan 3, 2003)

badbullgator said:


> Come on Chuck, please tell me why it matters to the dog work if I wear camo or a pink thong?


If color doesn't matter, then why (any venue including AKC) are people in the gallery not allowed to wear white ?



.


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## duckdawg27 (Apr 30, 2007)

Mr.Snickers....sorry dude can't agree with ya. On any given day at any given HT in the South, Shorts would be "the dress code" if you look around.

AKC...they would do well to leave that can of worms alone....just ask HRC.


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## bandcollector (Oct 9, 2003)

1. Is there REALLY some sort of movement to change the vague, "customary or dark clothing" rule in AKC HT?

2. That being said I used to have an issue with people who didn't wear camo at AKC HT. Since then Black has become the "dark" and the preferred by a lot of handlers. I think it's more "the spirit of the game" than an actual difference in dogs performance relating to the clothing. I would prefer it be camo but don't think it really makes that much difference in the long run.

2. My buddies and I routinely wear blue jeans and a camo jacket inside the blind. After I install the durahide cover this year the jacket color won't matter either. I never have had a concern about having to wear blue, black, camo, white or any other color while handling on a real hunt...

4. Has anyone considered that handler's faces shine like a silver dollar on a hunt. Just saying. 

Take'em! :snipersmile:


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## Steve Peacock (Apr 9, 2009)

Ok, wasn't going to, but I will a little. My dogs and everyone's that I train with, when the camo goes on and the guns come out, the dogs mental attitude CHANGES (be it hunting or HT). This CAN & WILL affect the dogs work. Also, your attire can affect the way the dog can or cannot see the handler, especially at a distance, thus AFFECTING the dogs work. I train in a white jacket or light colored clothing so my dogs can SEE me, I'm trying to teach not test at that time. When I hunt or run hunt test - in camo. The dogs know the difference, if I was able to go to the line in lighter clothing and no camo, MY dog would interpret that as a training day and mental attitude would be different. Don't want it that way but, it is and have seen the same with many others over the years. Not your experience or opinion, so be it, not going to argue with you. This is the way I see it and the way I believe. If you believe different, well then good for you and go with your gut. That's why I always say that I am just expressing MY opinion or experience. If yours is different, I'm not going to knock or throw mud at it, I just don't agree with it. I know the tests are about the dog work, but what we do as handlers and judges can & does affect the dogs work.


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## DarrinGreene (Feb 8, 2007)

Buzz said:


> Maybe they want to insist on camo because Lord forbid the dog could actually see the cast you're trying to give.


LOL if he can't see ya at these distances, put him back on the truck!

I have never understood what the issue is in a HT wearing dark or customary hunting attire. We're asking a dog to mark a dark object, thrown against a dark background and in poor lighting half the time, then negotiate a miriad of factors to get there and find it...

If he can do that he can sure as hell see you at 100 yards, in a dark shirt giving a cast!

And if he can't, train some more...


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## Heelsit (Nov 7, 2007)

C'mon people! Neither one of these games (AKC or HRC) is that close to actual hunting!
Why obsess over the clothes? I run in both AKC and HRC. I enjoy them for their differences. I wear camo at HRC because they want it, I wear shorts and a camo top at AKC because they allow it.
If either organization wants to get obsessed about what handlers wear, they both have a long way to go toward actually simulating hunting.
Things I've seen at "hunt tests" which were allowed by either HRC or AKC:
HRC Tests:
1. Allowing handler to say "ank ank ank" instead of blowing duck call. (I tried that once in Stuttgart on a duck hunt, it didn't work too well.)
2. Sitting on a white bucket, at the end of a point, as the position from which to hunt. (Not behind a blind or in a blind. Wonder if ducks would land in that decoy spread?)
3. Shooting blank loads in a pump shotgun. (Hard to bring home a duck without real shells.)
AKC Tests:
1. Holding a single-shot gun at the line, welded shut, impossible to load, painted orange. (Hard to kill a duck with that one.)
2. Judge waves a white book to begin the duck hunt. (Might be OK for a goose hunt, wonder how it would work on real mallards?)
3. Not allowed to talk to my dog while ducks are being thrown. (Yeah, right. On a real hunt I AM gonna whisper "sit" if it takes a few minutes to get a big group down into the spread, and maybe even throw in a light nick to be sure I get it.)
I did not write this to offend either of you strictly HRC folks or AKC folks - just to make the point. If you decide to play one game, play by their rules.
Last, if you run under me at an AKC event, wear drab-colored shorts and shirt if you want, just don't wear anything that will distract other dogs if another handler is running a blind.


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## Doug Main (Mar 26, 2003)

Steve Peacock said:


> Ok, wasn't going to, but I will a little. My dogs and everyone's that I train with, when the camo goes on and the guns come out, the dogs mental attitude CHANGES (be it hunting or HT). This CAN & WILL affect the dogs work. Also, your attire can affect the way the dog can or cannot see the handler, especially at a distance, thus AFFECTING the dogs work. I train in a white jacket or light colored clothing so my dogs can SEE me, I'm trying to teach not test at that time. When I hunt or run hunt test - in camo. The dogs know the difference, if I was able to go to the line in lighter clothing and no camo, MY dog would interpret that as a training day and mental attitude would be different. Don't want it that way but, it is and have seen the same with many others over the years. Not your experience or opinion, so be it, not going to argue with you. This is the way I see it and the way I believe. If you believe different, well then good for you and go with your gut. That's why I always say that I am just expressing MY opinion or experience. If yours is different, I'm not going to knock or throw mud at it, I just don't agree with it. I know the tests are about the dog work, but what we do as handlers and judges can & does affect the dogs work.


Sorry Steve, but I call BS on this. I just can't let this one slide by. ;-)

Do you REALLY think that if you came to the line at a test in "training clothes" your dog would think you are just training?  I don't.;-)

The clothes are for the handlers.

JMHO


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## 1st retriever (Sep 2, 2008)

Scott Parker said:


> If it says proper hunting attire then your clothes should match the type of hunt your doing.


Great, insulated clothing in 80+ degree heat!


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## Bill Davis (Sep 15, 2003)

Heelsit said:


> C'mon people! Neither one of these games (AKC or HRC) is that close to actual hunting!
> Why obsess over the clothes? I run in both AKC and HRC. I enjoy them for their differences. I wear camo at HRC because they want it, I wear shorts and a camo top at AKC because they allow it.
> If either organization wants to get obsessed about what handlers wear, they both have a long way to go toward actually simulating hunting.
> Things I've seen at "hunt tests" which were allowed by either HRC or AKC:
> ...


add this to the AKC HT
#4. Signal you are ready for the birds. Duck call and shoot from the where duck is being thrown from....


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## Juli H (Aug 27, 2007)

DarrinGreene said:


> LOL if he can't see ya at these distances, put him back on the truck!
> 
> I have never understood what the issue is in a HT wearing dark or customary hunting attire. We're asking a dog to mark a dark object, thrown against a dark background and in poor lighting half the time, then negotiate a miriad of factors to get there and find it...
> 
> ...


I always had this same opinion, the dog should be able to see me at these distances...not really working on field trial distances, you know, so wearing white should not make much difference (but I am pretty sure that AKC hunt tests frequently have marks and/or blinds over 100 yds). I used to train with my camo coat on almost all the time (occasionally I'd wear white, or a 'solid' color blue coat or just a t-shirt). I noticed over time, that sometimes on blinds (usually between 75-150yd), my dog would take incorrect casts when I wore the camo coat - esp when he was getting to the end of the blind, and depending on background, lighting, etc....This yr I decided to change and (try) to wear white every time I trained..The days I have not had it, I have seen a marked difference in how my dog handles on blinds. 

Juli


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## Heelsit (Nov 7, 2007)

When I judge, I do look at the gallery, and I have asked spectators in white to cover up, or move to be seated behind other people, and to be still. I do try to remove unnecessary distractions when handlers are running blinds, and the gallery can sometimes be the source of a distraction.


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## MSchack (Jun 22, 2009)

badbullgator said:


> Really? I have never seen this. Not allowed to wear white? What do they do if a spectator shows up in white? This is not a rule. How can you enforce a rule in a gallery.
> Have another dirk


Before I even owned a lab I went to an AKC hunt test just to see what it was all about and I was wearing a white shirt. 

I was standing in the gallery watching a JR test and a lady (I'm guessing the marshal) asked me very nicely to leave or at least stand way far away under some trees.

When she was telling this to me I noticed everybody at the line and in the bird stations was turned around watching what was going on so I am guessing that one of the judges told her to do it.

It was embarrassing but she was very nice and explained that it would distract the dogs so I had no hard feelings.


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## redleg06 (Jan 28, 2008)

Golddogs said:


> Use some common sense. No venue is *JUST LIKE HUNTING*. Try to honor the spirit of the reg's as far as required color of clothing and have some fun. I appreciate any handler trying to comply with approprate attire color wise, but they, and I need to be comfortable and safe. It is not that hard to go out and buy a olive drab t-shirt or tank top.
> 
> I have yet to see clothing, or lack ther of, make a dog remember a double or sit still on the honor.
> 
> Camo bikini regards


This!!! 


I am sitting back laughing about the folks arguing about camo attire because the test are supposed be just like you would see in hunting and i have to ask if those people have EVER been hunting.... The hunt test games (both AKC and UKC) are in the spirit of a hunting situation and have some resemblance to a hunt ON OCCASION. 

I could make a long list of things that you regularly see at tests that you wouldnt see in hunting situations.... 

- I've never shot ducks while sitting out in the middle of an open cow pasture on a bucket with a couple of judges sitting behind us in lawn chairs. 

-I cant remember a time that I shot a triple with none of the birds falling closer than 50yds.

Why then would you ever see these scenario set up in a hunt test if they dont exactly mirror how people hunt??? Because the point of the test is to *judge the dog work *against a standard while trying to simulate hunting scenarios. Exactly mirroring what you would do while actually hunting would be difficult or impossible to accomplish on a consistent basis for a variety of reasons. 

Hunt test arent hunting and they dont have to be


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Steve Peacock said:


> Ok, wasn't going to, but I will a little. My dogs and everyone's that I train with, when the camo goes on and the guns come out, the dogs mental attitude CHANGES (be it hunting or HT). This CAN & WILL affect the dogs work. Also, your attire can affect the way the dog can or cannot see the handler, especially at a distance, thus AFFECTING the dogs work. I train in a white jacket or light colored clothing so my dogs can SEE me, I'm trying to teach not test at that time. When I hunt or run hunt test - in camo. The dogs know the difference, if I was able to go to the line in lighter clothing and no camo, MY dog would interpret that as a training day and mental attitude would be different. Don't want it that way but, it is and have seen the same with many others over the years. Not your experience or opinion, so be it, not going to argue with you. This is the way I see it and the way I believe. If you believe different, well then good for you and go with your gut. That's why I always say that I am just expressing MY opinion or experience. If yours is different, I'm not going to knock or throw mud at it, I just don't agree with it. I know the tests are about the dog work, but what we do as handlers and judges can & does affect the dogs work.


That is antidotal at best. My dogs are just as UP at AKC test with me wearing a black shirt as they are at HRC with me wearing full camo. Yes they know the difference between a test or hunting and training, however, they don’t know or seem to care if it is an HRC test with camo or and AKC test without. 
You will get no argument form me that a dog can see you better in white than camo, but are you testing eyesight or are you testing the dogs ability? I would rather a dog is able to see his handler and know if the dog is well trained. MANY times I have stepped out of a blind and removed my jacket so a dog could see me handle him while hunting. Sorry I don’t find that to be a dog issue. 
I am just asking for your opinion and a real answer to the question that actually makes sense.


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## DarrinGreene (Feb 8, 2007)

1st retriever said:


> Great, insulated clothing in 80+ degree heat!


let's face it Steph, we know how you like your men dressed


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## RKDuce (Apr 12, 2010)

Man I'm glad my dogs are not allowed to run AKC hunt tests! You guys are crazy.


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## DoubleHaul (Jul 22, 2008)

badbullgator said:


> a real answer to the question that actually makes sense.


There is no answer that makes sense. It is obvious to anyone who has ever hunted (and most folks even if they haven't) that a hunt test isn't hunting and isn't even much like it. They are supposed to test the dog work. No one mentioned it but I think the whole making up the hunting scenario thing is silly as well. I have never known a judge to come to grounds and say "this is great, we could set up an extremely realistic dodo bird hunting situation here". Instead, they look at what they have to work with, set up a good test of dog work and make up a silly justification for it (99% starting with "you are late to the hunt and your friends are already in the blinds down there with no dogs. Test dog to the line please").

I think the clothing requirement really comes from a desire to be "not field trial". When the HT program was getting started it largely came about because folks were bemoaning the fact that FTs had gone beyond what Average Joe Hunter and Average Joe Hunting Dawg could or would want to do. So they set up the program and just to make sure folks knew it wasn't a FT, they punctuated it with a dress code. There is no good reason for it.

If there is, in fact, some proposal to crack down on folks who don't wear camo at AKC tests, I would be against that (not that anyone cares). I think that the slackness with which the dress code is treated at an AKC HT is good, but if they change it, whatever. I don't typically wear a lot of camo when hunting but I have plenty of it. Having to wear camo would change nothing at all on marks and would have very impact on blinds at HT distances. We would still pass or fail based on how the dog did.


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## duk4me (Feb 20, 2008)

Don't forget to wear your boots.


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## Troy B (May 25, 2005)

Kevinismybrother said:


> HRC won't let us even wear shorts in camo now, much less flip flops.
> I agree with with FOM - it is a hunting style TEST - not a realization simulation.
> If I wanted that - I'd turn on my Wii Bird Hunt game and get after it regards


I'm in the same region you are and I run in shorts and judge in shorts and flip flops all the time. Who has told you that you can't where shorts or flip flops?


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## Troy B (May 25, 2005)

Dman said:


> I have never understood this issue. Let's say I have a game. This game has certain rules as each and every game does. You decide to play my game and then complain about my rules when things don't go your way or you decide they are contrary to what you believe?
> 
> That's what makes absolutely no sense to me. Play another game or start one to your liking. It's that simple.
> 
> It's kinda like an illegal immigrant comming into this country and then trying to tell the American people we should change the immigration laws, making it easier for them to get in.......Stupid!


The problem isn't with the rules it's how some interpret the rules differently than others do. HRC does not call for head to toe camo in the rules, it calls for camo or clothing harmoneous to the environment.


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## SCOTT C. (Oct 20, 2004)

The problem is when you get a power trip type of judge that wants to be a hard a$$ and make you wear head to toe camo. I have run lots of HRC test all in the southeast where it happens to be hot, I wear camo shorts, camo shirt, and a camo hat. It has always been fine.

But if a power trip judge like Snikelfritz told me to put pants on, I would be pissed and would make sure I never ran under him again. Then the clubs that brought him in to judge would lose my entries, and I have 3 dogs.

Bottom line is there are lots of things we wear or don't wear during hunting that don't transfer to a testing enviroment. Point being...the biggest thing that will flare a bird is a pale white face looking up at them, so does this mean I need to wear my face mask at the next HRC test...give me a break.

Judges need to get off there high horse and judge the dogs not the fashion. As long as it's not blatant.


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## KwickLabs (Jan 3, 2003)

I wear the same clothes to AKC and HRC hunt tests......and think nothing of it. 

When playing games, I read the rules and try to "play" accordingly. Just for the record, I will argue about things that are important.

This thread is driven by three prevalent social dogmas 1) "that doesn't make any sense.....to me......so it's wrong", 2) "no one can tell me what I can and cannot do because I know better" and 3) "one of us is wrong and it isn't me".


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

MSchack said:


> Before I even owned a lab I went to an AKC hunt test just to see what it was all about and I was wearing a white shirt.
> 
> I was standing in the gallery watching a JR test and a lady (I'm guessing the marshal) asked me very nicely to leave or at least stand way far away under some trees.
> 
> ...


 
Agreed, but there are no RULES against it. I have asked the marshal to do the same thing and to move white trucks that were visiable in the field of the falls. White draws attention becasue of the way we train. But the questin remains who does one wearing non camo help a dog. Sorry but if you dog need a white jacket on those long 150 yard blinds you get in a HT there is probably a problem. I also never suggested wearing white, I simply asked why wearing something other than camo helps the dog. Other than as stated above, camo hides you from the dog which seems pretty stupid to me if you are testing a dogs ability to follow your commands at a distance (i.e. blinds).


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## Robert (Feb 28, 2006)

Whaaaaat? So does this mean I'll not be able to watch female handlers run their Golden Retrievers while wearing tube tops anymore?


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## RKDuce (Apr 12, 2010)

Just buy a pair of lightweight camo pants that have zip off legs. Geez 13 pages about shorts and flip flops


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## badbullgator (Dec 20, 2004)

Karl
Change your setting and the thread will only be 4 pages...
Go into your user CP at the top of the page and change the display settings.


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

KwickLabs said:


> I wear the same clothes to AKC and HRC hunt tests......and think nothing of it.
> 
> When playing games, I read the rules and try to "play" accordingly. Just for the record, I will argue about things that are important.
> 
> This thread is driven by three prevalent social dogmas 1) "that doesn't make any sense.....to me......so it's wrong", 2) "no one can tell me what I can and cannot do because I know better" and 3) "one of us is wrong and it isn't me".


game, set, match!-Paul


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## Byron Musick (Sep 19, 2008)

KwickLabs said:


> I1) "that doesn't make any sense.....to me......so it's wrong", 2) "no one can tell me what I can and cannot do because I know better" and 3) "one of us is wrong and it isn't me".



Gosh darn it you left out the socially inept responses from the Monkey gallery who have only smart quips and jokes to add to the debate.. Us guys who are to RTF what static noise is to AM radio, unwanted and darn near obsolete!

Also, did I miss it or did someone actually agree with someone else? I need to go check.

So hot and humid and it stinks...


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## Joe Brakke (Jul 3, 2008)

Anyone interested in a camo handlers jacket? PM or 303-594-0334


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## Codatango (Aug 2, 2009)

Ok, so when it's hot, if AKC says we wear camo, then tank tops, shorts can be worn? Otherwise they say long sleeves, long pants. Then the judges would have to do that as well, otherwise you'll get a handlers rebellion!

In California, there's only about one test where you might not find yourselves in short sleeves by the afternoon. That would be a February test in Lost Banos. 

Then you have the question of: "What is the real point of CAMO"?? Isn't it to CAMOUFLAGE?? Against a plain background any solid color would be more 'camouflaged' than camo. And what variation of camo is acceptable. there is some 'lovely' pink and brown camo out there !! ; )

June thru November in California you have a lot of dry grass backgrounds and people are wearing black or even darker camo at tests. A light tan shirt would be very camouflaged in many cases, but THAT would unacceptable according to the "rules".

I think there are TOO many variables in temperature and vegetation/terrain across the country to put anything specific in the rule book. 
When the temp hits 65 degrees, I'm in SHORTS!!

Debbie Tandoc


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## Buzz (Apr 27, 2005)

SCOTT C. said:


> Judges need to get off there high horse and *judge the dogs* not the fashion. As long as it's not blatant.


Judge the dogs? Whaaaa? What a concept.

I used to have a pair of pink shorts I would wear at my office golf league. I did it to tick off my partner, he hated being seen with me. Wish I still had them. I always replied to criticism with, it takes a real man to wear pink.;-)


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## RF2 (May 6, 2008)

Labs R Us said:


> Woah...I never thought my innocent question would create such controvery. Sorry. I had just heard this issue discussed among our training group and thought *I'd turn to this forum to clarify*.


Turning to RTF for clarity is like going to a brothel for communion.


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## Smokin' Guns (Feb 2, 2009)

It's quite simple, wear camo it's the rules!!! But don't be a dumb ass and sweat your n***s off when it's 100 degrees outside!!!


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## Smokin' Guns (Feb 2, 2009)

The smart ass in me wants to ask why do we worry about pants versus's shorts and not short sleeve shirts versus's long sleeve shirts! Or better yet, a full hat versus's a visor hat!


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## Furball (Feb 23, 2006)

Smokin' Guns said:


> It's quite simple, wear camo it's the rules!!! But don't be a dumb ass and sweat your n***s off when it's 100 degrees outside!!!


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## david gibson (Nov 5, 2008)

Furball said:


>


we can only hope.. ;-)


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## LESTER LANGLEY (Jun 12, 2008)

2010 spring grand


http://upclosenature.com/?page_id=35&g2_itemId=121726


I judged the North La HRC fall test in Sept apprenticing under Tom Weeks from Ms and he did not want our handlers wearing shorts (this was at least 10 years ago.) I didn't understand it but did not question it at the time, as he was a much more experienced judge.


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## LESTER LANGLEY (Jun 12, 2008)

"Turning to RTF for clarity is like going to a brothel for communion. "


you mean that's not holy water at the front door?????? uh oh!!!!


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## John Robinson (Apr 14, 2009)

Golddogs said:


> Use some common sense. No venue is *JUST LIKE HUNTING*. Try to honor the spirit of the reg's as far as required color of clothing and have some fun. I appreciate any handler trying to comply with approprate attire color wise, but they, and I need to be comfortable and safe. It is not that hard to go out and buy a olive drab t-shirt or tank top.
> 
> I have yet to see clothing, or lack ther of, make a dog remember a double or sit still on the honor.
> 
> Camo bikini regards


I only read the first seven pages, but I think you hit the nail on the head. 

I thought we were testing dogs, not making a fashion statement. As long as you are not blatently tring to gain an advantage for your dog by wearing an obviously light or dark contrasting color, what difference does it make if you are in shorts or not? IMO there ought to be lots of other more important factors to dwell on, ie dog work. I usually wear a tan Filson tin cloth jacket and denin pants when I'm duck hunting out of my boat, would that pass in HRC?

John


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## Riverdog SC (Oct 28, 2008)

LESTER LANGLEY said:


> 2010 spring grand
> 
> 
> http://upclosenature.com/?page_id=35&g2_itemId=121726
> ...



If I'm not mistaken, that's Mr. Charlie Jurney on the bucket at the Grand.


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## DarrinGreene (Feb 8, 2007)

Juli H said:


> I always had this same opinion, the dog should be able to see me at these distances...not really working on field trial distances, you know, so wearing white should not make much difference (but I am pretty sure that AKC hunt tests frequently have marks and/or blinds over 100 yds). I used to train with my camo coat on almost all the time (occasionally I'd wear white, or a 'solid' color blue coat or just a t-shirt). I noticed over time, that sometimes on blinds (usually between 75-150yd), my dog would take incorrect casts when I wore the camo coat - esp when he was getting to the end of the blind, and depending on background, lighting, etc....This yr I decided to change and (try) to wear white every time I trained..The days I have not had it, I have seen a marked difference in how my dog handles on blinds.
> 
> Juli


yea yea I know yall want this to be over but...

Juli, bein from Alaska and all that I suppose you would wear a white coat huntin more than most of us LOL but at the end of the day... this is a HUNTING TEST and we would all be wearing colors that blend into the background while hunting this... Our dogs have to be able to handle at the prescribed distances in order to be considered finished retrievers by AKC standard...

I hear ya... they see a white sleeve better than anything. Of course they do but this is a HUNTING TEST...

There should be no big deal with the dog seeing you in HUNTING attire, which anywhere other than there, is generally dark...

Which leads me to the rhetorical question...

do you want to test your dog against a hunting standard, or get an MH after his name? 

shoudln't be no big deal, sorry...


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## allydeer (May 11, 2008)

camo/ hunt test / hunting test standards/ they want to make it a hunting senaros . i wear camo when i'm hunting so i soppose at a hunt test it should make it a hunting senaro. i put a ecollar on my dog when i hunt so i should be able to put one on her for a hunt test>>>>>>>>


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## john fallon (Jun 20, 2003)

DarrinGreene said:


> yea yea I know yall want this to be over but...
> 
> Juli, bein from Alaska and all that I suppose you would wear a white coat huntin more than most of us LOL but at the end of the day... this is a HUNTING TEST and we would all be wearing colors that blend into the background while hunting this... Our dogs have to be able to handle at the prescribed distances in order to be considered finished retrievers by AKC standard...
> 
> ...


Not always... against a dark backround with dim lighting the proper _break up type camo_ will be more difficult to see than than white.

In answer to your question. When hunting, while I am "out" and handling my dogs on a bird, all thoughts of being inconspecuous (sp)to waterfowl has taken a back seat to the retrieve... so off comes the dark clothing revealing something a dog can see:razz:

john


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

john fallon said:


> When hunting, while I am "out" and handling my dogs on a bird, all thoughts of being inconspecuous (sp)to waterfowl has taken a back seat to the retrieve... so off comes the dark clothing revealing something a dog can see:razz:
> 
> john


To each his own, but in my opinion, you have lost a big opportunity to bag many more birds. I have killed hundreds of ducks while my dog was in the process of making a retrieve.

Down here in my part of the country, if you were hunting with me and my partners and handled your dog with that attitude, I, or more probably one of them, would kindly ask you to leave your dog in the blind on future retrieves.

Our ducks here are too hard to come by and we work too hard to afford many missed opportunities. The ducks are very educated by the time they make it here. 

I believe the purpose of a good retriever is to pick up all the downed game without disturbing the hunt and in my mind, you and your dog would be disturbing my hunt.

My dog can pick up all the birds that my 5 or 6 hunting partners can kill, and I can handle him inconspicuoulsy (sp) while wearing camo. My dog is certainly nothing very special in the talent department and couldn't place in a field trial if his life or mine depended on it, but he can pick up ducks (30-40) all day long at 100-150 yrds with me handling him while wearing camo. It's not that difficult if that's the way you train. 

I know many other serious hunters/trainers who's dogs can do the same and they all do very well in hunt tests.

This "camo" argument for a "hunting" dog is BS plain and simple!


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## trapper1 (Mar 19, 2008)

Hi i know people take the Hunt test very serious . and so they should . but the reason that i will be in the Hunt Test is because I love my Dog and i love working with him . what the hell about a dress code . i want to have Fun with my Dog . sure i would like to pass the test . but if i don't so what as long as We have a little Fun . in all the reading i have done on Hut Test and Field Trails . i never heard the word Fun . just another way of bringing new members in to a sport . where one should have Fun . life is hard so lets have some Fun with are Dogs .


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## john fallon (Jun 20, 2003)

Dman said:


> To each his own, but in my opinion, you have lost a big opportunity to bag many more birds. I have killed hundreds of ducks while my dog was in the process of making a retrieve.
> 
> Down here in my part of the country, if you were hunting with me and my partners and handled your dog with that attitude, I, or more probably one of them, would kindly ask you to leave your dog in the blind on future retrieves.
> 
> ...


I don't hunt with large groups. 
I'm not there for a party, just to call, shoot and have my dog retrieve a few ducks. It's not the kill itself it's the whole experience if you will that I am after. 
So when the ducks are hard to come by it makes the retrieve of ALL of them that much more enjoyable to me, and by hunting with one or at the most two likeminded partners, there is no worring on my part what some other........

Your argument is of course true at short distances , but there are scnerios where it isn't. what about the pass shot that you just got one ot two shot in, that did not drop for a long distance... at sunsets last light or a very early in the morning or on an overcast day, with you standing against a very dark backround while handling... do you just give that/those bird an "F" it ???.

john


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## DarrinGreene (Feb 8, 2007)

john fallon said:


> Not always... against a dark backround with dim lighting the proper _break up type camo_ will be more difficult to see than than white.
> 
> In answer to your question. When hunting, while I am "out" and handling my dogs on a bird, all thoughts of being inconspecuous (sp)to waterfowl has taken a back seat to the retrieve... so off comes the dark clothing revealing something a dog can see:razz:
> 
> john


how is your answer to my question an answer to my question John? 

you getting undressed while hunting (scary as that may be) has nothing to do with your objective in entering an AKC hunting test... 

You have pretty nice dogs John. I dare say they can see you at 100 yds or less even in camo, provided of course, they sit and look for you first 

when the cork comes out, regards,


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## Swampcollie (Jan 16, 2003)

Labs R Us said:


> I've recently heard that AKC will be making it mandatory at hunt tests for entrants to wear camo clothing. If so, do they mean the actual camo design or will solid green, brown, or tan clothing do the trick? Just wondering.



From the latest edition of the AKC Regulations and Guidelines for Retriever Hunting Tests.... 


_Chapter 3, Section 15. Attire. __In keeping with the aim of simulated_
_hunting conditions and situations, handlers,_
_Judges, workers and other test participants shall be_
_attired in dark or customary hunting attire that adequately_​
_reflect a waterfowling or upland hunting environment_

Unless the RHTAC elects to propose new changes to the Regulations and Guidelines for Retriever Hunting Tests and the subsequent approval by the BOD of the AKC, there is NO requirement for Camo clothing in the AKC Retriever Hunting Test Program. 

The work of the dog is what is important, not the latest fashion of the day. 

It is unlikely that such a proposal would receive the support of the majority of the Member and Licensed Clubs.


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## Juli H (Aug 27, 2007)

DarrinGreene said:


> yea yea I know yall want this to be over but...
> 
> Juli, bein from Alaska and all that I suppose you would wear a white coat huntin more than most of us LOL but at the end of the day... this is a HUNTING TEST and we would all be wearing colors that blend into the background while hunting this... Our dogs have to be able to handle at the prescribed distances in order to be considered finished retrievers by AKC standard...
> 
> ...


I have no problem at all with wearing camo at hunt tests. That is what they are about and what people should do, in the 'spirit' of the game.  I know I do!

My point was that I noticed in training, that my dog would have a more difficult time on blinds when I was wearing my camo coat - usually at longer distances and depending on lighting/background......

I want to test my dog against a hunting standard...

Juli


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## john fallon (Jun 20, 2003)

There is a lot of camo out there how much of it do you own????

So what is customary,.. any kind at all, or what is truely approprerate concealment for the location and the season

You are hunting late winter last week you wore http://www.camouflagepatterns.com/mossy-oak/duckblind and it worked weee

This week you got some snow and there isn't a leaf in sight for 300 miles.

Which do you chose

http://www.camouflagepatterns.com/predator/winter-white

or

http://www.camouflagepatterns.com/predator/spring-green

or what you wore last week?

john


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## Dman (Feb 26, 2003)

john fallon said:


> what about the pass shot that you just got one ot two shot in, that did not drop for a long distance... at sunsets last light or a very early in the morning or on an overcast day, with you standing against a very dark backround while handling... do you just give that/those bird an "F" it ???.
> 
> john


Nope. Done that many times. Those birds get picked up also.


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## Labs R Us (Jun 25, 2010)

Thank you SwampCollie. I can't believe it took 148 comments before my question was answered.


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## Gun_Dog2002 (Apr 22, 2003)

I'm curious what the rhtac has to say about this? 


/paul


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## paul young (Jan 5, 2003)

16 pages of arguing about minutiae............

the rule says dark clothing. we all know what dark looks like. give it a rest!-Paul


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## HarryWilliams (Jan 17, 2005)

Gun_Dog2002 said:


> I'm curious what the rhtac has to say about this?
> 
> 
> /paul


Who are they? HPW


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## Bubba (Jan 3, 2003)

HarryWilliams said:


> Who are they? HPW


"They" would be Keith Griffith, Rich Young, Vicky Christianson, Jeff Schoonover and Me .

If there is pressure coming from the AKC to "camo up" they sure haven't included us in the discussions.

I'll call Jerry this morhing if I get a minit to see if he has some insight.

Not too sure what a "Dress Code" is but I DO know that the last time I wore my pretty Yellow sundress (the one with the little red polka dots and spaghetti straps) to the line that even though BOTH judges agreed that I looked "Stunning" they still made me change - even thouigh them chaps make my butt look big.

Looking good is everything regards

Bubba


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## Gun_Dog2002 (Apr 22, 2003)

Bubba said:


> "They" would be Keith Griffith, Rich Young, Vicky Christianson, Jeff Schoonover and Me .
> 
> If there is pressure coming from the AKC to "camo up" they sure haven't included us in the discussions.
> 
> ...


Well, whatever happens, don't show them the photo's of you in the sundress or they sure as hell will be wanting to impliment a code....



/Paul


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## K G (Feb 11, 2003)

paul young said:


> 16 pages of arguing about minutiae............
> 
> the rule says dark clothing. we all know what dark looks like. give it a rest!-Paul


This post pretty much says it all....thanks, Paul.

When the clothes matter more than test setup, evaluation, and scoring, it's a sign that things are going pretty well in HT land..... 

k g


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## Angie B (Sep 30, 2003)

K G said:


> This post pretty much says it all....thanks, Paul.
> 
> When the clothes matter more than test setup, evaluation, and scoring, it's a sign that things are going pretty well in HT land.....
> 
> k g


That's so wrong..... 

Angie


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## TN_LAB (Jul 26, 2008)

Labs R Us said:


> Thank you SwampCollie. I can't believe it took 148 comments before my question was answered.


Hey now.
I think my post #15 did a pretty good job of answering your question. 



TN_LAB said:


> I'd wait for the rules to be written before stressing too much.


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## K G (Feb 11, 2003)

Angie B said:


> That's so wrong.....
> 
> Angie


I haven't worked the percentages (and don't intend to) but when the hot button issues with regard to the regulation/guidelines are about apparel and gun-handling, I take that as a pretty good sign...but I'm a realist.

k g


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## windycanyon (Dec 21, 2007)

I know what I'm wearing tomorrow, and it's not going to be "traditional" camo at all--- because I'm wearing SHORTS for one... and a DARK hawaiin "camo" as a top. The forecast is for fricking 91F w/ humidity..... Anyone think that's traditional or normal hunting weather (for ducks)????  Heck, I'll be far more concerned that my dogs are okay as I'm also working the test!


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