# 1968 Training book by James Lamb Free - anyone seen it?



## runnindawgz (Oct 3, 2007)

I just scooped up a copy of this book on Ebay ... The index looks interesting ... about how to read a pedigree, the “names to look for” in a dogs pedigree - the Nat’ and Nat’l Am. information and a CHAPTER titled *If the LADIES CAN “Do It ”* ha ha .... looking forward to the book arriving! 

Has anyone ever seen this book? $4.00 wasted or worth it?


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## Evan (Jan 5, 2003)

Like many older trainers, I started out on "Training Your Retriever" by James Lamb Free. It was pretty basic, and didn't go very far, but it was one of the best out there back when dinosaurs roamed the earth! 

Evan


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## runnindawgz (Oct 3, 2007)

Looked interesting ... I am particularly looking forward to reading about the “hot” dogs in pedigrees.


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## Rnd (Jan 21, 2012)

If you got the 1968 copyright, you have the third edition. (earlier editions 1949, & 1963) The 1968 edition was the first edition released by the estate of James Lamb Free.

There are plenty of folks here that think it's not worth the read however, at one time it was considered the "Bible" for retriever training.

IMO...Money well spent and enjoy the read.

It's not a "program". It is a very nice nostalgic read with some pertinent information and some not so pertinent points.


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## Mary Lynn Metras (Jul 6, 2010)

runnindawgz said:


> Looked interesting ... I am particularly looking forward to reading about the “hot” dogs in pedigrees.


. 

I have the 1977 edition. It is a good book to read. I love the illustrations. I still use the baseball drill. One of the few books and CDs I did not get rid of. Talks about training fundamentals and the pictures demonstrate what he is referring to. As Evan said it is a good book in its time but takes you only so far. Glad you were able to get a copy!Enjoy!


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## runnindawgz (Oct 3, 2007)

Rnd said:


> IMO...Money well spent and enjoy the read.
> 
> It's not a "program". It is a very nice nostalgic read with some pertinent information and some not so pertinent points.


Cool - thanks! Certainly not looking for a “program" from 1968 but, yes, a "nice nostalgic read” is what I had in mind....


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## bayou (Oct 27, 2010)

I think any book on dog training can be worth reading there will be something there that can help you and to work out your own 
training program.

I also like to listen to pro trainers opinions and reasons as well as the amateurs.


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## crackerd (Feb 21, 2003)

Almost any book on retrievers and retrieving is "worth reading" - another nostalgic and humanizing look (as in field trial training) is "The Retriever Game," which can also be had for a pittance. 

MG


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## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

I enjoyed Free's book. I have not read my copy in years and don't recall which edition I have. 

After probably 15 years or so, I have 3 takeaways that have stuck with me. Keep in mind, these things have a way of "warping" over time versus the way it is literally written.

Takeaway #1:

Back in those days, Free and his peers did not believe in doing much training during the puppy days. If I recall correctly, Free seemed to be on the extreme edge of this - waiting 'til the dog was a year of so old before doing any real training.

#2:

Free advised against letting kids and others play with your Field dog. He felt that the dog should be kept under lock and key in a kennel run during the day and only handled by you, the trainer. I do get what his angle was, in terms of making the training sessions the highlight of the dog's day and getting full value of the training sessions. But again, I recall the idea that Free was a bit on the extreme end of the application of this.

#3:

Free was the source of the term "stir your stumps". Stir your stumps is the equivlanent of what I sometimes think of as "indirect pressure with poor timing". The idea is that if the dog is blowing the trainer off on a sit whistle, a cast, or some other expected response, the handler is to "stir" or run his legs off getting out there to address the dog at close range.
I don't recall whether it is Free, or not, that mentions e-collars and that they're not good. Some writers of that era certainly wrote this sort of thing. If it is indeed Free, and again, I don't recall, you will have to just remember that at that time, whatever was on the market is a far cry from today's equipment, and the thousands of dogs that the retriever training community used as guinea-pigs to create some established e-collar "best practice" (which is now available) was not yet around.

I would like to pull out my old copy and re-read it.


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## AmiableLabs (Jan 14, 2003)

Everything said here is the truth. I too cut my teeth on the book back in the early-seventies, when there was nothing else. It indeed was the "Bible."

It is a good read. A fun read. Even still today! There are still some nuggets and gems to pick up. But by and large it is horribly, horribly obsolete now.


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## Criquetpas (Sep 14, 2004)

It's an interesting read of the old school. Used the book to train my Golden retriever in 1964 . We lived in a North suburb of Chicago at the time and lived in a two flat rental ,trained at the local city parks. On Sundays we would visit the trial people of the time, Barrington, Iilinois, Wadsworth, ilinois. Bent the ear of Cliff Wallace, Dual Ch Shed of Arden
Who had training grounds in Wadsworth,Illinois, Mr Wallace was very cordial to the 19 year old and his Golden, cleaned his kennels a few times. Fond memories of the book and some of the trialers of era mostly wealthy folks with a few commoners. I have original copy and 1963 maybe will dust it off and read again. Four bucks was a good buy just use it as good reading, not training.


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## Dos Patos (Oct 15, 2012)

It was one of the first books I ever read back when I was a kid.it was in my Fathers collection which is now mine and I just picked it up and glanced the other day.I use to sit and dream about finding a pup from all those bloodlines in that thing.Then one day I could afford a pup came home and immediatley opened it up as a refrence and there was a couple of the names.I thought I was the biggest on the block.Gonna go pull it out and see what names as I remember highlighting them or something.Great buy and thanks for some good memories.


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## 8mmag (Jan 1, 2010)

Also my first retriever training book in the early 80's. I still go back and read it sometimes for James' humor, some of his stories make you laugh out loud. Of course everyone on here already knows this, but the biggest takeaway from the book to me was 'get a good dog to begin with' referring to learning to read pedigrees and buying the best pup you could.

My son was getting into labs last year and his gf didn't understand why he should spend so much on a pup. I had him read the chapter on pedigrees and he was able to give her multiple reasons to spend a few extra dollars, logically and easy to understand. Helped a lot. I have yet to see another work treat this subject as thoroughly.


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## Byron Musick (Sep 19, 2008)

I thought Free's book was well written and its kind of fun to read. Although it was my first training book, after getting into Smartwork and seeing TRT stuff, yep Free is very old school, but a good historic viewpoint on training, IMHO.


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## luvalab (Oct 10, 2003)

I love it. Four bucks will give you 100 times the pleasure, IMO, and there is still some common sense in there, if updated to current technology, and common sense isn't common, as the saying goes. The anecdotes about the great studs of yore that still show up in pedigrees are priceless.

Somebody talked of highlighting dogs' names--I did that too.


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## Dos Patos (Oct 15, 2012)

luvalab said:


> I love it. Four bucks will give you 100 times the pleasure, IMO, and there is still some common sense in there, if updated to current technology, and common sense isn't common, as the saying goes. The anecdotes about the great studs of yore that still show up in pedigrees are priceless.
> 
> Somebody talked of highlighting dogs' names--I did that too.


That was me and what was relly neat was I found that one of my best friends great Uncle owned a dog that was mentioned in one of the stakes.I thought it was neat anyhow.


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## A team (Jun 30, 2011)

I have the seventh edition and I have enjoyed reading it, as stated earlier it's not program. My copy has the test diagrams for both the 1967 National Amateur Championship and the National Open Championship, I find it interesting that the marks and blinds in both the AM and Open would barely make it into a decent Master Hunt Test these days. In humble opinion it shows how far the sport has progressed. And in no way am I taking anything away from these tests, I'm sure they were cutting edge at the time. 

Enjoy your find.


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## Chris Atkinson (Jan 3, 2003)

Danielle,

After a bit more thought throughout the day, I will tell you that I remember a similar feeling that I recall from reading Free's book. I tend to have this feeling when reading almost all training material. You will come across a whole lot of stuff that makes total sense to you.

It will make sense because this was written by a dog person who has had success training dogs. Most all of us, even if we want to nitpick the nuances, will agree that if we view it objectively enough, the other trainer's ideas probably make some sense. They may not always fit our personal preferences, or exactly suit the temperament of dog(s) that we perceive ourselves to have, but it will probably have some fit.

I remember one of my first experiences with "trained" retrievers being dogs that were exclusively trained by someone who used Free's material. At that time, they were the finest retrievers I'd experienced.

Have fun! You will probably be glad you got it.

Chris


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## Melissa Page (Nov 23, 2011)

Saw your post and pulled mine off the shelf to look at it --- it's 1963. For awhile we found lots of old retriever training books and bought them up. Just for the nostalgic value and good reading and chuckle on a cold night. Makes me want to go read it again tonight--- but I have a new puppy so I should probably spend my time reviewing more “modern” publications and techniques. 

Enjoy your new book.


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## runnindawgz (Oct 3, 2007)

Thanks all for the responses... I suppose it was $4 well spent  
I hope you enjoyed a trip down “Training Book Memory Lane" ... I am looking forward to flipping through the pages of an oldie but _apparently_ - a goodie


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## clipper (May 11, 2003)

It is the book I cut my teeth on in the mid 70's. Read this book and made sure I bought a quality pup for my first one.. thank goodness....


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## smarrr (Jul 3, 2014)

*Love That Book*



runnindawgz said:


> I just scooped up a copy of this book on Ebay ... The index looks interesting ... about how to read a pedigree, the “names to look for” in a dogs pedigree - the Nat’ and Nat’l Am. information and a CHAPTER titled *If the LADIES CAN “Do It ”* ha ha .... looking forward to the book arriving!
> 
> Has anyone ever seen this book? $4.00 wasted or worth it?


You will love it. It's entertaining, and also teaches techniques that WORK!! 

Enjoy.


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## Wayne Nutt (Jan 10, 2010)

Ditto to all that was said above


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## Granddaddy (Mar 5, 2005)

Outdated but interesting & without question the best available during its time. It was considered the training bible at the time because there was virtually nothing else available in terms of written material. I had that book & Charles Morgan on Retrievers when I started, then "progressed" or added Richard Wolters books & then to Tarrants books. I thought Quinn had a good book, The Working Retrievers, more modern in approach but still pre-ecollar. I found John Dahl's book, Ten Minute Retriever to be an excellent book especially to give the amateur trainer a broad summary scope of the tasks involved in a relatively short volume. John & Amy are still training gun dogs in NC. But nothing compares to the modern & detailed training materials available today from Lardy & Graham. They detail systems of training from 8 wks to AA competitors and everything inbetween. Hillman & others have focused materials on certain aspects of training but none more comprehensive & tested among a large group of trainers than Lardy & Graham materials.


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## Marvin S (Nov 29, 2006)

Chris Atkinson said:


> I enjoyed Free's book. I have not read my copy in years and don't recall which edition I have.
> 
> After probably 15 years or so, I have 3 takeaways that have stuck with me. Keep in mind, these things have a way of "warping" over time versus the way it is literally written.
> 
> ...


It was all we had in the early 60's + Pfaffenberger's book on canine behavior - the rest we just winged - I have probably every 
edition somewhere as we sold them when we owned the kennel - When Water Dog was published it was the book I recommended 
to novices with some takeaways - 

A lot of the basics still apply - dogs placing in AA stakes in those days were not hamburger dogs - the judges, for the most part, 
did a significant part of their dogs training & could set up tests that did not require a 1/4 section of real estate to be successful - 
having seen on one post the reference to MH's doing those tests, I don't think so. Oily Adams could set short tests that would 
clean up the field in short order - Given the right grounds Lanse, Pete Goodale, Jack Vollstedt can still do that - they may look like 
MH tests but only in length are they - 

If I'm not mistaken - Free used a trainer almost exclusively, so would fit right in with the use of pro's being so common in today's
training environment .


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## Mary Lynn Metras (Jul 6, 2010)

James Lamb Free's dog Freehaven Muscles appeared in some of the pics in the book. He is related way back to a number of dogs.

http://www.huntinglabpedigree.com/pedigree.asp?id=574


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## David Martin (Jun 26, 2014)

JLF's book is still a great read, and props to the previous poster that mentioned Tom Quinn's book. If you took JLF's principles you could still train a sound retriever. I totally agree with Chris though on the socializing aspect. Back in those days a dog was just that, we've come so much further. In my first edition of Free's book some of the training tools listed were slingshots, bb guns and 12ga #8's. I had a later edition where he talked about ecollarars , and I believe that it had to do with Rex Carr. Still a good read.


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## olepal (Feb 12, 2014)

I have the Fifth Edition from 1975. My mother gave it to me for Christmas 1975, just before I got out of the Army. I read it forward and backward while teaching my Golden Retriever that I brought home from Europe.

olepal


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## barbless (Aug 9, 2015)

This was the first training book I started with back in 1970. The real take home message that still applies today is start with a good dog.


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## Tim Carrion (Jan 5, 2003)

Chris Atkinson said:


> [*]I don't recall whether it is Free, or not, that mentions e-collars and that they're not good. Some writers of that era certainly wrote this sort of thing. If it is indeed Free, and again, I don't recall, you will have to just remember that at that time, whatever was on the market is a far cry from today's equipment, and the thousands of dogs that the retriever training community used as guinea-pigs to create some established e-collar "best practice" (which is now available) was not yet around.
> [/LIST]
> 
> I would like to pull out my old copy and re-read it.


I don't see any reference to how to use e-collars in his book but a common philosophy of collar training of that era was:
" if you can't train without one you shouldn't train with one".

Disregarding his opinion of Chesapeakes the book does provide a good historical perspective of retriever training.
Another great old book is Dave Elliot's Training Gun Dogs to Retrieve, 1952.

Tim


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## ErinsEdge (Feb 14, 2003)

Free's book is pretty old, in the 60's. Hey pup Fetch it up by Bill Tarrant could be where the e-collar reference was, that was published in 1979 but revised thinking was in the 90's


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## AmiableLabs (Jan 14, 2003)

Rnd said:


> If you got the 1968 copyright, you have the third edition. (earlier editions 1949, & 1963) The 1968 edition was the first edition released by the estate of James Lamb Free.
> 
> There are plenty of folks here that think it's not worth the read however, at one time it was considered the "Bible" for retriever training.
> 
> ...


Nailed it! Right on every point.

Once the most important retriever training book on the market, now seriously outdated.

But a fun read for the nostalgia.


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## Joe Kuczynski (Jul 10, 2008)

Since I started this crazy journey in 1970 I have "lent" copies of this book to many newbies over the years and never saw them again. Finally in about the mid eighties I won a copy at an auction of items donated to Shoreline by the Pryor's when they left the game. Ruth was the person who got me started in the sport and I never let that copy get out of my possession. It was the Bible at the time. I have collected many old training books over the years and enjoy them for the history and the training philosophy of the authors.


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## Bill Cummins Jr. (Aug 2, 2011)

Joe Kuczynski said:


> Since I started this crazy journey in 1970 I have "lent" copies of this book to many newbies over the years and never saw them again. Finally in about the mid eighties I won a copy at an auction of items donated to Shoreline by the Pryor's when they left the game. Ruth was the person who got me started in the sport and I never let that copy get out of my possession. It was the Bible at the time. I have collected many old training books over the years and enjoy them for the history and the training philosophy of the authors.


 I started with this book also in 1981, "lent" it out several times, eventually didn't get it back. A DVD disappeared also. Now I write down who I loan it too.

Bill C


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